GOTM 08 - final spoiler (free-for-all)

Cultural victory in 1866.
Funny thing is that, though I've done only cultural games in the GOTM, I seem to get worse at doing them. Both GOTM7 and 8 are among the slowest I've done and I don't really know why that is :confused:
 
Cultural Victory in 1868

It seems like all the cultural victory dates are falling pretty close to each other.

I tried to follow a strategy I came across in the forums whereby, I built 2 warriors and a workboat untill I reached pop 3. Then a settler, a worker and another settler. Then the capital went to work on the Pyramids. The First settler started on the Stonehenge followed by the Oracle. The Second settler claimed the spot by the Marble and went on to built the Parthenon.

Meanwhile, I researched Fishing, Poly, Masonry, Mono, BW, Writing, Alphabet. I got CoL thru the Oracle.

While all this was happening Americans claimed the only source of iron on our island and declared on me. I was able to conquer the iron city which put a hold on the American advance but cost me dearly. They did not demand or anything, just declared!!

I guess, if it wasn't for the prolonged war, I might have shaved off a few turns perhaps.

Oh by the way, I played the Adventurer save, as I ususally play on Noble in Civ IV.

I am hoping to submit my next game from my Mac as long as it is compatible with Civ IV hardware requirements
 
I eeked out a 1982 Spaceship Victory I probably didn't deserve.

Indecision was my main opponent. I didn't really have a victory condition in mind which is never a good idea. The Oracle was taken early, before I even really considered it. I took Pyramids, Gardens, and with the engineers a host of other wonders (Chapel, Collosus, etc). I put all the wonders in Berlin for maximizing GP points, which I figured would rule out a cultural victory. But then I got four religions spread to me which I moved around. But then I had a restless military from taking choice nearby barb cities.

Catherine declared war on me and I turned to the Americans to help wipe out her navy. She never landed anywhere (I had several frigates in defense.) I decided to go for Panzers with a UN backup. I got Panzers, which took longer than I expected, then took out the low guy on the totem pole, Tokugawa. I shifted my forces to Isabella who had several holy cities that I thought might come in handy. But then I scored the UN. Unfortunately that plan fell apart because I had crippled Catherine in the war by taking a couple cities and all of her sea resources were pillaged by George. After a couple votes for George I moved all my forces to take out America. Unfortunately Washington suddenly had MI and jet planes.

So, bottomline, I was stuck in 1940 as the score leader by about 700 points with 30%+ of population but behind in techs. I had a massive army, but I thought it was too risky to use them. I had good production so I started on a spaceship. (I already had Apollo.) I needed to invent the Internet. When I was about 8-9 turns from getting it, I went 100% commerce about 1500 gold per turn. I thought I might need to do some serious upgrading just in case I needed to take out Washington or Cathy quickly. Cyrus, Vicky, and Isabel weren't putting much effort into winning. As it turns out I placed spies in Washington and Moscow, and spent 10's of thousands of gold in sabotaging their spaceparts. Washington caught me once in about ten missions, then twice more in junk time when I was just making sure he was several turns back. I finished my ship just a few turns ahead of his last part. Tough break George.

After I had won and submitted, I attacked America after the launch, and handily wiped the floor with them for a turn or two. Oh well, nice to know the option was there.
 
CONTENDER

Finnished the game ( sorry - no previous post on first spoiler because I played the game in 2 periods, first part in the first week of this month and second yesterday because of some personal issues ) with UN vote on 1963 AD ( or 1964 ? didn't know exactely ).
Not a very good score& date but I'm extremely glad to finnish the game - this is my first Civ4 game won by Diplomatic condition !! :)

Except 2 wars to eliminate americans from "my" island I played the game in a very peaceful manner - but I want to thanks to the map-creator for numerous barbarians towns placed on the map on different remote island. I conquered most of then and those teritories & cities added good points and bring more vote on UN elections. ;)
All civs except ( was left from ) America was pleased or frendly with my - so, on my second mandate as UN Chairman, I sucessfuly promoted the resolution which allow me to obtain the victory.

I would try for Space Race - but Catherine & Victoria was 2-3 techs before me, so this gamble seems to risky for me. :(

Regards all
 
Continued from:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4280073&postcount=110

Somewhere during the game I managed to build some more wonders, mostly in Berlin. That was great for me off course. Also, because of having hereditary rule until the end of the game, I was able to get my cities to great sizes, which also helped me be very productive and keep up a high science rate (trade routes came in handy also, except for the short time when the other players closed their borders for trade).

This said, I was very happy to see my score going up, gaining on Cath and Washington and at some point I overtook them. This was more then I was expecting!
The only problem was I didn’t have recent units, so I kept a lot of money to upgrade old units when necessary. I did have some modern units all the time, but also kept the old for hereditary rule. Then I noticed I lacked some resources (coal and oil). My cities were not at the right places for them. And I needed space to grow: if I wanted a lot of more money it would be great to get the budhist holy city, which was in Japan. Japan also was far behind in tech and the lowest scoring player. So it was pretty easy to get his 2 cities on his home island. Then I made peace and later on most of his new and far inferior cities were captured by other players, but he was never eliminated. All in all it was a peaceful game.

Then it was time to decide how I could win this, because that appeared possible.
The only possible win was the space race (I always win like that :)). So I set tech for the needed research and went for it. I made it a nice 11700 score in 1977.

Since most players were friendly to me I wasn’t afraid of war much during the game. I even had a defensive pact with Catherine which was never used. My military was not so powerful, but I could have upgraded it fairly easy, I used merchants for some money (twice 1700 gold) and that was my reserve for upgrades if needed for most of the game while I researched at 80%. That kept me in line with Washington while Catherine and Victoria traded their way up. They never got near enough to be a threat.

Now I will again try gotm 7, I probably will be able to do better now.

Thanks again for the wonderful game!
 
As described in my first spoiler:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4249112&postcount=17

I decided to forgo the beaten path and skip any Oracle based sling-shot, relying instead of a Colossus + Great Lighthouse powered sea-based economy. During my first spoiler I expressed reservations about what would happen when I finally had to research astronomy, and how big a blow that would be to my economy. In retrospect, those concerns were ill founded, and the sea-based economy was able to power me all the way to the UN.

When we left the last spoiler, Washington had just declared in 25 BC (I said 1AD from my notes in the last spoiler, but apparently that was one turn off, according to the replay file.) He came at me with quite a bit, including horse-archers, and I was not ready to reply immediately. As a result, Frankfurt fell in 50 AD. Fortunately, Washington decided not to raze it.

At the time Washington declared, I had already started building up my forces for an attack against him, so a few years later, my axmen started rolling of the line for the counter attack. Frankfurt was retaken in 150AD, followed by Chicago in 350AD, and Boston in 520AD. The attached screenshot is from 500AD, just before I took Boston. It shows the state of my empire at the time. In 520, I make peace with Washington, leaving me with 11 cities (including Boston, and Oxford, which I build the same year). I would continue my expansion across the continent later….

The year after the war, having shortly finished CS, I adopted Bureaucracy; turning my capital into a driving force of research (It has an academy since a long time).

In 640AD came a surprise…. Cathy (at the time, I did not know who, it was BIAFAL) built the Hanging Gardens. I had NEVER seen an AI build it that early (rarely at all), so I assume that as others have speculated, Cathy was running out of things to do, and simply trying all the wonders. No big deal, since HG was not part of my main plans. Just a surprise. In the next 300 years, I founded only 1 or two filler cities, but built up forces to push Washington off the continent. Then, in 960AD, the time of reckoning has come… My Macemen and Catapult army role into US land, and takes out Atlanta in 1020, NY in 1110, and Washington in 1340.

During this time, I was also trying to expand to one of the southern islands, and founded two cities there. That turned out to have been a mistake, since I overextended, and ended up losing them to barbs. Oh well, probably did not cost me nearly as much as later mistakes, but annoying never the least.

In any event, back on the main front… LA in 1380, Philly in 1450, followed by peace, which was needed to war weariness, and because Washington has a couple of cities on Islands that I have not seen yet (apparently, since he is not dead!?!)

During this war, in 1440 to be precise, I was the first to Liberalism, and had a solid tech lead on the planet. After the war, I assessed my options as follows:


-Domination? Possible. I am first in tech, and rolling along nicely. However, given the shear number of squares to be collected, it is a daunting task.

-Conquest? Similar to domination (since I will need to keep all islands guarded after I sweep them, to prevent recolonization, it may be even worst in that I will have to pay troops away from home upkeep).

-Space race? It’s an option, but I still fear that my sea-based economy will wither as the early wonders go obsolete, and I am hesitant to commit to the end of the tech tree.

-Score? Does not really count… That is a fallback position only.

-Cultural? Not on the cards at all. Only my capital is at all in the running, and even it is nothing special culturally.

-Diplomacy? YES!!! Firstly, I have yet to annoy only Washington, so I might still get some other AI to vote for me. Secondly, I can basically pursue a domination-like path, and get to 62% of the world pop to vote myself in. That is what I opt for, so I bee-line for the UN, while continuing to grow.

So, in the following years, I continue to expand to nearby Islands, founding some cities, and taking some from barbs. The rest of the game is without news. No other real wars. Just a beeline to the UN, accompanied by expansion. Here, I did make a tactical mistake, which cost me at least 20 years. I though that my population would reach 62% and that I would vote myself in. Sadly, someone else grew quicker than I anticipated, and I maxed out at 61% (and could not get anyone else to vote for me). I had to declare war on Toku (low man on totem pole) and smack him down to get over 62%. Not a problem, but had I properly anticipated this, I would have done it 15 years earlier, knocking two election cycles of my victory time. In the end, I scored a back-door diplo in 1832. Not my best effort ever, but a solid game nonetheless.


Attached is a screenshot of my final empire the run after victory.
 
As many others have done, I got a nice win considering this is my 1st Monarch game. I presume the good starting location helped, but not as much as the reading of the inspiring pre-game discussion. I've been playing since GOTM5, each month the quality of the forumers' posts gets better and better. :goodjob:

That said, the game I played and the victory condition makes me seriously think about changing my forum nickname - Conquistador is for conquerers and I managed to finish the whole game without going to war at all! :blush: That is, besides the handful of barb towns scattered through the southern seas that I annexed to my empire, I remained at peace with my 6 neighbours all the time.

I got lucky and managed an Oracle CS slingshot 1240BC. Early research was fish/myst/poly/BW/priest/writing/CoL. I was able to found hinduism 3040BC and also built SH 1880BC. Other early wonders I built were Colossus 1AD, GLib 200AD and Sistine Chapel 475AD. OTOH, Cathy built GLhouse 825BC, C.Itza 525BC, Parthenon 200BC and HG 500AD, while Vic grabbed Pyramids 800BC.

Early on, Washington managed to settle east of our mainland soon, grabbing the only source of iron. That and his early tech lead (longbows) discouraged any warmongering from my part. Anyways, looking at graphs from end game I was 1st scorewise since around 1AD, but my military was between 5th and 3rd all the time. I think I could have been more aggressive (I always tell myself this after my games) but this being my 1st monarch game I feared I could fall behind on techs if I entered a long war.

Curiosity bits:
1. I also popped Astronomy from a hut as others have reported: is there a pattern? :confused:
2. At some point I stopped trading with Cathy at Washington's request, she wouldn't even talk to me for 1000 years, even though she was pleased with me for the last five hundred years of that period!:crazyeye:

I also considered a faster diplo win, but my friend Washington was 2nd in pop so it would be me against him and as Cyrus, Vicky and Izzy were pleased with the both of us getting their vote was a long shot. Reading the previous posts I wonder if I could have gifted a town or 2 to Cathy which pop was close to Washington's, and who was hated by everyone except little Toku, I might have had a chance.

In the last 2 centuries I had a huge tech lead, and I would accept any tech requests from my neighbours just to avoid any distracting wars. Even though, Washington only built his Apollo Program when my spaceship was about to launch.

Now I was looking at my personal HOF: 12 finished games, 9 space race wins, 2 diplo wins and 1 domination (GOTM5 warlord level): sheesh I should pick "NASA boy" or something for a nickname! :lol:
 
Conquistador 63 said:
1. I also popped Astronomy from a hut as others have reported: is there a pattern? :confused:
2. At some point I stopped trading with Cathy at Washington's request, she wouldn't even talk to me for 1000 years, even though she was pleased with me for the last five hundred years of that period!:crazyeye:

Congratulations on your first Monarch win, "NASA boy" :p

1. Yes, the set of techs you can pop from huts is limited. For instance, you can't get any techs that would found a religion. Towards the later techs, the set gets really limited to pretty much only the boat-technology techs: Compass, Optics, Astronomy. So if you learn a tech from a hut past 1000 AD or so, it's almost certainly Astronomy... which, while it might slow your economy down if you have the Colossus, is still a really expensive free tech.

Someone posted a list here somewhere on these boards from the XML, but I couldn't find it... anyone have a link to the that? :)

2. AI's don't seem to factor in Pleased (maybe Friendly) when you stop trading. They simply refuse to talk to you for the next 100 turns or so. It's a very long time. If you absolutely had to get them to the table I think you could declare war on them. ;)
 
The story of the game was avoiding Astronomy so that I could continue to use the Colossus we captured from Catherine. I didn't want to see what our economy did if we crossed that line. It probably wasn't the best choice, I think all the squiggly galley routing slowed my victory. Our score had stalled 100's of years earlier anyway.
I'll just paste in the rest of my notes. I'll get back to a proper write-up maybe next time.
@Redbad: Funny you're getting worse at culture vc's, you were the master in Civ3. I'm having to adjust to Civ4 too, suddenly I'm interested in military victories. Not that I'm winning any awards either...

the notes:
1806 Japan destroyed.
1808 DoW Spain.
1812 Destroy Persepolis.
1814 Cross the dom limit. Peace w/Cyrus for a tundra town. End turn at 65.00% of land area.
1816 Domination Victory, 66.19% of land area. 63343 points. My second best ever, and my best official score. Bismarck has the leadership skillz of Augustus Caesar, I guess he'd be ok with that.
 
Balton said:
Cultural Victory in 1868

It seems like all the cultural victory dates are falling pretty close to each other.

Contender, Cultural Victory in 1864 AD. Score – 15 661.

Why it was so late

As I said, in 0 AD I was sure I would be able to finish earlier, as I had a very good starting position.

The worst thing for me was that during all the game I had only 2 religions, both founded by myself – Confucianism and Islam. No other religions spread to me, though I never had Theocracy. Americans were my best friend and had only Confucianism in their cities.

As stated earlier in this thread, in such a situation one should go for a small war with one of his weakest opponents. I didn’t do it myself. Also my mistake was that I spread Confucianism in all my cities rather early, I didn’t know that in that case they had little chance to get another religion.

The last and may be the most important thing that I didn’t know was that it’s much easier for the religion to spread from one city to another if both if them are on the same landmass. In archipelago games there is a great probability you won’t get any religion from your opponents, so you should:
1) found religions yourself (research religion techs ASAP)
2) conquer cities with a foreign religion

My game

In 75 AD somebody built the Great Library, I still had several turns to finish it. Damn!:mad:

My next wonder came only in 680 AD, it was Notre Dame.

As I told I built only 6 cities before 0 AD, after 0 AD I founded 2 cities on the same continent and the last one on a landmass with stone and insence in the south (in 520 AD). It should have been founded earlier – stone would be useful.

In 900 AD I found Islam in Dusseldorf (my smallest city near stone), so it was harder to spread it to my main continent. Fortunately, my Islam missionary succeded in bringing Islam to my glorious capital.

I built the Spiral Minaret in 1050 AD and the Versailes in 1170 AD. Due to that I had no money problem till the end of the game, so I could run 90 % culture in the last centuries.

I don’t remember the date when I turned off research, I think it was after Democracy (late, I had only 2 religions and didn’t need Universal Suffrage to buy Cathedrals). After that I gained many techs through exchange and Representation.

I 1515 AD Cathy declared on me. I bribed Washington and Victoria, who were my best friends, to counterattack Cathy. In 1595 AD the war was over – I lost none, Catherine lost one loaded galley.

After that I just waited. In 1864 AD it was over. 9 hours played.
 
I was thinking to go to domination.

However the necessity of transport for a high number of units at every different point make it very difficult. Then I changed my mind.

Archipelago at monarch:king: is tough.

After I control the sea it was more ease, but that´s too late for domination:sad: .

I would go to sea domination before and decrease infantry or cavalary.

It was fun after all:lol: .
 
A 1972 Diplomatic victory.

It started so well, I managed to gain control of the island reasonably quickly as Washington had no metals. I planned to go after Togu next as we had already had a short war, but Catherine declared war on me first. I managed to take a couple of cities before WW set in, war is so slow on archipelago if you haven't pre-planned your strikes. I was then well in the lead, but didn't know what victory to go for, so I just bumbled along.

I decided to go for domination, but I couldn't attack Vicky as she was trading me coal, and I couldn't attack Izzy as it was the 1st time she and I had got on. When everyone else was gone I realised I still didn't have enough land for domination, but I had enough population to vote myself the winner, and a slow change of plan brought my longest game to an end.
 
A 1972 Diplomatic victory.

It started so well, I managed to gain control of the island reasonably quickly as Washington had no metals. I planned to go after Togu next as we had already had a short war, but Catherine declared war on me first. I managed to take a couple of cities before WW set in, war is so slow on archipelago if you haven't pre-planned your strikes. I was then well in the lead, but didn't know what victory to go for, so I just bumbled along.

I decided to go for domination, but I couldn't attack Vicky as she was trading me coal, and I couldn't attack Izzy as it was the 1st time she and I had got on. When everyone else was gone I realised I still didn't have enough land for domination, but I had enough population to vote myself the winner, and a slow change of plan brought my longest game to an end.
 
Contender, 1992 AD Diplomatic win

All along I thought I was doing remarkably well, but now it seems that the diplo win in 1992 will not get me anywhere (ca 12 k). Anyway, the game was great fun.

It was the first time I played Monarch.

It was my first GOTM.

[and therefore]

It was the first time haven’t reloaded even once.

It was the first time I achieved diplo victory.

And it’s my first post on civfanatics :goodjob:

The starting location was great – I just needed to attack Washington early on with my axemen, as soon as I got copper and bronze working. I didn’t care for religion much and went for the military techs taking on a warmonger attitude.

I hurried to the eastern coast, got there before Washington and secured the only iron resource on the island. Then I trained some swordsmen and Washington was left with 3 or 4 cities (apart for his colonies outside the island). Then I trained some knights and that was mainly it.

I went for optics, got the circumnavigation bonus and met Catherine, whom I recognized as my strongest foe. I figured that I had to expand a lot, otherwise she would beat me to the space race victory.

I made friends with Victoria and Isabella, as they didn’t pose a great threat and at the same time they had techs to trade.

I got liberalism first and quickly went for free religion, which secured my diplomacy and gave me the religious benefits needed to take care of the war weariness problem.

My strategy was to sweep the weak out of the face of the Earth, including some American leftovers, Cyrus and Tokugawa. They all were my neighbors and were quite behind me in military technology. I got artillery very early, so I produced a couple of artillery/infantry squads and sent them to Persia to fight against riflemen and longbowmen. Then I went for the panzers and bombers and walked all over Kyoto and the rest of Japan. I wonder how they managed to survive for so long, having their cities guarded by a couple of longbows.

So in 1980 the situations was comfortable. I was 1000 points ahead of Catherine, having great relations with Victoria. From there I could go for any type of victory. Space was easy as I had nearly finished the space elevator and Catherine was well behind in technology. Diplo was easy, as Isabella was cautious and Vic was ‘friendly’ towards me.

I decided to go for diplo, as I have never seen the diplo victory movie [for a reason, as I later figured out :rolleyes:]. I build the UN and got 2 votes less than needed because of the last japanese city hidden somewhere on the map :mad:. I traded maps with Vic and smashed the remaining city, which indeed was quite an eskimo one with snow all around. The next ballot gave me the exact number of votes needed (me+Vic, Isabella abstains) :king:

Thanks a lot for the GOTM and all the great work you do here!
 
igelkott said:
I decided to go for diplo, as I have never seen the diplo victory movie [for a reason, as I later figured out :rolleyes:].

:confused: There's victory movies?? OK, I need to look at my settings. Whenever i win, I just get the message saying I've won, then the game launches into the statistics screens.

(Could be because ages ago, long before I'd won my first game, I switched off wonder movies because later in the game they had a habit of crashing. Mebbe I switched off victory movies at the same time then forgot about it).
 
DynamicSpirit said:
:confused: There's victory movies?? OK, I need to look at my settings. Whenever i win, I just get the message saying I've won, then the game launches into the statistics screens.

(Could be because ages ago, long before I'd won my first game, I switched off wonder movies because later in the game they had a habit of crashing. Mebbe I switched off victory movies at the same time then forgot about it).

Well, I don't have much memory in my computer. The victory movies play at 1 frame per 5 seconds with no sound. Its just 30 seconds of agravation after a victory if you have a system that just squeeks past the minimum.
 
RobertTheBruce said:
Well, I don't have much memory in my computer. The victory movies play at 1 frame per 5 seconds with no sound. Its just 30 seconds of agravation after a victory if you have a system that just squeeks past the minimum.

On my system, I often find wonder movies play fine if I reload a game just before the wonder gets built, although the same movie crashes if the wonder has been built after half an hour or so of playing. Ditto - on occasions - AI leader graphics during diplomacy sessions, though they tend to just go very slowly, like on your system, not crash like wonder movies do on mine.

That makes me suspect that perhaps I can see a victory movie by loading a game that's just on the point of being won. (Dunno if that'd work for you too?)

(It also makes me suspect that civ has an occasional memory leak somewhere. Probably something to do with the graphics card rather than normal RAM, since I've not particularly noticed the virtual memory going up unduly as the game plays)
 
DynamicSpirit said:
:confused: There's victory movies??

so there it is - my first contribution to the civfanatics - "well, you know, there are victory movies.."

just to be clear - there is a movie for each kind of victory, apart from diplo. probably firaxis couldn't come up with an appropriate triumph cutscene staged somewhere in the UN conference room :smoke:
 
Back
Top Bottom