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EMM 5.1(+) Multiplayer Games on Evolve

Discussion in 'More Naval AI Modmod' started by Tasunke, Feb 18, 2017.

  1. Tasunke

    Tasunke Crazy Horse

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    Ladies and Gentlemen!!! Fall from Heaven has Evolved!!

    Played a 3 player game on Evolve the other day, first completely stable MP game with more than 2 players since the Gamespy servers closed down a few years back.

    Now, we had tried Evolve before that, but due to excessive traffic, people were kicked off of the program et al to make room for paying users.

    Well now, thanks to updates with the Evolve's programming (likely) plus a shift towards the new Evolve 2.0, the new Holy Land for FFH2 mp gamers has formed!!!

    Now - it must be noted that *if all players use steam version* that they can just use steam multiplayer sure ... but!! Most, or rather about half, of the FFH2 players I know don't use steam versions, so that would be a poor solution indeed ... and without reliable servers, hamachi can only support 2 player games, as has been my norm for the last 2 years (with exception of buggy evolve games about 2 years ago). Private Servers with strange access algorythms didn't seem very practical, especially for a large number of players, and ultimately the FFH2 Multiplayer scene dwindled into a shadow of its former self.

    But I can say that a NEW ADVENTURE has begun! One of daring, bravery, diplomacy, subterfuge, and MAGIC!!!

    - lately we have been playing based off of a small modmod I made of EMM 5.1, but all versions are welcome!

    - we have played according to a wide variety of settings, mostly random maps, but pre-made ones as well!

    - lastly we need you! to join the fight! Help save Erebus, or help destroying it in the AMAZING ADVENTURE awaiting at the Computer nearest YOU!!!!

    (Warning: Tasunke Gaming Community is not responsible for any Death/ Dismemberment/ Lack of Sleep/ and/or loss of social skills, please be advised)



    EDIT!!!!! NEW Patch as of 2/23/2017 .... new XML does lots of changes, including primarily Bannor related ones.

    Balseraph arcane/priest units now start with Schizophrenic .... read the Civilopedia to find out what that means! :)


    Partial Changelist:

    Galleys (transport) and Tririme's unlocked at Fishing

    Sloop of War and Caravel (transport) unlocked at Sailing

    Frigate and Privateer unlocked at Optics

    Ship of the Line (14 str) and Transport unlocked at Astronomy

    First Rate (18 str) unlocked at Blasting Powder

    -> this was my first set of changes and I really think it helps to balance the water dynamic

    Bannor Crusade (+50% instead of +25% unit production) - has yet to be tested, was planning on testing this weekend.

    Caste System - unhappiness removed

    Theocracy - added -40% number of cities maintenance

    Sidar -25% XP needed/ +10% science, Ancient Council replaces Elder Council, with 1 slot for each secular specialist and +40% GPP growth (has yet to be thoroughly tested)

    Sheaim get Summoner as a Civ Trait

    Amurites get Arcane as a Civ trait, Dain is Philo/Ingenuity and Valledia is Org/ Sinister

    Amurites get a defender leader, Defender gives Guardsman and Mob1 to Archers, Dbl speed Walls and Archery ranges

    Walls give +2 archer XP, Dungeons give +2 melee XP, Forges give +2 Mounted XP, Monastary (religious law) gives +2 disciple XP, Castle (Engineering) gives +2 siege XP

    Classic "Defender" renamed to Tribal -> gives homeland to all units, as well as Dbl speed Elder Council, Pagan Temple, and Palisade.

    Elohim get Spiritual as a Civ Trait -> Einion logos is now Philo/Defender

    Balseraphs get base +40% culture and +1 happy, and their caster units are immune to enraged b/c they are already perfectly well grounded in their Insanity (meaning they are the only Civ which can handle quite well Asylums in all their cities) - will still give occasional martial units the madness though

    Balseraphs get Slaver as a Civ trait, Slaver also grants Subdue animal, and the units affected have been reduced to Melee, Recon, Archery, and Mounted (the martial unitcombats, best for catching slaves, and animals)

    Weevil Pickle Hyde gets Slaver replaced with Savage.

    Immortals and Chief Ogres req. Lv 5, Skulds req. Lv.4 -- High Priests req. Lv.4

    Castle is a walls clone, but with +2 Siege XP, and Bannor get UB Citadel which adds +1 trade route ((Citadel UB will also have -20% maintenance in the next patch))

    Monastary is +10% science, +2 culture, 1 sage slot/ 1 priest slot, and +2 Disciple XP

    Alchemy Lab gives +10% science, +1 free sage, and +4 Arcane XP

    University (at Arcane Lore) gives +25% science and +25% GPP growth

    Catacomb Libralus gives +4 Arcane XP

    Alchemy Lab Dbl production with Arcane, University Dbl production with Sage

    Plenty of new leaders, quite a few now have 5 leaders each (Including Judecca Spi/Agg for Hippus and Calabim) -Volanna still at Spi/Agg but considering changing back to Agg/Exp

    Tethira (formerly Agg/Exp) changed to Spi/ Imperialist of Bannor civ.

    Bannor gain Valorious Civ Trait (adds Combat 1 + Valor to Melee and Disciple units) and keep Guardsman trait

    Villages during Crusade (but only those which reverted from Demagog) only take 5 turns to switch back to Town at Normal Speed, and keep town commerce during the process ---> was done entirely in the XML

    Demagogs get freePromoPick, to make up for the fact that they either A) start with nothing, or B) start with other stuff (if built in city) but will disband after the War anyways.

    * if have enough Towns, should become excessive at this point to build Demagogs in Cities thanks to the village change, but again the Balance of this has not been tested yet.

    Arena is allowed for Doviello as well, may later be replaced by unique UB "halls of Camulos"

    Planning on adding "Totem Pole" Monument UB for Doviello which grants +2 xp and a few specialist slots

    Nightwatch are invisible recon with Investigate City ability and move rival

    Ghosts have move rival

    -----

    Thus far this should make the following civs fully playable in Multiplayer

    Sidar, Grigori, Doviello, Bannor, Calabim, Khazad, Ljos, Svart, Amurites, Sheaim, Kuriotates, Lanun, Mercurians, Infernal, Balseraphs, Illians, Hippus, Luchuirp, and Clan of Embers

    I still feel that some work on my part could be done for the Elohim and the Malakim, and I have a few ideas for each but will need to first implement and then test ....

    Each Civ is of Course well balanced up to an extent, and Hippus could gain a little Eco without hurting anyone, and perhaps Kuriotates as well (eco not military ... hahaha, freakin Cav rush civs have all the love already)

    But I think Elohim and Malakim could have a bit more uniqueness and I will try to include at least the Malakim changes in the next patch .... in the meantime Elohim's universal Spiritual trait should give them a much needed boost (but its still not super unique)

    Anyways, as Stated, I still have possible changes planned for Elohim, Malakim, Doviello, Hippus, Kuriotates, and perhaps playing around with Naval Combat a bit more still ..... (and possibly more Esus changes)

    I almost forgot, Grigori Citizen's forum gives +25% GPP growth and has 1 slot of each secular specialist (still has the bonus 10% maintenance reduction)

    Also, Creation gets a bit of a boost, with growth saving 20% food, and Blessing getting 2 slots each, +25% living unit construction (instead of 20%), and +25% GPP growth rate.

    Sidar and Grigori get a 'Good' leader called Statius the Everlasting, which can allow high level units to buy the 'immortal' promotion, which is as you know a 1 time use only.

    Grigori taking Statius however prevents him from building Luannotar, which are now at Fanatacism and target Disciple Units first in combat outside of cities. Grigori have an Evil leader in Meresin (Agg/ Mag Resist) and a Good leader in Statius (Serene/ Everlasting) which can build Eidolons and Paladins respectively, but in order to build Luannotar (only way for them to cast inquisition to remove religions) and run the Neutrality Civic, they need either Cassiel or Minister Koun .... who btw, I changed from Org/ Sage to Imperialist/ Sage ... thought he needed a bit of a boost when compared to Cassiel, and since they already have Adventurer guilds they don't really need Org imho.

    And the additional XP buildings does make Org slightly less important if I must say so, I welcome any thoughts to all mod changes, in terms of both Balance and Flavor.

    I must say, the Catacomb/ Alchemy Lab changes make using the Altar of Luannotar exploit (with Veil Savants) a bit redundant unnecessary, but I will just say that it allows for an optional (and more global) alternative. If you think it is OP please let me know.

    I would definitely welcome a test where it is a Magical mage civ with these new XP buildings vs Bannor with new Crusade ... I think it would be an interesting test, even if in the end a lot of it would still come down to Economics.
     

    Attached Files:

    • XML.rar
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    Last edited: Feb 24, 2017
  2. Tasunke

    Tasunke Crazy Horse

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    I will make best effort host at least one (if not two) Multiplayer games once each weekend, either Saturday and/or Sunday.

    Festivities will begin at 2 pm GMT, next Saturday.

    my Skype is tasunke(dot)horselord, although sign ups may be done here on this thread (must pm, or post, evolve ID for invite purposes), and yes, Evolve is free and fully functional. :)
     
  3. Terkhen

    Terkhen King

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    It is awesome to see the mod being used in MP! :D

    As usual please bring any feedback back to me; EMM 0.6.0-beta1 is nearly ready, but there is still time to implement minor things that might be annoying on MP games.
     
  4. Jojo_Fr

    Jojo_Fr Prince

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    It's running very well, nearly no OSS except with Puppet City mode on it seems. :)

    As technical problem, I would say that :

    - The A.I city governor does not always pick the best food titles when you have set up it on Food priority. It's stupid and problematic when you use Slavery especially. For exemple as Calabim, I have to pick myself the right titles for each city, because if I let the A.I governor automatic, he will pick cottage on hills but not farm on grassland.

    Is it possible to change this ?

    As balance problem (and balance is very important for the multiplayer), civs are very unbalanced, especially Elves with their incredible happiness boost by forest. But I guess you don't work on Balance, so I will not rewrite these kind of balance problem here, right ?

    Fun suggestion :

    - Sidars should haver furtivity on their settler and their workers. It's a very secret people, and it's justifiable by the lore. Gameplay speaking, it would help Sidar to build city distanced from each others, avoiding the dangers of the barbs. Building a concentration of cities is the boring and normal ways of all civ, and I would find fun if Sidar could build distant city in the early game.
     
  5. Terkhen

    Terkhen King

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    I was talking more about minor headaches that may happen in multiplayer because it is not tested as much. I am not thinking on doing changes to balance or AI anymore :)

    Also we can talk about that in the EMM thread, it is kind of offtopic to do it here.
     
  6. Tasunke

    Tasunke Crazy Horse

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    I would just say that I would prefer if 'by default' No Puppet States were selected .... just because of the OOS

    If there was a way to give ownership to the Player prior to the pop-up (the way Capture/ Raze/ View City works) it might prevent OOS, but the way it is currently implemented it causes OOS.

    Currently, as has been for a long time, if a City has Veil in it, the AC does not rise upon its destruction. I would prefer if it was simply "if infernal" that it doesn't increase the AC ... or to simply allow all scenarios for the AC to rise (removing the exception), but I can see reasons to keep things the way they are (primarily to prevent other potential OOS issues)

    Anyhow, those are my current observations (Puppet States = OOS)

    In other news, Advaced Tactics works fine, capturing Siege is fun.
     
  7. Terkhen

    Terkhen King

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    The Puppet States OOS is already fixed in development versions, and it will be fixed on the next release. I was planning on just moving on towards 0.6.0-beta1 but since that is likely not going to be released immediately, I could release a 0.5.2 version with the Puppet States OOS fixed during this weekend. Would that help you?

    Yeah, the AC mechanic could use some improvements, but modifying it is opening a can of worms because of the reasons you mentioned.
     
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  8. [to_xp]Gekko

    [to_xp]Gekko QCT junkie

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    well done :D

    can you explain what changes you made to the file attached in the OP?
     
  9. Tasunke

    Tasunke Crazy Horse

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    Thank you Terkhen, that would be excellent.

    Are there any XML updates in this 5.2 patch? Or is it all within the DLL and Python? I only ask so I can know if I can simply re-patch my XML or if I need to repeat it all by hand.

    Thanks! :)


    ( will be quite fun to play with puppet states in MP! :) )
     
  10. Terkhen

    Terkhen King

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    Nice, I'll do it tomorrow.

    I only plan to backport the puppet states fix to 0.5.1 and re-release, so the XML will be untouched (except for bumping the TXT with the version from 0.5.1 to 0.5.2). There are a LOT of other fixes in the repository for 0.6.0 (mostly coming from MNAI development versions) but backporting those would be too much effort so those will have to wait for 0.6.0 :)
     
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  11. Tasunke

    Tasunke Crazy Horse

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    Cool, sounds awesome!!! We can probably test it out either this weekend or the next ...

    So it will be shown in downloads as 0.5.2 ?

    ( depending on time, we may still have to use 0.5.1 for tomorrow's game, but can definitely update for next weekend! :) )
     
  12. Terkhen

    Terkhen King

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    Yes :)

    I'm testing the new 0.5.2 as I write this post, it will be uploaded in an hour or so. So please wait a bit :D

    EDIT: The version is already uploaded at the usual place: https://bitbucket.org/Terkhen/extramodmod/downloads/

    I am still writing the usual release post at the ExtraModMod thread but I'll write the short version here. Besides the promised Puppet States OOS fix, from More Naval AI it brings fixed versions of the Archipelago and Islands MapScripts, a new version of MapScriptTools, and a brand new MapScript: Discworld.

    Please save your 0.5.2 multiplayer games frequently, and if you get an OOS let me know what you where doing and send me the savegame from right before the OOS :)

    EDIT2: I forgot to clarify. All of the changes between 0.5.1 and 0.5.2 are just in the dll, a couple of Revolutions Python files, and in the PrivateMaps subfolder. So no XML changes at all besides the version bump.

    EDIT3: You might have noticed that I took away the download and reuploaded it. It is just because I forgot to update the changelog :D
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2017
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  13. Tasunke

    Tasunke Crazy Horse

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    Ah, what do u mean by XML changes for version bump? Does this affect the primary control theme or ... ? (just Kurios :p)
     
  14. Terkhen

    Terkhen King

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    Nah, it is just a single text file (XML\Text\CIV4GameText_Version.xml). It is used to show the versions of EMM and MNAI when you hover the mouse over your civ's flag. Before it contained ExtraModMod 0.5.1 and now it contains ExtraModMod 0.5.2.

    EDIT: The TXT strings in CIV4GameText_Version.xml are also used to force an OOS if any client connects to a game with a different text in those strings. So, if you want to prevent anyone from connecting to your games without applying your XML patch (or even using an older version of your XML patch), just change
    TXT_KEY_VERSION to whatever you want in your patch. You will just need to remember to change it again whenever you merge with EMM, as that file is always changed on release by the build system I use.
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2017
  15. Tasunke

    Tasunke Crazy Horse

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    Puppet States works with no OOS :) .... (at least early and mid-game)

    we still got some massive OOS in the late game, but that May have been due to me somehow launching 2 copies of FFH2 and running them simultaneously .... (one in the lobby, one in-game)

    The rehost after I closed the 2nd instance had much less OOS, and no visible OOS for several turns :)
     
  16. Terkhen

    Terkhen King

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    Nice! :D

    I test for OOS by running two copies of FFH2 at the same time, playing against each other with each copy being controlled by an AI. I do not get any OOS errors by doing this so I don't think that was the issue.

    Right now I am trying to track a random OOS that some users have reported, in order to fix it for 0.6.0-beta1. I know that it is caused by human interaction with the game somehow (as I have executed like 100 multiplayer games with automatic play without any OOS), but besides that I have no other clues about what might be causing the issue. It would be very helpful for me if at least a few of you enabled OOS logging (as described there) and sent me the logs along with a savegame from slightly before the OOS.
     

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