Illians at terraforming the world to ice

[xilr]

Merge the343danny's idea and xienwolf's idea from two posts up and it'd be perfect.

Temples of the White Hand act as seeds. Ice spreads across Illian lands, similiar to how hell spreads. It stops at Illian borders....

until...

AA is in the game, now it just spreads everywhere until he is dead. Then either it "melts" in non-illian lands or simply ceases to spread and non-illians can terraform it as they see fit.


Of course, in order for this to work right Illian-Snow/Ice tiles would need to be always on par with the regular quality tiles. There are a few instances where the Illians lose resources for ice/snowing tiles. The spread of ice/snow would have to be universally a good thing for Illians prior to the above ideas...

 

[EmptyWolf]

Merge the343danny's idea and xienwolf's idea from two posts up and it'd be perfect.

Temples of the White Hand act as seeds. Ice spreads across Illian lands, similiar to how hell spreads. It stops at Illian borders....

until...

AA is in the game, now it just spreads everywhere until he is dead. Then either it "melts" in non-illian lands or simply ceases to spread and non-illians can terraform it as they see fit.

That would be perfect and no micromanaging is involved either.

 

[Keeper_GFA]

Illian workers could really use a boost to working in snow.

 

[Rod]

Originally Posted by xilr
Merge the343danny's idea and xienwolf's idea from two posts up and it'd be perfect.

Temples of the White Hand act as seeds. Ice spreads across Illian lands, similiar to how hell spreads. It stops at Illian borders....

until...

AA is in the game, now it just spreads everywhere until he is dead. Then either it "melts" in non-illian lands or simply ceases to spread and non-illians can terraform it as they see fit..

I would love it !

 

[Ahriman]

The really huge problem with ice is that it isn't feasible for other races to reverse. If ice spreads to much, the world becomes useless for all non-Illian races.

There needs to be a mechanism to reverse the ice for other races.

 

[Merddyn]

Isn't that already handled by the Sun and Fire spheres, though? Forgive me if I'm wrong, can't look stuff up in class.

Also, the idea of freezing the water makes me want to have an idea stolen from Exalted: Ice-Ships. ... Basically a lot like your standard wind-powered ship, but a flat(ter) bottom and ... Well, snow-mobile skis. As I recall, it could work both in on ice and in water.

If nothing else, might not be a bad idea for a thing to give them if the Temple ends up freezing water as well; probably want to lower the strength of the ice-ships compared to normal ones to balance out against land units. (Perhaps a balance or durability issue due to the different structure not being ideal for taking damage and/or carrying weapons.

 

[Saytr]

Fellowship of Leaves can revitalize the lands via the High Priests. I find it qquite thematic that when Ice threatens, it's opposite (nature) is a good option for fighting it.

 

[Mailbox]

I hate to post "ideas that I had that I can't get around to programming" because it's no fun to just generate ideas and let them rot without implementation but I guess I'll just share those ideas since this thread hits on it exactly.

What if the White Hand was a full fledged religion in that it spread and showed up like a religion but had a low chance to spread (both via trade and disciples)? Then lands in which the White Hand was prevalent, blizzards would autospawn. These blizzards would then slowly terraform the lands to tundra and then snow as time went on, and they would fade in and out. The change would be very slow and the conversion to the White Hand could be forced after a population threshold was reached. The White Hand would also get normal disciples that upgraded to priests and high priests and other special units but only the Illians would want to adopt it because it would be a terrible religion and the only bonuses it would give would then be far outweighed by the degradation of the terrain.

Here's what I wrote on it ( I was thwarted by the complier continually not working for me ), definitely not something for the main mod but it could be a fun modmod:

Spoiler :

Winter's Fury Mod

Mostly a test of my coding skills and to add some fun things to the Illians.

Needed XML/Python/SDK

- XML hook for State Religion Feature Spawn + chance
- SDK backing in CvPlot.cpp
- SDK terrain change on turn change in CvPlot.cpp
-

Needed programs

- GIMP
- .dds plugin
- FPK unpacker
- Codeblocks

Adds:

- Auric Ulvin Traits Charismatic / Spiritual

- The White Hand as a religion
- + 1 culture, + 1 science, + 1 gold (if State Religion)
- Founded with "The White Hand" ritual
- Allows building of Disciples of Winter
- Holy City receives + 1 gold per city
- Holy City gives + 1 Ice Mana
- Can only autospread
- If a civilization has over 75% cities with the White Hand, it is forced as the state religion
- When "The Draw" ritual is finished, all civilizations with the White Hand as the state religion
declare war the same way the Illians do
- Blizzards spawn in White Hand lands, slowly terraform the terrain into tundra/snow

- New Blizzard mechanics:
- Blizzards autospawn in territory under the White Hand
- Blizzards have a 10% chance per turn to turn a terrain into tundra (Gamespeed Modified)
- Blizzards have a 5% chance per turn to turn tundra into snow (Gamespeed Modified)
- Blizzards have a 5% chance per turn to destroy improvements if not in Illian lands (Gamespeed Modified)
- Blizzards have a chance to be created by the Snowfall spells

- New Snowfall mechanics:
- Still temporary snow tiles + cold damage
- 4 Levels of Snowfall
- (1x1) (Disciple of Winter) (Borders only)
- (3x3) (Priest of Winter) (Causes war)
- (5x5) (High Priest of Winter) (Causes war)
- (7x7) (Auric Ascended) (Causes war, just in case)

- Has a chance per tile to spawn a Blizzard
- 10% per tile (Disciple of Winter) .1 per cast
- 10% per tile (Priest of Winter) .9 per cast
- 10% per tile (High Priest of Winter) 2.5 per cast
- 10% per tile (Auric Ascended) 4.9 per cast

- Has a chance to destroy enemy improvements
- 0% per tile (Disciple of Winter) 0 per cast
- 15% per tile (Priest of Winter) 1.35 per cast
- 25% per tile (High Priest of Winter) 6.25 per cast
- 35% per tile (Auric Ascended) 17.15 per cast

- White Hand Units:

- Disciple of Winter
- 1 Str + 1 Ice Affinity
- Medic 1
- Can spread culture
- Can spread the White Hand
- Available after building "The White Hand"
- Can cast Snowfall (1)
- Triple the cost of a regular disciple
- Winterborn

- Priest of Winter
- 2 Str + 2 Ice Affinity
- Medic 1, Medic 2
- Cannot be built
- Upgraded from a Disciple of Winter, requires level 5
- Can Cast "Call Blizzard"
- National Limit of 4
- Can cast Snowfall (2)
- Winterborn

- High Priest of Winter
- 2 Str + 3 Ice Affinity
- Medic 1, Medic 2, Medic 3
- Cannot be built
- Upgraded from a Priest of Winter, requires level 7
- Can cast "Call Blizzard"
- National Limit of 4
- Can cast Snowfall (3)
- Winterborn

- Frost Giants
- 4 Str + 2 Ice Affinity
- Melee Unitcombat
- Can use all metal weapons
- Can be built after "The Draw" is finished for all White Hand nations
- National Limit of 4
- Winterborn
- Cannot enter Desert
- + 25% Snow Combat
- + 15% Tundra Combat

- Bear Riders
- 7 Str
- Mounted Unitcombat
- 2 move
- 25 % Forest Strength, 25 % Ancient Forest Strength, 25 % Snow Strength, 25 % Tundra Strength
- Winterborn
- No Defensive
- Cannot enter Desert

Illian only units:

- Auric Ulvin
- 3 Str
- Adept Unitcombat
- Starts with Channeling 1
- Can be upgraded

- Sorcery
- 5 Str
- Channeling 1, Channeling 2

- Strength of Will
- 7 Str
- Channeling 1, Channeling 2, Channeling 3

- Loss of Auric means loss of Traits, inability to build Auric Ascended

- Auric Ascended
- 20 Str + 20 Ice Affinity
- Avatar
- Multiple Attacks per turn
- 10% heal after combat
- 2 First Strikes

- Tanaris
- Spawns when "The Draw" is completed.
- Cannot gain experience
- 5 str + 5 Ice Affinity
- Starts with "Unchanging" promotion
- Heals 100% after combat
- Heals while moving
- Starts with "Heavy"
- + 25 % Ice Combat
- + 15 % Tundra Combat

- Fiacra
- 5 Str + 5 Ice Affinity
- Flying, Blitz
- Move 5
- Beast Unitcombat
- Is spawned with the Ascension Ritual
- + 25 % Blizzard Combat

 

[Keeper_GFA]

The Illian temple of the hand could use a flat culture boost as well. Even a +1 would help a lot since they are religious but can't adopt a religion.

 

[Bad Player]

I like the new ways Illians can terraform lands into snow and tundra, but I noticed none of them are permanent with the exception of temple of the hand.
Currently the only ways (unless there's some I don't know of) for Illians to terraform land to snow/tundra is:
Temple of The Hand - snow in city radius
Snowfall (tier 3 ice spell) - the snow on the tile is temporary
The Deepening - about 25% of the world turned to tundra but it's temporary
Blizzards - limited supply of these, requires a priest of the hand and is temporary.

Overall the only 'permanent' way to terraform tiles into snow is the temple of the hand's city radius effect. Snowfall can be used again and again only to revert back to normal but that requires a lot of those limited-supply level 3 snow casters and lots of micro-management.

FoL gives bloom to create forests (even outside your own territory) and converts forests in cultural territory to ancient forests.
Scorch turns plains to desert, and snow to tundra.
Vitalize simply upgrades terrain on a single tile up one level each time it is cast.

Yet Illians have no way to permanently terraform/(downgrade?) the world to snow, with the exception of the temple of the hand affecting only city radius. I realize that 'snowfall' works best with the effect as temporary so the possible places for a spell to convert terrain on a tile to snow would be a 2nd spell of Ice III, or simply an additional ability 'freeze' of high priests of the hand (that would probably be the best fit), although there are most likely other places that would work.

I'm just wondering what other's thoughts are on the lack of permanent snow terraforming for the Illians. It's a strange shortcoming to the Illians' goal of locking the world in frozen stasis and I don't see why they lack the power to cover their own land completely in snow when they are capable of creating their demi-god of winter, Auric Ascended.

I'd really like to see The Deepening effect to be permanent - it's a late game ritual after all leading to Auric's return!

 

[zup]

And since auric cannot get promotions he is dumb to fight with. Makes sense he hangs back in his capital or some other easy to defend place.

 

[Keeper_GFA]

It'd be nice if the Illians could Bloom on snow as well.

 

[civ_king]

Frostfire counter FTW make it so the city tiles start at 100% and the surrounding tiles have a 10% chance to convert to a colder tile grasslands+desert=Plains, Plains=tundra and tundra=snow. i don't know how that would work in practice

 

[xienwolf]

And since auric cannot get promotions he is dumb to fight with. Makes sense he hangs back in his capital or some other easy to defend place.

Especially since that is what he does in Age of Ice scenario

 

[Mailbox]

But that was after the world was already frozen. He originally had to move to fight Sucellus and freeze everything, I would think.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

Mailbox, you have some great ideas about the white hand. I agree that it would be a lot better as a full-fledged religion

 

[EmptyWolf]

Mailbox, you have some great ideas about the white hand. I agree that it would be a lot better as a full-fledged religion

That would be great either as a mod-mod or main FFH. White Hand being a religion reminds me of Age of Ice. Very well thought out ideas Mailbox. It would be interesting to actually force other nations to bend to the will of Auric.

 

[zup]

Well I still think fighting with nothing to gain is useless. (I don't see my enemies losing something as gain. I played too many kill => get xp => get stronger => kill more => get more xp games.) Even then, Auric is supposed to be a god right? One who broke the compact and therefore is vulnerable to Godslayer. Not mortal weapons.

Furthermore. Since Auric is a god and ascension is a late game ritual (requires a late tech), his presense should turn the whole world into ice. If that wins the game for the Illians quickly, I find it perfect. (Or then again I could pound my enemies to kingdom come while my future tech hits 250 ... ) And he still has to contend with Hyborem. Who at this point has 100+ cities.

Perhaps if ice was hell immune after Auric ascends, but hell is always ice immune in ashen veil lands. Then other civs could go av and let Agares shield them from Auric. Creates an interesting scenario of 'Will the world end in fire or ice?'

 

[Mailbox]

I'd like Auric's Snowfall being permanent.