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If you could bring anything back from a past Civ game what would it be

Discussion in 'Civ - Ideas & Suggestions' started by oliver, Apr 26, 2012.

  1. markusbeutel

    markusbeutel NiGHTS

    Sep 26, 2010
    Vancouver BC Canada
    1. Dynamic Cultural Borders.
    2. Diplomacy of Civ 4, (as a base to build on).
    3. Health.
    4. Local Happiness.
    5. Foreign Trade Routes
    6. Difficulty levels on par with those found in Civ 4.
    7. A UN with actual decisions/functions.
    8. Bronze Resource.
    9. Civ 4 style National Wonders.
    10) Points bonuses for ending games earlier.
    11) Civ 4 style culture victories.
    12) Civic/Policy hybrid system, (Civics unlocked through policies - either/or scenarios).
    13) Globe View.
    14) Clearly defined resources on the world map.
    15) Less Popups.
    16) Era specific music.
    17) Balanced traits, (not necessarily Civ 4 style, just balanced - unlike in Civ 5).
    18) Anything but Art Deco for menus/buttons.
    19) Balanced eras (where you can't get tanks in 1200 AD).
    20) An AI that actually expands across the map.
  2. PhilBowles

    PhilBowles Chieftain

    Nov 20, 2011
    I hadn't heard that that was the reasoning. Having just been on the receiving of the most (read: only) effective AI naval invasion I've seen - a large invasion of several artillery, infantry and tanks backed by four destroyers. And with air support. And then the same again against another city - I realised that transports fundamentally don't work with the tactical combat system: you'd need to move the transport a hex for every unit or two you want to offload (depending on landing site terrain), since they can't disembark on the same hex due to the absence of stacking, something that wasn't an issue in Civ IV - the stack could just move out of the boat onto land in the same formation.

    This would be a severe vulnerability for any naval invasion. It undoubtedly would make the AI still less effective - maybe that's what was meant? It would help the AI manage naval invasions in the Civ V combat system more effectively than it could with transports, not that it would help relative to Civ IV.
  3. smallfish

    smallfish Immortal

    Oct 1, 2011
    This is horribly off-topic, but please tell me more about this !!!

    What game level, map type, turn/year, tech level, who vs who etc.
  4. Grump

    Grump Chieftain

    Oct 7, 2006
    Something more akin to the planetary council rather than the perpetually useless in civ and rl UN.

    Atrocities and sanctions and resolutions you could defy. Ability to defy diplomatic victory.

    Assassinations, AC type spy missions etc

    Economic victory

    true globe-didn't Rev have a globe looking thingie?

    A surrender relation
  5. PhilBowles

    PhilBowles Chieftain

    Nov 20, 2011
    I was astonished - never seen a game like it. Never underestimate the AI's desire to beat you when desperate.

    I was Darius, Emperor game on random Huge map that turned out to be islands. Except for the ever-faithful Isabella (she and Askia have turned up in every one of my recent games) everyone now hated me (as I got closer to victory, my long-time allies the Inca, Korea and Arabia had successively denounced me and warned me of barbarian invasions), though only the Ottomans and Songhai were nearby. I'd had a continent/big island to myself (after occupying the three Songhai cities that had established a foothold) for most of the game, and had gone the science victory route. I had one spaceship part left to complete (which was building in Susa, on another continent), and had been at war with the Ottomans and Songhai (who declared together) for a while. Usual stuff, and not worried since, after all, the AI can't handle naval invasions - the Songhai had made some reasonable landings given their low tech level, but had no chance when throwing infantry against mech, and did occasionally lead with artillery (oops). But their main island was only a single hex of water away.

    The Ottomans were more distant but still my second-closest neighbour; they'd sent a few token waves of infantry against Ecbatana (off my main island, and the closest city to them) without effect - usual stuff.

    Then the 1960s hit, and my spaceship neared completion. Suddenly 4 destroyers appeared escorting 2 artillery, 2 tanks, several infantry and a cavalry right off the coast of Pasargardae. As an island map, where I hadn't had a major war (only a minor one against the technologically weak Songhai) I hadn't invested much in military, and had only one destroyer to see off marauding ships. Due to the lack of conflict my few units hadn't got many promotions (I had one mech inf with blitz, that was it). I still eliminated most of the attacking melee units, but couldn't quite relieve Pasagardae in time.

    No problem, the Ottomans had run out of attackers, they couldn't hold the city. So I ignored the usual "give us everything" peace treaty offer (in retrospect, I was fewer than 10 turns from victory so should probably just have signed, as long as Susa wasn't part of the deal). Naturally, next turn more destroyers with a whole bunch of anti-tank guns and infantry showed up outside Persepolis, the one city (other than Susa) I couldn't afford to lose. Fortunately, with endearing AI inability to understand victory conditions, the giant fleet decided to turn round and attack Ecbatana, which was undefended. It didn't hold out as long as I'd hoped, but for some reason the large attack force stayed over there and didn't come back towards Persepolis, which was just hit with a few small waves of AA guns, anti-tank guns and bombers based in Pasagardae (another first - I've never seen the AI use bombers, only fighters and nukes. Plus they'd have needed to rebase to attack from Pasargardae, and I wasn't aware the AI could handle rebasing) which my army could hold off while the Ottomans used ground forces that should have been attacking my capital to attack Taghaza (with Songhai air support from fighters based in Gao).

    While all this was going on, the Songhai did something very interesting - they repeatedly used fighters and artillery to bombard Tombuctou from Gao (my only ranged unit had been lost in the defence of Pasagardae, which it was garrisoning, so I only had city militia as defence), and it's not unknown for the AI to do things like this pointlessly when it has no way of capturing the city (I had a game once where Mongolia did that indefinitely to one of my CS allies, apparently unaware that all their melee units had been destroyed). What I didn't expect was that they would have an anti-tank gun lurking out of both sight and attack range (after all, invasion forces normally sit happily within the city radius where you can shoot them) - the turn Tomboctou's defences were reduced to 1, this thing just came round the corner and attacked the city from the sea.

    In the event, Susa was never attacked and both Kinkia (closest rail link to the capital on the coast facing Susa) and Persepolis survived (although Persepolis was under siege and weight of numbers and my absent-minded tendency to throw modern armor at AT guns had seen off my army) long enough for the stasis chamber to get there and complete the spaceship. My space victory ended up feeling rather like the remnants of the Persian people fleeing from the burning remains of their empire...

    If the AI had played only slightly better (attacking Persepolis with everything rather than hitting Ecbatana, and/or had the Songhai allied with Bucharest - on my island and with several mech inf, as well as naval units on the side of the island the stasis chamber had to enter from - instead of distant Singapore) I wouldn't have held out long enough to get the victory. As it was its choice of target left something to be desired, but for a rarity its actual combat could hardly be faulted.

    Naval invasions, coordinated attacks by naval, air and ground units, allied AI forces coordinating attacks on the same targets, sensible use of air power (those annoying little fighters kept attacking cities - but if they spotted a mech inf in the open with a couple of remaining hit points, you could bet they'd switch targets and that mech inf would be no more. When coordinating attacks from 6 fighters based in Gao and an Ottoman bomber or two, even attacking cities with fighters makes sense), even a successful naval assault against a weakened city directly from the sea (and, admittedly, several of the usual pointless suicide assaults from embarked units by the Ottomans). Come to that, an unexpectedly sensible choice of first target (that first invasion was nearly stalled against Pasagardae - it would have been wrecked if sent directly against Persepolis. But it gave the Ottomans a well-placed beachhead on my island from which to support later attacks on the capital, as well as the pointless but effective invasion of Taghaza). I don't recall the Civ 4 AI pulling off stuff like that; for Civ V it's amazing.
  6. NJC

    NJC Chieftain

    Apr 27, 2012
    perhaps the mind map from civ 4 could be used again, it displayed all factions relations quite clearly

    also, if a similar mind map be used in a separate branch in diplomacy for individual major nations relations relations to all city-states

    it would certainly simplify diplomacy for both multiplayer and solo games, especially when versing many opponents and especially when games are drawn out.

    not to mention how after not playing the game for a while, you'd return to it and not quite remember what was happening or what plans were originally made due to other things in life. civ is a great game, but unless its clearly set out, i find myself starting new games or re-loading all ones because i didnt remember specific strategic points which with the diplomatic mind map of civ 4, made so simple
  7. historix69

    historix69 Chieftain

    Sep 30, 2008
    I miss
    - to choose from several leaders for a civ (as in Civ4).
    - Civ3 / Civ4 leader traits like bonus on Gold, Production, military, culture, GP, ....
    - Civ3 start where all civs had 2 individual starting techs
    - Map-trading
    - opportunity for tech trading (difficult : AI might cheat on tech trading!)
  8. neutral_leader

    neutral_leader Chieftain

    Dec 11, 2007
    Colorado Springs
    From Civ 2:

    The foreign advisor. :rolleyes:
    The ambassadors. Seriously. It is not at all realistic that every world leader comes to visit me for every little thing. Plus, they were a lot more imposing as portraits on their ambassador's wall, with an aura of mystery about them.

    From Civ 4:

    Foreign trade networks.
    Culture flipping of cities. It gave me a reason to live.

    From SMAC:

    Real terrain height and climatic effects (like prevailing winds affecting rainfall). That was fricking awesome and it has NEVER been used again!
    The planetary council. Much more interesting resolutions than the UN ever had and the bribery was awesome.
    A social policy/civic/whatever-you-want-to-call-it system that actually tied, in a logical, one-to-one correspondence, to political, economic, etc. systems by which a country might be run.
    The whole SMAC storyline. Can Apolyton really be demanding that much money for the rights to the story of a game that old? If SMAC 2 is ever made (or even just a total conversion mod for a future Civ game), I can pass from this world content.

    From Call to Power:

    The future. And most specifically, the revelation of ocean floor terrain and the ability to improve it, colonize it, and build undersea tunnels across it. It massively livened up the end game to so dramatically redraw the map and bring some of the excitement of the beginning back in, not to mention shaking up diplomacy by once again making settlement claims an issue.
    The inclusion of more modern civilizations, i.e. Brazil, Canada, Indonesia, etc.
  9. Tabarnak

    Tabarnak Pô Chi Min

    Sep 17, 2010
  10. apocalypse105

    apocalypse105 Chieftain

    May 17, 2011

    war!!!!!!!!!!!! Build city wals!!!!!!!

    Yeah I would like 3 D advisors
  11. Civciv5

    Civciv5 Grand Emperor

    Aug 14, 2011
    Nergenshuizen, Belgium

    Bring back multiple leaders.
    (Qin Shi Huang with his beautiful crown/hat with pearls that swing when he moves)
    (Hatshepsut with her ridiculously tall hat)
    Leaders of India that are not called "Gandhi"
  12. shihuacao

    shihuacao Chieftain

    Aug 8, 2010
    Ethnic Population
  13. PhilBowles

    PhilBowles Chieftain

    Nov 20, 2011
    If treating India as the modern unified state, since Nehru it hasn't had many leaders not called Gandhi - they're just a variety of different Gandhis...
  14. SmellyJelly

    SmellyJelly Chieftain

    Oct 7, 2007
    Bradenton, FL
    civ IV BTS - The capability to see any foreign leader's attitude towards you right before agreeing to deals they're offering.
  15. joncnunn

    joncnunn Senior Java Wizard Moderator

    Mar 17, 2008
    1. Regenerate map (from Civ IV and others)

    2. Some sort of reward building palace (from either Civ II or III)

    3. The other Conquests from Civ III Conquests. (Some of these are in DLC and others are coming in G&K but there are a few others not yet present.)

    4. Civ IV escalating city upkeep (instead of building based)

    5. City based happiness instead of global (Civ IV and earlier)

    6. Capitulation (AC & Civ IV: Warlords)

    7. Civ IV style trade networks (also found in AC)

    8. Gold taken from capturing cities based on treasury (Civ IV and earlier)
  16. PhilBowles

    PhilBowles Chieftain

    Nov 20, 2011
    This is already in the game - if you mouse over the 'Friendly', 'Neutral' etc. status on their leader screen you get the tooltip showing their various modifiers.

    This would only work with major changes to the way the AI plays Civ V, since it's not uncommon for an AI civ to run on permanent deficit during wartime to maximise its unit count. That means no gold for you when you capture cities. And fixing AI behaviour means an AI with fewer units, which reduces its combat ability, which makes games easier.
  17. comatosedragon

    comatosedragon Chieftain

    May 5, 2008
    Harrisonburg Virginia
    I think he means when an AI pops up and offers you deal or a trade or something, in civ IV you could see their attitude, in civ V you have to back out and then check the diplo, and the try to re-enter negotiations. And the AI civ will not always accept the same deal they offered you after this.
  18. vcutag

    vcutag Chieftain

    Jun 11, 2004
    Richmond, Virginia
    Civ II's civil wars and Civ IV's interaction between culture and borders. I liked the idea of a culture gradient, with the border being drawn on the side of whomever had 51% or more. The ability to use a Great Artist and jack up the city's culture, possibly taking over a large swath of a nearby neighbor's frontier, was really awesome.

    I also liked that Civ IV had vassal states and let you grant independence to overseas colonies; it was handy if your empire got too large and you needed to cut back.
  19. Ailedhoo

    Ailedhoo ADVENT

    Mar 19, 2012
    I would love to see the return of the U.N as a place of commencing international laws as oppose to the instrument simply for the diplomatic victory.
  20. cac160

    cac160 Chieftain

    May 30, 2011
    Regenerate map
    Save starting preferences

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