Discussion on "Undo Button"

[Xur]

No thanks. But at least it's one of those things I can ignore.

 

[GeneralZIft]

It's one of those things where once the option is there, people are going to abuse it, and then it feels like you're not playing optimally otherwise, and then the game loses rigidity

That's why it needs heavy restrictions. Once-undo only once per turn for example ...


EDIT: BUT the biggest hurdle really is probably working the code base to be able to do that without any bugs or exploits.

 

[Brutus2]

I think people are missing the point of what the OP is suggesting. It's not about changing outcomes, civ6 already has autosaves if you want to do that. He is talking about just simple things like mis-clicks, accidently moving the wrong unit or something like that, not changing the results of a combat (which again, you can already do anyway). More options are always better than less options especially in a single player game. Nobody is forcing you to use the undo button if it's there so why would you force others not to have the button because you don't want it. Always better to have the option and not need it than to need it and not have it!

 

[UWHabs]

I think people are missing the point of what the OP is suggesting. It's not about changing outcomes, civ6 already has autosaves if you want to do that. He is talking about just simple things like mis-clicks, accidently moving the wrong unit or something like that, not changing the results of a combat (which again, you can already do anyway). More options are always better than less options especially in a single player game. Nobody is forcing you to use the undo button if it's there so why would you force others not to have the button because you don't want it. Always better to have the option and not need it than to need it and not have it!

I think if they limit it to a very strict subset of movement, basically just a mis-click prevention, it would be fine. Like they could only allow undo of simple moves, and not attacks. So you could undo putting your scout on auto-explore and have him step right next to a barbarian. Or when you click on a goto and the unit suddenly starts moving to some random square because a tile is occupied and it thinks it can walk through some fog section to get to the next continent. Items like that, if that's what they limit it to, I think is "safe" enough that it would probably be more helpful than harmful.

You'd still have some mis-click attacks that maybe you wish you could undo that wouldn't get caught above, but once you allow undoing an attack, that starts spawning an even bigger chain reaction. Even un-doing a builder chop action, for example, could run you into trouble (ie I can imagine a case where you chop to finish a building, but if you're suzerain of Ayuthaya then you get a culture boost, which maybe finishes a civic, which triggers a eureka, which finishes a tech, which unlocks a resource, etc...). Even the simple undo-move action probably would have some limits - for example, you can't undo a move onto a goody hut, or if the move triggers something else (like unveiling a new continent or a natural wonder or a eureka). Sometimes it's all those other pieces that make a developer not want to allow the undo. Which is more often than not the bigger problem. If it takes them 2 hours of coding to add it in, sure, go wild. But even a simple undo can have vast consequences you have to control for, that it might literally be faster to come up with an entirely new World Congress system than it would be to add a simple undo button.

 

[b81a98]

I prefer that give the command in the turn but move the unit when the turn is ended, then it wouldn't need a undo button to correct your moves and you can save/load the game if you needed.
And it make the wars much fair and smooth in the multiplayer games.

 

[Noble Zarkon]

I like how you tell everyone else how they will feel, what they like in 4x games, and how it affects them.

I've been on this world many decades and played Civ since Civ I so I think I have a pretty good handle on human nature

How is that different to.....

You can take a chance on an attack and then reload and walk away if it goes wrong though ....

Time and convenience.

 

[Thrasybulos]

I won't consider buying Civ7 unless it has an UNDO button.

But that button needs to be located in the dev environment, and apply to Civ5 & Civ6.

 

[Thrasybulos]

Consider this.

A and B are two sides of a "thing".
50% of players want A
50% of players want B

If the Devs implement A or B, then 50% of players are disappointed.
If the Devs implement a toggle that players can choose between A or B, then 0% of players are disappointed.

Why would you oppose an option that would result in 100% of players being able to play how they want?

It may not apply to the specific functionality discussed here, but as a rule, it's usually not so simple.
Allowing players to choose A or B means your game has to support A and B.
So players who want A do not get A: they get A with support for B.

Let's get an example, from the RPG sphere.
Some players prefer playing with a controller, others prefer mouse & keyboard.
Nowadays, most games offer support for both... but development ressources being what they are, they don't provide two completely different control schemes.
They usually go for the more limited one (controller). That means you can't click on an item to pick it up, you move (with the mouse) next to it and press an "action key". Your active skills slots are limited to what a controller supports.
So while the option to play with mouse and keyboard is there, it's been heavily impacted by the need to support a controller scheme.

I don't think an "Undo" button option would have such design consequences, but it might?
As some have said, not abusing "Undo" to explore your immediate starting environment could quickly be considered substandard play. As a counter to that, the devs could decide to have the game start with a city instead of a settler. That would be an example of how support for the option would impact both sides.

 

[Leyrann]

I think if they limit it to a very strict subset of movement, basically just a mis-click prevention, it would be fine. Like they could only allow undo of simple moves, and not attacks.

And what if I misclick attacking when I meant to move to the adjacent tile instead?

I've been on this world many decades and played Civ since Civ I so I think I have a pretty good handle on human nature

I've been me for almost three decades so I think I have a better handle on my nature than you do.

And I want an undo button.

 

[Dale]

I've been on this world many decades and played Civ since Civ I so I think I have a pretty good handle on human nature


Time and convenience.

You're not the only old fart here you know.