Economy Mod

[Valkrionn]

Alright people, have some questions for you all. Your answers determine how I implement a few things.

First: I've fixed the buildqueue mod. It now:

• May be toggled on and off.
• Does not come into effect in the "Choose Production" popup (meaning no more having to hit close every time the popup comes up)
• Purchasing items no longer places them in the queue.

However... It annoys me to have to toggle it all the time. So, there are three options I see here; Which should I use?

1. Queue defaults to On, but may be disabled.
2. Queue is always on. Clicking an item places it in the queue and closes the dialog immediately (as it would if the queue was disabled), shift-clicking adds the item to the back of the queue (current standard), ctrl-clicking adds it to the front (current shift), alt-click clears the queue and then adds the item (Current ctrl)
3. Nothing. Leave it as it is and suck it up.

The first is simple. The second is nearly as simple, and while it prevents you from closing the queue, it otherwise has the same functionality.


Now for a second question: The "Choose your next tech" popup, should it open the side bar, or the tech screen? I'm open to either, think I slightly prefer the bar honestly, aside from the fact that it constantly resets the infopanel to the tech display.

 

[Feyd Rautha]

I say go with option 1. I sometimes like not having my queue up, but it is rare. As long as I can turn it off I'm golden.

 

[Valkrionn]

Yes, but with option two, it functions like in Civ4. You only get the queue functionality if you specifically choose to use it (via use of shift, ctrl, or alt clicks); A standard click just switches production. Meaning you can entirely ignore the queue functionality, aside from the expanded display in the city screen (If not for that one item, I honestly would not even ask. The civ4 method is unobtrusive and well done; I have no idea why it was changed).

Edit: Also, any opinion on the second question?

 

[davidlee]

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=380955

there's a mod out already for game-wide 2upt play. Not saying this makes it easy / feasible, just thought I'd mention it ... (re: 2 units inside castles)

 

[Valkrionn]

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=380955

there's a mod out already for game-wide 2upt play. Not saying this makes it easy / feasible, just thought I'd mention it ... (re: 2 units inside castles)

I'm aware there is a mod out (and likely played with it before any of you, by a few hours at least )... It involved changing a single line of xml.

However, that line is a constant, a global define. We have no control over specifics. For example, we can't have it apply to only civilian or military units, we can't have more units stack in cities, etc.

That mod exists because the capability was allowed for by the devs, not from any real code behind it.

 

[Lebowski89]

I'm not sure... I know there is an animation option in the Advanced start menu, but I think that's just combat.

I personally just play from the strategic view. I prefer it anyway.

wow, I thought they added that as a joke I just have no idea what is going on when I switch to that view.

Anyway, I think the main problem with the build queue was not being able to buy units without disrupting what was being built. If you have fixed that than option 1 would be best imo.

 

[davidlee]

thanks for taking the time to explain.

My vote would be for #2 btw - my biggest annoyance with the default queue is how it takes 5 clicks + mouse movements to add something to the top or move the current item to the bottom. Poor UI design there.

 

[Novem]

I've used your Mod Valkirionn, I like it very much btw.

It would be nice to have the queue work as it did in Civ4 as it was easy to use. So I would vote for option 2.

 

[darkedone02]

I like option 2, I am already used to civ 5's default queue system, but I still like civ 4 better (and it's in-built world editor).

 

[Valkrionn]

Okay, going to go with option2.

Any opinion on the tech popup?

Also, I got fed up with trying to get the damn tabs to work last night, decided to go with an infopane, and then just as I settle down to actually code the thing, someone else released a working version. As I've modified the TopPanel.lua file, the two mods will not work together separately... But he's given general permission for people to merge it, so this will be the resource pane used. Saves me a lot of time, for sure.

Can check it out here: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=9709601#post9709601

 

[Elvince]

just a word to say I really like your work so far, go with option 2 please
when are you planning to have the next version up?

cheers

Elvince

Ps: I find that reducing unit cost works pretty well with my AI tweak mod btw...

 

[Valkrionn]

just a word to say I really like your work so far, go with option 2 please
when are you planning to have the next version up?

cheers

Elvince

Ps: I find that reducing unit cost works pretty well with my AI tweak mod btw...

Hopefully sometime today; All that's really left is to remove some tweaks that I decided I didn't want (makes the top bar too cluttered at smaller resolutions), and then adding the new bonus resource buildings.

Right now, however, I have some calculus to be doing. Still in college.

 

[dweebit]

Love this mod. Just wanted to warn you guys though that it makes warring on higher difficulties really hard. I was playing an immortal game as Rome (I had whopping 8 irons in my territory!) and I started up a little border war with Russia (she had 4 irons). In our first skirmish, my goal was to take control of the far side of a mountain pass which joined our two empires. I wound up wiping out all of her swordsmen plus what was probably the majority of her auxiliaries while securing a small foothold on her side of the divide. However my own forces sustained heavy casualties while trying to be pooped out of the buttcrack of the mountain range so i decided I'd take 10 turns of peace to reinforce and heal. Turns out this was a horrible mistake. Within 5 turns, all 4 russian swordsmen were back on the field with a hefty stream of archers and spearmen coming to back them up. after maybe 30 more turns of trying desperately to thin Russia's ever expanding forces, I gave up. Presumably Caesar committed suicide in a bunker as the bits were being reset. Thats what I'd like to think.

Anyways, a combination of the AI "cheats" on higher difficulties and the decreased unit costs with this mod seems to snowball out of control. When russia had this sort of production out of her (fairly crappy looking) classical-age empire, god know what a medieval or later war would have been like.

 

[Archwizard]

For the new tech I strongly prefer the list on the left. If I want to see the whole tree I can click the button there.

 

[Hystrix]

I'd just like to say THANKS FOR THE MOD, it saved civ V for me. otherwise i think i'd be back on civ IV. ^_^

 

[Kyoss]

Heya Valkrionn,
i played a little with your mod and liked most of the changes you made. I'm not sure if i like the workshop yet, but its true most cities rely on mountains in the first period of the game for production.

I once had a city surrounded by nothing but grass & floodplains and the production was nil.

However i think your changes to the route-maintenance cost did reduce them to zero.

 

[davidlee]

I am strongly of the opinion that "select tech directly on tech tree" should be its own mod. It's small, self contained, orthogonal and has no obvious connection to the rest of the features bundled in the "economy mod".

Furthermore, people who don't want to run Economy Mod might want that behaviour.

It's rather nice how the Balance mods have been packaged separately and presented together in one thread - as the Economy Mod starts to tackle more disparate things (ie, as soon as you include anything I don't want included I'd encourage consideration of the same strategy - but then, I'm sure you've already thought about it. Just sayin.

 

[Franks]

Anyways, a combination of the AI "cheats" on higher difficulties and the decreased unit costs with this mod seems to snowball out of control. When russia had this sort of production out of her (fairly crappy looking) classical-age empire, god know what a medieval or later war would have been like.

Immortal is intended to be hard. Actually I find Immortal and Diety the only challenging difficulties. In my current Immortal game as France, I'm in the industrial era controling all my continent (I conquered Iroquois, Japan (who conquered Egypt) and America without much problems. The war against Japan was really slow for the first 20-30 turns due to the full-strenght fighting Samurais. I think the key on higher diff is to be patient and bring reinforcements non-stop, eventually you'll progress. At the end of the war I had around 6 Cannons, 4 Knights and 16 Musketeers (Normal, Standard, Continents). Right now Russia controls the whole other continent and has an army about 3 times bigger than mine, so I plan to build a huge air/nuclear force and win by space.

Anyways, I love this mod, it makes the game more enjoyable, I play it without the workshop tho as in my last game the AI was spamming it everywhere and I didn't bother using it. Keep up the (very) good work, I really hope the devs will implement most of this in an official patch!

 

[db0]

Love this mod. Just wanted to warn you guys though that it makes warring on higher difficulties really hard. I was playing an immortal game as Rome (I had whopping 8 irons in my territory!) and I started up a little border war with Russia (she had 4 irons). In our first skirmish, my goal was to take control of the far side of a mountain pass which joined our two empires. I wound up wiping out all of her swordsmen plus what was probably the majority of her auxiliaries while securing a small foothold on her side of the divide. However my own forces sustained heavy casualties while trying to be pooped out of the buttcrack of the mountain range so i decided I'd take 10 turns of peace to reinforce and heal. Turns out this was a horrible mistake. Within 5 turns, all 4 russian swordsmen were back on the field with a hefty stream of archers and spearmen coming to back them up. after maybe 30 more turns of trying desperately to thin Russia's ever expanding forces, I gave up. Presumably Caesar committed suicide in a bunker as the bits were being reset. Thats what I'd like to think.

Anyways, a combination of the AI "cheats" on higher difficulties and the decreased unit costs with this mod seems to snowball out of control. When russia had this sort of production out of her (fairly crappy looking) classical-age empire, god know what a medieval or later war would have been like.

This mod actually makes the AI more challenging as it can recover from its losses and bring reinforcements before you manage to take all its cities (especially with the higher difficulty bonuses). All in all a great improvement.

I'll also like to mirror the idea that too many completely distinct modifications should be their own mod and keep things a bit modular.

 

[Valkrionn]

For the new tech I strongly prefer the list on the left. If I want to see the whole tree I can click the button there.

I agree, and have already removed that.

I'd just like to say THANKS FOR THE MOD, it saved civ V for me. otherwise i think i'd be back on civ IV. ^_^

Glad to hear you like it.

Heya Valkrionn,
i played a little with your mod and liked most of the changes you made. I'm not sure if i like the workshop yet, but its true most cities rely on mountains in the first period of the game for production.

I once had a city surrounded by nothing but grass & floodplains and the production was nil.

However i think your changes to the route-maintenance cost did reduce them to zero.

Yeah, the workshop is a bit situational really, but can be useful if you have nothing else to rely on.

And the route maintenance did, yes, as it doesn't accept decimal values. I had not intended to have that in, was just a simple way to test for someone else which I then forgot to remove before releasing. It's been gone for the next version.

I am strongly of the opinion that "select tech directly on tech tree" should be its own mod. It's small, self contained, orthogonal and has no obvious connection to the rest of the features bundled in the "economy mod".

Furthermore, people who don't want to run Economy Mod might want that behaviour.

It's rather nice how the Balance mods have been packaged separately and presented together in one thread - as the Economy Mod starts to tackle more disparate things (ie, as soon as you include anything I don't want included I'd encourage consideration of the same strategy - but then, I'm sure you've already thought about it. Just sayin.

Unfortunately, it does not work that way. If I do anything at all with the UI (And I will, as some features I want require it, and as I've said, this is more a showcase of changes I think should be made to the base game than anything else) I have to overwrite the entire file the change is made in. This means interface mods that affect the same thing are not compatible with one another, so I tend to include them.

For instance, I've added both a clock, and the ability to click your gold display to bring up the economic adviser. Sure, you could make each of those their own mod. But they would no longer function together; Both affect the top panel, with the way I implemented the clock (which I did because I think it looks far better).

WIth xml mods, however, if I see someone do something that I was going to do (and I'm satisfied with what they did), then I'll just recommend you use their mod. For instance, Afforess's Active City Defense mod.