G-Major 16

[ParadigmShifter]

With age comes great wisdom, as they say Mid 30s. I thought everyone had heard of the chipmunks though?

30BC in my game, Ramesses is now down to 1 last city on a large island (enough for 4 cities if you cram them in really tight). I may send a few troops over to finish him off but I may just leave him ther for a while, I don't know. The rest of my troops are recovering in the former Egyptian cpaital before having a short break in China. Qin only has 4 cities, he has no metal, so a lightning strike to stop him producing more protective archers looks like the plan.

EDIT: Cathy is next after Qin. She is furious anyway. She'll be even more furious soon.

Somehow I traded construction to Wang Kon of all people, so I might leave him till last I don't fancy facing loads of Hwachas just yet. It was an exchange for currency, I traded literature and construction. I should have given him code of laws instead that was an error. He hasn't traded it to anyone else yet though but in time everyone will have it.

I'm thinking of putting off calendar as long as possible to keep stonehenge working when I spam some settlers. Unlike monuments you stop getting culture from stonehenge ones as soon as calendar is discovered. I have most of the happy resources anyway now, and can always get monarchy soon for winery and hereditary rule.

Master plan is to take astronomy from liberalism, upgrade galleons, fill with settlers, and have a spam fest in the new world. I've got barbarians on so I need some troops as well to do that.

What happens if you win by conquest and domination in the same turn? I am still missing a conquest win in my HOF so I would prefer a conquest victory.

EDIT: And no-one has built me the pyramids yet. I'm even thinking of building it myself. Some people, tsk.

 

[Perugia]

I guess you trust the game engine more than I do. As one who plays Caesar quite a bit, I need iron as well. However, the game engine does not always give iron, or even copper to conquer iron, in one's local area and so iron needing civs become useless. So I like to find out relatively early whether I have at least got copper before I invest a large amount of time in an iron requiring civ game. I may hook up food first, but iron will be an early research priority.

I'm running Vassalage (and Theocracy) instead of Bureaucracy in my current game in order to get CR1 even without a barracks, and CR2 with a barracks. I weighed up switching to Bureaucracy when it became available (didn't build Oracle and got Feudalism first for military priorities), but decided that the free units from Vassalage would count for more than my food/production poor smallish capital. Am staying with Vassalage even far into AD since number of free units keeps going up with city number I think and who can afford a 4 turn anarchy period.

I don't trust the game engine either, no local iron can be an issue in such cases, I've often found all my neighours have some but I don't. This doesn't worry me if I have copper otherwise I'll restart. Actually in my first attempt I chose a classical start and found copper on the second turn so was prepared in case iron did not show which it actually did in my capital radius.

It's a good idea to run vassalage with a poor capital if you don't switch capital. I prefer a good capital and would normally not settle a bad location unless it was sited to squeeze the AI in an early rush. One trick I have used in the past in such cases is once I have captured an AI capital is to let the AI capture my original one. Capital then automatically moves to the largest city which you can force to be an AI capital using slavery if you have other cities.

I personally feel that running vassalage and theocracy is a waste for an aggressive civ unless you can wait to switch civics in a single revolution. I'm happy for units to begin with 2XP without barracks and 6XP with on top of the free C1 promo for melee/gunpowder.

 

[Perugia]

Yes - Quechuas don't go obsolete until you get macemen! A nice trick to try with Capac is to time the builds of several quechuas just before you get the CS/Machinery combo so that they change into macemen builds just before they finish

Yep, quechas are still available up to macemen...

... But even as the Inca you are still better off timing the builds of several axemen just before you get CS/Machinery as they cost more hammers than quecha and so you can start them earlier and have more hammers invested when they change into macemen. You should pop rush them on the turn before CS/Machinery comes in and they will change into macemen and complete.

 

[ParadigmShifter]

I moved the palace in my game, the former capital has very low food.

I really should try running vassalage or theocracy one day, it might make things easier. I'm not keen on switching out of bureaucracy (when I get civil service: 2 turns from now), and I don't spread my religions so it's too random which religion to pick (I haven't chose one yet, I like the culture from all religions at the moment for winning culture battles). My new capital is super anyway, loads of flood plain cottages.

Playing marathon speed is the first time I have been tempted to run serfdom when it becomes available though.

EDIT: Might try the whip axes before macemen become available strategy. I don't think it will matter anyway, I am so far ahead in tech I have some Quechua which will participate in the razing of China. No-one has code of laws yet, and no-one has metal casting either (including me).

 

[IglooDame]

My first legitimate Monarch attempt. I think I must have learned a lot in the last few months since I played a few Prince games (winning only occasionally).

As Julius, high-water pangea, normal speed, 9 civs. Started on the southern side of the pancake, with Washington to my west (a long bay separating him from the rest of the land), and everyone else oriented with Napoleon closest.

I beelined to IW and started churning out praets and while Washington climbed to the top of the scoreboard and founded Judaism and Hinduism along with four cities I was able to eliminate him. This essentially gave me a single land front and Washington got tapped as my GP farm, with Rome staying as a military production city. Exploration shows that the continent has three lobes joined in the center - mine (the smallest) to the south, a northeast one (Bismarck, Hannibal, and beyond them Monty) and a northwest one (Napoleon, Saladin, Asoka, and beyond them Alexander)

Kept going, missed Oracle but was second to Alphabet and so climbed from near-last to near-leader in the tech dept. A quick war with Bismarck for a single city of his, then with catapults showing up I mowed down Napoleon but for a single distant city. I'm now score leader and control the central nexus of the pangea but behind Hannibal in tech (he just beat me to Liberalism) and Monty and Saladin are pretty far ahead on the power graph. I've worked to stay friendly with Hannibal, Monty, and Alexander, and the latter two are Pleased.

I bribed Alex to declare on Saladin, and then a few turns later hit Saladin myself, just as I finish up Chemistry and some CRII/III praets become grens. However, Hannibal appears to be increasing his tech lead. I bribe Bismarck to make peace with Monty (the two have been at it for ages), then bribe Monty to declare on Hannibal. If I can keep those two fighting while I finish off Saladin and discover Steel, then I should be able to roll into Carthage at which point Monty becomes my kicktoy instead of my friend, and Domination is inevitable - though it's about 1400AD right now, I don't see any Gauntlet-winning score coming from this.

 

[Mad Professor]

I played Capac on a great plains map since that seemed to be a good way to score well, aiming for domination. It went fairly well and I'm quite pleased, though a couple of things could have gone better. Mansa beat me to the Oracle by a couple of turns - I was hoping to short cut the route to higher military techs with Metal Casting, but not to be. Then at the end I was surprised by achieving domination the turn before I expected resulting in me being caught a turn short of education which I was aiming at finishing to add a few points - I was running a large negative at 0% science by then, but I had the cash to get education if I'd just known I was going to finish that one turn earlier.

The highest score for a large Monarch map is 278K and that seemed a bit beyond my reach but I figured if I played well (for me) I could top 200K. I achieved that - just - finishing just over 201K.

I decided for low sea level (not that it makes much difference on a great plains map) and crammed in the max 14 civs, figuring that I'd rather be building quechuas than settlers early on and if the map was crowded, other civs would build the settlers for me... I played at marathon, of course.

I did a quechua rush of course, knocking off Izzy (after she founded Buddhism - thanks Izzy) and Cathy before 1250BC. Then a little settling, and putting my economy back together before hitting Tokugawa with Swords as AD approached, finally wiping him off the map about 200AD. After that the juggernaut started to roll faster as swords became maces, and cats joined the fray, and after that I just rolled over civ after civ, keeping just about every city despite bad positions so I could max population. It cost heaps though. I shut down research afterCS/machinery but I limped to guilds (for knights) on the strength of specialists, and eventually nearly got to education the same way as I said above. I built the Sistine Chapel which proved very useful. My main objective in doing so was to hire citizens for 2 culture a turn to produce city expansions more easily, but it also allowed me to hire scientists (where I had libraries) for the same 2 culture a turn, and still limp along studying something at zero percent and still get somewhere. After capturing the pyramids from Monty, I revolted to police state (WW was awful) and Caste System which allowed me to get more serious with the culture expansions, hiring artists instead of citizens.

Overall I was quite pleased with that. That is probably my highest scoring game I think. I don't remember hitting 200K before. It still beats me how people get it done hundreds (no make that thousands) of years earlier (I finished 1175AD) but for me, that's a fairly good one.

 

[ParadigmShifter]

Still going strong in my game too, 410AD now, just finished off Qin, Ramesses and ended the session after making Cathy my vassal since her only 2 cities are in the icy ice tundra zone, I left her Moscow and 1 other city.

Built the Hanging Gardens now, score for winning this turn is 127000 odd, still going up at the moment. Still not got calendar but happiness isn't a problem with hereditary rule. Just finished the colossus, because I was first to metal casting, should keep my tech rate ticking over. Still aiming for astronomy after liberalism before winning via domination or conquest. Notre Dame is being built for more happiness availability, I was first to music but am saving the Great Artist for purposes unknown at present (a big border pop at last minute? A golden age?).

Still no-one has built the pyramids, geting a bit ridiculous now. I've got loads of cash in hand but running at 40% research now. Still teching fast, under 20 turns marathon for latest techs. Machinery finished so I'm upgrading my CR3 swords and axes to maces.

Now I've got to decide whether to go for Washington, Wang or runner up Saladin. Saladin is looking tempting with his 2 holy cities (I have 3 already - hinduism [from Egypt], Buddhism [Russia] and Confucianism [my city, Rome, well I say my city, it was all Julius could build before being Quechuad]).

Still tech leader (hence my diversion to music earlier on), researching engineering now, probably go guilds next and do a knights/trebs/catapults/macemen steamroll of everyone else. Leave 1 city still alive and nip off to the new world. I'll need to start building settlers for end game spam soon, if I'm not tempted to build all the wonders that no-one seems to want to build [only ToA - captured, Oracle and Great Lighthouse have been built by other civs so far, which leaves an awful lot remaining].

No idea when I will win, or if I will tech all the way to liberalism/astronomy. A great scientist should be along soon, probably lightbulb philosophy, perhaps. Tempted to build the Parthenon to squeeze a few more out. Saladin asked me to convert to Judaism so have been doing a bit of missionary work, will switch to either Organised Religion or Pacifism after Notre Dame is finished I think (I don't think the anarchy is worth the +25% at current hammer rate in the build city). Will probably switch to caste system at the same time to stop me cracking the whip so I can grow cities more, and stagnate growth with merchants or scientists.

 

[Methos]

Please note, that it appears the BTS v.3.13 patch modifies some non-BTS assets, which could give you the "Protected Assets" message. I would suggest either finish any ongoing games prior to patching, or setup a dual install. Current discussion regarding this can be found in this thread.

 

[Alan_of_Dale]

Two good results seem to have been obtained, 180k and 201k. However, I don't see them listed on the G-Major 16 Gauntlet page which instead states "No games submitted yet". I wonder whether the victors have submitted their games or whether there is an issue with determining this very broad score category. I guess any large Monarch game should show up in the list.

 

[Methos]

Two good results seem to have been obtained, 180k and 201k. However, I don't see them listed on the G-Major 16 Gauntlet page which instead states "No games submitted yet". I wonder whether the victors have submitted their games or whether there is an issue with determining this very broad score category. I guess any large Monarch game should show up in the list.

Good question. Has anyone submitted a game for this gauntlet that should be displayed?

 

[Alan_of_Dale]

Took another day off from my vanilla Julius marathon terra game to watch some TV, season two episode 1 of Heroes, and season 1 episode 1 of Bionic Woman, and a new Stargate SG-1 episode! The first two were "fast-tracked" to Australia without the usual 6 months delay to deliver the expensive video tape I guess. Must be sending a hard drive now with the HD digital program on it so tape availability may no longer be an issue.

Played another 19 turns, (38 years) last night, from 1294 AD to 1332 AD. Took 4 of (next strongest) Washington's 5 cities, the local ones, then gave peace treaty. Three civs eliminated now and four down to 1 or two island cities. Only two untouched civs remain to be exploited for points, two local groups of maybe four cites each. Also founded four cities on continent two with nobody else having Astronomy yet. So eight cities with one captured wonder in 19 turns including a bit bigger 2k of score decay nets me a win this turn score of 138,240, about 11k points this time. Am up to 43 cities now.

Still at 50% research and up to 854 bpt now. Still maintaining a two or more tech lead, although Fred just got Gunpowder. Won't help him too much against my Gren/Knight/Musk/Cat stack of doom. Will have rifles shortly. Did the lumbermill tech to give my 20 or so workers more to do as they have already puts roads even in the forests. Getting nearer to the domination limit with 45.13% land (of 58% needed) with two captured cities still in anarchy, and with 70.96% population. Want those eight or so large cities on this continent before I hit domination limit. At this point it looks like I'll be lucky if I hit 160k.

 

[Alan_of_Dale]

It's a good idea to run vassalage with a poor capital if you don't switch capital. I prefer a good capital and would normally not settle a bad location unless it was sited to squeeze the AI in an early rush. One trick I have used in the past in such cases is once I have captured an AI capital is to let the AI capture my original one. Capital then automatically moves to the largest city which you can force to be an AI capital using slavery if you have other cities.

I personally feel that running vassalage and theocracy is a waste for an aggressive civ unless you can wait to switch civics in a single revolution. I'm happy for units to begin with 2XP without barracks and 6XP with on top of the free C1 promo for melee/gunpowder.

Only advantage of the capital is the Palace's culture and +1 happiness. Not an issue here really with size 9 capital producing 77 beakers with GL and one extra specialist scientist. Could have grown it a bit more if i felt like it with a non-gold farm next to a lake available, but needed the gold mine and extra two mines to get Univ built ,and now building observatory since have only 5 of 7 Univ's required for Oxford. Game should be over before Oxford gets built though.

Actually in a domination game I really like Vassalage. In this game it turned out I was able to switch to Theocracy at the same time as Vassalage for only one extra turn cost so it was worth doing. OrgRel is more expensive than Theocracy, too. Although Theocracy says no non-state religion spread, it is worth noting that you can still build missionaries to spread religion manually so as to get gold from religious shrines.

 

[Andrei_V]

Well, I just submitted 304K. Huayna on Terra against 10 AIs, finished by conquest in 1050AD. I made it to Biology around 900AD, then milked the score for a while.

 

[Mad Professor]

Good question. Has anyone submitted a game for this gauntlet that should be displayed?

Mine was the 201K game which I have submitted and it has been accepted. I've never submitted a gauntlet before though - was I supposed to do something different? I didn't read any special submission rules anywhere, but then I didn't go searching for them very far either. I submitted it as a normal HOF game.

 

[Mad Professor]

Well, I just submitted 304K. Huayna on Terra against 10 AIs, finished by conquest in 1050AD. I made it to Biology around 900AD, then milked the score for a while.

Well done. Teching to biology by 900AD while managing a huge empire, and presumably a huge military is a good trick! My empire cost me too much to be teching that well though I would have gone there if I'd been able. I had Cuzco at size 20+ even without biology, but WW was awful - all I had to do near the end was declare war, and half the city would go out on strike. I was glad to snatch the pyramids off Monty and revolt to Police State to help with that! I discovered that in a very large empire with dozens of cities, WW can cost you really bigg piles of gold!

 

[ParadigmShifter]

Well the Gauntlet HOF page still says "no games submitted yet". Yet Andrei_V said his gane has been accepted, and there is no need to do anything special submission wise so I expect there should be several games on the list by now!? EDIT: Congrats Andrei, that beats the #1 score in the HOF tables at the moment.

I'm going to play another hour or so anyway. 652AD in my game.

About to take Wang out (I''ve always wanted to say that on an internet forum). Trebs, maces and an elephant outside his capital. He's got another 3 cities, 1 off on an island, 1 I can see and another I haven't yet seen. May vassalise him when he has just his island city left, but that costs maintenance (but gains happiness) so I'll have to think about that.

Saladin I think will be next with Washington at the same time probably. Saladin has a nice 1 tile island city that I will surround with boats and then commence milking. Building some settlers now.

Have built Notre Dame, Pyramids now. Not changed civics yet, I am getting a civic bonus for hereditary rule from Cathy and I want compass when she researches it. The other possibility is to demand it and drama from Saladin and Wasshington before I declare war.

Just did a bit of micro-management on the GP front, got a scientist from my 2nd city so the capital is about to produce another GP (Scientist probably from Great Lib, or a prophet, hopefully a scientist, a prophet isn't too bad though).

When I get compass I will switch civics, may skip representation and go police state, we'll see. I may take a bit of a happy hit from losing hereditary rule.

So how best to milk? For domination, I presume I need to pop down settlers to be as close to the land limit as possible, then go over the limit when they all pop borders to max out land. If I place more settlers down the turn before the borders all pop will the border pops happen before the domination win is calculated or not? Is the win calculated before or after the culture border pops are calculated? Also, what happens if I get domination and conquest on the last turn?

Will run caste system and free speech right at the end, run artist and build culture in all new cities, should get a border pop in 3 turns then (I think, 4 for an artist + 1 for building culture, multiplied by 2 = 10 cpt). Will change civics when my settlers in galleys are on the way to the new world, will have to take some knights as well. EDIT: Me and my leaving barbarians on, I wouldn't recommend it!

I plan to disband all my military on the home continent when I have Saladin down to 1 city to save cash.

This has been a fun if very very slow game. I don't think I'll challenge the 304K score but you never know, I'll get alot of land shortly thanks to Saladin and Washington. Presumably it is worth getting biology as well though, and not caring about health or happiness at the end to maximise population.

I think I will be able to win by around 1000AD anyway (fingers crossed), I don't think I will need gunpowder, but I won't score high for tech I guess.

 

[Andrei_V]

Yet Andrei_V said his gane has been accepted

No, it's 'not checked' so far. Hopefully it will be accepted eventually.

 

[Denniz]

The gauntlet results page is fixed. There are currently 4 games listed there.

 

[Mad Professor]

The gauntlet results page is fixed. There are currently 4 games listed there.

I'm not sure it is working right, but then again I'm not sure exactly how it is supposed to look. When I go to the gaunlet results for this game I see four blank rows. Indicates four games submitted perhaps, but all four rows are blank. If I login and then go look I see the details of my own game there but the other three rows are blank. Is this a problem with the page or my system...?

Or is that how it's supposed to be? If that's how it's supposed to be then it's working fine

 

[azzaman333]

I'm not sure it is working right, but then again I'm not sure exactly how it is supposed to look. When I go to the gaunlet results for this game I see four blank rows. Indicates four games submitted perhaps, but all four rows are blank. If I login and then go look I see the details of my own game there but the other three rows are blank. Is this a problem with the page or my system...?

Or is that how it's supposed to be? If that's how it's supposed to be then it's working fine

That is how it is supposed to be.