Dynamic Civ Names

About Exarchates and Themes. I agree that Theme should be used after a limit year, but two Vassals should never change from Exarchate to Theme, as they didn't in real history even after the adoption of the Theme system.

One is the famous Exarchate of Ravenna, name for Venice as Vassal. No reconsiderations about this.

The other is the Exarchate of Africa, and this is something that should be introduced. Respawned Cordoba is a perfect candidate to have this name if vassalized by the Byzantines. But original Cordoba should have the same name as well. Exarchate of Africa was originally conceived as all territories at Western Mediterranean (past the Exarchate of Ravenna to the west), and that not only encompassed Northwestern Africa (capital at Carthage) but the Hispanic possessions too. Spain and Portugal should be more Iberian related Vassal States to Byzantium, but Cordoba could have this African trait, even if not respawned.

These two Exarchates continued to be treated like this even after the introduction of the Theme system as stated {Article Theme (Byzantine district)}: Sicily too was formed as a theme by the end of the century, but the imperial possessions in mainland Italy remained under the exarch of Ravenna or the local doukes, as did Byzantine Africa until the fall of Carthage in 698.

So my suggestion is that, besides Cordoba (Exarchate of Africa) and Venice (Exarchate of Ravenna), all other players should be treated as Exarchates up to something around 630-640 AD, and after that should be treated as Themes. Maybe this could be ignored, as at that date only France could be a candidate for Exarchate, and surely no one would accomplish such a goal (barbs would probably kill most of your poorly trained army before reaching France, at a time that if you really want to win, you wouldn't try this campaign). But it could have the option for fanatic players (I would surely try it out). For the others, no one is spawned before that limit year (the necessity of early war with Arabia makes it impossible to vassalize it before the limit, even if it was at 640 AD). On the other hand Exarchates of Ravenna and Africa should remain with this name for the entire game.
 
Is it possible to name a civ by having it's capital on a specific province?

This would be really nice and would make names a lot more realistic. I don't know if SoI uses it, but i've seen their Principality of Antioch changing to County of Edessa when the capital changed to Edessa, and the Kingdom of Jerusalem changing to Kingdom of Acre for the same reason.

For Byzantine would be fantastic and could even make they respawn more frequently and for more time as Despotate of Epirus, Empire of Trebizond, Empire of Nicaea, Kingdom of Thessalonica, Despotate of Morea and even a Kingdom of Greece (Thessaly) depending on where is their capital.

Actually it would make possible for a lot more civ names for everyone:

For the Norse would be great to have distinct realms of Denmark, Norway, Sweden and its variants (Kingdom of Denmark-Norway, Kingdom of Norway and Sweden, Kalmar Union). It's annoying when you see a Kingdom of Denmark and Norway (or even a more strange Kingdom of Denmark) with its capital at Norway and no possessions on Denmark;

Germany with so many different realms could have some names for respawning with different Capitals. Once Germany respawned with capital at Prag (I was France), it would be nice if they weren't called Kingdom of Germany in this situation;

Most Serene Republic of Venice with its capital at Raguxa (and probably without the city of Venice itself) could have its name changed too (also when it moves to other cities as well, Raguxa is just an example). Genoa could be minded the same way.

Cordoba and Spain could have some more names with this idea as well. So many different Christian and Muslim realms there, that a change of Capital could reflect this as well.

Most civs should have this feature. But still, I don't know if it's possible. I hope it is. And with this implemented the respawn rate could happen more, as actually its just a smaller state (but not an insignificant one of course) emerging from the independents.
 
Yeah, I had a game where Austria were waging war against Hungary and the Hungarians drove them off leaving them only with Prague, then vassalized them as "Province of Austria". It would be a nice effect to see what you have mentioned.
 
Is it possible to name a civ by having it's capital on a specific province?

This would be really nice and would make names a lot more realistic. I don't know if SoI uses it, but i've seen their Principality of Antioch changing to County of Edessa when the capital changed to Edessa, and the Kingdom of Jerusalem changing to Kingdom of Acre for the same reason.

For Byzantine would be fantastic and could even make they respawn more frequently and for more time as Despotate of Epirus, Empire of Trebizond, Empire of Nicaea, Kingdom of Thessalonica, Despotate of Morea and even a Kingdom of Greece (Thessaly) depending on where is their capital.

Actually it would make possible for a lot more civ names for everyone:

For the Norse would be great to have distinct realms of Denmark, Norway, Sweden and its variants (Kingdom of Denmark-Norway, Kingdom of Norway and Sweden, Kalmar Union). It's annoying when you see a Kingdom of Denmark and Norway (or even a more strange Kingdom of Denmark) with its capital at Norway and no possessions on Denmark;

Germany with so many different realms could have some names for respawning with different Capitals. Once Germany respawned with capital at Prag (I was France), it would be nice if they weren't called Kingdom of Germany in this situation;

Most Serene Republic of Venice with its capital at Raguxa (and probably without the city of Venice itself) could have its name changed too (also when it moves to other cities as well, Raguxa is just an example). Genoa could be minded the same way.

Cordoba and Spain could have some more names with this idea as well. So many different Christian and Muslim realms there, that a change of Capital could reflect this as well.

Most civs should have this feature. But still, I don't know if it's possible. I hope it is. And with this implemented the respawn rate could happen more, as actually its just a smaller state (but not an insignificant one of course) emerging from the independents.

Analyzing the appropriate xml the Dynamic Civ Names can be assigned with the following conditions:

  • combination of 3 civics
  • religion/not-religion
  • vassal/vassal-of
  • master-of up to 2 other civs
  • after-turn
  • number of provinces conquered
  • owning ONE specific province
  • respawned Y/N
Any other required conditions need some implementation effort in C++. DCNs based on the conditions above can be added by modifying the XML-files
 
Dunno whether you're going to uptade dynamic names, but since term "Polish Commonwealth" sounds really out of place in X-XIV c IMO, i suppose i can give few hints about polish DCN.

It should start as "Duchy of Poland", and not turn into "Kingdom of Poland" without at least lesser poland, greater poland and masovia under control. As a bonus for holding all core provinces (since it's hard for AI, as far as i've seen; or instead of unoriginal kingdom), it could get name "Crown of the Kingdom of Poland" (term used in latin as "Corona Regni Poloniae" since XIV, that emphazised indivisibility of the kingdom after we overcame feudal fragmentation).

Term "Polish Commonwealth" is hard to define, since in that period we only had P-L Commonwealth. Mb "Polish Commonwealth" after conquering number of unstable provinces? With Lithuanian provinces it could be Polish-Lithuanian C, with Prague it could be Polish-Czech?

Also, term Commonwealth refers to specific political system that isn't represented in the mod. Adopting limited monarchy, or year 1505 ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihil_novi ) may be some guidelines..

About religions and vassalage - Poland under Ottomans should definitely be called "Lehistan", probably the same when converting to islam.
 
The French still appear to remain the "Frankish Empire" well past the 9th century...

I'm bringing this thread here again to be discussed, as I think lots of good ideas here that were never implemented just got forgotten over time. And as I'm working on translations of the text files, I'm willing to commit these changes to remove some load from Absinthe and Merijn, if that's ok to you.

Firstly I'd like to know, if my intentions are accepted, how should we proceed to introduce a new set of DCNs. Lots of ideas will pop here, or brought back from old posts, some will be accepted others won't.

So after we decide everything (and I hope we can make some progress here), we may update the DCNs to make the game even more realistic.


Assuming my plan is going forward, my first proposal to the DCNs is the use of Theme instead of Exarchate for most of Byzantine Vassals. As described above the only two known exarchates were the Exarchate of Ravenna (currently Venice as vassal) and the Exarchate of Africa (currently none, IMO it should be Cordoba's DCN as vassal). They changed their political administration to Themes, including turning Sicily into a Theme. So I think all the other Exarchates should be changed to Themes. (Of course none of this is historical, but it seems to me more true to the rules of administration of the Empire)
 
Thanks!
But actually it's enough if you and the other forumers help me finish this WIP table for the DCNames
Then - when everything seems fine and more or less decided - Merijn or I can easily add them to the xml files

Spoiler :
<Arabia>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Arabia
Vassal of France, holding Levant province: French Levant
Vassal of France: French Arabia
Vassal of Cordoba: Emirate of Arabia
Vassal of Spain, holding Levant province: Spanish Levant
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Arabia
Vassal of Norse/Sweden, holding Levant province: Norse Levant
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Norse Arabia
Vassal of Venice, holding Levant province: Venetian Levant
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Arabia
Vassal of Russia/Kiev, holding Levant province: Russian Levant
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Arabia
Vassal of Germany, holding Levant province: German Levant
Vassal of Germany: German Arabia
Vassal of England, holding Levant province: Counties of the Levant
Vassal of England: County of Arabia
Vassal of Austria, holding Levant province: Habsburg Levant
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Arabia
Vassal of Ottomans: Sharifate of Mekke
Generic Vassal (all the other civs), holding Levant province: Province of Levant
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Arabia

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Arab Islamic Republic
Under Merchant Republic: Arab Republic
Islam State Religion and controls Egypt after turn 217 (1250 AD): Mamluk Sultanate
Islam State Religion and controls Egypt after turn 190 (1170 AD): Ayyubid Sultanate
Islam State Religion and controls Egypt after turn 103 (909 AD): Fatimid Caliphate
Islam State Religion after turn 63 (752 AD): Abbasid Caliphate
Islam State Religion after turn 40 (660 AD): Umayyad Caliphate
Islam State Religion: Rashidun Caliphate
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Abbasid State of Arabia

<Austria>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Austria
Vassal of France: French Archduchy of Austria
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Austria
Vassal of Spain: Junior Habsburg Lands
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Norse Austria
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Austria
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Austria
Vassal of Germany: German Östmark
Vassal of England: Counties of Austria
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Avusturya
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Austria

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of Austria
Under Merchant Republic: Republic of Austria
Islam State Religion: Islamic Habsburg Sultanate
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Habsburg Empire

<Bulgaria>
Vassal of Byzantium: Theme of Bulgaria
Vassal of France: Duchy of Bulgaria
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Bulgaria
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Kingdom of Bulgaria
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Varangian Bulgaria
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Bulgaria
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Principality of Bulgaria
Vassal of Germany: German Bulgaria
Vassal of England: Counties of Bulgaria
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Bulgaria
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Rumelia
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Bulgaria

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of Bulgaria
Under Merchant Republic: Republic of Bulgaria
Islam State Religion: Caliphate of Bulgaria
Respawned and has 2 unstable provinces without being Islam: Second Bulgarian Empire
Has 2 unstable provinces without being Islam after turn 150: Second Bulgarian Empire
Has 2 unstable provinces without being Islam: Bulgarian Empire
Orthodox State Religion: Bulgarian Tsardom
Catholic/Protestant State Religion: Bulgarian Kingdom
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Bulgarian Khanate

<Burgundy>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Burgundy
Vassal of France: French Duchy of Bourgogne
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Burgundy
Vassal of Spain: County of Burgundy
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: New Bornholm
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Burgundy
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Burgundy
Vassal of Germany: Lothringen
Vassal of England: County of Burgundy
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Burgundy
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Burgonya
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Burgundy

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of Burgundy
Under Merchant Republic: Burgundian Republic
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of Burgundy
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Kingdom of Burgundy

<Byzantium>
Vassal of France: Duchy of Greece
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Constantinople
Vassal of Spain, holding Thessaly province: Duchies of Athens and Neopatria
Vassal of Spain: Duchy of Neopatria
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Varangian Roman Empire
Vassal of Venice, holding Morea province, Islam state religion: Emirate of Morea
Vassal of Venice, holding Morea province: Kingdom of Morea
Vassal of Venice, Islam state religion: Latin Emirate
Vassal of Venice: Latin Kingdom
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Tsargrad
Vassal of Germany, holding Constantinople: Eastern Roman Empire
Vassal of Germany: Eastern Roman States
Vassal of England: Counties of Greece
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Greece
Vassal of Ottomans, holding Thrace province: Principality of Thrace / Eyalet of Thrace
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Greece / Eyalet of Greece
Vassal of Genoa, Islam state religion: Latin Emirate
Vassal of Genoa: Latin Kingdom
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Byzantium

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Roman Republic
Under Merchant Republic: Second Roman Republic
Islam State Religion: Islamic Byzantine Empire
Holding Constaninople province: Byzantine Empire
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Eastern Roman States

<Cordoba>
Respawned and Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Tunisia
Respawned and Vassal of France: Duchy of Tunisia
Respawned and Vassal of Arabia: Emirate of Tunisia
Respawned and Vassal of Spain, Islam state religion: Spanish Maghreb
Respawned and Vassal of Spain: Spanish Kingdom of Tunisia / Spanish Kingdom of Oran
Respawned and Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Norse Tunisia
Respawned and Vassal of Venice: Venetian Tunisia
Respawned and Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Tunisia
Respawned and Vassal of Germany: German Tunisia
Respawned and Vassal of England: County of Tunisia
Respawned and Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Tunisia
Respawned and Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Tunisia / Eyalet of Tunisia
Respawned and Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Tunisia

Respawned and Merchant Republic: Hafsid Republic
Respawned and Islam/no state religion: Hafsid Caliphate
Respawned and Catholic/Orthodox/Protestant: Hafsid Kingdom

Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Andalusia
Vassal of France: Duchy of Andalusia
Vassal of Arabia: Emirate of Cordoba
Vassal of Spain, Islam state religion: Emirate of Granada
Vassal of Spain: Kingdom of Granada
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Norse Andalusia
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Andalusia
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Andalusia
Vassal of Germany: German Andalusia
Vassal of England: County of Andalusia
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Andalusia
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Endulus / Eyalet of Endulus
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Andalusia

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Taifa of Cordoba
Under Merchant Republic: Andalusian Republic
Islam State Religion: Caliphate of Cordoba
Christian state religion: Kingdom of Cordoba
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Duchy of Andalusia

<Dutch>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Batavia
Vassal of France: Duchy of Batavia
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of the Netherlands
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Netherlands
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Norse Frisia
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Netherlands
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Netherlands
Vassal of Germany: German Holland
Vassal of England: County of Holland
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Netherlands
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Holland
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Holland

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of the Netherlands
Under Merchant Republic: Republic of the Seven United Netherlands
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of the Netherlands
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): United Kingdom of the Netherlands

<England>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Britannia
Vassal of France: Duchy of La Manche
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of England
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Kingdom of England
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Danelaw Britain
Vassal of Venice: Venetian England
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian England
Vassal of Germany: British Saxony
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg England
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Britanya
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of England

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of England
Under Merchant Republic: English Commonwealth
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of England
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Kingdom of Great Britain

<France>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Gallia
Vassal of Arabia: Emirate of Frangistan
Vassal of Cordoba : Emirate of Poitiers
Vassal of Spain: Viceroyalty of France
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Duchy of Normandy
Vassal of Venice: Venetian France
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian France
Vassal of Germany: Western Francia
Vassal of England: Duchy of Chinon
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg France
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Frangistan / Eyalet of Frangistan?
Vassal of Burgundy: Western Francia
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of France

Burgundy and Germany vassalized under Merchant Republic with Islam: Western Islamic Republic
Under Merchant Republic with Islam: French Islamic Republic
Burgundy and Germany vassalized under Mechant Republic: Western Republic
Burgundy and Germany vassalized with Islam: Western Sultanate
Under Merchant Republic: French Republic
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of France
Burgundy and Germany vassalised: Western Empire

At least 3 unstable provinces after 987 AD: French Empire
At at least 3 unstable provinces: Frankish Empire
After 987 AD: Kingdom of France
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Kingdom of the Franks

<Genoa>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of West Italy
Vassal of France: Duchy of Savoie
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Genoa
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Mediterranean
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Norse West Lombardy
Vassal of Venice: Venetian West Italy
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Genoa
Vassal of Germany: German Genoa
Vassal of England: County of Liguria
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Genoa
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Ligurya
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Liguria

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Genoese Islamic Republic
Under Merchant Republic: Most Serene Republic of Genoa
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of Genoa
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Most Serene Duchy of Genoa

<Germany>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Germania
Vassal of France: Duchy of the Rhine
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Germany
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Kingdom of Germany
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Greater Denmark
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Germany
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Germany
Vassal of England: German Counties
Vassal of Austria: Northern Great Germany
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Almanya
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Germany

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of Germany
Under Merchant Republic: Republic of Germany
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of Germany
After 1200? Kingdom of Germany?
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Imperial States of Germany

<Hungary>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Sirmium
Vassal of France: Duchy of Hungary
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Hungary
Vassal of Spain, Islam state religion: Spanish Emirate of Hungary
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Kingdom of Hungary
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Norse Hungary
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Hungary
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Hungary
Vassal of Germany: German Hungary
Vassal of England: County of Hungary
Vassal of Austria, Islam state religion: Habsburg Emirate of Hungary / Royal Hungary
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Kingdom of Hungary
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Transylvania / Eyalet of Transylvania?
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Hungary

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of Hungary
Under Merchant Republic: Republic of Hungary
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of Hungary
At least 2 unstable provinces: Hungarian Empire
At least 6 ok provinces: Hungarian Empire
After 1001 AD (cannot be Islam by default of course, that's above on the list): Kingdom of Hungary
Have a Christian State Religion: Kingdom of Hungary
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Principality of Hungary

<Kiev>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Kiev
Vassal of France: Duchy of Kiev
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Kiev
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Kiev
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Varangian Kiev
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Kiev
Vassal of Russia: South Russia
Vassal of Germany: German Kiev
Vassal of England: Counties of the Ukraine
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Kiev
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Kiev
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Kiev

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Kievan Islamic Republic
Under Merchant Republic: Kievan Republic
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of Kiev
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Kievan Rus'

<Lithuania>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Lithuania
Vassal of France: Duchy of Lithuania
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Lithuania
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Baltics
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Norse Baltics
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Lithuania
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Lithuania
Vassal of Germany: German Baltics
Vassal of England: County of Lithuania
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Baltics
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Lithuania
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Lithuania

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of Lithuania
Under Merchant Republic: Lithuanian Republic
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of Lithuania
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Grand Duchy of Lithuania

<Muscovy>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Moscovia
Vassal of France: Duchy of Muscovy
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Moscow
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Muscovy
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Varangian Muscovy
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Muscovy
Vassal of Kiev: Vladimir-Suzdal
Vassal of Germany: German Muscovy
Vassal of England: Counties of Muscovy
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Muscovy
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Moskova
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Muscovy

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Russian Islamic Republic
Under Merchant Republic: Russian Republic
Islam State Religion: Islamic Tsardom of Russia
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Grand Duchy of Moscow

<Norse>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Scandinavia
Vassal of France: Duchy of Denmark
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Scandinavian Emirate
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Kingdom of Scandinavia
Vassal of Sweden: Kingdom of Denmark
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Scandinavia
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Scandinavia
Vassal of Germany: German Scandinavia
Vassal of England: Counties of Scandinavia
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Scandinavia
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Iskandinavya
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Scandinavia
Master of Sweden: Kalmar Union

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Nordic Islamic Republic
With Merchant Republic and Paganism civics: Viking Republic
With Merchant Republic and controls Svaeland: Kalmar Republic
With Merchant Republic and controls Norway: Danish-Norwegian Republic
Under Merchant Republic: Danish Republic
With Paganism civic: Viking Kingdoms
Islam State Religion: Islamic Nordic Sultanates
Controls Svealand province: Kalmar Union
Controls Norway province: Kingdoms of Denmark and Norway
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Kingdom of Denmark

<Poland>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Polonia
Vassal of France: Duchy of Warsaw
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Poland
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Kingdom of Poland
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: South Baltic State
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Poland
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Congress Poland
Vassal of Germany: Grand Duchy of Posen
Vassal of England: Counties of Poland
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Poland
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Polonya
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Poland

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of Poland
Under Merchant Republic: Republic of Poland
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of Poland
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Polish Commonwealth

<Portugal>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Lusitania
Vassal of France: Duchy of Portugal
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Portugal
Vassal of Spain: Council of Portugal
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Suevian Kingdom of Portugal
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Portugal
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Portugal
Vassal of Germany: German Portugal
Vassal of England: County of Portugal
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Portugal
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Portekiz
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Portugal

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Portuguese Islamic Republic
Under Merchant Republic: Portuguese Republic
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of Portugal
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Kingdom of Portugal

<Spain>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Hispania
Vassal of France after ~1200 AD, Islam state religion: French Emirate of Spain
Vassal of France after ~1200 AD: French Kingdom of Spain
Vassal of France: Duchy of Leon
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Al-Ispanya
Vassal of Norse after ~1050 AD, Islam state religion: Danish Emirate of Spain
Vassal of Norse after ~1050 AD: Danish Kingdom of Spain
Vassal of Norse, Islam state religion: Visigothic Emirate of Spain
Vassal of Norse: Visigothic Kingdom of Spain
Vassal of Sweden, Islam state religion: Swedish Emirate of Spain
Vassal of Sweden: Swedish Kingdom of Spain
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Spain
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Spain
Vassal of Germany: German Spain
Vassal of England: Counties of Spain
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Spain
Vassal of Ottomans: Eyalet of Ispanya
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Spain

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of Spain
Under Merchant Republic: Spanish Republic
Islam State Religion: Emirate of Spain
At least 3 unstable provinces: Spanish Empire
At least 5 ok provinces: Spanish Empire
Holding Aragon province: Kingdom of Spain
Holding Castile province: Kingdom of Castile and Leon
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Kingdom of Leon

<Sweden>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Suedia
Vassal of France: Duchy of Sweden
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Sweden
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Kingdom of Sweden
Vassal of Norse: Kalmar Sweden
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Sweden
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Sweden
Vassal of Germany: German Sweden
Vassal of England: Counties of Sweden
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Sweden
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Isves
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Sweden

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of Sweden
Under Merchant Republic: Republic of Sweden
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of Sweden
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Swedish Empire

<Turkey>
Vassal of Byzantium: Theme of the Anatolics
Vassal of France: French Turkey
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Ottoman Beylik
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Kingdom of Turkey
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Norse Turkey
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Turkey
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Turkey
Vassal of Germany: German Turkey
Vassal of England: Counties of Turkey
Vassal of Austria: Austrian Turkey
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Turkey

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of Turkey
Under Merchant Republic: Republic of Turkey
Islam State Religion: Ottoman Caliphate
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Turkish Empire

<Venice>
Vassal of Byzantium: Exarchate of Ravenna
Vassal of France: French Kingdom of Italy
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba: Emirate of Venice
Vassal of Spain: Spanish Protectorate of Venice
Vassal of Norse/Sweden: Norse East Lombardy
Vassal of Russia/Kiev: Russian Venice
Vassal of Germany: German Venice
Vassal of England: Counties of Venice
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Venezia-Lombardy
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Venedik
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Veneto

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Venetian Islamic Republic
Under Merchant Republic: Most Serene Republic of Venice
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of Venice
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Most Serene Republic of Venice


I'm fine with changing the exarchates to themes
 
Some comments

<France>
Vassal of England: Duchy of Chinon
- I don't think there was a duchy of Chinon, but there was a serious English claim to the French crown. What about: United Kingdom of France?

<Dutch>
Vassal of Germany: German Holland
Boring. Why not County of Holland or County of Flanders, the real life HRE titles?

<Lithuania>
Vassal of Germany: German Baltics
How about 'Duchy of Livonia', especially if the capital is in the flip zone.

<Swedes>
Vassal of France: Duchy of Sweden
What about 'Bernadotte Kingdom of Sweden'. Slightly out of synch with our time period, but fun!

Some suggestions
<Austria>
Has Germans as vassal: Holy Roman Empire

<Germans>
Vassal of England after 1500: Electorate of Hanover
With Austrians as vassal: Holy Roman Empire
 
France:
Vassal of Byzantium: Theme/Exarchate of Gallia
Vassal of Arabia: Emirate of Frangistan
Vassal of Cordoba/Morocco: Emirate of Arbuna
Vassal of Spain/Aragon: Viceroyalty of France
Vassal of Denmark/Norway/Sweden: Duchy of Normandy
Vassal of Venice: Venetian France
Vassal of Novgorod/Kiev/Russia: Russian France
Vassal of Burgundy/Germany/Prussia: Western Francia
Vassal of England: United Kingdom of France
Vassal of Scotland: County of France
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg France
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Frangistan
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of France

Burgundy and Germany vassalized under Merchant Republic with Islam: Western Islamic Republic
Under Merchant Republic with Islam: French Islamic Republic
Burgundy and Germany vassalized under Mechant Republic: Western Republic
Burgundy and Germany vassalized with Islam: Western Sultanate
Under Merchant Republic: French Republic
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of France
Burgundy and Germany vassalized: Western Empire

At least 3 unstable provinces after 843 AD: French Empire
At least 6 ok provinces after 843 AD: French Empire
At least 3 unstable provinces: Frankish Empire
At least 6 ok provinces: Frankish Empire
After 987 AD: Kingdom of France
After 843 AD: West Francia
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Kingdom of the Franks

Hungary:
Vassal of Byzantium: Theme/Exarchate of Sirmium
Vassal of France: Duchy of Hungary
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba/Morocco: Emirate of Hungary
Vassal of Spain/Aragon, Islam state religion: Spanish Emirate of Hungary
Vassal of Spain/Aragon: Spanish Kingdom of Hungary
Vassal of Denmark/Norway/Sweden: Norse Hungary
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Hungary
Vassal of Novgorod/Kiev/Russia: Russian Hungary
Vassal of Germany/Prussia: German Hungary
Vassal of England/Scotland: County of Hungary
Vassal of Austria, Islam state religion: Habsburg Emirate of Hungary
Vassal of Austria: Royal Hungary
Vassal of Ottomans: Principality of Transylvania
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Hungary

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of Hungary
Under Merchant Republic: Republic of Hungary
Islam State Religion: Sultanate of Hungary
At least 2 unstable provinces: Hungarian Empire
At least 5 ok provinces: Hungarian Empire
After 1001 AD: Kingdom of Hungary
Have a Christian State Religion: Kingdom of Hungary
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Principality of Hungary

Bulgaria:
Vassal of Byzantium: Theme/Exarchate of Bulgaria
Vassal of France: Duchy of Bulgaria
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba/Morocco: Emirate of Bulgaria
Vassal of Spain/Aragon, Islam state religion: Spanish Emirate of Bulgaria
Vassal of Spain/Aragon: Spanish Kingdom of Bulgaria
Vassal of Denmark/Norway/Sweden: Varangian Bulgaria
Vassal of Venice: Venetian Bulgaria
Vassal of Novgorod/Kiev/Russia: Principality of Bulgaria
Vassal of Germany/Prussia: German Bulgaria
Vassal of England/Scotland: Counties of Bulgaria
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Bulgaria
Vassal of Ottomans: Eyalet of Rumelia
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Bulgaria

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Republic of Bulgaria
Under Merchant Republic: Republic of Bulgaria
Islam State Religion: Caliphate of Bulgaria
Respawned and has 2 unstable provinces without being Islam: Second Bulgarian Empire
Has 2 unstable provinces without being Islam after turn 150: Second Bulgarian Empire
Has 2 unstable provinces without being Islam: Bulgarian Empire
Orthodox State Religion: Bulgarian Tsardom
Catholic/Protestant State Religion: Bulgarian Kingdom
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Bulgarian Khanate

Byzantium:
Vassal of France: Duchy of Greece
Vassal of Arabia/Cordoba/Morocco: Emirate of Constantinople
Vassal of Spain/Aragon, holding Thessaly province: Duchies of Athens and Neopatria
Vassal of Spain/Aragon: Duchy of Neopatria
Vassal of Denmark/Norway/Sweden: Varangian Roman Empire
Vassal of Venice, holding Morea province, Islam state religion: Emirate of Morea
Vassal of Venice, holding Morea province: Kingdom of Morea
Vassal of Venice, Islam state religion: Latin Emirate
Vassal of Venice: Latin Empire
Vassal of Novgorod/Kiev/Russia, holding Constantinople: Russian Tsargrad
Vassal of Germany/Prussia, holding Constantinople: Eastern Roman Empire
Vassal of Germany/Prussia: Eastern Roman States
Vassal of England/Scotland: Counties of Greece
Vassal of Austria: Habsburg Greece
Vassal of Ottomans, holding Thrace province: Eyalet of Thrace
Vassal of Ottomans: Eyalet of Greece
Vassal of Genoa, Islam state religion: Latin Emirate
Vassal of Genoa: Latin Empire
Generic Vassal (all the other civs): Province of Byzantium

Under Merchant Republic with Islam: Islamic Roman Republic
Under Merchant Republic: Second Roman Republic
Islam State Religion: Islamic Byzantine Empire
Holding Constaninople province: Byzantine Empire
Default name (if nothing else is true from the ones above): Eastern Roman States
 
Finally convinced myself to code some very long due DCN names.
Ehh, it's a tedious and extremely boring work, but France and Hungary is updated at last :)
It was indeed very annoying to see them as Frankish Empire and Hungarian Empire all game long.
These are still far from final, I would love keep them improved.
Minor changes are fairly quick to make, so all suggestions are very welcomed.
 
For the Byzantine vassals, maybe Exarchate would be better than Theme? Exarchates were much larger and more autonomous, and which seems to fit the idea of an ingame vassal more.

Also, perhaps Latin Empire for Byzantium as vassal of Venice/Genoa would be better?
 
For the Byzantine vassals, maybe Exarchate would be better than Theme? Exarchates were much larger and more autonomous, and which seems to fit the idea of an ingame vassal more.

Also, perhaps Latin Empire for Byzantium as vassal of Venice/Genoa would be better?

Oh, yeah, it was meant to be Latin Empire.
About themes and exarchates, I based it on the first post of this page, by Spirictum.
He argued that Exarchates were an earlier, while Themes a later system used in the Byzantine administration.
I'm ok with it either way.
 
Well, there's nothing to say that the Byzantines wouldn't have kept their exarchates if they hadn't all been conquered. ;) But really, the main reason I prefer exarchates over themes is because the themes are so small in comparison to even the smallest civ; it's like using Sanjaks instead of Eyalets for an Ottoman vassal.

Also, would it be possible for the Byzantine Empire to change name based on where its capital is (i.e. if Constantinople is lost)? Then there could be names like Empire of Nicaea, Empire of Trebizond, etc.
 
Well, there's nothing to say that the Byzantines wouldn't have kept their exarchates if they hadn't all been conquered. ;) But really, the main reason I prefer exarchates over themes is because the themes are so small in comparison to even the smallest civ; it's like using Sanjaks instead of Eyalets for an Ottoman vassal.

Also, would it be possible for the Byzantine Empire to change name based on where its capital is (i.e. if Constantinople is lost)? Then there could be names like Empire of Nicaea, Empire of Trebizond, etc.

Alright, as I said Exarchates also work for me perfectly. Let's hear a couple more opinions on it though, Right now it's 1-1 between you and Spirictum :)

Capital province - DCN dependecy isn't implemented yet, but it would be very usedul for lots of civs, and it's on my todo list for a while.
Requires some more complex coding in the .dll (at least it's not solveable in python), but I will get there eventually.
 
Another suggestion: for France as vassal of Cordoba/Morocco, Emirate of Arbuna (i.e. Narbonne), since they actually conquered the region for some time (I assume Poitiers is just based on the Battle of Poitiers?).
 
Another suggestion: for France as vassal of Cordoba/Morocco, Emirate of Arbuna (i.e. Narbonne), since they actually conquered the region for some time (I assume Poitiers is just based on the Battle of Poitiers?).

I don't remember who came up with it (it's entirely possible that it was me :crazyeye: as I took the base of the lists from older notes), but yeah, I would also guess that it's only based on the battle.
Emirate of Arbuna sounds good.
 
To be honest exarchate ot theme, doesnt matter at all. but first one sound better to my eyes. :)
in the feedback threads are a lots of idea, what to do and there are more in some new too.
 
I definitely prefer exarchate, as themata sound more like internal provinces of the empire rather than vassal states.
 
These are some further suggestions for vassals:

If we intend to change the vassal titles, we should consider to use for

venice: colony (this is what venice used for their possessions)
russia: guberniya (administrative subdivision created by tzar Peter)
turkey: beylik
germany: march (german "Mark" meaning borderland)
byzantium: exarchate up to 630
byzantium: theme from 630 (Byzantine district -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theme_%28Byzantine_district%29)

What do you guys prefer for the Ottomans' vassals? Eyalet or Beylik?
Both were commonly used as administrative units, with Eyalets seem to cover somewhat bigger territories, but Beylik also looks like a valid choice in some cases.
Any thoughts on Colony, Guberniya?
March is already used for some civs
 
Personally I prefer Eyalet (it might be more relevant) but Beylik is relevant too. There was the Beylik of Tunis.
Colony and March sound fine.
Will Governate be used over Guberniya?
 
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