GOTM 39: Spoiler 1 - The Ancient Era, All Contacts

[Methos]

PTW Conquest level

This is my first GOTM game and since I typically play Chieftain with an occasional Warlord game I was rather hesitant about this Monarch game. Amazingly I’m still in the game and doing good, I think.

I settled in place and since to me Monarch is a tough level I decided to build my cities close together for protection (CxxC). Unfortunately I didn’t realize we were supposed to take notes so have none, my apologies. I started researching Pottery than went to Iron Working, after that I quit researching and just bought everything.

I was expanding fairly well when Arabia tried to extort from me. Being used to the easier levels I expected it to be a bluff so called it, and of course he declared war on me. I wasn’t prepared for war and knew it would destroy me so I searched for an ally. The Ottomans were willing to sign a MA with me for most of my gold and 9 gpt which I had to accept. It was very nice watching the bulk of the Arabic force that was in my lands turn back after the Ottomans declared on them. During that brief war I might have lost one unit and actually managed to autoraze one of the Arabic cities. After that I sued for peace with Arabia even though it gave me a rep hit with the Ottomans.

Realizing my military was horribly weak I began building it as fast as possible. It wasn’t too long before both Arabia and the Ottomans sued for peace and I began seeing Arabic soldiers walking through my territory. By the way, a lot of civs are walking through my lands but I say nothing, fearful of another war. Luckily Arabia declares on the Zulu and leaves me be. The one problem is I’m directly in the middle of both civs. Figuring I’d side with the Zulu without going to war I decided to be a friend and gave them a RoP. The battles slowly moved from my eastern side to the central and then the western side. About now Arabia and the Zulu sued for peace. A couple turns before their peace I had signed a second time for the RoP, go figure.

During their war an alert popped up stating the Koreans had been destroyed, even though at this time I hadn’t yet met any of the Asian civs. Realizing that unless I changed something quick I’d probably lose this game I started looking for someone to conquer; England. I had about 10 catapults and about that many swordsmen that I had been moving up to our border. Luckily my cultural border was up against York so as soon as I declared I was able to attack it and take it. England was rather easy, I was able to take every city on our continent (only 4) and than sued for peace. Until now no access to ocean therefore no ships so I couldn’t get to the two colony cities they had.

I’m typically the builder type and stay away from wars as much as possible, but my war with England went so well I wanted to continue. During this brief peace time I moved my units towards Zulu’s borders and since I still had a RoP I moved as many workers as possible to connect roads to their cities so I could use my catapults. At this point the RoP had 6 turns left. Just before it was over I moved everything out of Zulu land and waited. Once the deal was over I declared and took 3 of the 4 cities I attacked the second turn (one turn to get within range, second to attack). The next turn I took the 4th city that I failed to take the turn before. I then moved my entire army towards Zimbabwe, which by now consisted of a total of 38 units with about 20 catapults. Between the war with England and the peacetime I had built a lot of catapults and units. Weird thing though, out of around 20 catapults I only had around 3 successful bombardments versus Zimbabwe. Is that because they were located on a hill?

Sometime between my war with England or the Zulu I attempted to research again but it was doing so horrible I turned off all research.

One point, either during my battle with the Zulu or just before it I got Feudalism free and was able to use Medieval Infantry during my war with them. I apologize if I wasn’t supposed to state what happened once I left the AA.

Like I said this is my first time playing Monarch ever in any version of Civ3 so I’m rather shocked I’m doing so good. At this point I’m currently in 2nd place with only China ahead of me, though they are pulling further ahead each turn. I attempted to play on Regent level once and got my butt kicked so I dropped back to the easier levels. I’m unsure why I am doing so good (for me anyway) this game but lets hope it lasts. I’m going to attempt to continue destroying some other civs since so far its working great! Granted that means building a lot of roads so I can get my catapults to their cities. I’m also having trouble with corruption in my conquered cities and I’m not used to that due to usually playing easier levels. I haven’t built my FP yet because I forgot about it (got caught up in war).

Currently Japan is at war with China but it’s fairly obvious China will win that one.

 

[MikeH]

PTW Conquest level


I was expanding fairly well when Arabia tried to extort from me. Being used to the easier levels I expected it to be a bluff so called it, and of course he declared war on me.

Glad to see you doing so well on your first attempt on Monarch and GOTM, Methos. One thing to do when the AI tries to extort is to wait for you advisor to tell you how your military compares to the bad guys' before replying. If he says that they outnumber you it's best to pay up, unless you want to fight. If he says that they are about the same size as you or that you outnumber them, they're probably bluffing.

On the research thing, most people will research Writing on 10% at the higher levels, on Monarch in particular, you will have a good chance of getting it first and you can trade it around for other vital stuff like the Wheel and Iron Working, after that Literature and Philosophy are good techs to research for use in trading.

 

[ControlFreak]

Welcome Methos!

In your spoiler you've listed a great many techniques that will have you beating Diety in no time.

e.g.:

• Closer city spacing in the beginning (good MM opportunities, faster development, sharing of improved tiles, fewer units for defense...)
• Using your embassies to your benefit (allies, ROP to accomplish tasks an AI wouldn't do himself)
• Bringing overwhelming force to finish battles quickly. (Great job taking so many towns in the first couple turns)
• Building lots of artillery (I needed to do more of this in my game)

Speaking of artillery, I have a couple of observations that are begging for discussion:

Japanese Catapults
The first is a screen shot of my Japanese Embassy. I have never known the AI to favor catapults as much as this. Did someone already mention this? They have iron and horses but continue to build cats, with only a warrior and archer on defence. I wish I had a few horsemen there to claim these cats...


Inpregnable Rome
The second is a map with the City of Rome hidden to show the territory. Talk about a defendable position! Rivers on all sides, on a hill, an elite legionary (Defend like a pike - 3) with iron too. On top of that, the city is size 7 so it's getting a defensive bonus. It's no wonder that they've held off America, Zululand and Greece for two thousand years. I'm going to take their other cities but leave this one until I've got a bit more firepower.

 

[rrau]

I can't remember my history (been a looong time since high school latin and Roman history), but wasn't Rome actually built on hills surrounded by rivers?

 

[Shigella]

Japanese Catapults
The first is a screen shot of my Japanese Embassy. I have never known the AI to favor catapults as much as this. Did someone already mention this? They have iron and horses but continue to build cats, with only a warrior and archer on defence. I wish I had a few horsemen there to claim these cats...

I noticed the Japanese building an obscene number of cats while I was in the milking phase in GOTM38. You can see a screenie here.
I thought they were doing this in my previous game simply because I had robbed them of all resources, but perhaps the Japanese are just fond of artillery!

 

[ControlFreak]

I noticed the Japanese building an obscene number of cats while I was in the milking phase in GOTM38...I thought they were doing this in my previous game simply because I had robbed them of all resources, but perhaps the Japanese are just fond of artillery!

Ah yes, that's where I had seen this behavior before. I wonder if there is a problem with the rule set for Japan. In my GOTM38 they were a fairly insignificant civ despite their decent starting position.

 

[eldar]

This game is fun (still playing...).

PtW, Open.

I settled 1NW, it seemed like slightly better territory.

I didn't go straight for a Settler pump, instead going for an early Barracks, and a couple of Settlers and Archers, before building a Granary in Berlin.

I went for ring-3 and ring-6; bad move, I think ring-4 and ring-7 would've worked a lot better (it would also have meant me noticing that there was Iron right next to Leipzig, instead of right under it - never mind, I settled by the northern Horses and Iron early on to nab a second source of both).

Contacts came thick and fast, though the final 3 didn't emerge until after I'd entered the Middle Ages in ~300BC (rather funnily, Shaka sold me the final AA tech, and I turned right round and sold my free tech to him to get my money back! - not to mention gifting the other Sci civs in to get Engineering and Feudalism for my Monotheism, and selling Engineering to my allies to give them an advantage in the wars we were fighting).

War also came thick and fast, and somewhere around 500BC, I was:
- At war with Arabia (started myself);
- At war with Rome, then America, then the Ottomans (started by Rome);
- Allied vs. Rome and America with Greece;
- Allied vs. Ottomans with Celts and England.

The Arabian campaign had to end, for a while, with Rome subsequently forced into peace after I razed Pompeii. Arabia were particularly stubborn in their defence, and took quite a lot of rooting out when I finally turned my eye back to them after becoming a Republic.

The Ottomans were wiped out entirely, the English setting it up (taking Izmit), me doing the damage (razing one city and capturing Sogut), with the Celts putting the final boot in (razing their final city). The Ottoman war also provided me with a Leader, who rushed Sun Tzu for me.

Currently in 420AD, after the protracted campaign to rid the continent (though not the world) of the Arabians; and the research afterburner has been applied after much minimum research. Knights are online, England has the Pyramids, and are my next target.

Neil.

 

[Drazek]

Open PTW 1.27f

Normally I don't want to fight very early. But in this game AI respawn was off and it was pangaia, so an early warrior/archer rush would be worthwile.

I settlet on the spot and produced about 4-5 warriors. My first scout found Zulus and they headed there. Zimbabwe was defended by a warrior and an archer, but I won and it was captured in 3050 BCE. I had seen an English & Arabs scouts, so I knew where they were. I didn't actively explore, as I didn't have resources, all production was for war.

English scout was seen first, so they were prolly next closest. But English had researched Bronze Working already, so warriors wouldn't be enough (ok, there are many HoF games with warrior conquests, but I never win against a spear). I produced a barracks and started to pump archers. By the time I had 4-5 archers I attacked London and English was gone in 2270 BCE (I killed an English settler too).

Next target would be west as the Arab scout got from there. I found Ottomans there too, but at this time they had grown quite strong with 2-4 towns. But in 1500 BCE I captured Mecca and got Medina in a peace deal. I got my first GL against Arabs in 1600 and he rushed FP in Mecca as early as he could. 1300 BCE I captured Sogut and in 1250 BCE Ottomans were dead with their last town razed.

Next I attacked Arabs again and got another GL who rushed Pyramids in Mecca. Damascus was captured in 975 BCE. At that time I started my research for the first time as I needed Republic income for warrior->swords upgrades. By 1000 BCE I had used mainly archers but next I was preparing for Rome's and Greece's tougher defenders.

I killed Arabs & Celts with archers, but it took a while as I didn't want to send new troops there (dead end). Arabs were gone in 670 BCE and Celts in 270 BCE. Rome was gone in 270 BCE too. I had an old war with America so I continued there and they were gone in 50 BCE. Next were Japan and Greece. Greece gone in 110 CE.

Japan was gone in 360 CE, Korea in 380 CE and China in 390 CE. It took so long due to not enough galleys. I peaked around 60 swords + horses & archers.

Unfortunately, Korea reached MA so my AA conquest wasn't complete success. If it had been a real pangaia, it would have prolly worked as I would have fomented constant wars.

 

[Randy]

@ Drazek, I glad to see some one else had good luck with thier early wars.

 

[OneFastWarrior]

Well, I have not played even 1 meaningful game since I last played a SG game, about 6 to 7 months ago

Anyway I am having fun and I did not take any notes, but here goes some.

I started off by researching at minimum on Iron working and I never rose my research above 10% through the AA. I built a few warriors and learned as much of the land as I could. Very early in the game when I only had 1 town I was attacked by the Ottomans and my only warrior that was there(I left him there when I saw unfamiliar visitors nearby) was knocked down to 1 bar before killing the Ottoman warrior. It really would have sucked if I had lost the game this early.

The Ottomans finnally wanted peace and Iwas not into the early warmongering too much. Later on the Arabs declared war on the Celts and asked me for an MA against the Celts, I said sure and I had a warrior up there learning the land, so he destroyed most there roads before he was killed. I also had gotten the Ottomans to sign a MA against the Celts with me.
The Arabs burned down a couple Celt towns and signed Peace. So, I took 1 of the remaining Celt towns for peace and the Ottomans and Celts kept their war going for awhile, which pretty much ruined both of those Civs. The Ottomans and Celts had 2 or 3 towns through this entire era.

At 1000 BC I had 7 towns and was about in the middle on score.
The turn after 1000 BC I planted 2 or 3 more towns. I then set on building military consisting of Horses and set my sights on the Zulu. I attacked with 13 horses and reduced them down to 2 cities after I sued them for 1 city and took 2 and burned 1 or 2. This Peace was signed because I was sneak attacked by the Ottomans and had to divert troops.

I entered the MA in 230BC and the peace treaty was signed before I entered the MA. I traded with America to get my last AA tech needed to get into the MA, then I turned around and took the tech lead as soon as I entered the MA.

So far pretty good. I hope to finish Before the 15th.

 

[Methos]

So far pretty good. I hope to finish Before the 15th.

It's nice to know I'm not the only one who's not for sure if they'll finish in time. I haven't even made it to the requirements of the next spoiler!

Back to the game.

 

[tao]

Open, Mac 1.29

My target victory condition for this game was 20k cultural. But I was not very successful.

Berlin was founded on the spot and built warrior, warrior, granary, settler, warrior, settler.

I did not want to use Berlin as 20k city and founded Leipzig 2470BC on the western river at distance 4. It was a site with a lot of potential (river, 2 gold mountains, iron hill), but it was extremely slow development because of all the surrounding jungle. I always kept the population at the maximum possible by joining workers, but nonetheless it was a very very slow start. The floodplain city was a 3 (in republic 2) turn worker factory well into the Middle Ages.

Beijing built The Pyramids and I missed the Great Library by 5 turns (Zimbabwe) and also the Hanging Gardens (Rome). In fact, I got NONE of the Ancient Age Wonders and it looks as if my 20k goal is a lost case already.

We relatively fast met English, Zulus, Rome, America, Greece, Arabs, and Ottomans. Keltoi contact was traded for 1725BC, no new world civs were contacted in the Ancient Age; the first foreign sailors arrived 270BC and map and contact trading took place.

Research was minimum on iron working, but Rome was 9 turns faster and min research for mathematics was bested by 15 turns (Ottomans). But with all the money coming in from minimum research and the contacts I could easily trade for all AA techs. Republic (3 turns of anarchy) was the first tech I got a monopoly on (and delayed trading to slow down the AIs).

War was declared on England 900BC and 730BC London with its wines was captured. Quite some fighting, some elites, but no Great Leader. 370BC England gives a western island city, currency and construction for peace and is reduced to 1 coastal city in the north. Germany enters the Middle Ages.

 

[Smirk]

Doh! Wrong thread!

 

[CdB]

v1.29f Open

I will go for Domination, especially with all those neighbours that will make my favorable path Horse > Knight > Cav quite easy. I will try to build limited culture and focus on military (barracks / SunTzu / Leo's)

I start at max on Pottery in order to build a Granary in Berlin that I founded on the spot. Then I went to search IW in order to capitalize on my starting tech
In 2430 BC, I found Liepzig on Food Plains by the Wheat where I will build one Wa and then Settlers.
In 2070 BC, I found Hamburg in East, near a mountain. I will build towns far away (RCP 5) and maybe will fill gaps after. I found this strategy interesting to “reserve” space for later growth since the landmass seems to be cluttered with many civs.
In 2030 BC, I manage some trading that leaves me with some edge. After gaining Alphabet, I switch to Maths at 100% to be able to do some trading later.
In 1500 BC, Another round of trading after discovery of Math, I gain Writing / Horseback / Mysticism and some cash. I am leading in techs and moving fast towards Republic (100%). I have 6 towns, 6 Wa and 1 wo. I am still building settlers to settle in the jungle and barracks to be ready for the Horseman > Knight > Cav upgrade.
I plan to build only those units + Sun Tzu + Leo’s to limit upgrade costs.
In 1125 BC, Just gained Code Of Laws with Philosophy in 10 turns at 80% (-1 GP & 12 GP in treasury), but I have nothing to trade it with. I have 9 towns with still 6 Wa and 2 Wo and 2 settlers. I am switching my builds toward Horseman in “center towns” with Barracks and Wo in remote towns as there is no much room to expand. I have placed Munich in the middle of the Jungle SW of Berlin near Spices and fresh Lake, Nuremberg is near the cow S of Berlin and Cologne, very south, close to Romans towns just grabbed one Fur.
875 BC : I switch to searching Republic (40 turns even at 100%). I have 11 towns, 6 Wa, 7 Wo, 3 Horsemen & 1 Settler. I have exchanged MM so I will exchange WM very regurlarly, it will make 8 more GP a turn potentially with my known eight neighbour. The last settler will go towards some coast town in Roman territory to allow me to build some galleys. WM shopping allows me to grab buy some slaves also.
690 BC : 12 Wo & 5 Horses
570 BC : 13 Wo / 5 Slaves & 8 Horses
510 BC : 14 Wo & 12 Horses

Ottoman War (410 BC – 310 BC)
410 BC : 14 Wo & 16 Horses & 2 Swords & 6 Wa. I have positioned my forces (9 Horse & 2 Swords) ready to attack Ottomans 3 main towns in order to grab incense. I have still 3 more turns at 80 % to have Republic.
390 BC : Iznik fells and I have one horse killed.
When I have republic, I trade it with England vs all remaining techs & Wine to get to Middle Age. I get 3 turns of Anarchy… I get Monotheism as free tech.
350 BC : Sogut is mine with another horse killed and in 310 BC, I raze Uskudar. I then declare peace with Ottomans. Their last town is not reachable now.