I few newbie ?s I haven't found answers 4.

L

lockandload

Warlord
Joined
Mar 21, 2005
Messages
149
I have the original out of the box version which I guess is "vanilla".

1. Does Livy's list mean anything? Sometime's my civ isn't even on it.
2. Are the AI's trades generally fair?
3. Why do they walk all over me, yet demand I get off their territories?
4. How important is it to upgrade the game version?

Thanks for any replies.
 
1. It lists which civs are the top among the list. It is generally good to be at the top, but it isn't crucial
2. If you both have a lot of money and cash, you can often get a good trade. If they have something like 2 gold, they will offer 2 gold. There's a lot more to it than this, but it is often a good idea to buy their techs and sell it to every other civ you know before they do the same
3. Because you let them. If you demand them to leave, they might declare war on you, but they might also leave. It all depends if it is worth the risk.
4. I would look for version 1.29, since its fixed a bunch of bugs and helped balance out the game.
 
lockandload said:
4. How important is it to upgrade the game version?
Click to expand...

If it's the same as the out of the box version I played for a long time, you *need* to upgrade it. It's missing a lot of features like advanced keys for moving units in stacks. Also, some of the Wonders, most notably the Theory of Evolution, didn't function properly.
 
1) Almost nothing.
2) Depends. Their suggestions ("Lookie here, t'is nice Territory Map, waddabout giving me Atomic Theory for it?") are usually only funny. But if you offer them something, they do pay about everything they can afford. You often can haggle a bit, but not substantially. Same for buying something from the AI. Of course, they ask for Techs first; more haggling needed.
Then, 'fair'? They make better deals among each others, depending on the level.
3) Because they're obsessively trying to settle everywhere.
4) VERY important. Each and every patch was benefitial.
 
lockandload said:
2. Are the AI's trades generally fair?
Click to expand...
At lower levels, especially chieftain, the AI is so restricted that they rarely have any money to buy with and nothing worth trading for anyway.
 
And, at higher levels, they often have money and techs to trade but they always try to screw you up with insane demands (such as world map vs. world map + Gunpowder). On the other hand they seem to sell techs between themselves for a world map and even less.
 
tR1cKy said:
And, at higher levels, they often have money and techs to trade but they always try to screw you up with insane demands (such as world map vs. world map + Gunpowder). On the other hand they seem to sell techs between themselves for a world map and even less.
Click to expand...
Everybody keeps saying that but I have yet to experience those "insane" demands. I played a couple of test games at emperor level and they just demand something like teritory map + 9 gold. It's not worth going to war over that.
 
Bad choose of words, i intended trades. Such as when you ask for a world map and they want in return your world map plus a premium tech or a luxury. They you haggle and discover that a world map + 20 or 30 gold is sufficient, while the premium tech may be worth 2000 golds or more.

EDIT: about proper demands, it's not rare that they ask you to hand over a tech or a luxury for free. Once again, the tech may be worth a few thousands bucks.
 
I wouldn't call Emperor a 'higher' level.
Also, what tR1cKy quotes is a trade offer, not a demand. YOu can easily reject it.
A demand is: "Give us Iron/up to 100gp/TM/a Tech", and our mighty Armies won't crush you."
And on DG and above, they should be indeed able to do that for the first half of the game (or they are obviously joking, so you can refuse).
 
Buried in the hints thread is this great suggestion for AI's spontaneous demands. Propose an alternative trade instead, but then hit "forget it". Apparently, that sends them away with nothing. Haven't tried it.
 
You can't haggle real demands. You pay or you don't; that's it. If you can haggle, it's not a demand, just a trade suggestion. There's no penalty for refusing it.

Renata
 
lockandload said:
3. Why do they walk all over me, yet demand I get off their territories?
Click to expand...

This sometimes depends on your relative military strength. If you are much more powerful than they are, and have some forces near their border, they will be less likely to try and cross your territory. It's no guarentee though. If they decide that they want a certain piece of land on the other side of your empire, they'll keep trying. Especially if they've run out of room to expand in.
 
Brain said:
Well, I'm playing vanilla. Are you saying that only Deity is a 'higher' level in vanilla Civ 3?
Click to expand...

Essentially, yes.
Higher level=AI gets at least one more Settler.
That isn't meant disrespective; the mid-levels Regent to Emperor aren't 'easy'.
But the difference is: An experienced player can win a mid-level game under all circumstances. Even with an insanely bad start. Once the AI gets another Settler, that's no longer possible. The AI is stupid enough to found their capital whereever they start - but their Settler goes to a good spot, since they see all resources.
 
lockandload said:
I have the original out of the box version which I guess is "vanilla".

1. Does Livy's list mean anything? Sometime's my civ isn't even on it.
.
Click to expand...

If you have set your opponents to be random, it lets you know who you are up against.
 
lockandload said:
Do you usually challenge them or let them walk?
Click to expand...

Quite often, if I have a strong military in comparison, I don't even have Settlers try to cross my land. They just stay away, especially if I have a sizable offensive force near their borders.

I've actually chosen a completely different approach to interlopers in my territory though. I've created a number of Hidden Nationality land units that can attack anything that crosses my borders, without actually having to go war. Having a few of those near my frontiers also works well at keeping Settlers out.
 
Ask to leave only if you know they're targeting at you. They usually declare and you get some useful inverse war weariness point - and if the enemy is republican he start immediately to collect positive ww points :evil: Then, you have the advantage of a first strike (more ww for the enemy!)
 
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