I'm upset at Firaxis (New Conquest problems, O JOY!)

[embryodead]

Originally posted by Louis XXIV
Of course, either way isn't the best way (the best way for mod makers would be a "disables city-view and palace" flag, but that's probably the worst thing for programmers).

If they were able to disable the views, that's actually the easiest thing possible.

 

[Dom Pedro II]

Huh.. ya know, I was wondering why I hadn't gotten any offer to upgrade my palace...

Meh, I'll live, but it'd be nice if they put it back.

I've got much bigger bones to pick with Firaxis.

I'm tearing hair out to make my mod workable with civ-specific techs... I would've preferred if each tech had a sort "can be researched by" list of the civilizations like there is for units. And it would be nice to have EITHER/OR options instead of just AND options for prerequisite technologies.

And something that could even make this even easier would have been the ability to add Eras, which I was really hoping for...

And one thing I think they should do in a patch is give the ability to set the turn interval of units produced with certain wonders/improvements to zero, so that you can have it so that you need to build this improvement to build a unit, but that it won't give you any freebies.

 

[embryodead]

Originally posted by Dom Pedro II
Huh.. ya know, I was wondering why I hadn't gotten any offer to upgrade my palace...

Meh, I'll live, but it'd be nice if they put it back.

As far as I've read, the palace is still there, it just doesn't appear automatically as it used to.

I'm tearing hair out to make my mod workable with civ-specific techs... I would've preferred if each tech had a sort "can be researched by" list of the civilizations like there is for units. And it would be nice to have EITHER/OR options instead of just AND options for prerequisite technologies.

And something that could even make this even easier would have been the ability to add Eras, which I was really hoping for...

As far as I understood you, C3C didn't add anything to what was in PTW in this matter. It's truly disappointing, since those civ-specific trees have very little use with the current setup (prerequisites spoil the fun, you know the deal).

And one thing I think they should do in a patch is give the ability to set the turn interval of units produced with certain wonders/improvements to zero, so that you can have it so that you need to build this improvement to build a unit, but that it won't give you any freebies.

I don't like this idea simply because it's in RTS/MoM style and I hate RTSes/MoMs. While it could be useful, I imagine that suddenly most of the mods would turn into AoE or MoMmy clone, with all mounted units requiring stables and so on. Horrible!

EDIT: I meant HoMM not MoM of course MoM was quite good, it had such buildings too, but it wasn't so scary that days, no RTSes and such...

 

[Dom Pedro II]

Yes, you're right, embryo, this was just from PtW... they didn't do anything about techs in Conquests.

I had been hoping they would. I was disappointed.


And hopefully, most people wouldn't make mods like that... I mean, its A LOT more cumbersome than in RTS-style. Oppurtunity-cost and all... but there are some occasions where it could be useful.

 

[computerdude113]

Originally posted by Dom Pedro II
Huh.. ya know, I was wondering why I hadn't gotten any offer to upgrade my palace...

Meh, I'll live, but it'd be nice if they put it back.

I've got much bigger bones to pick with Firaxis.

I'm tearing hair out to make my mod workable with civ-specific techs... I would've preferred if each tech had a sort "can be researched by" list of the civilizations like there is for units. And it would be nice to have EITHER/OR options instead of just AND options for prerequisite technologies.

And something that could even make this even easier would have been the ability to add Eras, which I was really hoping for...

And one thing I think they should do in a patch is give the ability to set the turn interval of units produced with certain wonders/improvements to zero, so that you can have it so that you need to build this improvement to build a unit, but that it won't give you any freebies.

Actually, to my wonderful suprise, they DID address civ-specific tech trees, however ot gets very stickey, because the civ-specific techs all need not to be required for era advance. How did they do this? Flavors! This, of corse, only works for the AI, but a simple work-around for the human civ to only have 1 tech tree option is to make an ERA_NONE tech for each civ and make it the prequisite for the first techs of the civ's tech tree (for each era). Then you give that tech to the desired civ and VOLA civ-specific tech trees (messy, ok, but it's better then nothing!)
As for the flavors, you can only have seven, so you need to group (the era_none tech thing you can make era-specifics for all civs) but if you have <7 civs, then flavors work great, they are also good for messing around with what improvements, wonders, and the such that certian civs (ai) will build.

But regardless, I'm still peeved at the City View and Palace View things.

 

[Louis XXIV]

Originally posted by embryodead


If they were able to disable the views, that's actually the easiest thing possible.

Making it an option in the editor is probably very tricky. It is one thing to add some code disabling it in scenarios, it is different to make a flag in the editor with a patch. This requires a slight artwork change and removal of something probably hardcoded.

I personally would be happy if they brought back city view and, when you look at the Temple of the Sun, you see Woman's Sufferage in the city view. I'd stop looking at city view, but I would look at it in another scenario if I see a giant bronze possum instead of the Collossus.

 

[embryodead]

Originally posted by computerdude113

Actually, to my wonderful suprise, they DID address civ-specific tech trees, however ot gets very stickey, because the civ-specific techs all need not to be required for era advance. How did they do this? Flavors! This, of corse, only works for the AI, but a simple work-around for the human civ to only have 1 tech tree option is to make an ERA_NONE tech for each civ and make it the prequisite for the first techs of the civ's tech tree (for each era). Then you give that tech to the desired civ and VOLA civ-specific tech trees (messy, ok, but it's better then nothing!)

But those ERA_NONE civ-specific trees were already in PTW 1.27 and were quite useless, except for small bonus techs etc. Maybe I don't get the flavors, but tell me for example, how do you make a civ-specific tree containing a resource or worker action? A resource can have only one prerequisite tech, and if it's in civ-specific tree, only this one specific civ will be able to see the resource... hope I'm clear. I know DP was complaining about the same problem, and that was after he got C3C am I right?

 

[embryodead]

Originally posted by Louis XXIV
Making it an option in the editor is probably very tricky. It is one thing to add some code disabling it in scenarios, it is different to make a flag in the editor with a patch. This requires a slight artwork change and removal of something probably hardcoded.

So??? City view was also hardcoded, but it was disabled. Checkbox is a standard component of VC++/whatever, there is no "artwork change".

 

[Dom Pedro II]

Yeah, computerdude, I hear what you're saying, and that works very well for scenarios, but I'm talking about a mod.

Basically, I've been working on a mod where each civilization (and in some cases geographic region) has its own technologies, specialists, improvements, units... in short, it's HUGE.

Of course, though, there has to be several techs that are common to everybody in order to get Worker Actions and Natural Resources like Saltpeter, Oil, etc. And there's no way to have this work unless you make a completely seperate tech tree that is common to everybody, and then have the alternate tech tree for each civ/civ group.

I mean, most of the civ-specific techs are what you might call cultural ones and only go up until the end of the Middle Ages, at which point, everybody's pretty much researching the same stuff. So it's not completely ludicrous to have a sort of "technology" tree that everybody can research and a "culture" tree that is unique, but still, I haven't been terribly satisfied with the results.

Oh well.

 

[pesoloco]

Originally posted by Louis XXIV
I'd stop looking at city view, but I would look at it in another scenario if I see a giant bronze possum instead of the Collossus.

If that were the case I would look at it, and I'd stare at it so long I'd forget about the rest of the game

Anyways, I didn't realize till I read all these posts that the palace view was also disabled.

 

[computerdude113]

Embryodead, yah, but that's the best thing we have as of now. Dom, yah, that's what we need! That would be great!
As for the Giant Golden Possum, we'll see what we can do...

 

[Louis XXIV]

Aren't you guys using the Dino units from PTW as well?

 

[computerdude113]

Yah...
We know how to do it legaly, don't worry.