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FfH2 0.34 Change log

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Fall from Heaven' started by Kael, Oct 2, 2008.

  1. Zechnophobe

    Zechnophobe Strategy Lich

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    Raiders don't get bonus XP, which is a great change. They still get double yield from pillaging, and still all start with a tier 4 promotion. I think this was an epicly good decision, because it balances them out with Aggressive and Charismatic.
     
  2. Avahz Darkwood

    Avahz Darkwood Chieftain

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    Is Fiacra making a comeback as well?
     
  3. MagisterCultuum

    MagisterCultuum Great Sage

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    I think The Northwind should.


    I'm thinking that instead of adding a seperate block to stop birds from being trained by Govannon, you should simply make Hawks (which I'm thinking should just be called Birds, as some are Parrots or Ravens) be UNITCOMBAT_ANIMAL. Fiacra should be a UNITCOMBAT_BEAST bird, with the ability to attack.

    Speaking of unitcombats animal and beast, I really think that Duin (and maybe greater werewolves, but probably not ravenous ones) should be switched to being a Beast. He's just too valuable to have his captured by a hunter or ranger.

    I'd still like to know what is happening to Beastmasters now that Subdue Animal and Subdue Beast are not starting promotions. (Or, you could just change this back instead of explaining)
     
  4. Avahz Darkwood

    Avahz Darkwood Chieftain

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    Yea I wonder why it was removed? It wasn't really all that powerful and by the time any of your scouts get the ability to catch animals the grand menagerie can be pretty much forgotten. It takes a highly promoted beast master to catch beasts (or a good bit of cannon fodder). The only thing I can think of is that they don't want dragons to be captureable anymore. In that case make them heros or give them the loyalty promo.
     
  5. orangelex44

    orangelex44 Partisan

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    One thing that'd be kind of cool would be for Beastmasters to have a unique spell for an random animal permanant summon.
     
  6. Blackmantle

    Blackmantle Chieftain

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    Agree with Raiders beeing a very decent change along with the change to agressive (even more needed imo).
    Both much needed and well thought out. :) (Raiders is still should kick-ass just not the be-all end-all of the combat traits regardless of anything else.)
    Anyone thinking Raiders sucks now, does harshly underestimate the value of pillaging and commando-promotion. The extra-xp was just the icing of the cake and isn't needed for it beeing a decent trait.


    @ Zechnophobe: thanks alot that was indeed a very good idea. :)
     
  7. Breunor

    Breunor Chieftain

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    That is good to see; but it makes limiting assassins even more important.

    Best wishes,

    Breunor
     
  8. Nikis-Knight

    Nikis-Knight Chieftain

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    I think there already exists strategies for dealing with assassins. They aren't invisible, for one, and they are weaker, so you should be able to take them down assuming equal numbers if you attack them first, rather than hoping to win on defense. Mages can go for earth mana to have stone-skin; it'll take more than one assassin to take down a stone-skin mage in a city, probably 2-3. If you see a large stack, hit them with collateral damage units, so the assassins are weak enough to lose out. Use your own assassins, you should have mobility advantage in your own lands. Etc.

    If it is the fact that it seems odd to field large numbers of them, remember these are abstractions and the assassins could represent special forces type units who might be fielded in large numbers in a war (and each unit is much smaller than a unit of champions, that's why they lose on defense).
     
  9. xienwolf

    xienwolf Chieftain

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    Location! Location!
  10. Avahz Darkwood

    Avahz Darkwood Chieftain

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    I remember one game were the Clan sent over 30 assassins to take down my invasion force. Was pretty effective considering they also sent in a number of lizard men as cannon fodder. Good thing Brigid was immortal.
     
  11. orangelex44

    orangelex44 Partisan

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    Assassins were never my favorite unit - both to use and defend from. I unwisely ignore the Exploration tech line in favor of religion/magic and melee almost every game, so by the time I get around to Assassins it's well past the time they're useful. To defend against, the AI's constant use of Assassins was more of an annoyance than a real factor. The best they do is whack a weak Adept or a couple slaves, and one the computer is well and truly on the defence it keeps Assassins as garrisons. So, a unit limit on them isn't that big of a deal. Seriously, a megastack of Assassins is no stronger than the equivalent stack of Axemen (weaker, since Axemen get weapons). A few Assassins, though, are still good for killing those few Adepts - the more so since STR 0 units no longer apply for Marksmen.

    I could be completely wrong (it's been known to happen), but from my particular strategic perspective limiting Assassins isn't a big big deal.
     
  12. El_Duderino

    El_Duderino Chieftain

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    please bring back barbatos, having really tuff unique barbarian units makes the game so much more interesting, also without it the barbatos slim modmod really doesnt make any sense
     
  13. MagisterCultuum

    MagisterCultuum Great Sage

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    Yes, Barbatos must return, and should be stronger than he is now, but only be one fairly rare outcome of exploring his lair.



    I really think that Destroy Undead needs to destroy the undead. It is a spell with limited usefulness, since it only effects units with a specific promotion, so it should not have any DamageLimit. I'm fine if the average damage isn't increased, but it must be potentially lethal.

    It should also be changed to be xml only. Tags making damage spells only target units with specific promotions (and letting those with specific promotions be immune to them) would be quite useful for this and may other spells.
     
  14. Mailbox

    Mailbox Chieftain

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    Why have a specific Barbatos unit when his lair can just spawn him with the name Barbatos (Lich) and domain_immobile? His unit is just clutter as of now considering he can be replicated perfectly with a python spawn.
     
  15. MaxAstro

    MaxAstro Spiral Knight

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    To allow for shiny unique graphics. :) And also because Barbatos is a fair bit stronger than a normal lich.
     
  16. MagisterCultuum

    MagisterCultuum Great Sage

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    Yeah, I guess that's true. I don't even think they would need to be immobile, as he isn't around all that early and you are risking exploring his lair to find some special rewards. (I could see learning KotE, Necromancy, Sorcery, or Arcane Lore as possible good results here.) He could just be a Lich with Hero, Arcane, Spell Extension I (and maybe II), and Death and Earth magic. (On the other hand, why did he ever have earth magic anyway? I never saw an explanation for the head of Kyorlins school of Necromancy being a master of earth magic too.)

    Destroy Undead still needs to be potentially lethal though.
     
  17. El_Duderino

    El_Duderino Chieftain

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    also on the illian draw ritual shouldnt the you get the option of maintaining dipolmacy with the doviello as lucians pedia entry suggests that he will lead the doviello into another allaince with the illians, and that the two civs were allies back in the age of ice when charadon was leading the doviello
     
  18. rusty217

    rusty217 Veil Fanatic

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    Actually it kind of fits how it is now, the Doviello may decide to turn their back on the Illian and join a different religious group and so would want to stop Mulcarns return.

    But if they still want to join with the Illians then they can quite easily get a permanent alliance with them, the ritual seems like it would be fairly late so there should be a good chance of an alliance happening. And if they don't ally then it shows that the Doviello must have fairly bad relations with the Illians so they wouldn't want to help them...
     
  19. MagisterCultuum

    MagisterCultuum Great Sage

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    I'd say that it shouldn't effect diplomacy with permanent allies or vassals. The Doviello were basically vassals of Mulcarn, and presumably would be vassals of Auric too.
     
  20. Kael

    Kael Chieftain

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    We wouldn't force random games to play out the specific history/diplomacy of Erebus. But that doesnt keep you from setting up those games if you like.

    My current game is a Final Five game with 18 civs on a large map (I love over crowded Final Five games since the game naturally weeds out weak players). Im playing as the Grigori but I added the Illians and the Doviello as a team (they are the only starting team in the game) which is working great.

    Barbatos is obsolete with Marnoks awesome explorable lairs mechanic. It is such a better way to do everything we were trying to do with Barbatos. its still possible to spawn a powerful version of a named lich when exploring the Broken Sepulcher. But other results are also possible. It is better in every way, and we are able to cut a unit from the mod.

    I also included a screenshot of the Trophy Hall for those that are interested.
     

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