DLC Unique Unit Elimination Thread

[elprofesor]

I won't let nationalism influence my vote. Thus:

Bowman 19
Berserker 20
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 24
Khan 22
Maori Warrior 20
Tercio 16
Conquistador 24

Conquistadores are basically a slightly worse mandekalu cavalry (against cities), but they gain instead +1 sight, and the ability to settle in other continents (lost with upgrade); mandekalu actually become weaker when upgraded, conquistadores become cities!
It pains me a lot to vote against a military formation that was the pride of our country for centuries, but frankly, comparing it to musketeers, the extra cost isn't justified for the +100% against mounted, and lesser strength.

There's a trick to its withdrawal ability. Look at the direction the enemy is attacking from. Your unit will only retreat *away* from the direction of the attack. The 3 tiles in the opposite direction of the attack need to all be clear to have that 80% chance. If all of those are occupied or mountain or watertiles, the ability won't work period. If 1 or 2 are blocked, the ability still works, but not near as well as you'd expect from that 80% number.

Useful to know, thanks for sharing!

 

[Sparthage]

Bowman 19
Berserker 21
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 24
Khan 22
Maori Warrior 20
Tercio 14
Conquistador 24

 

[Babri]

Bowman 19
Berserker 21
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 25
Khan 22
Maori Warrior 18
Tercio 14
Conquistador 24

 

[aatami]

Bowman 19
Berserker 21
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 22
Khan 22
Maori Warrior 19
Tercio 14
Conquistador 24

 

[Sylexz]

Bowman 19
Berserker 22 (+1)
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 23 (24 + 1 from Babri - 2 from aatami = 23)
Khan 22
Maori Warrior 17 (-2)
Tercio 18
Conquistador 23

 

[Bungle]

Bowman 19
Berserker 22 (+1)
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 23
Khan 23
Maori Warrior 15
Tercio 18
Conquistador 23

 

[Lyoncet]

Berserkers are just conquistadors with amphibious instead of +1 sight and without the ability to defensively embark and colonize overseas. Conquistadors are literally better in every other way.

Along with the aforementioned weakness to pikes (and especially pikes that get upgraded to riflemen), there's also the fact that Conquistadors come way off the optimal warmongering tech path. And the fact that they upgrade from a better unit, and they upgrade to a better unit (which also gets a couple more UU bonuses on top of keeping amphibious). Compared to that, getting +1 sight and the really silly settle ability just doesn't hold up in my opinion. As for defend while embarked, that only helps on water maps, and if you're on a water map, amphibious is going to help you way more - and that's discounting Denmark's UA and the associated bug, which shouldn't be factored into the discussion anyways.

Just my unsolicited 2¢.

 

[elprofesor]

I'm of the opinion that Denmark's UA bug is actually not a bug (it would be too weak if it was, IMHO).

On the other hand, what are we considering here, how much better the UU is compared to the base unit, or how good the UU itself is? Because I consider the conquistador waaay better than the knight, while I consider the berserker to be a really badass unit, all things considered (base unit and UA).

 

[Babri]

The best knight replacement in my opinion is Keshliks. Conquistadors are great in some situations.

 

[Ciek]

Bowman 19
Berserker 23
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 23
Khan 23
Maori Warrior 13
Tercio 18
Conquistador 23

This was hard for me, I had to pick between my berserkers, Conquistadores, Keshiks, and Tercios, all some of my favorite units in the game. But Maoris as cool as they are, are underwhelming when compared to this all-star list. Bowman would be next though. and Norwegian Ski infantry would be next in my list to go because they're only superb on certain terrains and are really good when upgraded from berserkers , but otherwise meh.

 

[MadDjinn]

Bowman 19
Berserker 24
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 23
Khan 23
Maori Warrior 11
Tercio 18
Conquistador 23

Yes bob, you're pansy expression does make me dislike you.

 

[Kevin J]

Bowman 19
Berserker 24
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 23
Khan 24
Maori Warrior 11
Tercio 16
Conquistador 23

 

[DirtyDirtyDirt]

Bowman 19
Berserker 25
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 23
Khan 24
Maori Warrior 11
Tercio 16
Conquistador 23

 

[Babri]

Bowman 19
Berserker 25
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 24
Khan 24
Maori Warrior 9
Tercio 16
Conquistador 23

 

[Sparthage]

Bowman 19
Berserker 25
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 25
Khan 24
Maori Warrior 7
Tercio 16
Conquistador 23

 

[Babri]

Wait ! Maori Warrior should be at 5. DirtyDirtyDirt did not subtracted 2 points from Maori.

 

[Sparthage]

Fixed.

Bowman 19
Berserker 25
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 25
Khan 24
Maori Warrior 5
Tercio 16
Conquistador 23

 

[bryanw1995]

Bowman 19
Berserker 25
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 26
Khan 24
Maori Warrior 5
Tercio 14
Conquistador 23

Keshik imho is the best unit in the game of any kind. Tercio isn't bad, but in general musket replacements are weak b/c they're too close to rifles.

 

[Man vs Civ AI]

Bowman 19
Berserker 26
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 26
Khan 24
Maori Warrior 3
Tercio 14
Conquistador 23

 

[Lyoncet]

Bowman 19
Berserker 26
Norwegian Ski Infantry 20
Keshik 27
Khan 24
Maori Warrior 3
Tercio 12
Conquistador 23