[BNW] Enjoyable Deity Games

The first 99 games in the Enjoyable Deity Games Experience (EDGE) series are presented on page 25 in this thread. The newest additions after that are:

100. Germany (Pangaea, Standard speed, Standard size, Unmodded), CV challenge
101. Brazil (Pangaea, Standard speed, Standard size, Unmodded)
102. Austria (Pangaea, Standard speed, Standard size, Unmodded)
103. England (Pangaea, Standard speed, Standard size, modded with RAS and Acken´s balance mod)
104. the Celts (Pangaea, Standard speed, Standard size, Unmodded)

The new subseries MIDGE consists of:
1. Finland (Pangaea, Standard speed, Standard size, Otherwise unmodded but the civ to play is Hypereon´s Finland v. 4)
2. The Papal States (Pangaea, Standard speed, Standard size, Otherwise unmodded but the civ to play is JFD´s The Papal States (v. 10). You also need TarcisioCM´s Austria-Hungary (v. 1))
3. Phoenisia (Continents, Standard speed, Standard size, Otherwise unmodded but the civ to play is Sukritact´s Phoenician civilization (v. 2)

 

EDGE #93 - Culture Victory on turn 285

Standard 4-city tradition opening. I stole a worker early from Ethiopia and started it on the long march back to Paris, but parked my warrior 2 tiles from the pillaged farm and snagged another one about 5 turns later, and left it in the North for Orleans. I built 3 scouts and parked one near Ormus and stole 2 workers. A ruin gave me archery on t2, so my tech order was Pottery, AH, Mining, Sailing, Optics (the timing works perfectly for finishing your 4th settler and being able to embark to the Ivory Coast. After Optics, I beelined Engineering for the 3rd trade route because Ethiopia was giving me 5 science per trade route to them. I founded the 2 cities to the south after finishing NC ~t95. After that was the standard beeline to Education, which I finished on t110 and soon after signed soon 3 research agreements. From there it was straight to Architecture for Uffizi and then Artillery to conquer Ethiopia and steal its Great Works. While at war I built the Louvre and Hermitage in Paris, then bulbed my accumulated GS to hit Radio and Refrigeration, building Eiffel Tower and purchasing a hotel in Paris. Because I went for Artillery before Archaeology I didn't dig too many artifacts, only 6 or 7. I wasted a lot of time and resources building submarines and Bombers because I was worried about Atilla and America dominating the western side of the continent, but it never really mattered. My tech path was Radar for airports, and then straight to Internet. On t274 I finished Ecology, popped a GW to finish Rationalism and finished Oxford for free Telecommunications and Internet. I had faith purchased a GE to rush National Visitor Center, but it only took 5 turns so I built that and rushed Broadway for an extra GM after generating one with Musicians Guild. Then faith purchased 2 more GM and culture-bombed America on t284.

I had more than enough influence and probably could have shaved a good 10 turns had I not bothered with building up a Navy and Air Force and maxed out on specialists.

 

I am asking a favor. Someone who has the requisite mods, please download my attached save file (T171), end turn, and upload your next turn file (T172).

I am still having trouble with my game crashing. Always just ask things are starting to get interesting! (As, a reminder, you will need JFD’s The Papal States and TarcisioCM’s Austria-Hungary.)

Thanks very much for your time!

 

MIDGE 3 Turn 354 SV.

Strange game. My economy was fantastic all game. I was making up to 500gpt at times, which Ive really only ever done with Venice. 4 city tradition, mostly peaceful early on. managed to scout almost all of the map kinda of early, when I usually only reveal everything after satellites.

So what happened

Spoiler :

Greece. It's always Greece, unless its Shaka. He was the runaway for the most part. 2nd best civ was Mongolia, and they were allies all game, which I didnt understand because Attila kept taking city states, which you would assume would tick off Alex, but apparently he only cared when I did it. We were never friends, and it was a tug of was over Zurich and Antananarivo all game. I had spies in both cities, and used gold all the time to keep them allies, and it was still a struggle. I was over 400 influence with both, and they still weren't safe.

Persia was mostly wiped out by Alex, he had 1 city left. India and I were friends, up to the end of the game when he turned on me for no reason. Babylon hated me all game, and I have no idea why. We barely interacted. Eventually Alex and Attila attacked together. We had warred once earlier and I took a city near Athens north of Antananarivo. I had a large navy, so could take it anytime, but his land army was massive so he kept taking it back. This time it was too much. I had to retreat, so after retaking Knossos, i sold it to India. Alex then wiped out Zurich and Antananarivo, so my happiness had tanked completely. I struggled to keep it under -10. Me and India had gone freedom, but Alex and Attila were autocracy, and he was over 500 tourism. The influence kept me in a revolutionary wave for about 100 turns. I couldnt switch as the only was I could win was to buy spaceship parts.

I had to pull everyone back, complete turtle, and just defend the homeland. Luckily nuclear subs are ridiculous, and I eventually shot down all his bombers. He was close to a cultural victory, but India held him off long enough for me to launch.

good times

 

I tried to help you. Sorry to say, the game crashes already when I try to load your save. Do you have an earlier save, like t170 or so?

EDIT. Turned out Austria-Hungary was not active. Here is your file on t172. Hopefully it works. I did not do anything but press "next turn":

 

EDGE#105: Water-tithe plan

Here we finally have something appealing with an underrepresented civ, since they appear only for the second time in this series. The task is to play as Rome on an unmodded Pangaea map with Large size and Standard speed. QC and QM are turned on and all VCs are enabled as usual. Go in any direction you want. I chose a rather passive style myself but I think that a DomV is very much on the board. You have a very nice starting position and I would say that there is one fantastic spot for an expand and some decent ones. But as in all my games with Rome I always run into some problems. I am sure you will handle this better though! However, I will throw a challenge to all of you: how much money will you be able to get from your religion? In my game I was generating 155 gpt from my religion alone! I have never done that before. Do it better if you can! There are also pictures from t145 and from my win on t305 for you to compare. Enjoy!

There is a short recap of my game behind the spoiler.

Spoiler :

SIP. The BO was Scoutx2-Shrine-Settler-Granary-Settlerx2. I stole one worker from Indonesia and three from a CS. First expand to the E for all that Salt and the Gold. Second coastal to the S and fourth to the W. Decent start but I was not happy with my early growth in city #3 and #4. The Incas attacked me early but I had no problem defending myself. NC on t88 and HG before that. I got a nice religion with EM/Tithe/Pagodas/Religious Community/Itinerant Preachers. Education on t109 and I felt I was in good shape. I took the Tradition opener but then went Liberty. The cultural wonders went really fast though.

In the midgame, Washington beat up Assyria badly and then he went after Theodora. Pacacuti took on Askia and Darius. The former more or less succumbed but Darius made a strong come back and started to take cities from the Incas instead. I had it all to do to catch up but managed to do so. I was first to Ideologies and picked Freedom and Washington immidiately followed. However, the rest of the pack chose differently. Darius and Portugal went Order while Siam, the Incas and Indonesia all went Authocracy. I had culture enough to defend myself though and never got more unhappiness from ideologies than 12 and never had a single turn in the negatives. I also decided to take one city from the Incas to ease the pressure on my heartlands.

In the endgame, the wars were the norm and peace was out of the question. Indonesia attacked me but I got America involved in the action and finally I could take a city from Gajah. The Incas were about to attack me as well but I redirected their efforts against Persia and later Indonesia. As soon as I could, I bought an Atomic bomb and after that the Incas (with the biggest army) did make no further attempt. Instead they wanted us to join them against Portugal. I agreed and took the last two cities from Portugal (the last one was a CS I liberated). Darius was first to build Apollo (on t250) but in the end he didn´t do well enough to be a threat. Instead I could launch on t305. Complex and eventful game! SP: Tradition 2, full Liberty, Piety opener, Commerce 2, full Rationalism and Freedom 6.

 

Thanks very much! But how did you figure out Austria-Hungary was not active, and how did you fix it? I have been only ever using the MODS menu to load games, and check for both mods each time.

 

Oh, sorry. I was not very clear with my statement. My computer crashed because I had not activated Austria-Hungary myself (even if I thought I had). I had no problem whatsoever with your file.

 

Thanks for the clarification, and again thanks for the help! I have no idea why I sometimes have this problem…

 

EDGE#106: Singing your song

This is only the second contribution with this civ in the EDGE-series. The task is to play as Songhai on an unmodded Pangaea map with Standard size and Standard speed. QC and QM are turned on and all VCs are enabled as usual. Those who like predictable maps will not enjoy this, but at least I enjoyed it very much myself. The map offers a lot of surprises and also your neighbours are interesting to say the least. On top of that you have "your own" corner of the map and there is Salt for you to enjoy (as usual). Already for these reasons I recommend this one. However, in my game I really had to play to my strengths to dig out a win here, since several AIs are doing well! Very interesting and entertaining and definitely not too easy. I also uploaded some pictures for you to compare. Enjoy!

I played according to HOF rules and submitted my win. There is a short recap of my game behind the spoiler.

Spoiler :

Settled t1 across the river on the hill. The BO was Scoutx2-Shrine-Settler-Granary-Settler. I stole one worker from Korea and two from a CS. First expand to the W for all that Salt and Gibraltar. Second coastal to the S for Citrus and Whales. Decent start but not more. Shaka was not too close, so we stayed friends through the entire game. Really interesting map. 3 city NC on t88 and I settled a fourth afterwards. I got the fourth religion with EM/Tithe/Mosques/Religious Community/Messiah. Education on t109 and I everything was going nicely, or so I thought.

In the midgame, Ethiopia and Morocco built the cultural wonders. Shaka attacked Ethiopia but Haile was able to defend himself thanks to the Great Wall. Sejong had a slow start and I was not too worried. However, after a war with the Ottomans, Korea started to snowball. England and Carthage beat up Morocco and Shaka joined the fun. A CV was looking very unlikely and I had to focus on teching, not to getting too far behind Sejong. I was able to reach Ideologies first and chose Order because my culture was not the greatest. Sejong followed on the same turn! Also Carthage went Order, while Shaka and Elizabeth went Authocracy. At this point things were getting really interesting. England really went for a DipV and allied almost all CS, Sejong took ouot the Ottomans all together and he was teching like crazy. Ethiopia was going for a CV and got all the wonders.

In the endgame, I entered Atomic 10 techs behind Sejong. Was this ending in a defeat? The Ottomans and Morocco were out of it and England got 38 votes in the first WL vote. Ethiopia was influencial with three civs already. I had to optimize my late game carefully to catch Korea. In the end I launched on t282 and it was not a turn too soon. Sejong had all the techs and only needed the last part and should have been able to launch on about t290. England could also win on the second WL vote. Very interesting all the way to the finishing line.

 

Poland will be next up. Runty, which civs were you thinking of for your Babylon/Korea idea?

 

If I had to rank for human players, I'd probably go with something like:
1-2. Korea vs. Babylon
3. Poland
4. Maya
5. Inca
6. Shoshone
7. Ethiopia
8. India

I don't even feel strongly about those last 3, and the AI doesn't always play the top tier human civs very well. For example, Poland always seems to under-perform as an AI.


Ranks 3-8 are pretty wide open, but I think it's more of a challenge to also have to compete against more well-rounded civs that the AI plays well. The Iroquois always seem to be a nuisance for me. Russia, Persia, and America also tend to be pretty strong. Brazil and Portugal seem to be inconsistent and either end up being powerhouses or just get stomped early.

For those interested: which AI opponents have you noticed tend to give you problems?

In my experience having one or two of the warmongers (Alex, Atilla, Genghis, Shaka, Monty) tends to make the game too easy, assuming you survive the first 60 turns, because you just bribe them into being your attack dog.

 

Good. My primary suggestions (on top of Babylon&Korea) would be Russia, Persia, the Iroqouis and India. Catherine has been my annoyance #1 recently, the Iroquois tends to do very well most of the time and Persia and Gandhi are usually strong in peaceful games. In addition, I would choose two out of the six following: America, Austria, Germany, Greece, Rome or the Shoshone. Maybe also the Mayans or Egypt might be considered. America and Greece tend to be more aggressive and thus maybe not the most suitable for what you have in mind here. Pocatello has a solid early game, setting him up for a good game. Austria is a wild card, in my opinion they are very weak early on, but when they get the funds to buy their first CS they tend to grow very strong quickly. My "five cents" list could be: Babylon&Korea, Russia, Persia, the Iroquois, India, the Shoshone and Austria. What do you guys think?

 

I agree that the Iroquois (which you mention) seem to do well in the hands of the AI.

Unmentioned so far, and the AI which consistently griefs me is Augustus. He is expansive and hostile and resistant to bribes. I don’t find that he is VC threat (unlike some of the other AIs noted) but I find him to be a significant frustration in most games that he appears.

That is a very insightful observation!

 

I'm interested in playing this. At least the science victory condition, I'm not very good at Deity but I can win with science. Diplo maybe, Domination possibly, I won't be able to win a Culture victory so I'll have to sit that one out.

Do I understand correctly - we're going to play a shared game with the top two civs in each victory condition? So for science we'll play a Babylon game and then a Korea game with the same opponents?

I definitely agree the Iroquois always seem to do well. Also Russia, Persia (although sometimes he just sits on 3 cites and does nothing), the Shoshone and Poland. Germany seems to do well also. Edit: Also Inca.

I would not put Alex or Shaka in the game as opponents; they can severely screw up a game and that could skew the results. I also don't like Austria, she can either do nothing or take a bunch of CS and mess up your game, Venice for the same reason.

I look forward to it!

 

Looks to me that we have 1. decided on Babylon, Korea, Russia, Persia, the Iroquois and the Shoshone and that 2. we need two more (and so far the Incas, Germany, Poland and India seems to be the primary suggestions). Out of those four, I would argue that Casimir (despite his fantastic bonuses) is very inconsistent, while Gandhi (when left alone) will do well. Rome performs usually well but they might be a little too aggressive for this one? Then I flipped a coin between Bismarck and Pacacuti, which Pacacuti won. Can we agree on India and the Incas as the last two?

Then another question: should all VCs be active or only SV?

 

My idea was that we would have two game files: one for Korea and one for Babylon, but from the same starting location. So for the Korea game you'll start in location A and Babylon will start from location B; in the Babylon game you'll start from A and Korea will start from B. All other civs will start from the same location in both games.

Sounds good to me. Yes, I think all VC should be enabled since I imagine the AI programming is not smart enough to vary play-style if VC is restricted.

 

Sounds good. I would vote for a new thread for this little experiment.

 

Trying this one now. I already restarted since I could not stand to miss the six-salt cap! Also, missed getting a pantheon (when another religion enhanced) but an expo settled a faith mountain, so I got the last religion regardless. Opened Patronage after closing out Tradition to try for a quick Diplo VC.

 

I am not sure how to do that. Is it possible to do that with the mod Rotate Starting Position?