ales_
Heir
What civilization in this mod is representing Italy?
Feedback: Civilizations
- Thread starter Xyth
- Start date
Unless we find something more specific that would work fine.
None currently, which is something I need to address. I wouldn't add Italy as a civ on its own, but I do need to expand Rome to include it. I need to drop one of the current leaders in favour of a couple later period ones. I'd really like to add Lorenzo de Medici but I've not found any good art for him; there was a fantastic one being made but the creator had computer problems and has vanished for a while now. Garibaldi or Cavour would be my picks for more recent leaders, and art exists for both of them. But I really feel that there needs to be a renaissance Italian leader; if not Lorenzo, someone else. (I'm expanding the leader limit for some civs to 5).
As for which current leader to drop, feedback welcomed. Personally I'm leaning towards Augustus; same era as Julius and the less iconic of the two. Marcus Aurelias would be the alternative. Scipio I think needs to stay as Rome needs a good military leader.
ales_
Heir
Rome can be one of these civs.
Yep. But given I want to add both a renaissance and modern Italian leader, we'll still need to drop one of the current 4 Roman leaders.
ales_
Heir
I think Augustus should be left. Either Marcus Aurelias or Scipio can be dropped in my opinion.
ShummaAwilum
Chieftain
- Joined
- Apr 10, 2013
- Messages
- 2
Since Rome is being used to represent Italy as well, perhaps the addition of a condottieri UU could fill out its Renaissance period.
All a bit moot until I can find suitable art for a renaissance leader, but more feedback on this from others would be good in the meantime.
Rome's 2nd UU will be the Ballista. I considered a condottieri UU but there were already plenty of unique versions of units it might replace.
ales_
Heir
Xyth, although I understand that this is a difficult task, can you please post what states, nations, cultures etc. do you understand under each civilization? This will help in several ways:
1) Not asking about civs that are already represented in your opinion.
2) Helping with the current leader addition project.
1) Not asking about civs that are already represented in your opinion.
2) Helping with the current leader addition project.
That is indeed a difficult task. Most should be obvious from leader choice thus far but I'll list some where I think the definition may seem a bit unclear. Unless there is a relevent civ (America, Brazil), you can assume that all colonial countries are or could be covered by their 'parent' civilizations.
Scandinavia: All the northern Germanic peoples. Excludes the Finns obviously.
Hungary: Currently covers the Hun but that will probably change at some point.
Berbers: Mauretania, Numidia, the Tuareg, the Almoravids, the Almohads, Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia, and many bits in between.
Mali: All the Mande kingdoms and empires, namely Ghana, Mali and Songhai.
Kongo: The kingdom itself but also it's ethnically and culturally related neighbours, most of which were vassals or allies at some point.
Sumer: Sumer and Akkad.
Amurru: The Amorite city states of Mesopotamia and Syria, notably Ebla, Halab (Aleppo), Mari, Babylon and its empire.
Hatti: The Hittite kingdom, some of its vassals and related allies, and the Neo-Hittite city-states of Syria.
Arabia: Also includes regions like Egypt and Iraq that became predominantly Arabian (ethnically and culturally) after the conquests.
Persia: Pretty much all Iranian peoples.
Kushan: Also includes their origins as part of the Yuezhi in the Tarim basin, as well as their empire in what is now Eastern Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, and other parts of Central Asia. This region has been under the control of numerous civilizations over the centuries. The Kushan don't begin cover all of its history but they were the most interesting and important choice in my opinion.
Turks: Still working out what this civ covers. Will probably narrow the definition to the Turkish people that moved westward into Mesopotamia and Anatolia. I don't consider the Seljuk and Ottoman Turks to be different civilizations; they're just different dynasties. It gets messier further back in time and further east though. I don't feel any great need to go back as far as the Gökturks or the Uyghurs. Much more research needed on the periods in between though.
India: Northern India. Despite the diversity of the region, northern India has been reasonably united politically and culturally for much of it's history. Excludes the Harrapans however.
Tamil: Southern India, where Dravidian people and culture were (and are) preeminent. I think I will rename the civilization, 'Tamil' is much narrower in definition than I thought.
Indonesia: Also covers much of Malaysia.
Polynesia: Just Polynesia, not Melanesia, Micronesia or other peoples of the Pacific.
Anasazi: The Anasazi and related cultures like the Mogollon and Hohokon, and their descendants: the Pueblo, Hopi and Zuni in particular.
Aztec: Not just the Mexica, but also their predecessors and related contemporaries. This includes the Toltecs, who weren't actually a real people, but actually a mythologizing of aspects of the region's past.
Inca: Currently just the Inca themselves, may expand the definition in the future if appropriate. Research needed.
Let me know if you have any specific queries about or beyond the above.
They do, but they're pretty tenuous and exaggerated. Which is why Attila has to go.
ales_
Heir
And from the city lists?
Yes, but there are many citylists I haven't had time to rework yet and are just using the same lists as in BTS or lists I've found in other mods. Many of these are perfectly reasonable but some (chiefly Firaxis ones) are pretty awful with numerous inaccuracies. Most civilizations will have dynamic city naming set up for their capital cities, but not for the rest of their city list yet.
Here's the citylists that I have personally reworked for HR, most have full dynamic city naming set up:
- Germany
- Russia (partially)
- Greece
- Phoenicia
- Egypt
- Nubia
- Berbers
- Mali
- Swahili
- Sumer
- Amurru
- Assyria
- Hatti
- Persia
- Kushan
- Indonesia
- Aztec
ales_
Heir
Are you planning to add dynamic city naming for every civ in later versions?
Definitely. Though all the coding is done it's still a massive project to research and assign cities to each civilization/leader/era. I'm trying to add to it a bit more with every version of HR.
Absolution
King
If you are merging Sumer and Amuru into a Mesopotamian civilization, I think it can be a good idea to add Zenobia as a later Mesopotamian leader.
I've decided to leave Sumer and Amurru intact for now but I may review it again later. Zenobia was Arabian.
That seems excessive, and I'm not sure what could be causing it.
Absolution
King
Why is Hayam Wuruk included and not Gajah Mada, which was the more important of the two?
I think that the inclusion of Gajah Mada in BNW is a signal to make that replacement in here...
He can be Aggressive|Charismatic.
I think that the inclusion of Gajah Mada in BNW is a signal to make that replacement in here...
He can be Aggressive|Charismatic.
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