Foreign Affairs: Nobody knows nothings

[classical_hero]

It seems like the title of this thread is quite appropriate.

 

[Provolution]

Indeed Classical Hero By the way, I named the operation after you and Furiey.

 

[blackheart]

1) we aren't a superpower, our will isn't enforced around the world
2) MSAV isn't fault free from fighting the Zulu war with inferior troops
3) FA did not fail, coal is Trade's responsibility, and Trade did not fail there either
4) MSAV sure likes to complain about how much things have gone wrong and put itself above blame
5) Military buildup was suggested, but ignored by the MSAV

All that being said, since when do we bow to external pressure? Why are we so scared of the Russians? If we sign an MPP with China, America, or Aztec right before the turn, our new allies will declare war on Russia for invading our territory.

And not meant as a mean jab or anything, but MSAV's plans of containment vs. China and befriending Russia have been proven wrong, especially that we took their coal from them.

 

[Provolution]

1) we aren't a superpower, our will isn't enforced around the world

We are a superpower, we have the means to enforce our global will, and will need to do so in order to win the game. Saying anyting else is national treason and serves no purpose. FA or Historgraph, both require superpower status.

2) MSAV isn't fault free from fighting the Zulu war with inferior troops

The Tugela Campaign happened exactly as we planned, except for us having a bit old troops. However, using Elite Commandos accelerated Forbidden Palace, and we took the city at almost no cost, so yor criticism there falls short. MSAV got broad support for the performance in that campaign and the end result, as well as cooperation with the FA.

3) FA did not fail, coal is Trade's responsibility, and Trade did not fail there either

Everyone knows our Foreign Policy failed, but you Blackheart.

4) MSAV sure likes to complain about how much things have gone wrong and put itself above blame

MSAV sure gets most of the criticism from Mr Blackheart regardless, as shown throughout my administration in general, where everyone else goes free. MSAV can only take responsibility where this is given, and then deliver. This is the very proof that non-doctrinal policy thinking has failed, with compartmentalized Ministries focussing on short-sighted sectoral gains, at the cost of FAs effectiveness.
You denied personally Natioalism for a long while, personally worked against building up partnerships and personally talked Chinas case up till this point where a Russian conflict is likely.

5) Military buildup was suggested, but ignored by the MSAV

Wrong again Blackheart, you personally fought Japanatica getting Nationalism to the very end, your and your compatriots voting record proves that. You also proposed a limited upgrade of 1100, yet you dare to criticize MSAV for failing to call for military build-up (you only called for more musketmen). However, MSAV made the best use of limited resources, and delivered exactly what people want, short war, new city, some elites, very few losses, best use of obsolete troops possible, Forbidden Palace and a good peace settlement with the Zulus.

 

[Provolution]

Minister Nobody

I call for some assistance ahead from the Family. Please see if you can protect the peace with any means possible at your disposal, propose the needed agreements you see fit.
However, please do what you can to trade territory maps with the Russians, as well as Investigate the following cities:

Moscow
Lahore
Punjab
Sverdlovsk

If you cannot prevent war with Russians (I hope you do, since 3200 gold is at stake here), I hope you agree on taking the Russian East Coast to protect our national interest, which is three cities. We plan on returning Moscow to Russia after the war, if you consider that a good foreign policy. However, FA can discuss and poll all agreements needed, where MSAV will poll and discuss which cities to conquer.

 

[Donovan Zoi]

It seems to me that the smartest thing to do would be to sign an MPP with both America and Russia:

A Russian MPP (with RoP attached) will hopefully dissuade them from attacking us. If we go this route, we should NOT ask them to leave our territory. You see how that worked for the Zulus.

An American MPP would be used as leverage to keep Russia from breaking their treaty. If Russia attacks us without warrant, then America will ally with us instead of them. This in itself will hopefully be enough to have Cathy reconsider her intentions regarding Coal City, as well as holding her to her trade agreement.


Since MSAV is so quick to admonish those with peaceful intentions, I feel it should be noted that we would not be in this position were it for our interest in declaring foreign resources for ourselves with no viable strategy to retain the city. We had to trespass to get there, and we will have to trespass to secure it.

 

[blackheart]

We are a superpower, we have the means to enforce our global will, and will need to do so in order to win the game. Saying anyting else is national treason and serves no purpose. FA or Historgraph, both require superpower status.

I beg to differ, if we had means to enforce ourselves across the globe Russia wouldn't be trespassing in TBD would they, nor would we be worrying about losing TBD. I am saying anything else, are you going to execute me for ridiculous treason? Diplomatic and Histograph history do not require us to be a superpower, just a friendly nation.

The Tugela Campaign happened exactly as we planned, except for us having a bit old troops. However, using Elite Commandos accelerated Forbidden Palace, and we took the city at almost no cost, so yor criticism there falls short. MSAV got broad support for the performance in that campaign and the end result, as well as cooperation with the FA.

Exactly as planned, except for old troops? For all the planning that was made, the modern troops of Zululand weren't planned for were they?

Everyone knows our Foreign Policy failed, but you Blackheart.

Funny that, I don't remember you doing anything, while it was "failing", except trying to incite war with China.

MSAV sure gets most of the criticism from Mr Blackheart regardless, as shown throughout my administration in general, where everyone else goes free. MSAV can only take responsibility where this is given, and then deliver. This is the very proof that non-doctrinal policy thinking has failed, with compartmentalized Ministries focussing on short-sighted sectoral gains, at the cost of FAs effectiveness.
You denied personally Natioalism for a long while, personally worked against building up partnerships and personally talked Chinas case up till this point where a Russian conflict is likely.

Credit is received where credit is due. So now it's everyone elses fault that this situation rose up? We all supressed the FA? And how many times do I have to say it for you to absorb? TRADE FOR NATIONALISM, NOT RESEARCH IT. I personally worked against MSAV's attempt to make China an enemy, which the MSAV still doesn't seem to get.

Wrong again Blackheart, you personally fought Japanatica getting Nationalism to the very end, your and your compatriots voting record proves that. You also proposed a limited upgrade of 1100, yet you dare to criticize MSAV for failing to call for military build-up (you only called for more musketmen). However, MSAV made the best use of limited resources, and delivered exactly what people want, short war, new city, some elites, very few losses, best use of obsolete troops possible, Forbidden Palace and a good peace settlement with the Zulus.

My goodness, it seems like the broken record keeps on playing. My voting record speaks for itself, I'll vote what I see fit. Musketman are not military units? I took into the fact that cavalry becomes obsolete really quick and musketman doesn't.

Sorry for the off topicness there, so back to the discussion. A war not fought is a war won. We have a plenthora of options to gain more than lose from this, let us use them. We can involve China in an MPP with us, as well as America and Aztec. This way if Russia does indeed invade us, their backs will be up against a spiked wall.

 

[Provolution]

I let the FA handle the crisis management here. MSAV will only plan for the Russian expedition in a separate thread, so our very few turnchats are not prematurely interrupted. On a good note, we cooperated well in the upgrade polls, and with the new upgrades, I am confident on a positive outcome of any future war this term.
I am only stating that there is no military solution on the coal city, just a remedy if diplomacy fails.

 

[Ashburnham]

we are asking for trouble by doing this. Apparently it is too late to talk sense into those who have voted for this measure. So now that we have decided to meddle with Russia, we had better be ready to pay the price.

In the words of just about any action movie ever, "I have a bad feeling about this". If we start making bases and stationing troops in the middle of other nation's territory, we're eventually going to get burned. Let's leave Atarashika to the Atarashikans for the time being.

Settling there, is asking for it, IMHO. Let it go.

Borders will close in on it, anyway.

I am against settling a city just for the sake of it. We don't want to provoke china. If we will gain something from placing a city there do it. But not just for the sake of it, send the people home if need be. Defending our citys on Atarashika is a joke.

Again, I don't like any of the options. Disband him or send him home. There is no need for us to settle a corruption infested city which will only entice the AI to go to war with us.

Ask yourself this question: What do we gain of this city?

Damn, it hurts being so right.

 

[Nobody]

*walks into the office at 10:30am* damn sorry im late i was up all night at the forbindin palace. ok back to workthe Family has posted a discussion, in the citizens forum please discuss it there. sorry im late guys.

 

[Eklektikos]

Any chance you could edit the first post to correctly reflect France's attitude towards us?

 

[Nobody]

the first post is my opening statement thing, the second is where it says nations atitude, i will go check

 

[Nobody]

done and done

 

[Eklektikos]

Thankee kindly

 

[classical_hero]

A discreet note was left on the Office of the FAmily. Do not threaten me. If you try to do that you will suffer the consquences of those actions.

 

[Nobody]

i never threatened anyone.

 

[Crimso]

*Puts down bowl and lighter*
*Exhales*
Dude, Russia totally declared war on us.
*Resumes smokin'*

Edit: You just entered the chat, n/m

 

[Nobody]

*NEWS FLASH*

The FA conferms reports that russia has attacked. Japantica is in a dire situation, But the FAmily is working for you, everything will work on top. I am going to go check the save and get back to you.

 

[blackheart]

*NEWS FLASH*

The FA conferms reports that russia has attacked. Japantica is in a dire situation, But the FAmily is working for you, everything will work on top. I am going to go check the save and get back to you.

I wouldn't call it dire yet, they can't reach us!

 

[classical_hero]

I wouldn't call it dire yet, they can't reach us!

I would. They should pay for there treachery.