Imperialistic

[iamdanthemansta]

I've become less and less enamoured with the Imperialistic trait. At first I thought great, a trait that gives you more GG, since you don't seem to have enough on Epic, and gives you faster Settlers, since the AI always seems to out expand me. But the more I play the less I've liked it. The Settler bonus only applies to hammers and I always seem to make most of my settlers with food, which is more plentiful early. Also the GG themselves have limited usefullness, and you still get a couple even without it, which is really all you need. This isn't Philisophical were you can really start to crank out GP.

 

[DigitalBoy]

Definitely. Before Warlords came out, I thought Imperialistic was going to be some broken, all-powerful trait (+50% settler production ), but it's actually pretty far down the list of my favorite traits now.

 

[iamdanthemansta]

Charismatic on the other hand is stunning. I'll bet dollars to dimes that it gets nuked in the next patch. The happyness bonus alone makes it a great trait, as does the XP bonus. It's like having a better version of both Expansive and Agressive in one trait.

 

[Randolph]

I think the settler bonus does apply to chops, which is quite nice, since copping settlers is so common. You can also get more out of it by re-prioritizing tile improvements, mine a plains hill instead of farming a floodplain (mined plains hill + imperialistic = 6hpt for a settler). The GG bonus is probably most useful for getting your first GG earlier. With it’s new level 5 requirement, you pretty much need a GG to qualify for the heroic epic, and imperialistic could mean getting that GG in your first war instead of your second (which might be significantly later).

I agree it’s not a great trait, but it is useful.

I’m also afraid that Charismatic is going to get a nerf, it does seem almost as powerful as aggressive and expansive combined.

 

[Eqqman]

I'll bet dollars to dimes that it gets nuked in the next patch.

Actually it's 'dollars to donuts'. Don't ask me why.

 

[Tennyson]

+50% settler production would have been just awesome...

...in CivIII. Given the cost of cities in CivIV I think a leader bonus that's only used four or five times to advantage is not so great (building settlers after the initial push isn't so hard).

 

[Mr. Civtastic]

I second pretty much everyone else. I think Imperialistic needs one more ability added to it...maybe some kind of money bonus for land captured or something. As it stands now, I think both existing qualities have diminishing returns. The settler thing definately helps in the early game, but only so much...after 5-6 cities your economy slows down. Then after that, its usually not hard to big settlers fast WITHOUT the 50%. Just add forges. The GG are helpful, but after a certain point when you have a big experienced army they arent nearly as valuable. And Ive personally found that if Im warring a lot I still get plenty of GGs.

There should be some kind of tech or money bonus with imperialism because as it stands the benefits are narrow. While we're at it, protective needs even more love.

 

[Goombaz]

I second pretty much everyone else. I think Imperialistic needs one more ability added to it...maybe some kind of money bonus for land captured or something. As it stands now, I think both existing qualities have diminishing returns. The settler thing definately helps in the early game, but only so much...after 5-6 cities your economy slows down. Then after that, its usually not hard to big settlers fast WITHOUT the 50%. Just add forges. The GG are helpful, but after a certain point when you have a big experienced army they arent nearly as valuable. And Ive personally found that if Im warring a lot I still get plenty of GGs.

There should be some kind of tech or money bonus with imperialism because as it stands the benefits are narrow. While we're at it, protective needs even more love.

I got a good one for you. How about if imperialistic made settlers become Pioneers. Pioneers could have a defense-only combat value of 2. There, problem solved, gets the purpose of the trait across correctly.

 

[yavoon]

imperialist should reduce revolt time to 1 turn. but 3 separate abilities is kinda a lot.

 

[Eqqman]

imperialist should reduce revolt time to 1 turn.

Then the perpetual Anarchy gimmick they patched away would be back.

 

[yavoon]

Then the perpetual Anarchy gimmick they patched away would be back.

I meant for captured cities.

 

[catchsomezzz]

I think the Imperialist trait is fine the way it is. Not everything needs to be uber-powerful, game-breaking. As it is, I think it's fairly powerful if you play to its strength.

In my current game, I'm playing as Persia (18 civs, huge map).... the fast settler productions allow me to grab land quickly to block off the AI. I was also fortunate to beat the AI to the Great Wall, to get my only Ancient Age Wonder. The game is now in the Industrial Age and I've already generated 8 Great Generals!

I added them all to my best production city -- which, combined with Barracks (3XP), Stables (2XP), Vassalage & Theocracy (2XP each), West Point (4XP), Pentagon (2XP), I'm producing level 6 Infantry (29 XP) & Calvary (31XP) units every other turn! (Persia also has the Charismatic trait)... This game is about to end with a Persian domination/conquest.

Any leader's traits can be powerful if you play to their strengths from the beginning.

 

[iamdanthemansta]

I think catchsomezzz may be right. Imperialistic can be very good when combined with Carasmatic, Cyrus anyone, since the GG experance bonus stacks with the Carasmatic ability. Though to be fair I think I've had 17 standard drinks so far today.

 

[snipafist]

Imperialistic is fine, I think. Great Generals are pretty darn good, and I don't think I'd ever be disappointed by getting more of them (settle a couple in your heroic epic and iron works cities and just tell me that isn't game-altering). They're good for adding as great instructors, and great for leading armies (having one unit that's either a super-medic or guaranteed to win is quite useful in war).

The settler bonus isn't quite so important, but supposing you maximize production around your first couple cities, it works out quite well. With just food, it's obviously not quite so good (although I bet they patch it to give the bonus to food production).

Considering that a good half of my armed forces (usually the attacking element of my army as well), comes from my Heroic Epic+West Point city, settling a great instructor in there effectively gives all your units that matter (aka will be attacking rather than garrisoning or providing support) +2XP for each great instructor. Effectively, this trait either augments more agressive traits (like agressive or charismatic), or allows a builder-ish civ (like the romans, for example) to host a compotent and capable military. Sure, other people get GGs too, but you'll be getting about 50% more, which can really add up. Overall, I am not disappointed. I don't think it's an absolute power trait, but it's darn handy.

 

[apopholeus813]

I think you're missing +100% GG emergance. Huge if you plan to be an early warmonger. Plop on or two +25 military production, specialize the rest of you're economy and finish the game if you like or call it a win and move on.

 

[futurehermit]

great generals are pretty awesome, but overall i feel like imperialistic isn't that great.

charismatic indeed is a rockin, rockin trait. 2 early happiness? HUGE!

 

[PeteJ]

Personally I think Imperialistic is a great trait. It is best when you are close to enemies and you need a settler ASAP to snag a key spot before your opponent does. It stinks that the settler bonus only applies to hammers, but chop-rushing settlers is extremely powerful.

 

[Naastriil]

I Play with Victoria. Imperialistic and Financial. When you have the Financial part then the imperialistic trait acually works.

I tried Cengiz Khan and Catherine but I went broke after my 10th city but with Victoria the + commerce bonus really pushes your Civ and you can continue to advance as you expand. Cottages and Specialists also help.

 

[ese-aSH]

settler bonus should be +100%. the only use to me is the ability to build a settler at start if you manage to settle on a plain hill.
ths +100% GG is great too, but only means you will have your first GG earlier and that you'll get 2 or 3 more GG during the whole game, not so powerfull.

 

[lobster]

The settler production bonus should apply to food as well. Or just make them cost 33% less.