DWG01-Behind Enemy Lines, OCC, AW

[GreyFox]

Can't argue with monastary adding research ... but one has to consider that the happiness boost is short term ... globe theatre takes care of happiness once and for all.

Without having the pre-knowledge of whether there is iron nearby, IW is still needed ASAP, and seriously, survival in an OCC-AW relies on tech rate. Going for more religions doesn't seems to fit into the objective. Writing -> Literature is pretty high up on the list.

--

 

[Cabledawg]

We can wait for you Sansman. Greyfox, what would you want to pop with Oracle if not COL? Maybe we dont have to actively pursue a religion, but if a prophet can pop it...why not?

 

[GreyFox]

I don't know. Beakers count wise, CoL seems right. Plus CoL will be needed sooner or later for CS. I don't know if popping IW will be worth it. If we can get IW fast, maybe Metal Casting from Oracle is the best choice.

--

 

[The Sansman]

I have started and playing and have we have gotten a Great Engineer who could get us Metal Casting and we are one turn from completing the Oracle . I think we should burn the Great Engineer on Metal Casting and then use the free tech from the Oracle for Machinery. Iron Working is 18 turns while Metal Casting is 42 and Machinery 79, this would give us two fairly expensive techs (at this stage) for very little investment. I, of course, will wait to hear the groups opinion.

 

[Cabledawg]

Sansman, were better off right now settling any Great Engineers. It gives 2 hammers for the rest of the game and 3 beakers since we are in representation. As far as the Oracle, you could use it for COL if you have researched Writing allready or Metalcasting which would be great for forges and Collosus.

 

[negyvenketto]

This is OCC so GE gives 3 + 6 (in repr.)
GS gives 1 + 9
GP gives 2 +5 + 3
I agree with settling Gpersons

 

[The Sansman]

First off, I lied; I did not wait more than an hour for the replies . I could not resist, I choose to get both Metal Casting and Machinery with Great Engineer and the Oracle.

Those of you that feel that I deserves a thorough beating , please realize that I am still learning how to handle an OCC with Always War option (also get inline ). I felt that assuming that we find Iron in our Cultural Border that we should be able to further stagnate some of our opponents by depriving them of Metals (and other resources) with Crossbows. Also I find them quite capable at dealing with Barbarians. I have set us on Iron Works next so hopefully since Copper is just outside of our grasp Iron will be inside. I have also sent the worker to mine one of the hills south of Berlin. I did this because if Iron pops up there it will be ready, if not hopefully in time we will get lucky and something else will pop up there. Another reason is I could not think of anything else for it to do. As for the Great Engineer I am hoping since it is early in the game that we can get another one fairly quickly since we can now build a Forge.

Also we got this wonder.

I have set us to build a lighthouse, but I think we should build the Colossus and the Great Lighthouse soonish. Our fair city as I left it.

A question, if one of the AI captures (or razes) a capital and our Marine near that city are now in neutral territory can we use them? I ask this because I see us getting quite a few units that we could use to pillage a couple of our neighbors and this might encourage someone to wipe them out. Or are we to stay defensive until we have Calvary?

Spoiler :

Logging by Ruff's Cobbled Mod Pack v2.0.4 (Warlords v2.08) - New Log Entries
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Turn 110/0 (850 BC) [15-Feb-2007 22:02:07]

IBT:
Attitude Change: Isabella(Spain) towards Alexander(Greece), from 'Cautious' to 'Pleased'

Turn 111/0 (835 BC) [15-Feb-2007 22:07:45]
Berlin finishes: Hindu Temple

IBT:

Turn 112/0 (820 BC) [15-Feb-2007 22:10:42]
Berlin grows: 8

IBT:

Turn 113/0 (805 BC) [15-Feb-2007 22:11:35]
A Pasture was built

IBT:

Turn 114/0 (790 BC) [15-Feb-2007 22:12:29]

IBT:

Turn 115/0 (775 BC) [15-Feb-2007 22:13:23]
Joseph Marie Jacquard (Engineer) (Great Engineer) born in Berlin

IBT:

Turn 116/0 (760 BC) [15-Feb-2007 22:13:35]
Research begun: Writing (9 Turns)
Research begun: Theology (9 Turns)
Research begun: Sailing (3 Turns)
Tech learned: Metal Casting
Berlin finishes: The Oracle

IBT:

Turn 117/0 (745 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:14:51]
Tech learned: Machinery
Berlin begins: Forge (4 turns)

IBT:

Turn 118/0 (730 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:17:32]
Tech learned: Sailing
Berlin grows: 9

IBT:

Turn 119/0 (715 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:17:56]
Research begun: Iron Working (18 Turns)

IBT:

Turn 120/0 (700 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:18:24]
Berlin finishes: Forge

IBT:

Turn 121/0 (685 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:19:40]
Berlin begins: The Parthenon (9 turns)

IBT:

Turn 122/0 (670 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:20:59]

IBT:
Attitude Change: Hatshepsut(Egypt) towards Peter(Russia), from 'Annoyed' to 'Cautious'

Turn 123/0 (655 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:21:12]

IBT:
Attitude Change: Hatshepsut(Egypt) towards Peter(Russia), from 'Cautious' to 'Annoyed'

Turn 124/0 (640 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:21:24]

IBT:

Turn 125/0 (625 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:21:36]

IBT:

Turn 126/0 (610 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:21:45]

IBT:

Turn 127/0 (595 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:22:22]
A Mine was built

IBT:

Turn 128/0 (580 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:22:54]
Berlin finishes: The Parthenon

IBT:

Turn 129/0 (565 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:23:24]
Berlin begins: Lighthouse (3 turns)

IBT:

Turn 130/0 (550 BC) [15-Feb-2007 23:25:19]
Berlin finishes: Lighthouse


The save http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/108795/Marines_BC-0550.CivWarlordsSave

 

[ruff_hi]

I'm not that upset about burning the GE for metal casting then grabbing machinery ... but then again, what do I know?

We should also pasture those sheep to the W for +1 health.

Finally, nice post but your pictures require some sideways scrolling to see them all. Reduce them to a width of 860 means no scrolling (for me).

 

[Cabledawg]

Good set Sansman, Crossbows are fine and well be pumping out Great People pretty easily. Those 6 Beakers that the Great Engy would have given us is 1/3 of our current beakers. At this stage, thats huge. So if it takes 18 turns to get Writing, we get it in 12. Lets settle the rest. We can use Prophets to bulb a religion though. We need to head to Writing and get a Library up asap. Once those Marines are out of Cultural influence....we can move them.

Greyfox, are you available yet?.....if not, Ill play

Cabledawg.......On deck
VRA................can recite all episodes of Gilmore Girls
ruff_hi.............wishes his friends called him "Studmuffin"
negyvenketto...can we call you "negy"
The Sansman...just played
Greyfox...........needs to post a "got it"

 

[GreyFox]

I presumed it's my turns finally ...

Looking good, we hold most early wonders. MM'ed the city to accelerate growth. What we need is some navy to protect our precious sea resources. Anyone of them get pillaged and we plumphet down the darkest tunnel of starvation.

Our wisemen learnt Iron Working finally ... and ladies and gentlemen, all hail the Great Hindu God, we have iron. Mined. Within our BFC.

With added hammers, we completes the colossus:

And I proceed with adding us a spear and 2 triremes.

Under the benevolence of the Hindu God, we produced a Great Prophet ...

He settled into Berlin, thus completing the 3 Wise Men.

Danger lurks, however, as we have the first enemy ever to get near Germany:

We can wait for Alex's archer to move to where our spear is before attacking, or we can move the inner archer (together with spear, but spear used up his movement) in anticipation of alex's archer moving into the open desert.

Research-wise I got us Writing:

and started alphabet while Berlin is building the library. We really should head towards Literature not only for the Great Library but also to enable the Epics.

I started an engineer specialists to stagnant growth and I was hoping to produce one more Great Engineer to hurry the Great Library.

While waiting for Great Library to become available, I suggest we produce units (crossbows, chariots, spears, triremes) even though there is the Temple of Artemis and Great Lighthouse available. These two wonders, while great for economy, is useless for an OCC-AW with absolutely no trade routes. Because once Literature come on line, we won't have time to produce units as we would be building the Great Library and the Epics.

>>> The Save (325BC) <<<

Spoiler :

Logging by Ruff's Cobbled Mod Pack v2.0.4 (Warlords v2.08) - New Log Entries
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Turn 130/0 (550 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:26:14]
GreyFox: MM'd a bit for growth
Berlin finishes: Lighthouse

IBT:
Attitude Change: Mansa Musa(Mali) towards Hatshepsut(Egypt), from 'Pleased' to 'Friendly'
Attitude Change: Hatshepsut(Egypt) towards Mansa Musa(Mali), from 'Pleased' to 'Friendly'
Attitude Change: Hatshepsut(Egypt) towards Peter(Russia), from 'Annoyed' to 'Cautious'

Turn 131/0 (535 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:31:09]
Berlin begins: The Colossus (9 turns)
Berlin grows: 10

IBT:

Turn 132/0 (520 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:32:28]
GreyFox: MM'd toslow growth (happy cap)

IBT:
Attitude Change: Mansa Musa(Mali) towards Hatshepsut(Egypt), from 'Friendly' to 'Pleased'
Attitude Change: Hatshepsut(Egypt) towards Mansa Musa(Mali), from 'Friendly' to 'Pleased'
Attitude Change: Hatshepsut(Egypt) towards Peter(Russia), from 'Cautious' to 'Annoyed'

Turn 133/0 (505 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:34:41]

IBT:
Attitude Change: Louis XIV(France) towards Alexander(Greece), from 'Pleased' to 'Friendly'

Turn 134/0 (490 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:35:13]

IBT:

Turn 135/0 (475 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:35:42]
A Pasture was built

IBT:
Attitude Change: Hatshepsut(Egypt) towards Isabella(Spain), from 'Cautious' to 'Pleased'

Turn 136/0 (460 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:36:05]
Tech learned: Iron Working

IBT:

Turn 137/0 (445 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:36:45]
Research begun: Writing (8 Turns)
Berlin finishes: The Colossus

IBT:
Attitude Change: Mansa Musa(Mali) towards Hatshepsut(Egypt), from 'Pleased' to 'Friendly'
Attitude Change: Louis XIV(France) towards Alexander(Greece), from 'Friendly' to 'Pleased'
Attitude Change: Hatshepsut(Egypt) towards Mansa Musa(Mali), from 'Pleased' to 'Friendly'
Attitude Change: Hatshepsut(Egypt) towards Peter(Russia), from 'Annoyed' to 'Cautious'

Turn 138/0 (430 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:37:55]
Berlin begins: Trireme (3 turns)

IBT:
Civics Change: Isabella(Spain) from 'Paganism' to 'Organized Religion'

Turn 139/0 (415 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:39:10]
GreyFox: Izzy adopts OR
Berlin finishes: Trireme

IBT:

Turn 140/0 (400 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:39:36]
Berlin begins: The Great Lighthouse (5 turns)
Berlin begins: Spearman (2 turns)

IBT:

Turn 141/0 (385 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:41:42]
Berlin finishes: Spearman

IBT:

Turn 142/0 (370 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:42:30]
Berlin begins: Trireme (3 turns)
Tsongkhapa (Prophet) (Great Prophet) born in Berlin

IBT:

Turn 143/0 (355 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:43:18]
Tech learned: Writing
Berlin finishes: Trireme

IBT:
Attitude Change: Hatshepsut(Egypt) towards Louis XIV(France), from 'Annoyed' to 'Cautious'

Turn 144/0 (340 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:44:14]
Research begun: Alphabet (23 Turns)
Berlin begins: Library (3 turns)

IBT:

Turn 145/0 (325 BC) [17-Feb-2007 09:46:47]

 

[GreyFox]

Ah ... cross posted. The prophet is settled. He is going to learn us Mediation, and I don't think we need a second religion. Once Literature is in, Drama is but a few turns away.

--

 

[Cabledawg]

This is a "got it"

Our city at 325 BC

295..Finish Library and Start temple of Artemis for the Free Priest
I hire 2 Scientist, 1 Engineer and 1 Prophet and starve the city a tad for more production.

We have been forgotten

Wonders are falling quickly

160BC.. Alphabet---->Literature

I pop a Great Engineer which is merged. Before the merge: 30 Hammers and 60 Beakers....after the merge: 33 Hammers and 67 beakers
I built a couple of crossbowmen until Lit comes in

70BC..Lit comes in and i choose Drama for the Globe
I fire the Prophet and engineer to get the Great library in 8

This is our city at 5AD

And the Save
http://www.deadzoom.com/member/yoohoo3131/MarinesAD-0005.CivWarlordsSave

Cabledawg.......just played
VRA................needs to post a "got it"
ruff_hi.............on deck
negyvenketto...can we call you "negy"?
The Sansman...Fuscia is his favorite color
Greyfox...........not a player hater

 

[GreyFox]

Ah ... I see you chopped the trees ... that leaves us with 6 trees. Then the plains 2 tiles east of city can be used for workshop / farm ... no point praying for forest growth there anymore.

Hmm ... good call on TofA. I was worried we may not have time to built units thus I forgo it (9 turns in my set was too costly for 1 free priest), but apparently you've proven me wrong.

What do people suggest after Drama? I would go for Maths > Construction to get the Hanging Gardens. We need the health and free population.

We need Music also, although the Great Artists is useless (it does bring a little gold and beakers), but we need Music for Military Tradition. But it is not urgent, I am sure there are other more worthwhile techs after Maths+Construction.

We need more navy. I have placed 2 trireme on the northeast choke point of our borders, but ships can still sail one round via our southern coast to harm our nets. We need 2 more trireme in the southern border choke point.

--

 

[Cabledawg]

I put 1 Trireme to our south and left 1 north..were ok there.
I totally forgot that we dont have Meditation so we cant build monastaries yet. We should do that. Meditation would only be a few turns. We could still go for COL towards CS...Confusedism hasnt been founded yet and thats another monastary. Im hoping we can get a Great Scientist soon and get an Academy up and running. As far as Music, thats another good tech to go for. We settle the Artist for money and beakers and our borders pop sooner to get that fish online.

 

[The Sansman]

Cabledawg.......just played
VRA................needs to post a "got it"
ruff_hi.............on deck
negyvenketto...can we call you "negy"?
The Sansman...Fuscia is his favorite color
Greyfox...........not a player hater

Cabledawg my favorite colour is hot pink .

 

[Cabledawg]

Pink
Fuscia
If you see a difference, youre a chic...lol

 

[GreyFox]

I didn't even know Fuscia is a color ... or for that matter, there is such a word.

 

[Cabledawg]

Ruff, go ahead and post a "got it" if you can, well skip VRA till he comes back to the darkside.

 

[ruff_hi]

I can play tomorrow morning ... not earlier. About 24 hrs from now.

 

[vra379971]

*pops back from darkside*

Reporting in an hour.