How far can I get without Combustion?

[jerVL/kg]

I'm a few battles away from winning a LARGE source of whales, the first I've found in the game (which is my first Civ game ever, I must add.) However, I'm also just one tech away from learning Combustion, which OBSOLETES the whales, and I don't want that to happen yet! (Screw the Greenpeace treehuggers! ) I've discovered oil, but apparently there's nothing I can build with it yet.

I'm also close to Industrialism, which obsoletes Ivory, but since that's a prerequisite for Plastics (which also requires Combustion, so no Three Gorges Dam...bummer) I don't think I need it...can't build War Elephants anymore, but it's a useful trade item. Still, it could go either way...

If I skip Combustion, will I still be able to build tanks/gunships/destroyers and all that stuff? Checking the tech tree, I'm unclear if I'll still be able to eventually get Fiber Optics (Internet!) or Rocketry, Satellites, etc. I'm wayy ahead of all the civs both militarily and technologically, so I'm not worried about them outpacing me...yet.

 

[vra379971]

Eh...you care about Whaes because?

 

[BlackMage]

The only things you are absolutely missing out on without Combustion are Transports and Destroyers. You can make your way down the tech tree without it, if you are willing to forgo a navy.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

I'm a few battles away from winning a LARGE source of whales, the first I've found in the game (which is my first Civ game ever, I must add.) However, I'm also just one tech away from learning Combustion, which OBSOLETES the whales, and I don't want that to happen yet! (Screw the Greenpeace treehuggers! ) I've discovered oil, but apparently there's nothing I can build with it yet.

I'm also close to Industrialism, which obsoletes Ivory, but since that's a prerequisite for Plastics (which also requires Combustion, so no Three Gorges Dam...bummer) I don't think I need it...can't build War Elephants anymore, but it's a useful trade item. Still, it could go either way...

If I skip Combustion, will I still be able to build tanks/gunships/destroyers and all that stuff? Checking the tech tree, I'm unclear if I'll still be able to eventually get Fiber Optics (Internet!) or Rocketry, Satellites, etc. I'm wayy ahead of all the civs both militarily and technologically, so I'm not worried about them outpacing me...yet.

Well you need Combustion to Access the oil, so no Tanks, planes, or modern ships, without it.

I believe you can still get the whaling boats for the tile bonuses of the whales, though (And I think you May still be able to trade them to civs that don't have combustion)

 

[Ranos]

When those resources go obsolete, you can still access and trade them, they just don't make your citizens happy anymore. Try to get the three media wonders to replace the three resources that are obsoleted. If somebody already has them, do your best to trade and acquire them.

 

[jerVL/kg]

Ah, so they don't disappear entirely...cool!

It would still be interesting to see how far I can get w/o modern war machinery...all other civs are still using maces & longbows, which already don't stand a chance against my 2-man Infantry units.

 

[Errata]

You'll still get the tile bonuses and ability to trade the whale, just not the bonus to cities linked to it. But oil is a whole new resource, which will give you tile bonuses and city bonuses of its own. So even if you never build anything using oil (which you will), you'll still benefit enough from the oil to justify losing the small bonus from whale.

If you're taking infantry against longbows, then it sounds like you've already got the scenario won anyway. So no, it wouldnt really be more interesting to win without tanks. Tanks will just get the inevitable over with a little faster.

 

[jerVL/kg]

I went ahead and learned Combustion, built some oil wells (had to raze a couple villages where the oil popped up, forced relocation is a ***** ain't it?) and several turns later realized...I can't build Galleons and Frigates anymore! Only those fuggly Transports and Destroyers! Crap, if I knew I'd lose my cool-looking Frigates I would've built more of 'em...

Oh well, maybe I'll go back a few turns to an earlier save...on the other hand, I did see an Indian destroyer sail by, so I guess they're further up the tech chain than I thought.

 

[methodermis]

You're going to hate this, but you don't need to move a city to get the resource. You automatically get access to a resource a city is sitting on as soon as the relevant technology is available. Building a city on a resource is a good way to keep enemies from blockading it, actually.

 

[AnotherJon]

I can't build Galleons and Frigates anymore! Only those fuggly Transports and Destroyers! Crap, if I knew I'd lose my cool-looking Frigates I would've built more of 'em...

Sounds like you need to increase the difficulty some, you may yet be glad of the transports and destroyers

 

[player1 fanatic]

Anybody noticed that with Physics and Industralization you can build Battleships if having Uranium.

Only motorized unit in the game that doesn't require Combustion to be discovered first.

 

[DangerousMonkey]

Dude, you have Whales, you don't need combustion. I reccomend you research Whale Power next for Living Submarines. They do mad damage against other whales.

 

[Jantis]

Dude, you have Whales, you don't need combustion. I reccomend you research Whale Power next for Living Submarines. They do mad damage against other whales.

Yeah, they eat Navy SEALS for breakfast. Just stay away from the fishing boats, you might get caught in those big nets.

 

[jerVL/kg]

I did go back to a previous save & skipped Combustion, so I still have my lovely wooden ships. Good thing I did, it would have gotten boring really quickly otherwise...It's kinda neat having a civilization with 21st century gadgets like Fission Reactors and The Internet, but with an 18th Century Navy and barely WWI size army. Unless I decide to attack India sometime...stupid Asoka keeps voting for himself in the UN election! (I still have enough votes for a Diplomatic Victory, but I'm going to try for Domination instead...and then maybe Cultural too, oh and maybe build the spaceship for kicks...and after that, try a difficulty level higher than Settler. )

Dude, you have Whales, you don't need combustion. I reccomend you research Whale Power next for Living Submarines. They do mad damage against other whales.

That would be great for the expansion:
Civilization = Eskimo
Leader = Nanook (Philosophical/Creative)
Special unit = Whale Rider! (replaces Cavalry)

You're going to hate this, but you don't need to move a city to get the resource. You automatically get access to a resource a city is sitting on as soon as the relevant technology is available. Building a city on a resource is a good way to keep enemies from blockading it, actually.

Really? I didn't know that. This one was under a town though...you know, the ones that grow from cottages. (Do new resources actually pop up under existing cities?)

 

[Shillen]

When those resources go obsolete, you can still access and trade them, they just don't make your citizens happy anymore.

That's true, but if the AI has combustion then it won't even give you 1gpt for an obsolete resource. So they're essentially useless unless there are some backwards civs in the game that have something to offer, which isn't common in my games anyway.

 

[bob rulz]

Really? I didn't know that. This one was under a town though...you know, the ones that grow from cottages. (Do new resources actually pop up under existing cities?)

Yes, new resources can pop up under existing cities. The resources are always on the map. The oil is always on the map, it just takes Combustion to make it appear and allow you to access it. So technically you build the city on top of the oil, you just don't know it's there (same for every other resource).

 

[Good Omens]

Yes, new resources can pop up under existing cities. The resources are always on the map. The oil is always on the map, it just takes Combustion to make it appear and allow you to access it. So technically you build the city on top of the oil, you just don't know it's there (same for every other resource).

It seems logical that you'd get some hints about the existence of oil before learning the actual technology. Things like black stuff oozing out of the ground, people passing out from petroleum fumes, and the occasional massive underground explosion.

Of course, even stranger is the "appearance" of horses when you get Animal Husbandry. I know the justification, that the tech just teaches your people how to use them. But the fact that my people wouldn't notice the massive herds of half-ton hoofed animals doesn't give me much confidence in their intelligence.

"Hey, Frank, what are those things?"
"Those? Just really big dogs, I think."

 

[Errata]

It seems logical that you'd get some hints about the existence of oil before learning the actual technology. Things like black stuff oozing out of the ground, people passing out from petroleum fumes, and the occasional massive underground explosion.

Of course, even stranger is the "appearance" of horses when you get Animal Husbandry. I know the justification, that the tech just teaches your people how to use them. But the fact that my people wouldn't notice the massive herds of half-ton hoofed animals doesn't give me much confidence in their intelligence.

"Hey, Frank, what are those things?"
"Those? Just really big dogs, I think."

The world obviously contains thousands of species of animals that aren't shown as resources. Your people are perfectly aware of the horses, but they aren't particularly good eating, so your people don't think of them as a resource until they discover a use for them. The player knows they're a resource and would arrange city placement around them if given the opportunity, which is unrealistic. Why would your people want to arrange their city to be close to "massive herds of half-ton hoofed animals"?

 

[jerVL/kg]

Ok, I finally got to the point where the only tech left to research was Combustion. I was able to learn everything else except Flight, Plastics, Composites, Robotics (no Space Victory possible) and Future Tech. Tanks & Gunships were not possible, but as mentioned before, Battleships were.

Since there was nothing left (and I'd built a massive armada of wooden ships to last me quite a long time) I went ahead and learned Combustion...moot point, since I "accidentally" won a Domination Victory 2 turns later!

It's quite fun to limit yourself to certain techs, actually. Next time I'll try avoiding something else major...something like Writing.