eldar03: Playing Footsie (Monarch, slow units only)
- Thread starter eldar
- Start date
I'm only on turn 5, but I'd like some input. Here's what's happened so far:
First off, a dot map. Is this more or less what you were aiming for Eldar?
IT - Things look good, so I press enter.
Writing comes in. I'm not sure whether we should keep the set path of CoL then philo, or just go for philo. I decide to try to get CoL based on my previous experience. I usually go writing on min, then max to philo. Since we did writing on max, it should even out.
Do we want to establish any embassies? Doesn't matter - we can't afford to.
2510 BC (Turn 1) - Eric and Zinedine keep exploring. Zinedine gets barbs.
2470 BC (Turn 2) - Eric gets booted to the other side of Ottoman territory. Zinedine kills a barb.
Greece shows up. Trade Alexander Iron Working for The Wheel and 20 gold. Horses are south of Paris.
Only Osman doesn't have Iron Working now, so I trade it to him for Ceremonial Burial and his 5 gold. Osman has Math, but we aren't getting it without trading writing.
2430 BC (Turn 3) - Paris Barracks > Warrior
Orleans Worker > Barracks
The new worker starts irrigating the wheat at Orleans.
Zinedine walks out to a mountain on what looks like a peninsula - it is.
2390 BC (Turn 4) - Osman has a worker up for trade. The first post says "standard SG rules." Does that mean that we can buy workers this early or not? IIRC, you can't under RB, but can under LK. However, the LK games are deity, this is not. I think it would hurt the AI too much so I don't make the trade. Sorry if this is a mistake.
A Greek warrior wanders by Orleans, but it looks like it is passing through.
2350 BC (Turn 5) - The Greeks declare war?
They raze Orleans? 
This is an unwelcome surprise.
The new warrior also comes in at Paris.
Now for some questions:
1) What do we do with the worker? Move south and hope Alex doesn't have someone waiting (two squares south is fog)? Then try to get home through Korea?
2) Do we still want to have Paris produce a settler?
3) If we produce the settler, where do we want to send it?
4) What aggression level did you set the AIs to eldar? This is the first time I've ever seen one try this.
5) Losing Orleans has screwed up our tech situation. I'm not sure it would be a good idea to try for both CoL and philo any more. What does everyone else think?
First off, a dot map. Is this more or less what you were aiming for Eldar?
IT - Things look good, so I press enter.
Writing comes in. I'm not sure whether we should keep the set path of CoL then philo, or just go for philo. I decide to try to get CoL based on my previous experience. I usually go writing on min, then max to philo. Since we did writing on max, it should even out.
Do we want to establish any embassies? Doesn't matter - we can't afford to.
2510 BC (Turn 1) - Eric and Zinedine keep exploring. Zinedine gets barbs.
2470 BC (Turn 2) - Eric gets booted to the other side of Ottoman territory. Zinedine kills a barb.
Greece shows up. Trade Alexander Iron Working for The Wheel and 20 gold. Horses are south of Paris.
Only Osman doesn't have Iron Working now, so I trade it to him for Ceremonial Burial and his 5 gold. Osman has Math, but we aren't getting it without trading writing.
2430 BC (Turn 3) - Paris Barracks > Warrior
Orleans Worker > Barracks
The new worker starts irrigating the wheat at Orleans.
Zinedine walks out to a mountain on what looks like a peninsula - it is.
2390 BC (Turn 4) - Osman has a worker up for trade. The first post says "standard SG rules." Does that mean that we can buy workers this early or not? IIRC, you can't under RB, but can under LK. However, the LK games are deity, this is not. I think it would hurt the AI too much so I don't make the trade. Sorry if this is a mistake.
A Greek warrior wanders by Orleans, but it looks like it is passing through.
2350 BC (Turn 5) - The Greeks declare war?
They raze Orleans? This is an unwelcome surprise.
The new warrior also comes in at Paris.
Now for some questions:
1) What do we do with the worker? Move south and hope Alex doesn't have someone waiting (two squares south is fog)? Then try to get home through Korea?
2) Do we still want to have Paris produce a settler?
3) If we produce the settler, where do we want to send it?
4) What aggression level did you set the AIs to eldar? This is the first time I've ever seen one try this.
5) Losing Orleans has screwed up our tech situation. I'm not sure it would be a good idea to try for both CoL and philo any more. What does everyone else think?
Minute Man
Prince
Sneak attacked in 2350 BC? Ouch!
1) You pretty much have to run (and hope) with the worker; south is probably the best bet. There isn't really anything else to do.
2) I don't think we want to try any offensive operations yet; just try to hold off the Greeks until we can get peace. Maybe one more warrior in Paris, just to be on the safe side, but then back to a settler - we really need more cities.
3) Away from Greece, methinks.
Probably toward your red dot.
4) Don't know, but I suspect the extra-crowded conditions have something to do with the attack. I've never seen this, either.
5) That depends - does anybody else have writing yet? Or more than one city themselves?
Btw, your pink dot is one space off the coast, which is always annoying, though I'm not sure where else it could go. Maybe one space SE? We'll still get the wheat if we found on the red dot as well.
1) You pretty much have to run (and hope) with the worker; south is probably the best bet. There isn't really anything else to do.
2) I don't think we want to try any offensive operations yet; just try to hold off the Greeks until we can get peace. Maybe one more warrior in Paris, just to be on the safe side, but then back to a settler - we really need more cities.
3) Away from Greece, methinks.
Probably toward your red dot.4) Don't know, but I suspect the extra-crowded conditions have something to do with the attack. I've never seen this, either.
5) That depends - does anybody else have writing yet? Or more than one city themselves?
Btw, your pink dot is one space off the coast, which is always annoying, though I'm not sure where else it could go. Maybe one space SE? We'll still get the wheat if we found on the red dot as well.
Tomoyo
Fate
lurker's comment: You should change the location of pink dot. Pink dot needs to be where Orleans used to be.
Oh, and as long as I'm delurked, I'll add that three tile spacing may be important, since it's infantry only. (Which apparantly bans Mech Infantry 
)
Oh, and as long as I'm delurked, I'll add that three tile spacing may be important, since it's infantry only. (Which apparantly bans Mech Infantry
)Minute Man
Prince
That's a tough call. I'd be sort of inclined to go ahead and finish CoL (especially since we have 5 turns invested already), then decide whether it's worth trying for Phil at that point. Even if we can't pull off the slingshot, it's not the end of the world; we'll still have a CoL monopoly to trade around for other techs.
I'll add mine to Minute Man's as they are similar:
agreed!Minute Man said:
I know we need another town asap but it's no good if it's going to get razed so I would go further and go for an archer first.Minute Man said:
That was my preferred option before but I didn't know about the river and wheat. I would recommend this for now though and then get some archers out of it!Minute Man said:3) Away from Greece, methinks.
I haven't seen it either but I usually get wary around the time when good land is running out. I guess that we've reached that stage already! We now need to make sure that we are not dogpiled hence the need for settlers and offensive units.Minute Man said:
I would carry on-it's only monarch and they will normally go for MM after writing.Minute Man said:
eldar
ChiefTank
Tomoyo is correct, Pink Dot should move to ex-Orleans. There's some Dyes as well, by some Jungle; though Persia may have taken them. Tough call on the Greek DoW. At least they're a long way off?! They're one of the ones I didn't meet.
Agression level is normal, but this feels like an 80% water Pangaea. Very limited room. AIs will run out of it quickly. And Orleans, undefended, is (a) an easy target; (b) a prime target, with its two Furs. Then (c) Monarch AIs do start with, IIRC, 1 offensive and 2 defensive units (maybe the other way round). So Greece with its 2 bonus Hoplites will feel they are somewhat harder than anyone else on the map right now.
Agression level is normal, but this feels like an 80% water Pangaea. Very limited room. AIs will run out of it quickly. And Orleans, undefended, is (a) an easy target; (b) a prime target, with its two Furs. Then (c) Monarch AIs do start with, IIRC, 1 offensive and 2 defensive units (maybe the other way round). So Greece with its 2 bonus Hoplites will feel they are somewhat harder than anyone else on the map right now.
Minute Man
Prince
Tone said:
I missed that we have WC already. So, yeah, build an archer or two.
And I agree that we want to re-found Orleans, but we need to deal with the Greek situation first.
2350 BC (Turn 5 resumed) - Worker goes south, no Greeks in sight.
Eric and Zinedine keep exploring.
Science at 100% now gives CoL in 27 turns at -3gpt. We only have 26 gold (and it will be a while before we can found a city to help with unit costs, so I move it down to 80%. CoL due in 32 turns at -2 gpt.
Swap Paris to Archer.
2310 BC (Turn 6) - Worker finishes roading iron. We won't have enough food to work that for a while, so I move him down to start roading to the red dot.
2270 BC (Turn 7) - The Koreans don't like our worker walking through their lands, but don't give a move or declare order yet.
2230 BC (Turn 8) - The Koreans are moving a settler pair to the west. I sure hope we can get a city there still.
2190 BC (Turn 9) - Paris archer > warrior
The Greek barbarian is walking up to Paris. I move the archer on to the gold hill to meet him.
The archer puts us at -3gpt again. Move science down to 70%. It's going to need to drop again for a turn or two when the settler gets out.
Persia now has writing!
Will the Ottomans trade us Math for Writing? Nope. Does this mean Greece knows it, the Ottomans are about to learn it, or both?
Spain picked up HBR. Writing isn't enough for that either? So much for trade value.
2150 BC (Turn 10) - Attack and flawlessly kill the Greek.
Paris grows, so science can go back up to 80%.
Here's a view of the world. There are dyes south of Barcelona, and and a Korean settler pair somewhere south of our workers.
And the save:
Eric and Zinedine keep exploring.
Science at 100% now gives CoL in 27 turns at -3gpt. We only have 26 gold (and it will be a while before we can found a city to help with unit costs, so I move it down to 80%. CoL due in 32 turns at -2 gpt.
Swap Paris to Archer.
2310 BC (Turn 6) - Worker finishes roading iron. We won't have enough food to work that for a while, so I move him down to start roading to the red dot.
2270 BC (Turn 7) - The Koreans don't like our worker walking through their lands, but don't give a move or declare order yet.
2230 BC (Turn 8) - The Koreans are moving a settler pair to the west. I sure hope we can get a city there still.
2190 BC (Turn 9) - Paris archer > warrior
The Greek barbarian is walking up to Paris. I move the archer on to the gold hill to meet him.
The archer puts us at -3gpt again. Move science down to 70%. It's going to need to drop again for a turn or two when the settler gets out.
Persia now has writing!
Will the Ottomans trade us Math for Writing? Nope. Does this mean Greece knows it, the Ottomans are about to learn it, or both?
Spain picked up HBR. Writing isn't enough for that either? So much for trade value.
2150 BC (Turn 10) - Attack and flawlessly kill the Greek.
Paris grows, so science can go back up to 80%.
Here's a view of the world. There are dyes south of Barcelona, and and a Korean settler pair somewhere south of our workers.
And the save:
eldar
ChiefTank
Variant Rules:
We may never build ground units with a move rate above 1. This means no upgrades allowed to Mech Inf (if the game gets that far) or Radar Artillery (again...), of course.
No Armies, no SoZ! If we capture the SoZ it must be razed if it is still active.
Roster check:
eldar
Ville
Veovim -> just played
Tone -> up
Minute Man -> on deck
We may never build ground units with a move rate above 1. This means no upgrades allowed to Mech Inf (if the game gets that far) or Radar Artillery (again...), of course.
No Armies, no SoZ! If we capture the SoZ it must be razed if it is still active.
Roster check:
eldar
Ville
Veovim -> just played
Tone -> up
Minute Man -> on deck
plarq
Crazy forever
lurker's comment: @eldar:I was not a trainer but a trainee in the game I started.
I'm sorry but I won't be able to play until tomorrow evening. If it's OK with you, eldar and Minute Man can play before this we could swap the rota order if this helps keep momentum. Otherwise I'll post a 'got it' and play my turns after work Tues.
turn 0 (2150)
Press enter!
turn 1 (2110)
Archer onto hill to spot any Greek swine approaching. Workers road BG in south. Erik and Zin continue to scout.
IBT
Korea build town close to game. Cathage has obviously researched Myst and traded with Persia for writing.
turn2 (2070)
Workers head north to get road towards the east. Greeks still refuse our envoy. Reduce research to 70% and still lose 1gpt.
IBT
Mapstat tells me that Greece has Myst but not Writing so maybe they will trade with peace. Vikings have a worker and need techs but if we are passing up worker deals in the early game...
turn 3 (2030)
However, Greece will not even give us a peace deal if we give them Writing for nothing!
IBT
Caught between a rock and a hard place: Persia demands all our gold and we are running a negative budget. If I give in we lose an improvement or a unit. They declare war.
Paris:settler>sword.
turn 4 (1990)
Reduce research to 20% until we settle. Settler and vet warrior move 2 east.
IBT
Ottomans now have Myst and Maths.
turn 5 (1950)
Workers road towards furs and war/settler continue their journey.
turn 6 (1910)
settler/war in place, one worker chops and the other moves to the other furs.
turn 6 (1870)
Found Lyons (rax). Up research to 80%.
turn 7 (1830)
zzz (BTW Greece wants Lyons for PT and Persians will not talk)
turn 8 (1790)
1st forest chopped, furs in 2.
turn 9 (1750)
Persian spear/settler head right for our iron (protected by the archer), 2nd worker roads furs.
turn 10 (1725)
furs connected to Paris, worker mines.
Minute Man: You may want to send the archer towards the Persian settler/spear and see if you can highjack them or wait for the sword next turn. I'll leave this part of the turn to you as you will have to deal with the consequences!
If you wish to switch the build in our 2nd town please be my guest. For example we can get a reg sword once the road is connected or a granary-the choice is yours!
There is a Persian reg warrior E of Bergen if you want to send the elite after him.
All: Sorry if you disagree with not paying the Persians but we could have lost our barracks if we had given in. Luckily there has been no offensive action against us during my 10 turns. Maybe a couple of swords and get Perse? I suggest that our next town is built at the end of the road, SE of game-views?
the save
Press enter!
turn 1 (2110)
Archer onto hill to spot any Greek swine approaching. Workers road BG in south. Erik and Zin continue to scout.
IBT
Korea build town close to game. Cathage has obviously researched Myst and traded with Persia for writing.
turn2 (2070)
Workers head north to get road towards the east. Greeks still refuse our envoy. Reduce research to 70% and still lose 1gpt.
IBT
Mapstat tells me that Greece has Myst but not Writing so maybe they will trade with peace. Vikings have a worker and need techs but if we are passing up worker deals in the early game...
turn 3 (2030)
However, Greece will not even give us a peace deal if we give them Writing for nothing!
IBT
Caught between a rock and a hard place: Persia demands all our gold and we are running a negative budget. If I give in we lose an improvement or a unit. They declare war.
Paris:settler>sword.
turn 4 (1990)
Reduce research to 20% until we settle. Settler and vet warrior move 2 east.
IBT
Ottomans now have Myst and Maths.
turn 5 (1950)
Workers road towards furs and war/settler continue their journey.
turn 6 (1910)
settler/war in place, one worker chops and the other moves to the other furs.
turn 6 (1870)
Found Lyons (rax). Up research to 80%.
turn 7 (1830)
zzz (BTW Greece wants Lyons for PT and Persians will not talk)
turn 8 (1790)
1st forest chopped, furs in 2.
turn 9 (1750)
Persian spear/settler head right for our iron (protected by the archer), 2nd worker roads furs.
turn 10 (1725)
furs connected to Paris, worker mines.
Minute Man: You may want to send the archer towards the Persian settler/spear and see if you can highjack them or wait for the sword next turn. I'll leave this part of the turn to you as you will have to deal with the consequences!
If you wish to switch the build in our 2nd town please be my guest. For example we can get a reg sword once the road is connected or a granary-the choice is yours!
There is a Persian reg warrior E of Bergen if you want to send the elite after him.
All: Sorry if you disagree with not paying the Persians but we could have lost our barracks if we had given in. Luckily there has been no offensive action against us during my 10 turns. Maybe a couple of swords and get Perse?
I suggest that our next town is built at the end of the road, SE of game-views?the save
eldar
ChiefTank
Heh, this is turning into a bit of an OCC. I think we should concentrate on Swords for now, and use 'em to punish the enemy. Clear a firebreak.
Minute Man
Prince
Yeah, I think I would have refused Xerxes, too. I hate giving in to demands, and this way we have an excuse to clear out a little more breathing room. With this much crowding, war is probably our best bet for expansion.
Got it. I'll see what I can do.
Got it. I'll see what I can do.
