Easter Island

[thecaesar]

If I remember correctly, the first Romans were descended from the Etruscans who in turn were ethnically Greek, so christos has a point (although by that logic we could arguably trace all civilisations back to Ethiopia). In any case the Romans were rather in awe of the Greeks and copied great chunks of their culture - I mean come on guys, giving their gods different names and trying to pass them off as your own idea is a bit like trying to disguise them with cartoon moustaches.

Yes, that's exactly what I'm talking about. However, although your mustache analogy is accurate, the Romans also improved a lot of Greek technology they borrowed; for example, the Roman Ballista was an improved version of a primitive crossbow invented by the Greeks, and the well-know Roman Legion is a version of the Phalanx altered by the Romans to perform better.

[DEVIATION]The Greek phalanx, while virtually indestructible from the front, was very weak on the rear and flank, and could not disengage once engaged. The Roman Legion was more versatile thanks to better organization and the use of Gladius, a short sword, as opposed to an unweildy spear, retained cohesion while pursuing or retreating, and could fight on the flanks and even the rear.[/DEVIATION]

If it's any consolation to thecaesar, Rome has of course evolved into the fine world power we know as Italy

NUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The Italians may occupy the same land as, and be decended from, the Romans, but they should not be compared to the Romans!!! The Romans were conquerors, the Italians were the conquered*. The Romans were feared, the Italians laughed at*. I have nothing agains Italians, but they don't measure up to the Romans.

*In the middle ages up to the 1850's.

 

[christos200]

Romans are italians. So italians are greek. ( ancient greek colonies in italy+ rome+ migriation to italy after 1453) So the war between italy and greece at 1941 was in reality a greek civil war.

 

[Linkman226]

But Greeks are Ethiopians. So it doesn't matter.

 

[GHalfrunt]

Oy vey, I can't leave this thread alone for a day without it filling up with arguments? Here, how about this? Greece and Rome are both descended from a wave of Proto-Indo-Europeans that showed up around the Mediterranean around 4,000 years ago. The Basques were all over Iberia for sure and possibly other parts of Western Europe, too, for thousands of years before that and still haven't been wiped out or assimilated even though both the Romans and the Greeks colonized Spain at their empires' peaks. So I'm voting that they win over both Greece and Rome. Okay? Argument over.

 

[thecaesar]

They weren't a civilization...

 

[GHalfrunt]

The CIV mod community begs to differ.

(As do the members of ETA, but maybe we shouldn't bring them into this.)

 

[Linkman226]

'Civilization' is so loosely defined that I stopped accepting it as a valid demarcator of anything a long, long time ago.

 

[Lead Paint]

Yes, that's exactly what I'm talking about. However, although your mustache analogy is accurate, the Romans also improved a lot of Greek technology they borrowed; for example, the Roman Ballista was an improved version of a primitive crossbow invented by the Greeks, and the well-know Roman Legion is a version of the Phalanx altered by the Romans to perform better.

I agree, the Romans were master engineers and tacticians. However they severely lacked creativity, which they envied the Greeks for. Hence stealing Greek inventions and culture and colouring them slightly differently in the hope no-one will notice.

In terms of what defines a civilisation, I stopped trusting Civ4's word on it as soon as 'Native America' became one

 

[mayor]

HEY! Native America was a great civilization that consisted of....well....multiple civilzations

 

[strijder20]

So were the Celts, basically. They were one people, but very divided.
And the 'Chinese' is a group of civilizations too. (Qin dinasty, Hang dynasty...)

 

[thecaesar]

Well, the chinese were a Civilization later in history; the Celts and Native Americans are generalizations of a bunch of different (but similar) tribes, not really so much Civilizations... But Linkman is right, the definition of "Civilization" is very loose.

 

[GHalfrunt]

Not a lot of action this time around, I'm afraid, but some moderately strange developments.

Although court expansionists, in particular two nobles known as "momo1000" and "mayor", had hoped to absorb the Hawaiians into the Rapanui Empire, they were beaten to it by Japan. Ongoing antagonism of India notwithstanding, the Rapanui Empire was cautious about upsetting China and its vassals. The nobles' prevailing philosophy, an early version of what would eventually be known as "Pan-Polynesianism", continued to grow, and many theoretical and ambitious long-term plans were made for settling the remaining Pacific islands.

Spoiler :

Some also grew concerned that the Rapanui were in fact lagging behind their neighbors in some significant areas of science. Their piratical raiding of the New Indian coast was threatened (but certainly not stopped) by bizarre new weapons... giant balloons* that dropped explosives on their ships. Piracy proved to be a valuable new source of income, but failed to outweigh the costs of further upgrades of military equipment and an expensive new propaganda campaign to spread Rapanui culture more quickly to the rural areas of New India, in hopes of seizing their land without war.

Spoiler :

Land available for colonization outside of the Pacific and Southwest Land was at a premium, and international trade was booming. Going against the wishes of many in the court, a colony was established on the southern tip of the Great Mainland to serve both as a strategic military base and as a "free town": a market and supply station for traders and explorers rounding the dangerous "End of the World" cape.

Spoiler :

War again broke out in 1606, when Persia and its vassals jointly invaded Rome. The plan met a very quick backfire when Rome captured a Persian city on the Mediterranean coast (not pictured because Print Screen glitched again). Still, the outcome of the war was far from certain, and Rapanui explorers stayed in the region as observers.

Spoiler :

Greece, on behalf of Greater Persia, requested Rapanui intervention, but after careful deliberation, the Rapanui court declined. This time, they could have made more than a simple display of moral support like they had made in Russia's war on England; they had already been considering encouraging privateer harassment of the Roman province of Madagascar. However, Rome was a close friend of China, and the Rapanui goal was to pry India and China apart, not to get involved in a costly, probably unwinnable war with the superpower and its vassals.

Spoiler :

I'm wondering: If China comes to Rome's defense, should I enter the war on their side to ingratiate myself to China? Should I attempt to attack Roman shipping off Madagascar? Both? Neither?

-----
*My fellow Monty Python fans, however, know that "It's an airship, not a bloody balloon!"

 

[christos200]

Help greece, take over rome and give it to the greeks. If they dont want rome then raze it.

Also great update.

 

[Jwitti]

Really, christos?

 

[MaxWar]

Ive been interested in this story for a few days. Really was a crazy idea to begin with and i like that. Interesting to see how this is all evolving, well written, cool update

 

[Dumanios]

Invade Rome, Invade Greece, give cities to America.

 

[Lead Paint]

Invade Rome, invade Greece, invade America, raze EVERYTHING

 

[christos200]

 

[Jwitti]

:gasp: We need one if we don't have it. Anyway, :gasp: christos agreed to the razing of Greece!!!

 

[MoreEpicThanYou]

Wait... this means the Apocalypse is here!