Eastern civ in development

[Seon]

Which made traditional boarding stretegy of Japanese Navy impossible... Yes the shell and the spikes were anti-boarding weapon, so it was not much of an ironclad as the outer covering was not intended for defense against cannons

 

[civ_king]

for its purpose, it was exceptionally effective

 

[Opera]

When I mentioned my idea of an elemental civilization a few days ago, Ahwaric told me it would go with eastern civ. I wasn't totally convinced it would go along. I'm still not convinced. But I would like to share my ideas here...

First, there would be 4 leaders, one for each element (5 if Ice). The palace would provides 3 mana according to the leader. For example, if Leader A is Air and is played, the Palace in the capital would be 3 Air. If it was Leader B (who is Fire), it would have been 3 Fire. Every unit (that hasn't already a predefined race) would gain the {Element} Elemental upon production.

The thing is that a national wonder is available at some tech that give the possibility of using 1 {Leader} Mana in exchange to another mana that isn't {Leader} Mana. Only one of each wonder can be built in game. The point of having multiple but different elemental mana is that the "elemental" units can change their "race". They can shift to Water element and thus totally change their purpose. The point of having multiple but same mana is to enhance the power of your units, in exchange of a more rigid gameplay.

Lorewise, they would be humans "touched" by the power within the mana nodes, particularly by the elemental ones. At first, they would not have "learned" to use their powers, instead they would rather live with it. Only time, research and experience could grant them, say, a powerful promotion giving them +1 affinity for some mana.

Having written all of this, I'm still not quite sure it would fit with what has been discussed about the eastern civ. There would be no "summoning elementals" thing since they are, in a way, the elementals (btw, the summoning spells would certainly be different for them).

 

[arkham4269]

When I mentioned my idea of an elemental civilization a few days ago, Ahwaric told me it would go with eastern civ. I wasn't totally convinced it would go along. I'm still not convinced. But I would like to share my ideas here...

Hmmm, well that certainly new. I, however, still like the idea of a T/N/I Civ heavy into mysticism that summon mid-level elementals through 'kami shrines' or something dependent on which mana nodes they have.

...since we can't have both, obviously it must be resolved. Hmmm, I guess it's time for stripped to the waist at dawn with butcher's cleavers! (Sorry, old, old geek joke from the Horseclan's novels)

Actually, in some respects I think this would go a long way toward making a C/K/J Civ more unique and you'd still have your nice graphics that geeks like me want along with ninjas.

Another idea is perhaps the leader changes during the game? Every 100 years the culture goes into a new season? I mean in classical paganism you have East = Air, South = Fire, West = Water and North = Earth.

So the game starts you with one (or maybe you get to pick) and then you either randomly get one every 100 years or you 'progress' through year (East/Air = Spring, South/Fire=Summer, West/Water=Autumn and North/Earth=Winter)

If you do the progression through the year, it might make some sense. Start in winter and the Earth mana will allow you to build walls for protection. Come 'Spring' you can then use your air mana to speed your ships to explore. Come 'Summer' the game is heating up and you use fire to attack your foes. Finally come Autumn, the water mana will come in handy as by this time in the game you have to cross water boundaries to get at other civs so those Water Elementals will be needed.

Obviously it is possible to hit turn 500+ so the 5th leader would have to be Spirit which to the Celts was the 5th unifying element.

 

[Iskar Jarak]

Firstly what do T/N/I and C/K/J mean.
secondly, you wouldn't need a fifth element, and if your doing the 4 seasons thing then you wouldn't want 5 elements, if the game does go beyond turn 500 just have it loop, or have the whole thing be like the adaptive trait where you get to choose between them.

 

[Valkrionn]

Tibetan/Nepalese/Indian and Chinese/Korean/Japanese, I believe.

 

[civ_king]

the five elements are (element/direction/season/:
Wood/East/Spring
Fire/South/Summer
Earth/Center/Change of seasons (Every third month)
Metal/West/Autumn
Water/North/Winter

 

[Seon]

I prefer thinking about it as Air, Earth, Fire, and Water. Never got the Wood, fire, earth, metal, and water elements... although it kind of made sense in a vague kind of way.

 

[arkham4269]

the five elements are (element/direction/season/:
Wood/East/Spring
Fire/South/Summer
Earth/Center/Change of seasons (Every third month)
Metal/West/Autumn
Water/North/Winter

Where did you get these directions?

 

[Valkrionn]

Chinese astrology uses those directions/elements.

 

[Opera]

Any feedback, Ahwaric? I mean, not especially on what I said (which everyone but Arkham bypassed ) but on the whole eastern civ idea. You've been silent for a while on this thread.

I re-read it a bit (the three first pages in fact) and I think it's more akin to what I said above. I believed my idea was different but it isn't really that different after all. I'm not sure it would be what I imagined but, hey, if it doesn't please me, I know what I'll do

Anyway, I really like xienwolf's idea but I wonder how to balance that. Since you said you don't want them to use magic as other civs do, maybe they couldn't use mana to do magic? They will resort to alchemy for that, for example. Maybe using resources for spells, instead of mana.

 

[civ_king]

Look what I found http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=2795 (turtle ship )

 

[sputnik323]

the five elements are (element/direction/season/:
Wood/East/Spring
Fire/South/Summer
Earth/Center/Change of seasons (Every third month)
Metal/West/Autumn
Water/North/Winter

I prefer to think of wood and metal as life and death forces... Just sounds cooler! Sticking with the elemental theme there are only 4 included in elementalism tech. I think a 5th unifying (all elements in one) leader/units would be really awesome as the game progressed.

- with the introduction of this civ, I think that the mages guild building should provide the resistances to magic as a choice(free promotion) instead of through xp promotion. There are just too many good promotions to go through to ever use it except heros. Civs should only get the resistances they have access to mana. So access to fire mana would gain access to resistance to fire. Having a powerful elemental civ will actually make the resistances useful. Only one promotion should be free, all other resistances should be gained through xp promotion.

 

[Ahwaric]

Any feedback, Ahwaric? I mean, not especially on what I said (which everyone but Arkham bypassed ) but on the whole eastern civ idea. You've been silent for a while on this thread.

I am sorry. RL work, plus adding some things to o.23 - I wanted to add them for a long time and it takes time.

I did not abandon the idea, just sheduled it for later.
For now, I think they would less use elemental magic but rather be one with elementals - a bit like genasi. Elemental mana would grant bonuses to normal units (like xienwolf's ideas) and also some 'magic affinity' - specializing in chosen element combat style, cities different because of dedication to magic spheres...

But some extra magic power and elementals spawned in cities would be nice, too

ANyway, I did not start working yet. Will have to wait for a later 0.23 patch or .24. But want to work on them soon.

 

[Thonnas]

could be a good civ to integrate some type of "geomancer" unit(s) that someone was working on as a UUs.

I'd make the female leader a mischievous, aristocratic-type, and have a male general-type, and male spiritual leader-type.

I kind of hate to see another agnostic civ (that's actually not agnostic, but rather forced to utilize their own civ specific religion). If you think there's room for another (eastern) religion, why not make it, otherwise, hope you can make this (and other) civs more compatible with default religion options.

Also, kind of related, some of the pagan temple replacements (more specifically the promotions from them) really seem to pigeon hole the civs into certain paths. I'll probably look into it more, but it might just be something to consider while working on these guys.

 

[Opera]

I am sorry. RL work, plus adding some things to o.23 - I wanted to add them for a long time and it takes time.

I did not abandon the idea, just sheduled it for later.
For now, I think they would less use elemental magic but rather be one with elementals - a bit like genasi. Elemental mana would grant bonuses to normal units (like xienwolf's ideas) and also some 'magic affinity' - specializing in chosen element combat style, cities different because of dedication to magic spheres...

But some extra magic power and elementals spawned in cities would be nice, too

ANyway, I did not start working yet. Will have to wait for a later 0.23 patch or .24. But want to work on them soon.

Okay. As I thought, this is more inline with my idea. I'll let you create it then. I'll create something else

 

[civ_king]

I prefer to think of wood and metal as life and death forces... Just sounds cooler! Sticking with the elemental theme there are only 4 included in elementalism tech. I think a 5th unifying (all elements in one) leader/units would be really awesome as the game progressed.

- with the introduction of this civ, I think that the mages guild building should provide the resistances to magic as a choice(free promotion) instead of through xp promotion. There are just too many good promotions to go through to ever use it except heros. Civs should only get the resistances they have access to mana. So access to fire mana would gain access to resistance to fire. Having a powerful elemental civ will actually make the resistances useful. Only one promotion should be free, all other resistances should be gained through xp promotion.

melee line?

 

[sputnik323]

melee line?

@ civ king guess I dont understand your question



Just curious... cause I know there are lots of things going on for the next patch... Any progress on this civ? its easier to brainstorm and think of ideas when we know whats going on.

 

[Seon]

I belive Ahwaric is still working on it. BUt it won't becompleted any time soon, as with the Easter Eggs. Honestly Ahwaric, if what I requested was too hard to balance, yuo can substitute it with the rabbit of Caerbanog or Bun-Bun (in case you don't know .

 

[Opera]

It's especially that Ahwaric is working on debugging and balancing these days. Currently, there's a big issue with minor leaders and numerous minor ones that keep him from working a new features.