Hurricanes Harvey, Irma, Jose, etc.

[onejayhawk]

There is a lot more to play out, but our part is over. We are down to drizzly rain and spots of clear sky from time to time.

My friend from the north side of Houston sent pictures of his commute. They are just like the one above. Still, he has power and water pressure. He said the heavy rain stopped about 1:00 AM. What happened in Houston has been called, "a rain making machine for the ages." There has never been a well observed rain event like this. Houston has considerable experience with flooding, though it usually comes from rain upstream flooding the riverbanks.

BTW, the highest storm surge Friday morning was over three meters (9'7"). This was with a barrier island breaking the force and a 90° turn in the water path.

J

 

[Zelig]

Is he an emergency worker commuting to work?

 

[EgonSpengler]

Various media are reporting that Gov. Abbott has activated the entire Texas Army National Guard, ~12,000 people. I can't help thinking that Fort Hood and its ~40,000 soldiers is only a couple-hundred miles from Houston, too.

 

[shadowplay]

This is really a catastrophe. It looks even worse than New Orleans in 2005. I hope all Houston CFC'ers are making out okay. Wish I could help.

 

[Disgustipated]

So what's the situation exactly? Hundreds of thousands (millions?) stuck in their homes? Should we expect a lot more deaths?

it's really hard to say. I really feel they aren't giving us enough information. In theory, this could be much worse than Katrina.

But I read an article earlier this morning that they were doing rescues all night, and they only had about 250 left to go, and they were just asking people to sit tight. So in theory, everyone will be rescued by today.

The only concerning thing is how long will this water last. That's the thing that could kill a lot of people. Disease, thirst, and hunger could start to take effect if people don't have access to food, water, and shelter. How long can people remain in their homes until the flood waters receded? That's the thing I'm concerned about.

The conspiracy theorist in me wonders why this is going so much better than Katrina. Perhaps because Texas is a Republican state and Louisiana is a Democrat state? But seriously, I like to think they just learned some lessons since Katrina. The government seemed really incompetent back then. But still my concerned I stated in my 3rd paragraph are still relevant, and this could turn out to be really bad after all.

arious media are reporting that Gov. Abbott has activated the entire Texas Army National Guard, ~12,000 people.

This also has me thinking that it's really worse than what they are telling us.

 

[Zkribbler]

The conspiracy theorist in me wonders why this is going so much better than Katrina.

It might have something to do with the New Orleans levees breaking, due to cost-cutting shortcuts during construction, 80% of the city was underwater. Plus, Bush, had replaced the professional leadership of FEMA with his political cronies.
.

 

[EgonSpengler]

This also has me thinking that it's really worse than what they are telling us.

I guess it's possible, but what I'm hearing and reading is certainly bad enough to justify 12,000 additional people. In fact, I'm wondering if it's enough, which is why I mentioned Fort Hood.

Random bits:

• A Red Cross Vice President, who had previously worked for FEMA, was on the radio this morning. He said that this is the worst natural disaster he's ever seen. He described the inundated area of Texas as being about the size of Lake Michigan. For you Europeans, that's larger than the Netherlands, but not quite as big as Ireland.
  
• Texas might have had only half of what's due: 25" so far, and meteorologists are predicting up to another 25".
  
• The Army Corps of Engineers opened gates in a pair of reservoirs because there's so much water they're worried about the dams.
  
• A couple of hours ago, the Colorado River reached 54 feet where it passes through La Grange, about halfway between San Antonio and Houston. The "flood stage" there is 27 feet.
  
• In a worst-case scenario, it's possible the storm could back up, move offshore, and then come back after gathering more energy and more water.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Two senators and twenty congressmen from Texas voted against federal relief following hurricane Sandy. Their constituents re-elected them, indicating that they agree with their representatives that disaster relief is not the nation's responsibility. Should their belief be respected, or should federal relief be provided to them despite their views?

 

[Hrothbern]

How long can people remain in their homes until the flood waters receded?

How is that water going to recede ?
Can it just flow back to the sea when the storm surge elevated sea level is normal again ?
Or is much water caught on low ground between higher ground ?

This water amount and the rainfall yet to come is really staggering high when you need pumps. In fact there are no pumps big enough to handle for example even 10-20% of the total caught on low grounds in weeks or months

 

[Zkribbler]

Should their belief be respected, or should federal relief be provided to them despite their views?

The reasons we have nations and not city-states is so when a disaster strikes, the rest of the nation can aid the afflicted part.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

How is that water going to recede ?
Can it just flow back to the sea when the storm surge elevated sea level is normal again ?
Or is much water caught on low ground between higher ground ?

This water amount and the rainfall yet to come is really staggering high when you need pumps. In fact there are no pumps big enough to handle for example even 10-20% of the total caught on low grounds in weeks or months

The bayous will drain it out, it's just that they will drain it very slowly because they run on almost zero grades. Miles inland the elevation is still only thirty-forty feet.

EDIT: Out of curiosity and to make sure I wasn't misrepresenting the realities of Houston I downloaded a standard USGS 7.5 minute topo map from somewhere well out in the western suburbs of Houston. The entire map didn't have a single elevation line on it. The whole thing was between 35 feet at the high point in the northwest corner and 32-33 feet along the eastern edge.

The reasons we have nations and not city-states is so when a disaster strikes, the rest of the nation can aid the afflicted part.

Well, I agree...but that doesn't seem to be the generally accepted view in Texas.

 

[onejayhawk]

I saw an estimate that the storm had dump over 15 trillion liters ( 4,000,000,000,000 Gal) of rainwater in an area the size of Germany. That's 2000 L for every person on Earth.

At our local Walmart, they are getting trailer after trailer of water and paper goods for evacuees going home. We have several thousand staying here. Flashlights don't stay on shelves more than an hour. Generators and lanterns are impossible to find.

This is going to make New Orleans look like an overflowed tub in the upstairs bathroom.

J

 

[FriendlyFire]

This is going to make New Orleans look like an overflowed tub in the upstairs bathroom.J

Well it couldnt have happened to a nicer state !
I have a feeling this is just a taste of what is to come, with increasing ElNino effect on Hurricans and more frequent Hurricans.

Harvey turned eastward on Monday, the center of the storm returning to the warm waters of the Gulf of Mexico, raising the possibility that it could gain strength.

Welp

old legacy pollutants from a paper mill that has.. just left their toxins in the ground. .. we have had several rain events.. each time we have a rain event, this contamination is being spread into communities, homes..and further exposing more and more people.

..we know that we have elevated levels of cancers all along these areas. There have been many reports to show increased rates of childhood leukemia if you live within 2 miles of the Houston Ship Channel, for example."

And you cant fix stupid
At least they still have Obamacare, thanks Obama

 

[Timsup2nothin]

When a city of a million people is made uninhabitable, refugees are mostly absorbed by the fourth largest city in the country, which is not all that far away.

When the fourth largest city in the country is made uninhabitable, where do the refugees go?

 

[Zkribbler]

When the fourth largest city in the country is made uninhabitable, where do the refugees go?

They found that out with Hurricane Rita. The citizens of Houston got out on the highways, where they sat for hours in nightmare traffic jams. Cars and gas statios ran of gas. Many people died from from the heat and thirst.

 

[onejayhawk]

Well it couldnt have happened to a nicer state !

If that is not sarcastic, I'll agree. If it is sarcastic, then you spoke the truth unintentionally.

At least the city and state governments are massively better (less corrupt) than New Orleans had to endure.

I have a feeling this is just a taste of what is to come, with increasing ElNino effect on Hurricans and more frequent Hurricanes.

If that was supposed to be a climate change comment, it failed. Bad grasp of the science.

And you cant fix stupid At least they still have Obamacare, thanks Obama

Here we agree. ACA is massively stupid and you cannot fix it.

J

 

[Zkribbler]

Here we agree. ACA is massively stupid and you cannot fix it.

...except in California, where local officials weren't actively trying to sabotage it, and so it's working fine.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Well I was hoping the hurricane would smack directly into Maralgo in Florida
I was thinking about Perrys and Republican commitment to disband the EPA, which is ironic because Pollution and health issues would be buried and covered up by the State. Along with Texas politicians voting against Hurricane rebuilding funds for Sandy.

Oh well, even with Flooding mitigation methods the damage by this once in 800 year hurricane would only have been slightly mitigated.
Eventually even the most die hard climate denier is going to have to deal with reality, even this increase in El Nino events should be enough to at least get more funding into climate sciences at the very least. And give more incentive at climate proofing new infrastructure projects.

As for Houston a more or less Liberal island in a sea of Trumpland
Best of luck

 

[Timsup2nothin]

The big question is how long it takes having "500 year floods" and "500 year storms" and "500 year droughts" several times per decade before the dingbats realize they are being dingbats.

 

[Zkribbler]

There is a lot more to play out, but our part is over. We are down to drizzly rain and spots of clear sky from time to time.

I heard one (1) forecaster predict Harvey was going to head back out into the Gulf, where it'd pick up energy and moisture, and then it was likely to come back and hit Houston for a second time.

Plus this

An alligator sanctuary in southeast Texas says it’s on high alert as rising floodwaters risk the escape of roughly 350 gators.

Workers at Gator Country in Beaumont have been busy patrolling the watery grounds of the 15-acre preserve as water from Hurricane Harvey’s rain inches closer to the top of fences that enclose the reptiles. As of Monday evening, none had gotten loose.