Expansion Civilizations

[Rusty Edge]

Ah ha, I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. As a South American I feel the need to set the record straight.

SOUTH AMERICA:
Biggest Country: Brazil
Biggest Army: Venezuela
Biggest Population: Brazil
Biggest Economy: Chile

Brazil is an economic WRECK! Its got a literacy rate of 82%!!! its got a 25% living below poverty, etc, etc. Chile has the best economy in south america.

I'd say, that I'd love a south american civ, but there are just none that are "great" enough. And I say that with pain in my patriotism

OW! my patriotism

OK. So Brazil's behind on points. Got it.

 

[Eru Ilúvatar]

Ah ha, I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. As a South American I feel the need to set the record straight.

SOUTH AMERICA:
Biggest Country: Brazil
Biggest Army: Venezuela
Biggest Population: Brazil
Biggest Economy: Chile

Brazil is an economic WRECK! Its got a literacy rate of 82%!!! its got a 25% living below poverty, etc, etc. Chile has the best economy in south america.

I'd say, that I'd love a south american civ, but there are just none that are "great" enough. And I say that with pain in my patriotism

OW! my patriotism

How about the Internal brute production? How about an accurate analysis. Since the base of the discussion is literacy, I guess Monaco and Andorra are better choises at all.

Economically, Brazil only rivalizes with Mexico in certain aspects. Chile is not the main ecomonical force in Latin America, maybe not even the second one.

Please, guys, human development is not always the same thing as strong economy. If so, we'd never put China on the game, and that would me a mistake, wouldn't it?

 

[Sebiche]

dude, I lived, studied and analyzed Chile. I cab assure that it is the most economically powerful. Brazil's brute thing is only due to its size, but its an economic wreck. of all the latin american ones, chile is the most sound.

not just literacy, I mean actual economics and such, brazil is a wreck, chile is great and still going.

 

[Eru Ilúvatar]

Of course its due to its size. =)

If we consider things that way, Monaco and Andorra must be on the list

 

[warroom]

Was it CIV 3 or Civ 4 that had the game where there were lots of civs in their correct starting position. Included small civs... does anyone else remember this? And how come the world map isn't an option with Warlords? Even if I pull it up in warlords, it makes me play by the old Civ 4 rules; ie: No great wall.

 

[Eru Ilúvatar]

I remember, but I guess it used to be loaded as a scenarium, ain't that?

It would be wonderfull to play with all the civs at the same time in an even larger map of the world as we know.

 

[Eru Ilúvatar]

About Brazil and Chile, I made a research on wikipedia about PIB (Internal Brute Product.

Down, the results...


Statistics

Aquisitive Power (world)
10 - Brasil 1.701,183
44 - Chile 212,671

Nominal Internal Brute Product (world)
10 - Brasil 1.067,706
40 - Chile 145,205

Aquisitive Power equity (prev. 2007) (world) - in this one Chile did better
57 - Chile 13.804
73 - Brasil 9.503


Nominal Internal Brute Product per capita (so close)
54 - Brasil 6,571
55 - Chile 6,272


Latino American Countries per Nominal Internal Brute Product (not even near)
1 Brasil 1,083,198
2 México 846,782
3 Argentina 210,147
4 Venezuela 156,482
5 Colômbia 136,840
6 Chile 118,188

 

[Sebiche]

i really wish you had read my last post now.

are you happy? brazil has a better internal brute thing, BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN ITS ECONOMY IS NEITHER MORE STABLE OR STRONGER.

let the record state that sebiche is not from chile.

 

[Eru Ilúvatar]

are you happy?

Not at all. Why the question?

I read your post, and I guess its happening a common misunderstood of concepts. Life quality means not the same thing as strong economy. China has a strong economy, ancient Egypt also had it with a slavery-strucuted society.

Stability is important, but the only countries that are not developing, nowadays (in fact, the last 10 years), important archievements in economical stability are Venezuela and Bolivia, for option, and Argentina, because of its economical colapse in 2002 (but even them are recovering due to a responsible fiscal policy).

Strong economy doesn't mean social justice. USA is the strongest economy in the entire world, and thats not because of its literacy level or low poverty.

 

[Sebiche]

Strong economy doesn't mean social justice. USA is the strongest economy in the entire world, and thats not because of its literacy level or low poverty.

I know it doesn't mean the same thing. Don't you insult me.

As with the USA thing, I'll have to disagree. The world's strongest economy is that of the EUROPEAN UNION

thats right, with their new collectivized GDP system, they have by far the strongest, largest and more powerful economy in the world.

 

[Antilogic]

The European Union is not a united government, but a Confederation. They have voted down a unified "European" constitution a couple times, if I recall correctly.

Now, if we recognize the European Union for what it is, the new German Empire, then the Forth Reich has the largest economy in the world. Don't believe me? The "euro" currency was based entirely around the German bans--the head EU bank is in Munich, if I'm not mistaken--and the "capital" of the EU is in Brussels, Belgium...a territory that has an unusual propensity for falling under German occupation. The Germans just put it there to fool you.

 

[TheLastOne36]

@Rusty Edge: For eastern Europe, I would like to see Austria in before Poland, simply for the Hapsburg family--that is one of the longest lived European royal families, and much like Simon Bolivar, it deserves some representation in the game. Poland is second to Austria on my list for new European inclusions. I'm personally hoping for them both.

My only debate about that is, is austria part of eastern europe, western or southern? it has been very confusing after the term "central european" died of. But if you put it in the Austria-Hungary term then i might say that there eastern european.

Don't get me wrong, even though i want poland in i to think that austria would be in, before poland get's it's chance.

And i think ukraine has to be added before brazil does. Second of all brazil has been a part of portugal for a long time in history. < which brings back to the question, why isn't portugal in? it had the oldest and longest colonies from it's old empire in known history.
Oh yes Sebiche where do you live? don't need exact details just the country.

 

[jkp1187]

{Scratching head, trying to figure out where a debate about whether the E.U. or the U.S. has the better economy figures in a thread about "expansion civilizations".}


{Shrugs, gives up and goes looking for a better thread.}

 

[TNT_BoomBoom]

I would say to add the celts.

since i use the americans, germans, romans and celts, lol, seriously only 4 i really like.


i dont think ive ever lost as the celts, because they are just G, so, w/o them civ feels empty. and i love being a civ that is prety much supposed to be a neusance to the romans and concuring the world by force.

 

[TheLastOne36]

celts are already in...

 

[IvALBe]

about chile...

http://foro.loquo.com/viewtopic.php?t=67330

look for chile in wikipedia for latinamerican rankings.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chile

pretty good rankings


http://www.aneki.com/south_america_richest.html
http://www.doingbusiness.org/EconomyRankings/?regionid=427

 

[Eru Ilúvatar]

celts are already in...

Celts are in since Warlords... And, in BTS, there will be Boadicea as a leader option too.

 

[Yanez]

about chile...

http://foro.loquo.com/viewtopic.php?t=67330

look for chile in wikipedia for latinamerican rankings.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chile

pretty good rankings


http://www.aneki.com/south_america_richest.html
http://www.doingbusiness.org/EconomyRankings/?regionid=427

I don't think Chile has the biggest economy but you could certainly make an argument thats its the biggest and best in relationship to its size. This obviously has an effect which is it has the highest quality of life in Latin America.
However, lets be realistic. The makers of Civ are going to for sales. Chile only has a population of around 16 million, compare that to Brazil, Argentina, even Colombia, Peru, and Venezuela. For that reason i dont think (if there was ever going to be one) that Chile would be the S.A Civ. Although I would obviously love it Also, i dont think many Chileans are going to play with any other S.A civ other than Chile, even if it is a S.A Union, again, there will be exceptions but in general they wont.

I think they will give it to Brasil simply because of the population size (sadly they think about the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$)

 

[Antilogic]

My only debate about that is, is austria part of eastern europe, western or southern? it has been very confusing after the term "central european" died of. But if you put it in the Austria-Hungary term then i might say that there eastern european.

Don't get me wrong, even though i want poland in i to think that austria would be in, before poland get's it's chance.

And i think ukraine has to be added before brazil does. Second of all brazil has been a part of portugal for a long time in history. < which brings back to the question, why isn't portugal in? it had the oldest and longest colonies from it's old empire in known history.
Oh yes Sebiche where do you live? don't need exact details just the country.

I would call Austria, due to its territorial holdings in Eastern Europe, an East European country. I specifically say "Austria" and not "Austria-Hungary" becuase the latter refers to a small part of Austria's history, when the country could have easily earned the title of sick man of Europe had the Ottomans not been even worse off. It's a fudge, I know. I would call it Austria in the game, but still have, say, Budapest, in the city list. But that's just me.

Poland I think should be considered East European as well. But there will be less debate over that one.

 

[TheLastOne36]

i consider it east european to but i like to be more specific. I call austria one of the alpine states and poland central european even though people only say East european, West European, South European and Scandinavian now.

Also how did the term central european basically went extinct? i never learned the reason why, although i do know it has something to do with WW2.

And i chose Venezuela over every other south American Country because simon Bolivar is Venezuelan. Venezuela is also one of the richest countries in the continent. And Venezuela has the biggest army.