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Emperor Tutorial Series II - The Fundamental CE (Monarch/Prince players welcome)

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by feralminded, Feb 16, 2009.

  1. djvandrake

    djvandrake Prince

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2008
    Messages:
    404
    Location:
    Mediocrity
    Oh wow, what a start and with Darius too. My only concern is being production poor, so I would want to move 1 E to utilize the hill the settler is on (which appears to be the consensus).

    An Aside for Feralminded: Why do you hate hunting as a starting tech? I ask because you're a MUCH better player than I and hunting is one of my favorites. It's a fav because I start with a scout instead of a warrior, and I can research Archery right away to build archers for defense. I don't waste any hammers on building relatively weak warriors. Without huts then the advantage of the scout vs. warrior may be a bit blunted but I'm not a fan of warriors. Granted if we had something to camp in the BFC then hunting is a lot more useful.

    I have ZERO time to play civ at all right now, but I'll keep up if I can. This one looks very, very good.

    Thanks again for hosting these. I learn a ton. :goodjob:
     
  2. EmperorFool

    EmperorFool Deity

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2007
    Messages:
    9,633
    Location:
    Mountain View, California
    Heck, I've only played Darius once before. Think I'll give this ago when I get home tonight. I, too, will be settling 1E to pick up those extra river tiles and the guaranteed Grassland Hill. I don't like hoping I pop metal in the BFC only to be disappointed, and I definitely want more than two hills in my capital.

    This is going to be one helluva good Cottage capital!
     
  3. feralminded

    feralminded Obsessive Number Cruncher

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2008
    Messages:
    517
    Location:
    Hudson, MA
    @dualmaster

    Spoiler :


    Yeah right there you need to pick a path and go for it. Unless you have a very compelling reason never go mining without following it up with BW. Chopping/slavery are so powerful just getting mining feels like a tease. Same with wheel and pottery. Since we're playing a CE and are FIN pottery is going to be huge for us. Those river tiles are 3 :commerce: / turn from the second you finish that cottage. That's a huge jump in research early on. Not that your tech path hurt you much but early optimization is both the easiest optimization to implement (fewer "what ifs") and has the longest ROI.

    For a CE, even with a chariot UU I normally won't go AH early (before BW) unless I find a very close AI or if I have pigs/cows/sheep in my capital. Its a very expensive tech to get and pottery unlocks writing. Under SE's I often find myself delaying Pottery so I use AH to pick up writing. Ultimately the sooner we can get to writing the sooner we can get to Alphabet/Aesthetics and trade for everything we don't have. Still this isn't a bad way to go, just saying its possible to put off AH if you don't have an immediate use for it. As for your cities yeah that horse city is rough up there but its ok, got you what you needed. The third city is solid but yeah, you want to look to block. Also I think you needed to snag fishing before racing for alphabet. Sure you can backfill but thats a lot of turns for those two cities to sit there semi-starving.

    I personally would slide #1, 1W ... being on the ocean will do you no good for this city ... get close to that river and get more green tiles. I would move #2 south 2 and 1 W and pickup both bananas ... this allows you to build a superior city NE that can have horses, rice and marble (and cows if you want). Actually I ended up pushing #1 further south to get the rice in the BFC and make space, but your #1 isn't bad either for a tighter empire. Basically I made space there for a city between them all and that middle city with cows/horses/marble/rice is a monster production city for the early-mid game. The upkeep costs I did not find horrendous either on pushing down the peninsula some more.

    Also do not neglect the site between the Capital and your #5. If you settle 2W of the copper you can work the silk when your capital isn't as well as help develop some the captial's cottages. Its almost always worth your while to pack in your capital in a CE to help grow cottages in the early-mid game. Those little cities become very helpful sources of :espionage: late game and are great for drafting as well. Not every city needs 20 tiles.

     
  4. feralminded

    feralminded Obsessive Number Cruncher

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2008
    Messages:
    517
    Location:
    Hudson, MA
    Well I hate hunting for a lot of reasons, but I'll try to keep it down to a few.

    #1. I hate scouts. On emperor if you can keep a scout alive until 2000BC you've found a miracle. I actually pulled that off and miracled my way to Woods II and still have a scout. That said this is indeed a miracle. A warrior can almost always survive to woods II and at that point he is basically immortal until either a very lucky archer or an axe comes along. This is key because scouting your territory is hugely important on determining where to expand AND your first unit is likely your best (and sometimes only) candidate to get 10xp to unlock the HE ... which is hugely important. Even a woods II scout cannot keep getting promotions once animals go away while a woods II warrior can eat archers and even spears when used right.

    #2. I hate archers. At least on emperor whenever I HAVE to build archers I feel like I've lost in some way. Whenever humanly possible I get my hands on axes or chariots. But even if not I love warriors (so cheap and can stop anything pre-axes) and a solid fogbust works as well. I've won many emperor games without ever teching hunting or archery and as such I consider it a dead end tech until maybe I am looking for HAs ... and at that point its mega cheap. Its the whole the best defense is a good offense thing. When the AI is attacking me if I have a choice of a pile of archers or a couple catapults, a couple HAs, and some metal ... well the second option sends the AI home packing while the first just delays the inevitable. That said for my immortal jaunts I have started to use archery a bit more because the barbs just come so fast and furious there's sometimes little choice.

    #3. The hunting resources are almost all crap. Elephants are the exception but they're rare. Deer suck because they're almost always on an inferior tile (would love them if they would ever land on a wooded plains hill). Fur REALLY sucks because its basically silk (which kind of sucks) ... except on horrible tiles. I would trade fur's 3 :commerce: in a second for 2:commerce:, 1 :food: any day. Anything to make suck tiles less suck. Unless you are playing an Ice Age map or something these resources just don't cut it.

    #4. Agriculture is all but necessary, so hunting unlocking AH is basically useless. I mean that says it all. If agriculture didn't unlock AH I might find myself teching hunting more but since 80% of maps require agriculture immediately I end up unlocking AH that way.
     
  5. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Messages:
    25,905
    1. I don't use them much either, but they're cheap builds. Once everyone is settled, I recommend building one and pressing "e". This is an inexpensive way to map every AI on your continent pre-paper, and may be quite useful to war plans.

    2. Archers may be a necessity. They're not bad at all on any difficulty really, unless you have better alternatives (which isn't always). I like them alot vs early rusher type AIs, especially with hill cities where their bonus stacking gets ridiculous. Situational.

    3. The alternative is not working the hunting resources, just to build warriors. Thing is, fur and ivory are important just for the :), while deer is food that gives you +2 over the citizen working it ---> a post bio farm with some hammers basically. And health. The hunting resource are generally better for their bonuses and trade value than to work though...but you definitely want to work deer.

    4. It's nice to open AH instantly if you have livestock but not grain, otherwise not too useful here. Still, that's a decent % of my starts where I get pigs or cow/seafood and no grains.

    Overall, it's not worth avoiding if you get a :) resource or start with deer. I'd much prefer most other starting techs though, especially since hunting is cheap anyway so I can get it easily should i want/need it.
     
  6. djvandrake

    djvandrake Prince

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2008
    Messages:
    404
    Location:
    Mediocrity
    Well the conclusion that I can draw is that I don't really know how to use warriors. I'll have to work on that. My warriors seem to get eaten by bears even if on a forested hill. :lol: Luck of the draw sometimes.
     
  7. feralminded

    feralminded Obsessive Number Cruncher

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2008
    Messages:
    517
    Location:
    Hudson, MA
    Yeah until you get woods I you basically run away from bears. Even with woods I you better be on a hill forest/jungle. Once you get Woods II you have better mobility and you should win nearly every time against a bear if you are on a forested hill. That said a warrior will nearly never lose to anything else if its in a flat forest whereas a scout needs Woods II to make the same claim.

    As for handling your warriors you basically follow the rules of scouting. You prioritize forest hills->forests->hills->rivers->coast. Run from bears, be mindful of Jaguars, and stay at full health. Try to stay elevated though as this improves your sightlines and can keep you from moving adjacent to a bear.

    As for barb archers/warriors ... well you should never lose a woods II because you can control the terrain you fight on thanks to your mobility and won't lose on your chosen terrain. Woods I still should win most of the time to an archer when he's on a hill. However by this point you should be looking to setup a fogbust such that the warrior won't need to fight much anyhow. If you peek at my 1000BC save for this game you can see I have something of a bust already setup. The warriors don't have to fight because the barbs simply can't spawn. I don't have it locked down by any means but its definitely under control. This is where the strength of the warrior is ... the :hammers: cost. You spread those warriors out and bust the fog and then bring them home once you tech HR and use them for happy cap. They end up far more :hammers: efficient than archers at that point and effectively kept barbs out of your hair.
     
  8. michmbk

    michmbk Emperor

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2008
    Messages:
    1,415
    Location:
    D.C. Area
    I had set up a Darius game 3 weeks ago I had intended to be my first foray into emperor - but this one looks like an even better start than I had rolled, so I'll shadow this one along over the next few days.
     
  9. Alrin Kharr

    Alrin Kharr Warlord

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2009
    Messages:
    135
    Alright, played up to 1000 BC, here's my game.

    Spoiler :
    In the interest of full disclosure, I had to do a reload once. I'm still not used to the faster attack speed of the barbs on Emperor; I ended up being too sluggish about getting my copper hooked up, and my third city was eaten alive by barb archers while I still had only Warriors. I reloaded from 2800 BC and played it from there. I tried to play as close to my first attempt as possible, with only slight adjustments to keep from having my city eaten alive. I'm not sure if I'm entirely happy with where I am at the moment, city placement included, but I'm surviving for now. I'm teching far slower than you as well, not having managed to research Alphabet. Oh well. Any criticisms are welcome.

    My plans for the immediate future are to send an Immortal south to scout around, and get my first Scientists up and running. I also need to get my peninsula blocked off, and I think I need to get Monarchy very soon to grow my cities. Suggestions?












     

    Attached Files:

  10. Thalur

    Thalur Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2008
    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    England
    Well, I made it to 1000BC with only a couple of reloads (I'm really not used to barbs being so tough or turning up so soon!)

    Spoiler :

    I teched Mining->BW->Pottery->AH->Writing->Alphabet [trade myst & masonry] ->fishing->IW
    And built worker->warrior->warrior->setterx2 (I think - there may have been some bits of barracks in there somewhere)

    I settled the SE iron first, going 1W as suggested, and followed that up with the site to the NE with copper/fish/marble/pigs. I figure this one will be good for a GP farm or a drafting/Globe theater city. I sent my fourth settler down to block off the peninsula as in Feral's game - a tactic I'm not really used to yet!

    Overall, I'm enjoying this one more than the Ramesses game, but I have no idea why. I managed to do a lot more without reading any significant spoilers, which is good, but I was still surprised when the barbs turned up.

    I think my next moves should be to build a stack of axes to take the barb cities within my desired borders, and then to connect up some gems for the :) and some horses for the :ar15:

    Diplomatically I'm a bit lost :confused:. I'd normally trade techs with Mansa, but he is worst enemy with the other three civs he's met (not Stalin, who I think is on another land mass). 1000BC opens with Shaka asking for pottery and Mansa asking me to stop dealing with Monty (its not in the attached save, but in the auto save - I had to click through them to save it properly). As I share a land border with the Dutch, I figure I either need to befriend Willem, or annihilate him.

    My lands:


    and my techs:


     

    Attached Files:

  11. Lansky

    Lansky King

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2009
    Messages:
    630
    First time ever playing above Noble, however the map looked conducive so what the hell. I'm jumping into the deep end. Harsh criticism desired. I also apologize for the wordiness but I want to be called out for being an idiot so I supply quite a bit of my thought process.

    Up to 1000BC

    Spoiler :

    Overall tech path for this period is Wheel> Pottery> Mining> BW> AH> Myst> Writing> Alpha >Aes > Lit > 1/2 Currency

    Started by moving scout to see if there were more plains or just junk with the wine and saw more rivers and some silk. Start a worker. Get a 2nd worker.

    2450BC - Finish exploring the area and chop out a settler. Explore around and sure enough this is a peninsula.

    :crazyeye:

    " align="http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/6915/southerncities1000bcpc7.th.jpg" border="0" />" align="http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/4672/afteralphabetff7.th.jpg" border="0" />" align="http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/5972/2ndcityhk1.th.jpg" border="0" />" align="http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/5969/mypengp7.th.jpg" border="0" />

    Okay as my civilization was still alive and kicking I kept going. I would especially like some guidance from where to go from where I stopped in 940AD.

    Spoiler :

    Going to keep this part more to the point. Managed to get 3 GS out of the capitol as well as build the Great Library there, mostly thanks to popping gold out of a mine in the copper city and subsequently building the Shwedegon Paya there and running Pacifism. The first one was an academy. The 2nd researched philosophy. The third I settled. I will have another in 10-20 turns. University of Sankore will also be up in that window.

    The world remains mostly unchanged. Holy war in the south of my continent. In 900AD I met Victoria and Pericles. No clue from what direction as I never saw any units. Pericles is Hindu and Victoria founded Confucianism. She also built the AP and was just elected the leader. Thankfully Stalin and Shaka still do not have this religion... yet. Christianity and Islam went to Willem and I founded Taoism with the GS in 115AD.

    The year is now 940AD and I just finished Liberalism and picked up Nationalism as the free tech. The following is my empire, the diplomacy situation, and the tech situation. Lots of backtrading I did not list, however as you can see I still do not have metal casting and therefore forges. I'm really starting to hate myself for this.

    North half of empire
    " align="http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/4605/theworldhatesmemg2.th.jpg" border="0" />" align="http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/7116/southcivwt9.th.jpg" border="0" />" align="http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/3751/northcivot3.th.jpg" border="0" />
    " align="http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/6915/southerncities1000bcpc7.th.jpg" border="0" />" align="http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/4672/afteralphabetff7.th.jpg" border="0" />" align="http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/5972/2ndcityhk1.th.jpg" border="0" />" align="http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/5969/mypengp7.th.jpg" border="0" />
     
  12. EmperorFool

    EmperorFool Deity

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2007
    Messages:
    9,633
    Location:
    Mountain View, California
    Well I gave it a go up to 1000BC like the rest.

    Spoiler :
    Lessons reaffirmed this game:

    1. It's a dangerous world: My scout was eaten by a lion before making it even halfway around the first loop of my capital.
    2. Barbs are dangerous: 7 straight losses, but I won when it counted (3 Archers vs. an Axeman defending my capital)
    3. Scouting is key to good city placement (as opposed to what I did)
    This game went poorly from the very start as you can see above. I saw the second Copper immediately after founding my second city, so my first city had to expand in the wrong direction. :( The barbs settled what I had picked as my third city location, forcing me to settle a subpar third city. I'm building a couple more axes so I can take it post-haste.

    I chose to forgo the Great Wall this time as I've been relying on it too heavily. The first barb Warrior entered my territory in 2950 BC! I was hoping to have until 2500BC. Luckily he decided to dance in and out a few times, letting me move a Warrior to my second city, saving it from destruction by 1 turn! :eek:

    There's surprisingly little food inland given how many resource markers there are. The Cows will help, but I resorted to clumping my dots around the main river for the floodlands. I'm afraid I don't like my dotmap at all. I think I still tend to maximize resources per city too much, reducing the number of cities I can pack into an area. Given that there's no hope to get the GLH, the coast will be pretty bare, save the places with seafood.

    Spoiler Dot Map :
    Spoiler Autolog :

    Logging by BUG Mod 3.5 [Build 1457] (BtS 3.13-3.17)
    ------------------------------------------------
    Turn 0/750 (4000 BC) [17-Feb-2009 15:59:53]
    Persepolis founded
    Persepolis begins: Warrior (22 turns)
    Research begun: Mining (11 Turns)

    Turn 7/750 (3825 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:01:23]

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis's borders expand

    Turn 10/750 (3750 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:01:53]

    After End Turn:
    Tech research finished: Mining
    Persepolis grows to size 2

    Turn 11/750 (3725 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:02:03]
    Research begun: Bronze Working (20 Turns)
    Persepolis begins: Worker (18 turns)

    Other Player Actions:
    While defending in the wild near Persepolis, Scout loses to Barbarian Lion (0.24/2) (Prob Victory: 76.9%)

    Other Player Actions:
    Hinduism founded in a distant land

    Other Player Actions:
    Buddhism founded in a distant land

    Turn 28/750 (3300 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:03:52]

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis finishes: Worker

    Turn 30/750 (3250 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:04:38]

    After End Turn:
    Tech research finished: Bronze Working

    Turn 31/750 (3225 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:04:42]
    Research begun: Animal Husbandry (15 Turns)

    Turn 32/750 (3200 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:06:15]
    Research begun: Fishing (8 Turns)

    Other Player Actions:
    Contact made: Zulu Empire

    Turn 35/750 (3125 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:06:55]
    A Mine was built near Persepolis

    Turn 37/750 (3075 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:07:07]

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis grows to size 3

    Other Player Actions:
    Contact made: Aztec Empire

    Turn 39/750 (3025 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:07:17]

    After End Turn:
    Tech research finished: Fishing

    Turn 40/750 (3000 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:07:40]
    Research begun: Mysticism (9 Turns)

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis finishes: Warrior

    Turn 41/750 (2975 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:07:54]
    Persepolis begins: Settler (22 turns)

    Turn 43/750 (2925 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:08:13]
    A Farm was built near Persepolis

    Other Player Actions:
    While defending in the wild near Persepolis, Warrior (1.66/2) defeats Barbarian Lion (Prob Victory: 78.7%)

    Other Player Actions:
    While defending in the wild near Persepolis, Warrior (0.06/2) defeats Barbarian Lion (Prob Victory: 77.7%)

    Turn 47/750 (2825 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:13:46]
    Warrior promoted: Woodsman I

    Other Player Actions:
    Attitude Change: Montezuma (Aztec) towards Corrosion (Persia), from 'Annoyed' to 'Cautious'
    Civics Change: Shaka(Zululand) from 'Tribalism' to 'Slavery'

    Turn 48/750 (2800 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:14:05]

    After End Turn:
    Tech research finished: Mysticism

    Other Player Actions:
    Attitude Change: Montezuma (Aztec) towards Corrosion (Persia), from 'Cautious' to 'Annoyed'

    Turn 49/750 (2775 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:14:27]
    Research begun: The Wheel (11 Turns)

    Turn 50/750 (2750 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:15:24]
    A Mine was built near Persepolis

    Other Player Actions:
    Attitude Change: Montezuma (Aztec) towards Corrosion (Persia), from 'Annoyed' to 'Cautious'

    Turn 55/750 (2625 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:17:48]

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis finishes: Settler

    Turn 56/750 (2600 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:17:57]
    Persepolis begins: Warrior (4 turns)

    Turn 58/750 (2550 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:19:19]
    Pasargadae founded
    Pasargadae begins: Monument (45 turns)

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis finishes: Warrior

    Turn 59/750 (2525 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:19:55]
    Persepolis begins: Warrior (4 turns)

    Other Player Actions:
    While defending in the wild, Warrior loses to Barbarian Warrior (0.24/2) (Prob Victory: 74.9%)

    Turn 61/750 (2475 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:20:38]

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis finishes: Warrior

    Turn 62/750 (2450 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:20:44]
    Persepolis begins: Warrior (4 turns)

    Other Player Actions:
    While defending in the wild, Warrior loses to Barbarian Archer (1.80/3) (Prob Victory: 43.2%)

    Turn 63/750 (2425 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:20:58]

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis grows to size 4

    Turn 64/750 (2400 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:21:02]

    After End Turn:
    Tech research finished: The Wheel
    Persepolis finishes: Warrior

    Turn 65/750 (2375 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:21:30]
    Persepolis begins: Warrior (4 turns)
    Research begun: Animal Husbandry (9 Turns)
    Research begun: Animal Husbandry (9 Turns)

    Other Player Actions:
    While defending in the wild near Persepolis, Warrior loses to Barbarian Archer (1.74/3) (Prob Victory: 65.7%)

    Turn 66/750 (2350 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:22:14]

    After End Turn:
    Pasargadae finishes: Monument

    Turn 67/750 (2325 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:22:26]
    Pasargadae begins: Work Boat (45 turns)

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis finishes: Warrior

    Other Player Actions:
    Judaism founded in a distant land

    Turn 68/750 (2300 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:22:36]
    Persepolis begins: Barracks (11 turns)

    Other Player Actions:
    While defending in the wild, Warrior (1.68/2) defeats Barbarian Warrior (Prob Victory: 90.1%)

    Turn 70/750 (2250 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:22:55]
    A Mine was built near Pasargadae

    Other Player Actions:
    While defending in the wild near Persepolis, Warrior (1.58/2) defeats Barbarian Archer (Prob Victory: 40.7%)
    Attitude Change: Shaka (Zululand) towards Montezuma (Aztec), from 'Cautious' to 'Pleased'
    Attitude Change: Montezuma (Aztec) towards Shaka (Zululand), from 'Cautious' to 'Pleased'

    Turn 71/750 (2225 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:23:07]
    Warrior promoted: Woodsman I

    Other Player Actions:
    Civics Change: Montezuma(Aztec) from 'Tribalism' to 'Slavery'

    Turn 74/750 (2150 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:23:41]

    After End Turn:
    Tech research finished: Animal Husbandry
    Persepolis's borders expand

    Turn 75/750 (2125 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:23:49]
    Research begun: Pottery (9 Turns)

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis finishes: Barracks

    Turn 76/750 (2100 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:24:16]
    Persepolis begins: Warrior (3 turns)
    Persepolis begins: Worker (8 turns)

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis grows to size 5
    Pasargadae finishes: Work Boat

    Other Player Actions:
    While defending in the wild, Warrior (1.60/2) defeats Barbarian Warrior (Prob Victory: 53.9%)

    Turn 77/750 (2075 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:24:45]
    A Fishing Boats was built near Pasargadae
    Pasargadae begins: Work Boat (45 turns)

    After End Turn:
    Pasargadae grows to size 2

    Other Player Actions:
    While defending in the wild, Warrior (0.56/2) defeats Barbarian Archer (Prob Victory: 65.7%)

    Turn 78/750 (2050 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:26:08]
    Warrior promoted: Woodsman I

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis finishes: Warrior

    Other Player Actions:
    Attitude Change: Shaka (Zululand) towards Montezuma (Aztec), from 'Pleased' to 'Cautious'
    Attitude Change: Montezuma (Aztec) towards Shaka (Zululand), from 'Pleased' to 'Cautious'

    Other Player Actions:
    Attitude Change: Shaka (Zululand) towards Montezuma (Aztec), from 'Cautious' to 'Pleased'
    Attitude Change: Montezuma (Aztec) towards Shaka (Zululand), from 'Cautious' to 'Pleased'

    Turn 81/750 (1975 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:26:35]

    After End Turn:
    Pasargadae's borders expand

    Turn 82/750 (1950 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:31:16]

    After End Turn:
    Tech research finished: Pottery

    Other Player Actions:
    Attitude Change: Shaka (Zululand) towards Montezuma (Aztec), from 'Pleased' to 'Cautious'
    Attitude Change: Montezuma (Aztec) towards Shaka (Zululand), from 'Pleased' to 'Cautious'

    Turn 83/750 (1925 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:31:26]
    Persepolis begins: Warrior (4 turns)
    Warrior promoted: Combat I
    Research begun: Masonry (7 Turns)

    Turn 84/750 (1900 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:32:23]

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis finishes: Warrior
    Pasargadae finishes: Work Boat

    Turn 85/750 (1875 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:32:34]
    Pasargadae begins: Granary (90 turns)

    Turn 86/750 (1850 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:33:17]

    After End Turn:
    Pasargadae grows to size 3

    Turn 87/750 (1825 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:33:35]

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis finishes: Worker

    Other Player Actions:
    While defending in Persian territory at Pasargadae, Warrior (1.70/2) defeats Barbarian Warrior (Prob Victory: 95.6%)

    Turn 88/750 (1800 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:33:56]
    Persepolis begins: Granary (9 turns)
    A Mine was built near Pasargadae

    Other Player Actions:
    While defending in the wild, Warrior loses to Barbarian Archer (0.60/3) (Prob Victory: 79.9%)

    Turn 89/750 (1775 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:34:58]

    After End Turn:
    Tech research finished: Masonry

    Turn 90/750 (1750 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:35:24]
    Research begun: Writing (11 Turns)

    Turn 95/750 (1625 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:37:30]
    A Cottage was built near Persepolis

    After End Turn:
    Persepolis finishes: Granary

    Turn 96/750 (1600 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:37:38]
    Persepolis begins: Warrior (3 turns)
    Persepolis begins: Settler (12 turns)

    After End Turn:
    Pasargadae finishes: Granary

    Turn 97/750 (1575 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:40:37]
    Pasargadae begins: Barracks (9 turns)

    Turn 98/750 (1550 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:41:20]
    Warrior promoted: Combat I
    Persepolis begins: Axeman (8 turns)

    After End Turn:
    Pasargadae grows to size 4

    Other Player Actions:
    Attitude Change: Shaka (Zululand) towards Montezuma (Aztec), from 'Cautious' to 'Pleased'
    Attitude Change: Montezuma (Aztec) towards Shaka (Zululand), from 'Cautious' to 'Pleased'

    Other Player Actions:
    Civics Change: Corrosion(Persia) from 'Tribalism' to 'Slavery'

    Turn 100/750 (1500 BC) [17-Feb-2009 16:43:19]

    After End Turn:
    The whip was applied in Persepolis
    Persepolis finishes: Axeman

    Damn, I forgot to turn logging back on when I returned to the game. :(
     
  13. Bleys

    Bleys Deity

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2007
    Messages:
    2,573
    Location:
    Upstate, NY
    Through 1000 AD:

    Spoiler :
    Settled 1E, teched AH, Mining, BW, Wheel, Myst, Pottery, Masonry, Writing, and now Fishing, since my next few cities have seafood. Built a Worker, 3 Warriors, Settler, Barracks, Granary, Settler, Warrior, Worker, then Immortals. First 2 settlers went SW to cut off my "chunk" of land. Some VERY strong city spots on the fringe of that Jungle, making it a perfect place to "draw your line". The barbs were also kind enough to make me a city on one of my markers, but I dont have enough Immys yet, its on a hill and I will lose at least 2 trying to take it. Heres the pics of my empire:

    Spoiler :


    My plan from here is to just peacefully settle this HUGE chunk of land, build the GL, and maybe the MoM, take Steel from Lib, and run over the AIs with Cannons and Maces. Basic stuff, nothing fancy. As far as I can tell, the AIs are too far away to bother rushing, but Immortals are about the best Anti-Barb unit in the game, they can even handle a Spear if they are fortified on a hill with Combat I or II. I hope to have the Barbs build a pile of cities, which I will keep or raze as I can afford them.
     
  14. bobbyboy29

    bobbyboy29 I was saying boo-urns...

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    1,401
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    To 1125 BC

    Spoiler :
    Ok guys, this is my first shot at emperor, thought it was a good opportunity as i have been winning too easily on monarch as of late. I've played through to 1125 BC and think i've done ok, basically I've rexed hard to the south, cutting off the rest of the continent, leaving me room to settle around my capital later. I have the southern horses hooked up and a settler on his way to found the copper, banana, fish, 2 gems city. Right now I've got 2 plans, but not sure which way to go, I can research priesthood in 5, have marble hooked up in 6 or so turns and start the oracle in my capital straight away hoping to get COL for some cheap courthouses but i'm not sure if it's too late. Seeing as i dont yet have writing, and willem already has alpha, i'm thinking going aesthetics may also be a good plan. Overall I think i'm doing OK, maybe teching a bit slow but I'm gonna easily get 10 cities peacefully, i've got some cottages going and HE unlocked.

    Also could someone tell me how to post pictures? I've never done it but would like to so help would be appreciated. Please feel free to criticise me as much as you want.
     

    Attached Files:

  15. EmperorFool

    EmperorFool Deity

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2007
    Messages:
    9,633
    Location:
    Mountain View, California
    What better for a tutorial game than demonstrating how to recover from a mistake?

    Spoiler :
    I did the same thing at the NW Copper site and whipped an Axe in my capital just in time to defend from 3 Archers in one battle. That was waaaaay too close, but now that I made it through that city will be very nice.
     
  16. michmbk

    michmbk Emperor

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2008
    Messages:
    1,415
    Location:
    D.C. Area
    Got carried away and went all the way to 1000 AD. I was really aggressive with a city placement - did it pay off? Details in spoiler.

    Spoiler :


    I was super aggressive with my third city placement, hoping it would block a TON of land. It did - will pay off later in this game I think.

    First thoughts - wow – what a capital. Settle 1E to claim wine, and get silk too. Monarchy is going to be early priority anyway. Start on worker. Tech path: AH, no horses initially, so Mining next. Find the two horses, so go wheel to hook up horses. Will get to BW later. More flood plains – heavy cottages in at least 3 locations for sure. Everything looks great for 50 turns – tremendous scouting and super land to settle…and then turn 51:



    Well, that just made this interesting. Horses don’t mean squat against him. I meet him near a ridiculous gem site, so I have to beat him there for sure. Then turn 52:



    Here I was thinking I’d be a peaceful supertecher. Better block them off and make sure I can capably defend. Met Mansa as well. Second city here:



    Got my immortals hooked up quick. I then decided to try something after scouting – I settled my third city WAY down here:



    If I did this right (and I was not sure at the time I did), I just blocked a ridiculous amount of land with that city. I know it’ll need to be heavily defended, but I think this just blocked my entire peninsula. Costly in maintenance, but could be a ridiculous payoff if I’m right. By the way, I passed two barb cities already along the way in 1750 BC. One is a good location, the other is one away from where I’d settle, so it may get razed.
    Pulled this sucker off to get my courthouses up.



    Barb city taken which I should have realized earlier could be a great GP farm - was really lazy with that city this round - wasting an opportunity. I also settled another city by the copper to the east of Persepolis as well. Stole a worker from one of the barbs to help development.



    Built this wonder in my blocking city to help tech and to help beat back Willem’s culture borders.



    After this, rex, rex, rex. Barb city helped rexing…



    I got two free settlers and four free workers from barbs, at the cost of 1 immortal and 2 swords (which is all I lost on the two cities). Other than beating up barb cities, I just produced a few libraries, a bunch of units, workers and settlers. My units aren’t super strong ones, but I have a lot of them for hereditary rule. Cut off 1 turn from lib, and now need to decide next steps. I haven’t really generated any great people of note yet – one prophet and one scientist. Pretty much have done all this with cottages and HR, paying no attention to diplomacy either. No wars yet for me, but everyone is either cautious or pleased with me, so I haven’t been cozying up to anyone yet. A lazy game really. I forgot about a GP farm, so I’ve finally started to set it up in 1000 AD - will likely focus on merchants as a result and upgrade my immortals. Empire:



    13 cities, 4 of which were settled in the last 10-15 turns, and I'm still in the black at 60% tech. I think I've got 3-4 more pretty good sites to settle as well. How is my bureaucracy capital you ask? Seems like it’s doing ok to me – thoughts?



    That farm in the NE corner is needed for chain farming up to my production city NE of there. Tech situation – will improve once I get lib as I can backfill big time.



    Thinking about teching toward rifles to try to pull lib-rifling. Unfortunately, would have to manually tech guilds, gunpowder, print press and replaceable parts, since I can't trade education. Leaning a bit more toward nationalism-taj. Thoughts on the better approach? My thought is I'm too late with lib to be too aggressive, so nationalism can help me keep pressing my advantage . I can also trade edu around and backfill all techs plus take everyone's gold for possible upgrades or deficit research while beelining steel/rfiles.

    AI has been in a bunch of wars - shaka and mansa musa have constantly been at war, so i could go after mansa first, especially since Willem has a vassal and might be a tougher fight.
     
  17. Mogur

    Mogur Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2009
    Messages:
    24
    First post on here. Im fairly comfortable at Prince, but really comfortable running a CE. I figure what the hell, start looks awesome skip Monarch and jump right into an Emperor game.

    I had no intentions of posting this game so no screenshots and summary is totally from memory. But, after playing first round and reading the others I thought my start was rather odd.

    All suggestions, thoughts and criticism welcome.

    To 1000BC
    Spoiler :
    I decide to move 1E for an extra hill to work and 2 river silk.
    Build order: Worker>War x3>Worker>Settler>War>Settler>War>Worker>Oracle. I think thats right lol. I threw a few hammers into a granary at some point, and 3 chops in there.

    I go with most of Budweiser's suggested tech opening. AH>Mining>Wheel>Pottery>BW>Myst>Masonry>Fishing>Poly>Priesthood>Writing>Sailing>Math>Metal Casting(Oracle)>part of Alphabet.

    Very odd tech order for me. Go AH first and pray for horses in BFC to deal with Barbs. No luck. Mining>Wheel>Pottery lets the worker build corn>mine>cottage FP, in that order. BW delayed because none of these improvments needed forest chopped and no need for whipping yet. BW finished just as my settler was coming out and settle NE for copper, marble, fish, pig site.

    Haven't seen this in any other game but I pop gold in one of the capital's mines. SWEET!!

    I have scouted a bit and we are at the end of what appears to be a large penninsula with a great deal of room to expand, especially south. Have met no one yet around 2300 BC. Made it along the SE coast to where the continent turns E. Scout died. SW I can see even less, silk and horse are the only resourses. Warrior dies.

    At this point I had the Oracle in mind since we APPEAR to be isolated, but have marble. Freakin' great, my first Emperor game and its ISOLATED:mad: Dunno if this was a good idea or not, but I figured I needed all the help I could get. Free MC sounded great. Also if Im isolated I can justify spending hammers on wonders rather than settlers.

    Im extremely scared of barbs since its my first Emperor game. And what do I do? Build the GW? Tech Archery? Nope. Nothing! Im hoping my warriors can hold me over until axes. Unforunatly I needed a border pop for this. Got swomped by barbs about the time of my first axe. Suffered a couple of losses but no barb pillaging. Talk about cutting it close! Im rather proud of myself for avoiding archery on emperor given that its my first attempt.

    Founded second city W to claim fish, cow, horse. Its close to 1000BC and I have two cities, three on the way. No rush targets. I got the Oracle in 1300BC and took MC. Didnt hit the 4 city mark, but didnt really try since isolated. Also did rather poor getting only a 4/10 xp unit. Most any unit that won fights eventually died saving my improvments and cities before I had copper hooked up. I did however get cottages started early in the capital and 2 are now villages plus the lucky gold I had pop. I have 2 sceintists running and expect a GS for an Academy in ~17 turns. Oddly enough I have not whipped yet lol.

    Now the fun begins. I meet Willam just before 1000BC. OK! Great! Im not isolated. Where did his workboat come from!? Wha.Wha..What! A SCOUT! WTF!? A Scout? This sucks. Very poor exploration on my part. Im hoping he came from a distant continent connected by a small isthmus. But who the hell knows. I have done zero exploring since my initial scout and warrior died.

    Now I am in a mad rush to figure out where Willam is and try to mash out some settlers for blocking.


    Spoiler for me reading the other spoilers lol.
    Spoiler :
    I find it just freakin' crazy I only met one other civ by 1000BC. Most everyone else met Willam, Shaka, Monty or Mansa and Stalin. Lol cant remember if its Monty or Mansa or both.
     
  18. EmperorFool

    EmperorFool Deity

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2007
    Messages:
    9,633
    Location:
    Mountain View, California
    Spoiler :
    Only Montezuma and Shaka sent scouts my way. I had to seek out all the others on my own. That is extremely rare, especially since the others were closer.

    I've played a little further to 275BC, and I have done very poorly. I nabbed that barb city (high cost for a big distraction) and raised another to get a 10XP unit. However, Willem has now settled two cities near my side of the jungle.

    This is unacceptable. I'm seriously considering a restart which I never do. I'd usually just start a new game if I had done this bad since half the fun for me is exploring. But I want to play along, and this is going to be one hell of an uphill battle. :(
     
  19. PieceOfMind

    PieceOfMind Drill IV Defender Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2006
    Messages:
    9,319
    Location:
    Australia
    I just found this thread. Glad to see you trying the CE side of things feralminded. I'll do my best to find some time to play this game out.

    Personally I prefer not to rush in my games. I feel it's a bit cheesy and if I can only pass a difficulty by rushing then it would not satisfy me.

    Darius should be an absolute monster here I think. For me, it's hard to say yet what my techpath will be - even the first tech.
     
  20. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Messages:
    25,905
    Photobucket is under maintenance but I'll post an update tomorrow or something. I finished the game, although I ran into some snags while doing the usual attempt at super mass warmongering so my finish date is only in the 1700's :cry:. I thought I'd be doing good by ALREADY HAVING a decent stack of cavalry around 1300 AD. Oh well...at least I didn't find a way to TOTALLY screw myself.
     

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