FRESH! WWII with a twist

[FinnMcCool]

VERSION FIVE now uploaded

I'm playing America in a very balanced scenario, and I'm allying with the Axis. I stationed some destroyers in the Irish Sea just off the Isle of Man, in order to invade Caernarfon and acquire the Henge resource. My ships were in the way of a German fleet and she chose to declare war on her ally (me) rather than take a different route. That's when I ran into the last error in the pediaicons file, since I was building the World Series. I reran the same turn, but moved my destroyers out of the German's path, and she simply moved past me. Seems the AI considers a tactical route more important than a strategic ally...

 

[Grohan]

Looks promising...

Unfortunately schoolprojects hinder me from trying this scenario

 

[David Smith]

What is up with AI's going to war with your player if their sea unit has to go around yours? They even do it when they have just signed a protection treaty?

I had to restart 4 times just because a sub was in the way of another nations ship's direct route to it's target, a path, etc.

Land units don't seem to do that, so why do the sea units do it????

Please Fix that as soon as possible. It's very up setting!!!! :suicide:

 

[Abaddon]

dude its called the "sub bug" its like that regardless of modding or not.. its a problem within Civ itslef.

 

[David Smith]

I guess, I just never build that many subs in my others games to have run into this problem before.

Players still needs some sort of solution to this problem before trying to have fun playing this Mod.
I suggest either;
1. remove all subs to ports before the game starts , or
2. put all subs at sea, very far out and off normal paths at start of the game.

----------------------------------------------------------------------AND--------------------------

PLEASE WARN ABOUT THIS DANGER BEFORE SOMEONE PLAYS THIS SUB LOADED GAME.

 

[FinnMcCool]

Way to draw me in, David...

The sub problem goes much deeper than you suggest, David. I've played this mod as all 6 major nations, and it's always the same. The AI just doesn't have a strong enough sense of loyalty. My earlier post about being America, and allied to Germany is a good example. I had destroyers off the Isle of Man, so Germany didn't accidentally run into me. This problem happens in all C3C games, in fact, and I've read and posted in forums on it.

My destroyers in the bay, and no way around them, if you want to go from northern England south, and not all the way around Ireland. Germany chose to take this route, running into my destroyers. That, unfortunately, required Germany to declare war on me.

That's hardcoded into the game's turn sequence, which if you ask me, is a little scrambled, so I just play Civ knowing that when it comes to the AI, expect a lot of randomness...


ONNNN The other hand...
Land units have a similar problem with invisible units like Spies (Resistors, MI-5, Chekists, X-2) you wind up attacking them accidentally just by moving. So I made spies Hidden Nationality, and it makes the enemy just pass over without attacking, unless the unit can detect invisible.

So, I could just make Subs HN, but in my opinion, that would make them WAY too powerful. I've already made subs VERY powerful, and if you don't usually build them, try it and see. You can sink injured cruisers (ROF=2) pretty effectively by using bombardment. A pack of two subs becomes deadly.

 

[David Smith]

So I guess, I just have to group other ships with them.

AI's see the other ships and goes around them. It is, to me, just a waste of manpower, but the game goes on.

I will let you know how my game goes in a later post.

Party on!!!

 

[FinnMcCool]

I've always made it a habit, to have detroyer escorts, always. It's just a good precaution, and not a waste of manpower, IMO.

In the research I've made on naval forcepools of the time, the US was very equipped with destroyers, even though not many battleships, cruisers, etc. Same for Britain, France, even Italy. Only exception was Germany's Uboat fleet, which I suspect was the reason for the destroyers...

 

[David Smith]

I played as the Germans and had USA & Italy as major partners and Finland, Romania, Spain & Turkey as minor allies.

USA Helped with British ( both in Canada and UK) and Scandivan's; Itlay helped with British in north africa and Med and the French in africa.
While Turkey took on Egypt and British in Middle East.

All others, at one time or another, where allies, but by the end All where either attackers or dead .

First to fall was Europe, both France and the neturals countries.

I took out France while Italy & Romania worked on Greece & Africa. Turkey was on Eqypt from the start. The UK mainland was next, just to stop the British Navy & bombers from attacking Europe. With US Navy & Airplanes, Britian fell within one year.

Next was Norway-Sweden-Iceland, had help from USA, Finland & USSR. So far very thing was going great. I even saw the UFO in Iceland.
Then USSR attacked Finland- this sent Turkey and Iraq at USSR and I was left looking for more oil and plan to my next Great Attack.

With US, I was attacking Canada, Britian's new far away home. I sent 25 Tiger tanks units with 25 mixed units to do that. Transports, Battleships, subs, etc. all supporting that effort. It was a close fight for a long time.
It took about 2 years time to finish Canada, with my Science really advancing fast: modern tanks, jets, the Flying Wing, rockets & etc. all discovered by me.

At home I started to build modern tanks and jets and flying wings for the final USSR Attack. I also supported the Italian's with airpower and yes, tanks later when Italy stalled Africa.

USSR attack started late 1944, and by then, the foolish USSR had complete a nice railroad system between all the major their cities. It was a great path to the heart of USSR, they lasted until the end of 1945.

I never stopped pushing until last russian city fell. With the flying wings, which made it possible to move large number of units (Tanks). The needed units could built and moved to front very fast. Reposition as required to hit behind strong points. This finished the French, the British & Eqypt in north Africa.As units became free from Canada & USSR, I could move them there.

I won on victory points 50258 total at toward the end of 1947.
Never found the UFO

I HAD FUN, BUT I STILL HATE THE SUB FAULT !!!!

 

[FinnMcCool]

Way to go David!

It sounds like you wanted to take a conquest approach to this, and succeeded very well. Your strategy sounds like there's something good about the balance--with the US as a German ally, it should be difficult for the other nations to resist.

I hope that this mod can become appealing to any player who wants to approach this game with different strategies. Yours was a good conquest strategy (I sometimes lose because I make Hitler's mistake of attacking too many opponents) but I also want to offer a good space race strategy (you didn't get the UFO? Wow. No KSF Sturmsoldat, no RFZ-1, the Reich is still on Earth, not Alpha Centauri or Aldebaran?) Or diplomatic, or culture victories.

My first try as Germany in version 2, I got so many POWs to the Concentration Camps that the Culture Victory came too early. Version 3 has fixed that, and now in my playtesting, Germany isn't racing out in front, but only competing well.

Sounds like you played very smartly!

(BTW, I'm working on a version 4, which will include, Fluoridated Water, Secret Societies, Occultism, Gamma Knife Triangulation Agents, and highly-specialized spy networks. I want to set American and Soviet spies as Elite, but give culture-based Intelligence Agencies, so that if your spies are elite, your Espionage CivImp will be very expensive... Virtually everything Mel Gibson rambled on about in the movie "Conspiracy Theory" will be included. Tripartite Commission, World Bank, Templar Gold, Tectonic Satellites, I'm very amused by my own insanity...)

I'm STILL looking for a unit that can pose as a good KLAATU, that robot agent from "The Day The Earth Stood Still" but I haven't found one...

And I'm also considering very seriously, to soften up the submarines a little. Make em cheap but less powerful. I think the German Uboat fleet numbered more than 220 in the actual war...

 

[David Smith]

I can hardly wait! And reducing the Sub problem too!
Please, Make My Day!!!!

 

[David Smith]

So WHERE is the UPDATE?????



Saturday, OK I Will be Waiting

 

[FinnMcCool]

I might be too much of a perfectionist, but I don't want to post the update before I've checked over as much as I can. Ped entries, INI files, I don't want to see any errors. Uploads probably by Saturday:

I've added beaucoup numerous City Imps, Wonders, even units. The Mohorovicic Drillhole, Illegal Aliens, 2 King units (Reichsfuhrer for Germay and Carabiniere for Italy) and finally I've found a great unit graphic from this forum for Hitler's Brain! New techs, and a HUGE amount of plain gameplay tweaking to fit my exacting standards of strategy:

Fighters and all light-medium air units have very long range, to allow them to at least friggin escort bombers. I've seen interception work very well, within range, and whoever decided to make it limited to half their operational range was a little off, IMO... P-51's and Hurricanes with very long range, Spitfires and FW-190 with moderate range, Stukas with short range and bombers with short, medium and long range as well, for Allies and Axis.

Transports carry only 1 unit. Any sea convoy will require numerous transports, but it seems to me that the AI doesn't like to stack in transports, so I've added this to give some equality. Cheap too.

National differences are much more extreme. I'm keeping War Weariness HIGH for Democracy (America) and moderate for England and France. There are several Imps and Wonders that reduce WW tho. Playing America or England isn't easy. You have to address your civilian needs also, it can't work if you just go military all the way. Black Markets, The Underground, Guidestone, Dead Sea Scrolls, Casino Royale, all reduce WW.

All this, and I've been spending a lot of time just going over my music files. Too bad you can't share music here, since I've found a really excellent mix from a group called "Covenant" (they're Jewish, and have a very healthy sense of history...)

I've had to work very hard to stay sensitive to ethnic issues. I think this mod is a very challenging one, it isn't easy to win interestingly, and I want to make sure I'm not crass... Any race could be the enemy of the Gestapo; I don't need it to be that historicly accurate!

 

[FinnMcCool]

Version five is online.

By all means, any comments are welcome. Criticism, praise, suggestions...

I've stuck with my original intention of making the leaderheads and advisors black-and-white and grainy, to suggest the technology of the times. Smallheads are changed.

PM me if you'd like to make arrangements via some other channel to get some really righteous music FX.

EDIT: new edit as of 3-13
I knew if I uploaded this this in a hurry, I'd probably miss a couple of things, and I did. Engineer has been fixed, missing entry in the PediaIcons file (MI-5) and the pallette problem for Quisling is good now.

If you downloaded on the first day (3-11) you should download the fixed Advisors, Text and Engineer.

 

[David Smith]

Did you mean to only allow one unit per transport?
That makes it very hard to transport units for attacking else where. and it sure slow down war across water.

Germany again, but I have different allies: US, UK, nuetral europe and Italy, against nearly everyone else. I will let you know how it turns out.

Still looking for that UFO!!!!

 

[FinnMcCool]

You're a very interesting player, DavidSmith. By your posts I can tell you're actually playing this thing, so I'm interested in persuing your questions...

Yes. One unit per transport. That's very intentional. Sure, you can play with transports that hold 4, or any number of units, but I don't see the AI using transports very efficiently, so I wanted to set up a limitation that gave some equality between YOU and the AI.

I have this strange urge to make a mod that is both extremely strategic, and a little humorous, to give some comic relief.

So. Don't take the transport limit too seriously. It won't put you at a disadvantage, it'll only put you at the same level of transport the AI works with...

Transports are cheap, so it only means you'll need lots of transports if you want to make a D-Day type invasion. But if you're playing Germany all the time, I can't see it being much of a problem...

I enjoy playing England, possibly the hardest player besides France, and I'm already working on a version 6. It'll include Vril reconnaissance, Fundamentalist government, al-Buraq Wall, Solomon's Third Temple, al-Aqsa Martyr's Brigade, and the Ark of the Temple (Vril/Shekinah relics). Also I'm tweaking the unit combat values, to fine-tune the balance.

Also adding Arabia as a startup player... And music? I have a PERFECT set of music files that fit the time setting (WWII Europe) as well as permission from the copyright holders. It means I can post the files, and it will be appearing soon...

 

[Red Door]

I'm finally downloading this, do I have to download both Version 5 unit-32 file and Version 3 file?

 

[David Smith]

Why can't the workers be added to a city? When do the big planes become buildable? Why are the Germans tied to the Italians? And UK and Neutral europe? They are pains as linked players. Also I keep running into unseen UK units at sea. I cannot see them with SS or Gestop units in transpoert either. Why??? Hilter's Brain, What is that?

This war is a lot longer this time, but Russia still keeps building nice roads / rail lines for me to advance.
I have seen the UFO but how do I get?

 

[David Smith]

Where is the P-51 Mustang Files? It shut me down, and I wasn't even trying to make the unit.

I will find it some where and the world will be mine!!!!!

 

[FinnMcCool]

I'm finally downloading this, do I have to download both Version 5 unit-32 file and Version 3 file?

No, version 5 adds a couple units, so you'll need the latest units_32 file in order to see them, the version 3 file is out of date.



You are convincing me quite handily to get FTP software... perhaps soon...