First Civ 4 Screenshots!
- Thread starter Jon Shafer
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Blackbird_SR-71
Spying from 85,000 ft
W.i.n.t.e.r said:You won't need more than two hands to count them all in since early 2002.
And about the programs *sigh* you think wrong... and firaxis hasn't made a single unit for the community that wasn't in their expansions. So much to that, sorry.
what i mean is that Firaxis will provide the community with a 3DS to NIF(whatever file format) converter. i didn't mean provide us with more units. sorry for the misunderstanding
Nexushyper
Warlord
Removing micromanagment is a BAD idea to me.
Keep pollution, keep corruption, keep ALL that stuff and just add MORE!!
The more to control, the better!
If they truely are going to remove corruption and pollution and 'replace' them and remove the micromanagement, then I wont buy it. I hate games that brainless and require no thought and detail. I must have my hands in it, planing on how to deal with pollution, corruption, and I want even more to deal with. Removing these removes the reasons I liked Civ so much!
Keep pollution, keep corruption, keep ALL that stuff and just add MORE!!
The more to control, the better!
If they truely are going to remove corruption and pollution and 'replace' them and remove the micromanagement, then I wont buy it. I hate games that brainless and require no thought and detail. I must have my hands in it, planing on how to deal with pollution, corruption, and I want even more to deal with. Removing these removes the reasons I liked Civ so much!
Jon Shafer
Civilization 5 Designer
There's a difference between something requiring thought and needless micromanagement. Can you honestly say that you enjoy hunting down pollution tiles, watching them mess up city builds? Or that you like having a city or two riot out of hundreds simply because you're not babysitting every single city's happiness every turn?
Soren has said he's replaced pollution with a "health" system. He hasn't said much else, so we can't say what this entails yet, but I think there it could make the game much more fun in its own right, let alone as a replacement for pollution. That is what Soren and co. are trying to do - make the game more interesting and remove the tedius "check every city every turn to make sure it doesn't riot" kind of actions and replace them with things that require more planning and thinking, rather than busy-work.
Soren has said he's replaced pollution with a "health" system. He hasn't said much else, so we can't say what this entails yet, but I think there it could make the game much more fun in its own right, let alone as a replacement for pollution. That is what Soren and co. are trying to do - make the game more interesting and remove the tedius "check every city every turn to make sure it doesn't riot" kind of actions and replace them with things that require more planning and thinking, rather than busy-work.
The Last Conformist
Irresistibly Attractive
What Trip said.
If the 'mechanical' parts of the game are steamlined, you'll have more time for strategic decisions.
If the 'mechanical' parts of the game are steamlined, you'll have more time for strategic decisions.
hIdDeN_eViL
{кοтоя дѕѕαѕѕїй}²
damn itainwood said:Now that page links back to this thread!
now i'll won't be able to see those screenshots till its release here in sunny australia...
unless of course someone is kind enough to direct me to a site containing the sreenies *hint**hint*
Nexushyper
Warlord
Trip said:
Yes I can. I love the fact I have chase pollution down and manage the happiness of each city!! That's what makes it so fun!
Jon Shafer
Civilization 5 Designer
Well, you can keep playing Civ 3 then. 
kryszcztov
Deity
- Joined
- Mar 1, 2003
- Messages
- 2,423
How long have you been playing Civ3 ? Because after 18 months of playing this game (and not much this year BTW) I have completely enough of babysitting cities without having a control on the events. First, this is not fun at all. Second, it isn't micro-management, it is something that destroys my micro-management.Nexushyper said:
Third, it is a random process, so talk about the strategic implications elsewhere. Fourth, it's completely unrealistic ; the only historical event that makes me think a "tile" could be useless is Tchernobyl in Ukraine, 1986 ; C3C's craters are just a plain joke as well. Fifth, we all know you'll change your mind once Soren comes up with the whole idea (at least, what I believe). So stop whining, and stop thinking that only adding stuff is good. I hope it isn't an American trait ! 
(or How to become anti-American while visiting CFC 
)
Jon Shafer
Civilization 5 Designer
Gee, and I thought it was only the Americans who were stereotypical... 
There's no need to insult the guy, he said he doesn't want it removed, that's his opinion.
There's no need to insult the guy, he said he doesn't want it removed, that's his opinion.
The Last Conformist
Irresistibly Attractive
I think Nexushyper would make the ideal bean-counter.
@Krzysztof: Craters are only ridiculous if you think of them as actual craters. Think of them as the more-or-less inevitable devastation of war, and they make tolerable sense.
@Krzysztof: Craters are only ridiculous if you think of them as actual craters. Think of them as the more-or-less inevitable devastation of war, and they make tolerable sense.
Portuguese
Vassalising Spain
So, UFO enemy Unknown is back with it's 3d world and a perfect implemented zoom...
Just hope that this "simplification" talking doesn't go the wrong way... Some things could be simplified, but not many. Risk is to made it too simple. Or to cut essential things.
But my biggest hope is that it's completelly moddable, including the AI, and some people here could do better AI systems, and better and better... And then we could enter in specialized AIs (for Deathmatch, for Regicide,...).
I just hope GRAPHICS doesn't come as "TOYS for BABIES" as WarcraftIII, that I recused to play due to graphics. And those pics didn't confort me...
Why 3D games nowadays seem to hav units like Ballons?
I remember that ballons in form of dogs, clowns, etc when I see Warcraft3 for example. Luckily, Battle for Middle Earth seems not to be the case, but again that pics really put me in maximum alert...
PLEEEEEEAAASE in the final version beware of the graphics. Let me buy CIV4...
Just hope that this "simplification" talking doesn't go the wrong way... Some things could be simplified, but not many. Risk is to made it too simple. Or to cut essential things.
But my biggest hope is that it's completelly moddable, including the AI, and some people here could do better AI systems, and better and better... And then we could enter in specialized AIs (for Deathmatch, for Regicide,...).
I just hope GRAPHICS doesn't come as "TOYS for BABIES" as WarcraftIII, that I recused to play due to graphics. And those pics didn't confort me...
Why 3D games nowadays seem to hav units like Ballons?
I remember that ballons in form of dogs, clowns, etc when I see Warcraft3 for example. Luckily, Battle for Middle Earth seems not to be the case, but again that pics really put me in maximum alert...
PLEEEEEEAAASE in the final version beware of the graphics. Let me buy CIV4...
Aussie_Lurker
Deity
You see though, Trip, what you have said about MM is why I advocate a % based happiness system.
Firstly, the effects of such a system can be much more gradual, from mere drops in productivity to outright succession-so that you can get a much clearer idea of how close your city might be from a revolt or the production of insurgents. A good % system would also let you see, at a glance, roughly how all your cities are doing on the happiness front. This would be a HUGE improvement from the no unhappy heads to revolt model we have in civ3.
The other benefit is that such a system is difficult, if not IMPOSSIBLE to Micromanage, as the cause of a 5-10% dip in your happiness could be caused by a whole raft of possible factors, and can equally be solved by many different mechanisms, both city based and nation-wide (such as improving rations and wages, or ending a war). A HUGE improvement to the 'enter the city screen, click on the heads to make an entertainer, and the revolt is over' babysitting that seems to only help those who enjoy MM.
Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.
Firstly, the effects of such a system can be much more gradual, from mere drops in productivity to outright succession-so that you can get a much clearer idea of how close your city might be from a revolt or the production of insurgents. A good % system would also let you see, at a glance, roughly how all your cities are doing on the happiness front. This would be a HUGE improvement from the no unhappy heads to revolt model we have in civ3.
The other benefit is that such a system is difficult, if not IMPOSSIBLE to Micromanage, as the cause of a 5-10% dip in your happiness could be caused by a whole raft of possible factors, and can equally be solved by many different mechanisms, both city based and nation-wide (such as improving rations and wages, or ending a war). A HUGE improvement to the 'enter the city screen, click on the heads to make an entertainer, and the revolt is over' babysitting that seems to only help those who enjoy MM.
Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.
kryszcztov
Deity
- Joined
- Mar 1, 2003
- Messages
- 2,423
One should stop from visiting CFC's OT too often, so as not to be biaised (talking of me here).Trip said:Gee, and I thought it was only the Americans who were stereotypical...
Indeed. That's why I didn't insult him. Or is this an insult in the USA ?
You mistyped my name.The Last Conformist said:
So dromons can completely destroy coastal tiles (well, the ones by the sea) ?
Destroy their economical value, destroy the roads, destroy the mines, and above all destroy the ground so much that the land is less productive than before Man took it ? No, that makes no sense. It could only makes sense in a zoomed-in map, on a low time scale (like WWI in northern France). Apart from that it's just some hype to make more sales, I'm sorry to disappoint you, you really wanted craters to be the divine solution to how to make more strategical depth. It fell flat. (I hope you don't fall into my provocative description. )A reminder.
I know how a lot of you have been saying that the first Civ3 screenshots were not great at all either. These here are proof that you indeed don't need to worry about CivIV's looks (if you STILL need convincing ).
Compare these very first screenshots of CivIII to what was actually released:
Here and here.
I mean, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that the final graphics were much finer.
I know how a lot of you have been saying that the first Civ3 screenshots were not great at all either. These here are proof that you indeed don't need to worry about CivIV's looks (if you STILL need convincing
).Compare these very first screenshots of CivIII to what was actually released:
Here and here.
I mean, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that the final graphics were much finer.
Jon Shafer
Civilization 5 Designer
You sure are obsessed with Americans. You must secretly want to be one or something, with such a fixation.kryszcztov said:Indeed. That's why I didn't insult him. Or is this an insult in the USA ?
All he said was that removing micromanagement was a bad idea - and you made a checklist as to why he should stop "whining." I have no idea where you're getting the impression that that is whining.
toh6wy
Emperor
Civrules said:A reminder.
I know how a lot of you have been saying that the first Civ3 screenshots were not great at all either. These here are proof that you indeed don't need to worry about CivIV's looks (if you STILL need convincing
Compare these very first screenshots of CivIII to what was actually released:
Here and here.
I mean, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that the final graphics were much finer.
True, but from looking at those screenshots, it seems that it has the same basic graphical features. (the terrain and unit graphics look quite similar to the final version, for example)
Of course, the difference between these screenshots and Civ3 now is a lot less than a year.
So I can still hope for the best.Similar threads
