HephMod: a mod combo-pack emphasizing balance, realism, and historical flavor

All religions in the mod are realistic, if a bit esoteric and named oddly. :)

Also, Have already seen a religion heterogenous civ surviving a long time?
What do you mean?
I can list America as lasting for 200 years, and we're a melting pot of religions. :)
If that's not what heterogenous means, then I have no clue.
 
But... America is a particular case...

I think that non heterogenous nations for a parameter or one other should expose to periodical troubles...

Examples : riots of Los Angeles in 1992, riots of England a few later, riots in France in 2005, riots in Xingiang at the moment and even in Tibet...

I would say mixed populations or religions, that its causes instability....
 
I can't fault you, but this mod already penalizes multireligions by burdening you with high unhappiness costs. :(

What more do you want? Riots? Go play the broken Revolutions. :)
 
The problem is the fact that "No State Religion" is actually too good since it would be unrealistic to have civs with free cult choice so early in History...

I propose to hardening the fact your civ has no state religion when your empire has 3 different religions, because free choice of religion came only with "Siècle des Lumières" aka 18th century...

So i propose one new religion :
Animism : for figure primitive state of religion...
Bt default in all just built cities
But not count in diplomacy attitudes and disappears once a real religion appears...

For no State Religion, i suggest a specific building called
"[adjective of religion] represention instance" which would give an bonus of happiness...

So, for the civs wich would choose no state religion early at theirs risks, so it would force to have an official religion...

Good night i will shut down my pc...

:goodjob:
 
I have considered putting out a version of the mod with all the unique religion aspects removed. I considered it anticipating that people could be put off or offended by the choices I made in characterizing the different religions, choices that were admittedly biased not only inevitably by my own views, but also by game-related balance issues and particular historical contexts for the developments of religions (Christianity and Islam both come off as militant because I wanted to simulate a militant period of religiosity mirroring our own Middle Ages/Early Modern period, not because I think those religions are somehow intrinsically aggressive).

Giving different religions 'attributes' is always going to be a sensitive area, and I can see why the game designers steered clear of the issue and made them all the same. However, this makes religion ahistorically bland and undynamic, so as long as it's done carefully, religious differences are the way to go (and you've approached the problem with a lot more thought and sensitivity than some other modders have done).

Ideally (and this is something I've hoped for for a while) the religions in civ wouldn't have to be given hard-coded names, and could instead be created dynamically, in the same way that dynamic-civ-names works. E.g. if the Indians found a polytheistic religion, it gets called 'Indian Polytheism' as opposed to 'Hinduism'. So no more worrying about offending Christianity or Islam, because in game they would be 'Roman Monotheism' and 'Arabian Monotheism' respectively. So your game of civ could quite happily see bloody, agressive crusades in the name of 'Viking Monotheism', or whatever, and no-one could take it personally. Problem solved. Unfortunately, I suspect that this would be impossible to mod currently.

Incidentally, I find it strange that the developers avoided giving traits to religions, but were quite happy to stereotype entire races with in-built differences. Personally I find this to be far less justifiable (although Civ 4 isn't as bad as Civ 3, where the civ differences were down as racial traits rather than leadership attributes). Most historians will tell you that differences between civilizations are largely down to economic/geopolitical factors, nothing to do with race at all. E.g. an unforgiving landscape like Mongolia lends itself to nomadic lifestyles and the use of horse archers, wheras the rich, productive farmland of ancient Italy lent itself to the use of well-supplied, well-equipped Roman legions.

Anyway, just want to say, nice work with the mod, it's really refreshing to see someone who doesn't think chucking 800 extra units and buildings at the game somehow makes it better, and is in fact more concerned with historical gameplay and balance.
 
Nice ! i didn't thinked to this... ;)

"Early monotheism" for "Judaism"
"Middle monotheism" for "Christianism"
"Late monotheism" for "Islam"

Extensively :

"Middle Reformed Monotheism" for "Protestantism"
"Conservative Middle Monotheism" for "Orthodoxy"

"Late Adversary Monotheism" for "Shia Islam"

By Example : "Seven Towers Cult" for "a very ancient cult"
 
"X Pantheism" for all those pantheons.
 
Nice ! i didn't thinked to this... ;)

"Early monotheism" for "Judaism"
"Middle monotheism" for "Christianism"
"Late monotheism" for "Islam"

Yeah, I guess it can be done without the 'Arabian/Roman/etc' cultural signifiers. For the western, Abrahamic religions, this is pretty straightforward. Personally I would give religions more descriptive titles:

Traditional Monotheism (for Judiasm)
Trinitarian Monotheism (for Christianity. 'trinitarian' is the best non-literal description of Christ I can think of)
Universal Monotheism (need a term that represents the 'oneness' of God in Islam)

however, you might start to hit problems with Eastern religions, as they're difficult to define in western terms. my attempts would be:

Medititive Philosophy (Buddhism)
Pantheistic Philosophy (Taoism)
Moralistic Philosophy (Confucianism)

And then there's Hinduism. In my previous post I described it as polytheism, but thats not really accurate. In fact, finding a simple term for it, without saying 'Indian', is nearly impossible. You'd probably need the services of a theologian :)

But anyway, it's an interesting idea, and it means that religion in civ would never be 'inaccurate' - the simulated religions would only be 'versions' of their real-life counterparts.
 
I was playing your mod as usual... I had 5 cities with 5 units of different sort (skirmisher, archer, warrior (with upgrade to swordsman later [my mod], axeman, and spearman). Then SUDDENLY out of no where, Zululand declared war!

They sent STACKSTACKSTACK of units against my two cities before I decided to spam up to 3 of each type of units mentioned above, making 15 units in each city. I was left with three cities.

But after about 30 turns, they successfully captured my CAPITAL city with the best unit producing capacity and with FIFTENN!!!!!!!!! units in there. I wsa stunned by Zululand's subtle brilliance. This is the first time I ever met Noble level enemy this smart *shudder*. And then in addition I did not play Revolution or BarbCiv at all. Jus tvanilla with RevDCM options turned in -game. But STILL!!!! I'm defeated!

Stunned!
 
Zulu is known for sending stacks after you if you don't build up a massive enough army if he's your opponent.

Same with Montazuma, they're both cheap jerks. :)

Best defense is to put units on your borders. Tons of them. Build your own massive army.
This has happened before in Vanilla, by the way.
OH, and stop playing on Noble. I play on the easiest, and I still have fun.
 
Hi. I get a CTD on the next turn of my game. I am not sure if it is only something with my game or what the problem maybe. I attached my game to this post. I was hoping that someone could fix it for me as I want to continue playing this game. Thank you. Love this MOD, btw. It is the only reason I still play Civ4.
 

Attachments

ACK! From the capture of Canterbury, I discovered Theology (dang, cause I did NOT want to lose my beloved Imperial Glory Doctrine -- as Rome, of course), and was immediately thrust into the Theology civic!

At least I was running a state religion (and hope it wouldn't have happened if I wasn't). Also was in a golden age.

HB v1 beta
 
Um ,how the hell is that possible at all? Seriously, that's a big bug!
Ow, even.

I don't know what to say...
My technological yield is so high it's impossible for me to actually build any doctrines...especially since it's madness to wage a war in the ancient up until industrial era!
 
Um ,how the hell is that possible at all? Seriously, that's a big bug!
Ow, even.

I don't know what to say...
My technological yield is so high it's impossible for me to actually build any doctrines...especially since it's madness to wage a war in the ancient up until industrial era!

Not necessarily a bug. Just as the barbarian horde in early game event definitely is not a bug. Besides, new & different things happening in a game can be FUN and EXCITING!* :crazyeye:

--
If I find myself with a substantial lead over the AI, I will often search for ways I can play sub-optimally since I do NOT want a boring end-game. Such are the burdens of one who 1) plays the game until the end, 2) wants to win, 3) prefers to have only a MODERATE lead over the AI so they can provide some challenge (or interesting times).

* It is actually unusual for me to even run a state religion. Happens in maybe a third or less of my games.
 
Whatever, regardless, it's impossible for someone to be thrust into a civic. At least, to my knowledge. Unless someone thought it would be funny to make the Apocyatic palace force you into the Theocracy civic?

That's the bug. I don't know why you complained about it, if it's not a bug. Don't confuse ME!
Thank you. :crazyeye:
 
That's the bug. I don't know why you complained about it, if it's not a bug. Don't confuse ME!

You are the one who perceived I was complaining about it. :) I was just expressing my surprise and shock promotion! :eek: It's probably a function of the RevolutionDCM mod, not Hephmod anyway.

--
Meanwhile, here IS something I perceive to be in error:
I was perusing the Sevopedia promotion tree and came across Greek Fire: Fire II. +494149168 Collateral Damage, +2 First Strikes, +20% Strength.
 
Hence why the Revolutions mod is epic Fail, broken and fail in that order.
You won't catch dead and buried playing that mod.

I don't care what everyone says, it's as broken as a broken watch, I.E. right twice a day.

Heh, that's a bug with a 32bit integer. Hopefully it doesn't give you 4.9 Billion collateral damage.
 
Thanks for all your comments, everyone, and for those of you who have PMed me with other issues. I'm listening and mentally noting, though I won't be able to do any work on the mod for another week or so as I'm out of town and away from a Civ-capable computer (gasp!).

The being forced into the Theocracy civic is really weird ... I've never seen that. Did you get a text alert different from, "X has adopted Theocracy"? Revolution tends to add distinctive alert messages, so you can tell its events apart from regular Civ events (usually). I know there's a functionality in Revolution where your citizens can demand a civic, but I've never heard of Theocracy being one of those civics, and the normal process for those events is a pop-up saying your people are demanding civic x.

I'll look at the posted saved game when I get a chance in a couple of weeks, but can't do so before then. Are you using the Choose Religion option? I've seen what's looking like a pretty common CTD with that option enabled.

Regarding the renaming of religions, I'm pretty attached to them being real world religions because there's a more atmospheric historical resonance there. Making them more generic or abstract seems a little boring to me, and doesn't help the fundamental problem in my view, which is reducing a rich historical tradition to a set of statistics or essential qualities. This is a point which everyone and their dog can go round and round about, but which I don't want to dwell on too much, as it would give me unwanted grad school flashbacks.

Again, thanks for the feedback and the time you're all putting into playing the mod, and keep the comments and bug reports coming. The more info I have, the better the 1.0 release will be!
 
The being forced into the Theocracy civic is really weird ... I've never seen that. Did you get a text alert different from, "X has adopted Theocracy"? Revolution tends to add distinctive alert messages, so you can tell its events apart from regular Civ events (usually).

Here's how it went down (from my very limited perspective):
I took the city, learning Theology. Later, in the same or next turn, I discovered new troops having 2 excess experience points, and from investigating I discovered I was using Theocracy from the F3. From there I found the note about changing civics in the event log (paraphrasing: You have adopted Theocracy) immediately above the capturing Canterbury notice. No discrete event box appeared in the adoption of this civic.

I have nothing against the occurrence per se, as long as I at least am running a religion (though being in a golden age was definitely fortuitous :lol: ). After all, surprises are good!
 
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