StormbringerGT
Chieftain
- Joined
- Jul 9, 2007
- Messages
- 75
The AI doesnt seem good at playing the Dovellio, they always die every game I play. Most of the time I never get to meet them.
Doviello late-game economics
- Thread starter sylvanllewelyn
- Start date
Giga-Gigan
Warlord
I think in general, there is a good amount of people who desire the ability to loot technologies in some manner or another. Especially when one talks about the Doviello. I think this is no fluke, rather a tangible need for improvement. In reality Doviello are no more suited to pillaging than any other civ, the key uniqueness being their on site upgrading. What the Doviello need is to be better suited to pillaging than other civilizations. The most obvious solution being tech-looting ...
I strongly disagree. With tech stealing, there is even less incentive to pursue a "builder" strategy than there currently is. In the current game, strategy is largely military focused, but if you want a better military, you need to make sure you can research the technology for it.
If you enable tech stealing, you strongly encourage players to focus on military and just steal their technologies through conquest. An earlier version of Civ had this (I forget which), and it was removed precisely to encourage more diverse strategies.
Giga-Gigan
Warlord
Well the Doviellio are not the building type, they are focused on conquest. If you want to build, you can play the Sidar, or the Kuriotates.
Besides there are many ways to implement techs through conquest, you can have outright tech stealing, beaker pillaging, reverse engineering...
Besides there are many ways to implement techs through conquest, you can have outright tech stealing, beaker pillaging, reverse engineering...
Dont try to hold on to every city you capture, that way leads to stagnation.
Run your economy at a loss, and pay for it by building units and repeatedly razing cities.
WarKirby
Arty person
That's because earlier versions of civ just gave you 1 free tech that the opponent had for conquering any city. It was pretty silly.
It would be fine and not unbalancing if it would just give you research progress towards a tech, dependant on the city. Ie, taking a Size 12 city with a library, alchemist lab, elder council, academy, 15 cottages around it, and several settled great sages, could give multiple free techs.
Whereas taking a size 1 city that was just founded and contains a single monument, could give a mere 20
towards something or so.Also, even with tech stealing, you can only take what there is. If you did no research and relied purely on stealing, you could at best keep up with the world. You would never gain a tech lead.
Thunder_Gr
Emperor
The post's title is contradicting.
The terms Doviello and late-game, are incompatible with eachother. If you haven't won until then, then you will lose. Either by your economic/scientific weaknesses or by other nations' big guns comming after you. This is what I have extracted/understood from other posts about Doviello.
The terms Doviello and late-game, are incompatible with eachother. If you haven't won until then, then you will lose. Either by your economic/scientific weaknesses or by other nations' big guns comming after you. This is what I have extracted/understood from other posts about Doviello.
PanzerWolf
Chieftain
But their real hero, The war machine, comes in quite late. In my current game, I will try to head for it and hope I'll get it before the others are too powerful. I think it will work as I seem to have fairly good control of the other civs (the top in score is my buddy, but the most powerful is my enemy). But time will show. My worst economical period was in the beginning. I'm now sort of mid-game with a quite ok economy, so I'm very anxious to see how this end. Unfortunetaly I'm very busy for the next few days and will worst case not have time to play untill Monday/ Tuesday 
I play the Doviello VERY often, so I have some tips that might help you:
After conquering the first city with Luzian it should be no problem to attack the next enemy. At the latest if Luzian has Shock I and II, he is quite invincible for early opponents. After that the next promotions should be Combat IV, Combat V if you see your next opponent has no archers or if your opponent has already archers Cover I and Cover II. Of course conquering is faster if your other units are more than protection shields for a wounded Luzian and education in this case does wonders as your beastman from then on will start with Shock I.
After your road system stands attack your nearest opponent and then upgrade the dozens of workers you will probably get to beastman. Don't wait with your next opponent because your army is much more effective if your opponents are still weak. You will anyway have enough money to research at 100% IF you keep steamrolling. To ensure that your second opponent is weak enough you can split up a small part of your army that by now anyway isn't strong enough to conquer cities and pillaging the improvements of your next target (especially the Bannor and the Sidar are dangerous: The first are teching very roughly towards bronzeworking and the second towards archery. If you get bronzeworking by yourself very fast this isn't so much a problem. But if you don't start with a brillant position researchwise this might be the way to go)
Overall Charadon is more about single very welltrained units, especially Luzian, who can start the earliest rush possible whilst Mahala is about very many units (who do the pillaging works) accompanied by some welltrained units (but not so welltrained as Charadon's men), who conquer the cities.
At last some general advices: Look very very accurately at the city tiles of the cities you are about to conquer. If you see that they offer much possibilities to boost your research, keep them. Otherwise raze them. The AI builds very many cities that are really useless (where you ask yourself by what logic this city was build). You don't need many cities but you need more than your capital.
The most important tech is of course Bronze Working, but you must not forget Festivals and Mysticism as markets and elder councils are a very good possibility to stabilize your economy. For Mahala Way of the Wicked is more important because the Slaves you get can very cheaply upgrade to Sons of Asena, whilst for Charadon Warfare is more important as he works very much with experienced units and for them every additional promotion that makes it easier to conquer cities (City Raiders I, II,III) can mean victory.
Charadon:
With Charadon you can kill enemies on turn 15 if you want. Especially with him Luzian is a real gift, that should be protected. Take all units you start with (except the settler of course) and walk together in one single stack. Until Luzian is strong enough the weaker units should explore the Fog of War, because unless you want to play a lot with reloading the game, Luzian is dangered by animals. To conquer enemies you need nothing more than one single additional promotion for Luzian, that is Shock, because the starting units of the AI don't get the extra AI bonus, so at first that will be enough. If you don't meet any lion or wolf that Luzian can kill, attack the first scout you meet and then you should have enough experience to get either one or even two promotions (In this case don't choose Shock, but Combat II and III, because after that you can get the most important promotion: March). After conquering the first city with Luzian it should be no problem to attack the next enemy. At the latest if Luzian has Shock I and II, he is quite invincible for early opponents. After that the next promotions should be Combat IV, Combat V if you see your next opponent has no archers or if your opponent has already archers Cover I and Cover II. Of course conquering is faster if your other units are more than protection shields for a wounded Luzian and education in this case does wonders as your beastman from then on will start with Shock I.
Mahala:
Mahala needs longer to be able to attack your opponents, especially because she has to have a city defense (because she isn't Barbarian) and because Luzian has not the possibility to get immediately Shock (That's why after dozens of games I consider Charadon better than Mahala) and therefor is not made for a really early rush. In addition she plays best if you possess a develloped road net, because with raiders you can use the roads of your enemy and to have a constant stream of troops towards your opponent your own roads are about as vital as your opponent's roads. But this is not really a problem. Immediately after you have trained your troops by the stream of barbarians, you can use your workers to build roads towards your opponent. At that point they probably will be quite finished with building the improvements around your cities. After your road system stands attack your nearest opponent and then upgrade the dozens of workers you will probably get to beastman. Don't wait with your next opponent because your army is much more effective if your opponents are still weak. You will anyway have enough money to research at 100% IF you keep steamrolling. To ensure that your second opponent is weak enough you can split up a small part of your army that by now anyway isn't strong enough to conquer cities and pillaging the improvements of your next target (especially the Bannor and the Sidar are dangerous: The first are teching very roughly towards bronzeworking and the second towards archery. If you get bronzeworking by yourself very fast this isn't so much a problem. But if you don't start with a brillant position researchwise this might be the way to go)
Overall Charadon is more about single very welltrained units, especially Luzian, who can start the earliest rush possible whilst Mahala is about very many units (who do the pillaging works) accompanied by some welltrained units (but not so welltrained as Charadon's men), who conquer the cities.
At last some general advices: Look very very accurately at the city tiles of the cities you are about to conquer. If you see that they offer much possibilities to boost your research, keep them. Otherwise raze them. The AI builds very many cities that are really useless (where you ask yourself by what logic this city was build). You don't need many cities but you need more than your capital.
The most important tech is of course Bronze Working, but you must not forget Festivals and Mysticism as markets and elder councils are a very good possibility to stabilize your economy. For Mahala Way of the Wicked is more important because the Slaves you get can very cheaply upgrade to Sons of Asena, whilst for Charadon Warfare is more important as he works very much with experienced units and for them every additional promotion that makes it easier to conquer cities (City Raiders I, II,III) can mean victory.
