Fall Further - The Original Thread

[Vehem]

Vehem, I started a game with the new civ. (as expected ) Upgrading Adepts to Followers cost 185 gold. That's almost triple the normal cost, am I doing something wrong, or is this intended? If it is, I'd like to say that's quite harsh. One more thing, Kadhi doesn't state that they are Agnostic. I went for RoK and pwnd myself.

Increased is by design, but triple sounds too much - I'll take a look at that. I actually used the old Illian method for blocking religions (-100 Weighting) - I'll have to add something to make it a little more obvious that adopting is blocked.

 

[GhostQ]

Maybe just make the mouseover on Kadhi say Ambitious, Arcane and Agnostic? That's 3 A's in a row, heh. The upgrade cost is normally 65 from Adept to Mage, it costs 185 for Kadhi, if the upside of this is only the 1 level early upgrading that's a bit too much; as Arcane trait gets you the required levels most of the time. The pedia entry for the gate is pretty much empty, does it work like the Sheaim one?

One more thing: I've encountered a few more things and edited my last post about it.

P.S.: I'm currently researching Strength of Will, a bit delayed thanks to Kolsehvahn . I'm afraid to check the upgrade cost from Follower to Advisor .

 

[GhostQ]

The cost for Follower to Advisor is 285, just 40 more than the regular cost, hmm. The race seems balanced so far, if not a little bit slow. Grats to you and Sylvynn. I'm also enjoying the flavor.

The Thades have the teleport up to 4 tiles explanation twice when you mouseover on them. The Gnoslings steal the experience of the units they kill I believe, that's actually a bit strong when killing workers with the new worker xp add-on.

 

[Vehem]

The Thades have the teleport up to 4 tiles explanation twice when you mouseover on them.

Thanks - one is from the SDK (and needs removing).

Keep the bug/issue/quirk reports coming - I'll try to go for 24 hours before I patch it this time, but will post one tomorrow evening to cover the issues brought up by then.

 

[GhostQ]

I feel like I'm spamming the thread . Sadly, I keep getting weird stuff as I play. I created Kadh, he is quite cool. The problematic part is I chose Mammon after I researched Strength of Will and Kadh doesn't have Mind III promotion. And no Compelling Jewel to be seen (don't know what that is). He also has Command I on top of lots of seemingly random 1st sphere promotions, is this intended? Lastly what difference is there between the "Redeemed" and "Hero" promotion? Redeemed can't get Heroic Attack/Defense I-II?

 

[Demus]

the Kahdi are able to train horsearchers, aswell as the black dragon (atleast according to the tech tree). Right now you can adopt a religion (only the AI will never do it), but can't build any of the temples. Civics like GoN are still available though.

 

[GhostQ]

the Kahdi are able to train horsearchers, aswell as the black dragon (atleast according to the tech tree). Right now you can adopt a religion (only the AI will never do it), but can't build any of the temples. Civics like GoN are still available though.

I didn't try to train Abashi or the Horse Archers, but the tech tree shows them. But about adopting a religion, that's not the case in my game. I was able to research the religion founding techs, but I wasn't able to adopt any of them as my state religion.

 

[Vehem]

I feel like I'm spamming the thread . Sadly, I keep getting weird stuff as I play. I created Kadh, he is quite cool. The problematic part is I chose Mammon after I researched Strength of Will and Kadh doesn't have Mind III promotion. And no Compelling Jewel to be seen (don't know what that is). He also has Command I on top of lots of seemingly random 1st sphere promotions, is this intended? Lastly what difference is there between the "Redeemed" and "Hero" promotion? Redeemed can't get Heroic Attack/Defense I-II?

Thanks - all sorted locally and added to the patch package. The Kahd issue was a last minute change to the way I was determining whether you'd chosen Mammon/Oghma - you actually got the Oghma version. Redeemed is partially a cheat (allows me to switch Artstyles on Kahd for Redeemed/Corrupt versions rather than create two units) and partially to keep him away from the "Hero" promotions (Strength, Defence, Twincast).

the Kahdi are able to train horsearchers, aswell as the black dragon (atleast according to the tech tree). Right now you can adopt a religion (only the AI will never do it), but can't build any of the temples. Civics like GoN are still available though.

Horsearchers/Dragon sorted - did I mention that I dislike that file?
I'm going to take a look at what Xienwolf changed to see if I can get the other method of handling unique units to work this time.

The "Religion trick" actually does block players adopting - any religion set to AiWeight -100 is actually banned for that Leader (both for players and AI). Hyborem also uses the trick for non-Veil religions. The issue here was that Empyrean was banned twice and Fellowship wasn't at all (oops).

===

Don't worry about "spamming the thread" - the feedback you're giving now will help make sure that it's all sorted by the time everyone else gets around to their first games - it's a great help. Kind of a shame that despite all the testing some fairly big ones got through - in some places, the "fixes" led to problems elsewhere. That being said - the test games were actually great fun too

 

[Pike the Hands]

Falamar seems to find Kahd charming.

(love the modmod btw)

 

[Vehem]

Falamar seems to find Kahd charming.

(love the modmod btw)

Aye - that's the beard. Falamar always had a thing for beards...
(thanks - fixed in the patch)

 

[GhostQ]

The patch will be up later today, right? (As in it's not up yet? )

On a side note, you forgot to remove the Patch A and B for v0.22 from your version post in the first page.

 

[Slvynn]

!st of all - Vehem - you did great job, so much can be said that i have no words! Awesome , just awesome

Gnostlings get TXT_MSG_GET_KNOWLEDGE message when killing unit .
Awesome recon units, very flavour ones i think my new favorite unit of early game.

2nd: if playing advanced start and building 3 cities with repository and mages guild you get alot of units. The drawback is unit maintenance, that kills actually early teching. Any way to decrease maintenance costs for Vault gate summons?

 

[Perkin Warbeck]

Since installing 030 I've been getting OOS errors ever 15 turns with no apparent trigger (even tried leaving it on research an hitting enter) I installed it over the older version so I'm trying the clean install idea now to see if this helps. As suggested above I removed the required file from the screens folder but other than that and the new version there have been no changes to cause these. Oh and it only seems to happen when one player is on the Kahdi and another is on the lizards.

 

[GhostQ]

The Kahdi are able to build Pagan Temples, but not the religious ones? Are they a different kind of Agnostic, or was it unintended?

 

[thewyrm]

Stumbled across this, thought it would make a cool leaderhead for your spider worshiping civ.

http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/database/art/view.pl?id=107083

 

[Vehem]

The patch will be up later today, right? (As in it's not up yet? )

On a side note, you forgot to remove the Patch A and B for v0.22 from your version post in the first page.

Aye - later today - front page is sorted now (well - a bit tidier at least), thanks.

2nd: if playing advanced start and building 3 cities with repository and mages guild you get alot of units. The drawback is unit maintenance, that kills actually early teching. Any way to decrease maintenance costs for Vault gate summons?

Best option is to hold off on buying the vault gates until your empire can sustain the summons. Gnoslings have a "reduced" maintenance (they're not considered military units for maintenance) but reducing it any further for gate-summons would effectively give you an automatically rebuilding, free/very cheap maintenance army - which is going to be unbalancing. I don't often use advanced start myself, but I only tend to build one or two vault gates in the first 250 or so turns (or at least until I have enough mana to make the Djinni/Gnoslings powerful enough to attack with).

The maintenance issue is the same as when you buy 20 warriors in advanced start, except this way you actually get libraries etc as well.

Since installing 030 I've been getting OOS errors ever 15 turns with no apparent trigger (even tried leaving it on research an hitting enter) I installed it over the older version so I'm trying the clean install idea now to see if this helps. As suggested above I removed the required file from the screens folder but other than that and the new version there have been no changes to cause these. Oh and it only seems to happen when one player is on the Kahdi and another is on the lizards.

Do you think the Kahdi and Lizards both have to be human, or just both in-game? If anyone else has a similar problem or any information about it - let me know. In the three player testing there was only 1 OoS across 3 games, including a game with a player using the Mazatl.

The Kahdi are able to build Pagan Temples, but not the religious ones? Are they a different kind of Agnostic, or was it unintended?

I was planning on a different kind of agnostic, but for simplicity's sake I may use the trait as normal. The original plan involved actually blocking the major religion's ability to spread to cities (no spread, no adoption, no nothing), but allowing things like pagan temples to represent those small groups within Kahdi society that do drift into other worships (Kahd is highly influential, but he's not a tyrant - to start with at least...). The code change for that didn't "stick" for some reason though and I was left with just the normal "no adopting".

Stumbled across this, thought it would make a cool leaderhead for your spider worshiping civ.

http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/database/art/view.pl?id=107083

Nice. Bit "advanced" for Daracaat (heavy ornate armour not quite fitting for the Barbarian-Brute thing), but you may have found me some inspiration for a future civ (it's that good that it seems a shame not to use it)

EDIT: This guy on the other hand...

 

[Slvynn]

The Kahdi are able to build Pagan Temples, but not the religious ones? Are they a different kind of Agnostic, or was it unintended?

They are undifferent to Religion. Kahdi are about 2 things : Knowledge and Power. Both things they achieve by worshipping Oghma or Mammon respectively.
Kahd attitude towards religions set -100 as for current Auric. That mean he can tech things, but cant benefit from them, as well cant spread and adopt state religion. Its bit different from Agnostic.

Their additional culture comes from Meditation Halls (+2 culture add , great idea Vehem, may be should make it 3?)
Their Hapiness actually come from boosted resereach and ability to tech all needed techs for different hapiness buildings.

Also to Vehem: i didnt checked / found - did you implemented +1 hapiness in capital per each certain mana node?

+ another game played - lost to rushing me Orcs, played advanced start immortal. Adepts are key to survival as well as random Thades. Early defence can be warriors and Axemen - cince Kahdi get alot of units early and Religion civic is uselss make sense to stick to Nationhood and +1 happy from Training Yard till Scholarship resereached.

 

[CMHistory]

EDIT: This guy on the other hand...

The Crab King? The Rock will be eating his heart out when he hears about this....

 

[Slvynn]

Nice. Bit "advanced" for Daracaat (heavy ornate armour not quite fitting for the Barbarian-Brute thing), but you may have found me some inspiration for a future civ (it's that good that it seems a shame not to use it)

EDIT: This guy on the other hand...

Better one, since Daracaat - savage guy, i also have still unfinished LH i did once... Sorry have alot of job/ making art need certain moods etc... i will do that as well one day

 

[Slvynn]

Also, btw, about FF mp - FF still unplayable in MP since different OSS issues. (like FfH was once). Need alot of testing and tweaking b4 FF will be MP-playable. People who try it MP - please describe situations and post MP saves . I know already ALOOOOOOT of people who want to play FF MP games.