District Discount Mechanism

[walkerjks]

Relearning (and learning the new) game mechanics after taking 3 years off the game. So, if I am going for my peaceful cultural victory and plan on prioritizing early theaters... I could theoretically do the following - build 2 theaters and get either a discounted campus or government center. Build a 3rd theater and get the other one discounted.

Can probably get 1st harbor and 1st marketplace discounted as well as I don't use traders so much early. Can't really avoid entertainment complexes once I hit political philosophy. Just have to avoid certain techs and civics and until I plan on using them. Would need 5 theaters for a marketplace/harbor discount and a 6th theater to get the other. Time to experiment.

 

[RealHuhn]

Relearning (and learning the new) game mechanics after taking 3 years off the game. So, if I am going for my peaceful cultural victory and plan on prioritizing early theaters... I could theoretically do the following - build 2 theaters and get either a discounted campus or government center. Build a 3rd theater and get the other one discounted.

Can probably get 1st harbor and 1st marketplace discounted as well as I don't use traders so much early. Can't really avoid entertainment complexes once I hit political philosophy. Just have to avoid certain techs and civics and until I plan on using them. Would need 5 theaters for a marketplace/harbor discount and a 6th theater to get the other. Time to experiment.

Good idea in theory and you should try it yourself (that's half the fun right?).
However, those theatre squares will probably cost more than 100 production each because you unlock too many techs and civics along the way. That's 100 + 100 + 60 (for example a discounted holy site) = at least 260 production for 3 districts.
But if you rush holy sites immediately, they only cost 60 each (only Astrology is required). That's 60 + 60 + 60 later (the discounted theatre) = 180 production for the same 3 districts.
And you most likely get a religion on top of it in the 2nd example.

By the way, the government plaza is pretty cheap. I'd say it's not a big deal to build it without any discounts anyway. Not really worth the delay.

 

[walkerjks]

Good idea in theory and you should try it yourself (that's half the fun right?).
However, those theatre squares will probably cost more than 100 production each because you unlock too many techs and civics along the way. That's 100 + 100 + 60 (for example a discounted holy site) = at least 260 production for 3 districts.
But if you rush holy sites immediately, they only cost 60 each (only Astrology is required). That's 60 + 60 + 60 later (the discounted theatre) = 180 production for the same 3 districts.
And you most likely get a religion on top of it in the 2nd example.

By the way, the government plaza is pretty cheap. I'd say it's not a big deal to build it without any discounts anyway. Not really worth the delay.

Pretty much this and your numbers are pretty close. But it is possible. Beelining for drama & poetry and then political philosophy leaves very little time between drama & poetry and when you get state workforce. So to get the inspiration for state workforce, you either have to have half-price theaters or partially chop the first theater district. It's much easier to make a campus you're very first district. But this way is doable.

As Greece, I managed to build 4 theater districts at a cost 41 hammers each, lock in 3 campuses at 57, 97, and 97, and lock in the government center at 39 hammers

There were some small opportunity costs (delayed political philosophy for two turns, for example). 4 cities settled peacefully, first two theaters up turns 53-54 (with next two done 56-57). Political Philosophy popped on turn 58, which is fast enough.

Crazy amount of micromanagement for a bit over a turn's worth of hammer savings (across the 4 cities). Will not do this often. But one thing this exercise did force me to do was look at how district costs ramp up in general in the early game. I will be avoiding finishing techs or civics I don't need immediately, but will need, say 10 or 20 turns later in order to keep costs down.

 

[RealHuhn]

Pretty much this and your numbers are pretty close. But it is possible. Beelining for drama & poetry and then political philosophy leaves very little time between drama & poetry and when you get state workforce. So to get the inspiration for state workforce, you either have to have half-price theaters or partially chop the first theater district. It's much easier to make a campus you're very first district. But this way is doable.

As Greece, I managed to build 4 theater districts at a cost 41 hammers each, lock in 3 campuses at 57, 97, and 97, and lock in the government center at 39 hammers

There were some small opportunity costs (delayed political philosophy for two turns, for example). 4 cities settled peacefully, first two theaters up turns 53-54 (with next two done 56-57). Political Philosophy popped on turn 58, which is fast enough.

Crazy amount of micromanagement for a bit over a turn's worth of hammer savings (across the 4 cities). Will not do this often. But one thing this exercise did force me to do was look at how district costs ramp up in general in the early game. I will be avoiding finishing techs or civics I don't need immediately, but will need, say 10 or 20 turns later in order to keep costs down.

That doesn't sound too bad. Greece can make it work, especially Gorgo. Afterall, by avoiding early districts you've managed to expand to 4 cities instead of the usual 3 and get a lot more early great writers most likely.
You could have gotten a 2nd discounted campus though by waiting a little bit. If you have a dominant district you build everywhere, 2 discounts are very easy to get, even 3-4 if you can resist the urge to pre-place districts. This can save a noticable amount of production, even if you research quite a few techs in the meantime.

This reminds me of another fun strategy. Rush to commercial hubs, get the -25% district cost pantheon and the -20% district cost promotion from Liang and spam commercial hubs everywhere to unlock discounts. Useful for every type of victory condition.

 

[Fluphen Azine]

This reminds me of another fun strategy. Rush to commercial hubs, get the -25% district cost pantheon and the -20% district cost promotion from Liang and spam commercial hubs everywhere to unlock discounts. Useful for every type of victory condition.

Now you make me want to try this and play for discounted districts.
I find it a bit daunting and or restraintive (Is that a word? Perhaps Restrictive).
Things seem easier or more fluid when I plop the districts down and chop later.
I would like to work on the discounted districts though as it seems worth the save on production.

 

[Victoria]

I would like to work on the discounted districts though as it seems worth the save on production.

I would be interested in how you find it.

 

[Fluphen Azine]

I would be interested in how you find it.

I've tried it before but not this CH strategy with the Discount Cards and Liang.
Does it make you finish faster or is it worth it in most games?
What is the best way to go about it?
What district is best to focus on first and what is the district you should focus your discount on??
Now I have to dig up that Map/Key/Spreadsheet of how it all works again.
I like that video Potato has on it but he needs to make it more simplified.
Actually I watched it again and he does explain what I want.
Focus on Encampment/Campus/Commercial Hubs for Land Warmongering.
Just tell me one District to spam and one District to get the Discount on!
So much easier to just plop and chop.

 

[Victoria]

So much easier to just plop and chop.

Frees up beelining more and the drop Arguably discounts by as much if not more. Then add to that the fact you have to finish these districts before you drop more amd to me often it is not worth it.
Exceptions for me are holy sites which do work or an xbow rush with encampments which are not the best spammed district, much better to project 1 than spam many.
Bit I am truly interested in attempts, I personally struggle with it limitations.

 

[Fluphen Azine]

Frees up beelining more and the drop Arguably discounts by as much if not more. Then add to that the fact you have to finish these districts before you drop more amd to me often it is not worth it.
Exceptions for me are holy sites which do work or an xbow rush with encampments which are not the best spammed district, much better to project 1 than spam many.
Bit I am truly interested in attempts, I personally struggle with it limitations.

Well I am in a game playing as Australia and I tried it.
Once again like the last time I tried it a few months ago it gets disoriented.
It feels to me like hard building 3 Campuses take too long.
I'd rather have military units or more settlers.
So I'm bouncing all over the tech and civic trees trying to limit district techs.
I ended up getting 2 Commercial Hub discounts that seemed significant.
I got a discount on the Government Plaza as well. (I think)
However, I don't like delaying the Encampment and Iron Working.
I mean I need an Encampment for the boosts and I need Iron for the War Machine.
Things seem easier if I build a bunch of warriors or chariots.
Find the Iron, Upgrade and Kill.
IMO, it would be better to Kill a Neighbor with 4 or 5 cities and some districts compared to getting a few discounted districts.
That's the real discount, take cities with districts.
My Mayan Neighbor already has up a couple wonders and districts.
I remember discussing this with you before and I have the same conclusion.
It seems difficult and rigid with little value for me.
I do have a bunch of 1 turn techs now though so maybe Science Overflow comes into play??

 

[Victoria]

I mean I need an Encampment for the boosts and I need Iron for the War Machine.

... so ignore campus and just build 3 encampments and take those wonders and districts off others?

 

[Fluphen Azine]

... so ignore campus and just build 3 encampments and take those wonders and districts off others?

That makes sense.
I notice that I naturally get District Discounts throughout the games.
Perhaps it is working better than I think.
I do know that if the Mayans are gonna just build Wonders and Districts with no Army or Walls...
It doesn't matter what I do as long as I have an Army.
I don't mind rolling the AI but this feels dirty.
They are building 3 more Wonders as I take their cities?
Feels like a Public MP Game.

 

[yung.carl.jung]

Now you make me want to try this and play for discounted districts.
I find it a bit daunting and or restraintive (Is that a word? Perhaps Restrictive).
Things seem easier or more fluid when I plop the districts down and chop later.
I would like to work on the discounted districts though as it seems worth the save on production.

me, too. I really want to try this stategy but I cannot delay bronze working because I always want to fight, and because I value iron very highly.. it's the same for other techs, I always aim to get apprenticeship asap for the extra hammers. it's my #1 beeline. I feel like with Civ 6 you already have to hold back so often and execute minute timings just to be effective, I'd rather pre-place my district to get it discounted than alter my culture/tech progression.

 

[RealHuhn]

me, too. I really want to try this stategy but I cannot delay bronze working because I always want to fight, and because I value iron very highly.. it's the same for other techs, I always aim to get apprenticeship asap for the extra hammers. it's my #1 beeline. I feel like with Civ 6 you already have to hold back so often and execute minute timings just to be effective, I'd rather pre-place my district to get it discounted than alter my culture/tech progression.

I've tried the CH strategy again and I didn't have to delay Bronze Working all that much.
It is a peaceful opening though. Can't really afford to build too many units. A renaissance war with cannons is completely doable though. IZs were unlocked on turn 70.

District unlocks: Campus -> Gov Plaza -> CH -> Encampment -> Entertainment -> IZ + Theatre.
Build order for districts: 2x campus boosted by -25% pantheon (only took 5 turns each, got lucky with an early relic), 1x discounted gov plaza, 2x discounted CHs, 4x additional CHs boosted by pantheon/Liang and 2x campus boosted by pantheon/Liang (don't wait for Liang in some cities). Settlers chopped with Magnus whenever possible until I hit 9 cities.

Wonders: Pyramids, Petra, Colosseum (because Teddy built Kilwa on turn 84 xD)
Governors: Liang, Liang (-20% districts), Magnus, Amani, Pingala

Tier 1 government building: Audience Chamber for early tall cities and more district slots.

Here's a turn 108 screenshot (during a Medieval golden age (Free Inquiry) and +100% CH adjacency card. Everything went absolutely perfect according to plan though. Best start I ever had with this particular strategy. I buffed the forest between Panama and Valencia 3 times by laying forest fires with a sooth sayer (although this didn't affect the first 60 turns or so).:

Spoiler :

District overview: I'd say this is impossible without the pantheon and Liang/Magnus opening. I still haven't unlocked holy sites and harbors, so I need 22 districts to unlock 4 discounts per district (see my chart in post #32 of this thread). I already have 21, so for example, the next theatre square will be discounted as well.

Spoiler :

Few more tips:
Always use internal trade routes to boost the next CH + market to unlock more traders. Pick the great merchants who add even more trade routes. Use the gold to buy traders, high production tiles and builders.
Research as few techs as possible before placing CHs or in other words, rush to Currency and only research necessary builder techs. Settle cities near high production tiles to be able to delay Mining for example.


An earlier screenshot which shows how good the pantheon + Liang combo is. Only 9 turns for an unboosted campus in a size 2 city on turn 76.:

Spoiler :

OP forest fires (I love apocalypse game mode ^^. It was only fair that two dust storms which spawned in Valencia on turn 95 and 97 destroyed pretty much every district and tile improvement in the area xD):

Spoiler :

Edit: 7 Seas is a great map script for district discount strategies because you usually have enough space to expand peacefully.

 

[DanQuayle]

District unlocks: Campus -> Gov Plaza -> CH -> Encampment -> Entertainment -> IZ + Theatre.
Build order for districts: 2x campus boosted by -25% pantheon (only took 5 turns each, got lucky with an early relic), 1x discounted gov plaza, 2x discounted CHs, 4x additonal CHs boosted by pantheon/Liang and 2x campus boosted by pantheon/Liang (don't wait for Liang in some cities). Settlers chopped with Magnus whenever possible until I hit 9 cities.

How did you get that 2nd discounted CH?
Don't you need to build 6 districts (with 3 districts unlocked) to get that 2nd discount?

 

[RealHuhn]

How did you get that 2nd discounted CH?
Don't you need to build 6 districts (with 3 districts unlocked) to get that 2nd discount?

After finishing the first discounted CH, the second discount got unlocked.

You only need a+1 districts to unlock the 2nd discount. So in this case 3+1=4, not 6.

 

[DanQuayle]

After finishing the first discounted CH, the second discount gets unlocked.

You only need a+1 districts to unlock the 2nd discount. So in this case 3+1=4, not 6.

Ok, I thought you had two discounts at once.
But you need to complete the first discounted CH to finish first.
I guess if you quickly chopped that district, you would get to use that other discount quickly...

But now, I realize the spreadsheet I had made is confusing and I will need to redo it. The way you built yours look better.

 

[yung.carl.jung]

@RealHuhn very impressive screenshot and thanks for the write up, I will definitely try out the CH and discount strategy once. What Civ do you think works best with it? Germany and Rome come to mind, but anyone with boosted TR would benefit.

 

[RealHuhn]

Ok, I thought you had two discounts at once.
But you need to complete the first discounted CH to finish first.
I guess if you quickly chopped that district, you would get to use that other discount quickly...

But now, I realize the spreadsheet I had made is confusing and I will need to redo it. The way you built yours look better.

I didn't take any screenshots of those exact turns but I've quickly started a new game and this is how it looks after you unlock those discounted CHs. They cost 9 more production than a warrior. You really wanna chop them?

Spoiler :

@RealHuhn very impressive screenshot and thanks for the write up, I will definitely try out the CH and discount strategy once. What Civ do you think works best with it? Germany and Rome come to mind, but anyone with boosted TR would benefit.

The map is probably more important than the civ.

But I'd say Korea, Persia, Germany, Cree, Egypt, Nubia and Kongo. Rome's quick culture progression could become a problem. Not sure.

 

[DanQuayle]

I didn't take any screenshots of those exact turns but I've quickly started a new game and this is how it looks after you unlock those discounted CHs. They cost 9 more production than a warrior. You really wanna chop them?

Yes, but only if I have higher culture and expect "a' to increase before I have time to place the next district at a discounted price.
Also, it's not very common to have a 4pop city at ~16 hammer per turn.

 

[walkerjks]

So going to probably do this more than I thought in cultural games. Will do 2/3 campii first and grab a theater discount and a government discount when available (there are games when I finish with 2 campii... not going to go out of the way to build a 3rd if I don't have the terrain for it/... and it
s a msall discount on a cheap district anyway). Will only try theaters first if I am playing a civ with half-price theaters (and maybe not even then).