Geezers WOTM03

[Sam_Yeager]

The barb option was not listed in the game description, does that imply Normal?

To the best of my knowledge settings not explicitly mentioned will take the default value.

@Sam - are you updating your summary of rules, if so it would be good to add always move scout first and pause for consultation before settling or moving the settler as a note.

I hadn't started yet as I was waiting to see what else came out of the woodwork. However I'll see if I can find a suitable form of wording. Perhaps I need to split them into guidelines and rules rather than just rules.

 

[Harbourboy]

Excellent - NOW we're getting some decent discussion - although I still think we haven't ironed out how to exactly make decisions.

 

[LowtherCastle]

Lurker comment:
Hi guys! Couldn't resist lurking...hope you don't mind. I'll stay out of your discussions, but I thought I might point out a minor "hiccup" that could turn out to be annoying in the future (probably not for this game). I learned this the hard way, missing a gold hill for my settler once.

When moving both the scout and the settler on your first move, you could have exposed more tiles, while making the same basic moves. If the scout had gone S then NE to the hill you would have exposed that tile 2S of where the scout now is. You also would have exposed tiles further SW if they happen to be hills. Same thing with the settler. By going SW, then N, settler arrives at the same place but exposes the hill tile SW SW SW of the starting spot.

Looks like fun!

 

[erikthecelt]

Thanks for the tip LC. Any help from laurel winners is appreciated.

 

[Sam_Yeager]

Thanks LC.

 

[Harbourboy]

Hey, thanks LowtherCastle. The more stuff-ups we make, the more this practice turns out to be a good idea.

 

[AgedOne]

Hi. I'm back in . . . and what do I find?
I'm first player up, and everyone's been talking about what I should do in my absence!
This always happens at work, too

Shall I play the first moves the way Harbourboy did, or the way LC suggested? I could have memory problems

I've got to eat first, so I won't do anything for a couple of hours yet.

I'd guess we're settling in the location the settler is in after move 1.
My choice would be warrior first just to let us grow to 2 before building a worker.
I'd go along with researching straight towards BW.

 

[Sam_Yeager]

Shall I play the first moves the way Harbourboy did, or the way LC suggested?

Definitely the way Harbourboy did. We'll just have to remember the tip for future use.

I've got to eat first, so I won't do anything for a couple of hours yet.

I'd guess we're settling in the location the settler is in after move 1.
My choice would be warrior first just to let us grow to 2 before building a worker.
I'd go along with researching straight towards BW.

I didn't realise eating was such a long winded affair. If you go back a few posts you'll see that erik was going to number crunch a few figures later on. So perhaps you won't be playing until tomorrow anyway.

 

[AgedOne]

I didn't realise eating was such a long winded affair.

What? I was just waiting for the butler to bring in the 19 course repast that the staff had whipped up. Just a little something after a long day in the office. Doesn't everyone?

If you go back a few posts you'll see that erik was going to number crunch a few figures later on. So perhaps you won't be playing until tomorrow anyway.

No. That's cool. Erik seems to have elected himself the Geezers' Number Cruncher - and I'm glad! Tomorrow is better.

 

[Harbourboy]

Ooh, number-crunching. We're so mathematical. Well, not me, but I'll share the glory.

 

[erikthecelt]

OK - optimum build seems to be warrior until size 2 (11 turns) switch to worker, after worker complete warrior, 2nd warrior to size 3, settler.
tech mining, BW, wheel, IW and the settler (at turn 66) arrives 20 turns before IW completes so we want to find copper. Worker has mined everything in sight and can road the corn and cows for quicker access when other techs come online.

With more time I could look at what happens if we tech for Ag or AH. We can speed IW by slowing down the settler and working the lake or spices.
Big problem is lack of early beakers. This is a very risky path if we don't find metal in close proximity to our city.

What scenarios would you like me to explore or document? Should we think about Ag, Wheel, Pottery, Mining, BW and IW. That way we have a source of beakers, cottaging the spices would help and Ag would speed up the production of the settler.

 

[Harbourboy]

That's all too complicated. I reckon we gamble on metal being near.

 

[Sam_Yeager]

OK - optimum build seems to be warrior until size 2 (11 turns) switch to worker, after worker complete warrior, 2nd warrior to size 3, settler.
tech mining, BW, wheel, IW and the settler (at turn 66) arrives 20 turns before IW completes so we want to find copper. Worker has mined everything in sight and can road the corn and cows for quicker access when other techs come online.

Sounds like a good starting plan. By the time we have BW we should have a reasonable idea of our surroundings and any AIs that are nearby. We can then revisit the tech plan to see if it needs changing e.g. if we're on an island by ourselves then fishing becomes more important.

What scenarios would you like me to explore or document? Should we think about Ag, Wheel, Pottery, Mining, BW and IW. That way we have a source of beakers, cottaging the spices would help and Ag would speed up the production of the settler.

I'm not sure but I think you're proposing investigating the food path? It seems to me that there's broad agreement to beeline to BW. After that however it could well be worth researching a few techs before IW. Especially since the AI will have researched some of them making them cheaper.

 

[AgedOne]

OK.
Unless somebody seriously disagrees I'll be doing this:

1. Make Scout and Settler moves as before
2. Settle our capital.
3. Build order:

Warrior#1 until size=2
Worker
Warrior#1 to completion
Warrior#2 until size=3
Settler
Warrior#2 to completion​

4. Tech path:

Mining
Bronze Working
Wheel
Iron Working​

5. Meantime, scout out the locality to determine AI locations etc.
6. Worker mines hills, roads across other resources

I won't play 66 turns! Seems a bit greedy of me.
More like 30. I'll hand over at a convenient moment around that point.

I'll probably play in an hour or two.

 

[Sam_Yeager]

OK.
Unless somebody seriously disagrees I'll be doing this:

<snip>

I won't play 66 turns! Seems a bit greedy of me.
More like 30. I'll hand over at a convenient moment around that point.

Sounds good to me AgedOne.

 

[AgedOne]

Summary
Founded Bibracte.
Builds and Researches going exactly to plan.
Scouted NorthEast (met Ramesses); Found coast; Rounded Ramesses lands;
Met Shaka's scouts.
Scouted SouthEast (met Cyrus)
There is land to our west, but we are (partially/completely?) cut off by a narrow waterway.

Turnset Detail

Spoiler :

T0 (4000BC) Scout E to hill; Settler W to hill
T1 (3970) Scout NE; Setted Bibracte; Start Warrior (11); Start research Mining (12)
T2 (3940)
T3 (3910)
T4 (3880)
T5 (3850)
Scout heads off generally to the NE.
T6 (3820) Scout met Ramesses II (cautious) up to the NE. Lots of wine (3) and flood-plains up here.
T7 (3790)
T8 (3760) Scout finds Rammy's homeland.
View attachment 163810
T9 (3730) Scout continuing in anti-clockwise sweep. Bibracte borders expand. Growth due after T11.
Some land is now visible to the west across a narrow waterway. A hut is tantalisingly out of reach there.
T10 (3700) Scout found N coast
T11 (3670)
T12 (3640) Scout staggering wildly along rocky northern shore.
Bibracte grows to size 2. Switch to worker build (18).
T13 (3610) Mining complete. Start BronzeWorking (22).
T14 (3580) Saw first animals.
T15 (3550) Someone founded Hinduism
T16 (3520) Scout having rounded the north is returning south. Aiming to head off in other directions from Bibracte next.
Saw some stone conveniently close to the NE.
T17 (3490) Met Shaka - annoyed - as his scouts passed our SE border.
T18 (3460) Scout playing cat & mouse - with a cat (panther, not catapult).
T19 (3430)
T20 (3400) Scout is now due east of Bibracte - and plans to explore the SE next.
T21 (3370)
T22 (3340) Land of the Elephants over here in the E! No fewer than 4 in a herd.
T23 (3310)
T24 (3280) Scout bumped into Cyrus down here in the SE. Cautious.
Buddhism is founded elsewhere.
T25 (3250) Kind of water inlet down here by Cyrus. Anyway, the scout has to back-track.
T26 (3220) Met lions. We're on forest. Fingers crossed!
T27 (3190) Lions are dead.
T28 (3160) Scout continues scoping out the area between us and Cyrus.
T29 (3130)
T30 (3100) Worker completes. Continuing with the warrior (9). Bibracte to grow in 12. Worker to hill, ready to mine. Scouting continues.

The Save
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/22131/TeamGeezers_BC-3100.CivWarlordsSave

The Lie of the Land
View attachment 163811
View attachment 163812

 

[Sam_Yeager]

Whilst I was out shopping it occurred to me that I should have suggested carrying on until BW was in. Looking at the save I really wish I had as it would have made the discussion far more helpful. Perhaps the next person up should break once it's in and we know whether there's any copper about?

An interesting selection of AI so far. A culture grabber, a fast techer and a warmonger.

One oddity is why does the warrior only have 4 ? I didn't realise that declined that fast. Something to bear in mind for the future.

We definitely need to find out where Shaka is so scouting is still a priority.

 

[AgedOne]

@Sam
It's only a training game. I could knock off another 5 turns quickly, and re-upload. Reckon?

 

[erikthecelt]

Go for it - BW was the logical stopping place

 

[oldsaxon]

(From a lurker As far as I know, Sam, s decline after 10 turns. This often means that if you want to half-build a warrior, chuck out a worker and then finish the warrior, you need to go

1. Found city
2. Start on warrior while city grows to size 2
3. Switch to worker for 9 turns
4. Work on warrior for 1 turn
5. Worker for 9, warrior for 1 until the worker's finished
6. Finish the warrior.

I don't know whether the 10-turn period is affected by game speed or not. Also, I believe it's a lot longer for buildings.