Improved Mesoamerican Conquest

[Polietileno]

@RedAlert:

If you wanna make civ-specific wonder, there plenty off sites and constructions in the Andes. I can provide with information about the civilization, pictures and those things. But, let me do it tomorrow.

@Sword of Geddon:

I agree with the Mapuche. Actually their historical center was arround the northen-central part of Chile, and they were push down first by the tiahuanacu, and later by the incas, moving to the location that Almagro found.

 

[Sword_Of_Geddon]

The Incas are one of my favorite civilizations, so I try to learn as much about them as possible The Maphuche are very interesting as well since they managed to hold out so long against the evil imperialists. The news that they are more northern than I thought is great...

Did the Incas have any giant pyramids like the Mayan El-Castillo?

 

[RedAlert]

In light of the news about the Mapuche being from a northern location, I am considering replacing the Moche with them. There are a few conditions to this, though, ranked most important to least:

- Were the Mapuche of the same culture as the people of Peru? Would they fit in with the rest of the civs in the mod? (I do not know much about the Mapuche)

- Even though they come from farther north, will adding the Mapuche still make the map an inconvenient size? (as I still need to give the Mapuche reasonable room to expand, and this may be difficult since they will be cornered at the bottom of the map...)

- Will the Moche be worth giving up? (On this I have decided yes, as their start location is very close to the Chimor, also the Moche and Chimor to my knowledge shared similar cultures and did co-exist)

The first question/condition I have had insufficient information to answer myself, could anybody tell me? The second question/condition I will figure out myself when I start drafting the map.

 

[Sword_Of_Geddon]

The Maphuche lands to my knowledge, extended all the way to the southern border of the Incan empire.

 

[RedAlert]

I've been drafting out possible map sizes and I have come up with one with a width of 120 tiles and a height of 252 tiles. This includes room for the mapuche, if, like you say, they would be located at the bottom of the Incan empire.

 

[The Last Conformist]

That's a big map? How much of it will be sea or otherwise unsettlable?

 

[RedAlert]

I mis-calculated. The map will probably have a width of 126 and a height of 240. Yes, it is rather large, but a significant part of that will be uninhabitable.

I have a picture below to illustrate what the map will look like. Areas in dark green will be the initial boundaries in which the civs must stay. Later, they may expand into the light green. The brown is uninhabitable, and the light blue areas indicate where the civs will start.

 

[Polietileno]

Originaly the Mapuche were from Northen Chile, and the were push down by the incas during the expansion of the Coyasullo province during the period of Tupac Yupanqui (right after Pachakuti)
And the Moche started far northen than that. The Chimu started around the actual City of Trujillo, and the Moche around thew Moche valley, that is 20 km south of Chiclayo.

And The Moches can use a female LH. Is a fact that they had a cast leadership compose of female priest that conduct religios and aministrative matter in diferents valleys.

 

[Sword_Of_Geddon]

is this mod still on?

 

[Traianus]

I hope so. There are three mesoamericam mods out there now and each one with a different focus. We can all help each other out with many things.

 

[RedAlert]

This mod is still on, for sure. Unfortunately, for a while I was unable to work on it, or anything else for that matter.

As for the three Mesoamerican mods/modders helping each other out, I think it's a great idea. I'm already planning to use The Last Conformist's Obsidian and Jade resources, and also your mesoamerican ruins and diplo interface, Traianus. Plus, I will be doing those single era aztec cities soon.

What I am working on right now is the tech trees for the later two ages. I already have all the techs figured out, I am just lacking the 'tree' part at the moment.
My final decision for civs will be to include all the ones I originally mentioned, but replacing the Nazca with the Mapuche, and keeping the Moche, with a female leaderhead. (R8XFT is making a female mesoamerican leaderhead at the moment).

 

[Sword_Of_Geddon]

Man Red...I thought you dissapeared again, this time for good. Any way I can I-m you to keep in touch? I like you enough to ask you that.

 

[RedAlert]

I try not to disappear too often , but sometimes I just need a break from things. (Although this last time it wasn't by choice - I was ill for quite a while, and so unable to work on much.)

All the techs have now been treed, which means I can start thinking about the units. I'm going to wait until later to start plugging everything into the game, first I'm going to decide everything on paper. The map will probably be one of the last things I do.

Anyway, here are the tech trees for the two later ages. Again, a few notes:

- The coloured dots beside the techs denote which group of civs that tech is available to. Red for andean civs, green for central american civs, and blue for everybody.

- The techs 'postclassic era', 'middle horizon', 'Cortes's Expedition', and Pizarro's expedition' allow nothing besides access to the next era. They have no other significance.

 

[Sword_Of_Geddon]

I am loving this more and more the more you show your ideas on it off here Red.

But seriously, is there any way I can contact you?

 

[RedAlert]

Thank you There are still lots more ideas to come as well.....

oh, and check your pm's

 

[Sword_Of_Geddon]

just did.

I hope my new cities I made for Trianus work for your mod btw. It seems all existing Mesoamerican city graphics(minus my El-dorado of coarse), depict RUINS of all things. The cities I made more accurately reflect a true Aztec(or Mayan) city.

 

[Takhisis]

In light of the news about the Mapuche being from a northern location, I am considering replacing the Moche with them. There are a few conditions to this, though, ranked most important to least:

- Were the Mapuche of the same culture as the people of Peru? Would they fit in with the rest of the civs in the mod? (I do not know much about the Mapuche)

- Even though they come from farther north, will adding the Mapuche still make the map an inconvenient size? (as I still need to give the Mapuche reasonable room to expand, and this may be difficult since they will be cornered at the bottom of the map...)

- Will the Moche be worth giving up? (On this I have decided yes, as their start location is very close to the Chimor, also the Moche and Chimor to my knowledge shared similar cultures and did co-exist)

The first question/condition I have had insufficient information to answer myself, could anybody tell me? The second question/condition I will figure out myself when I start drafting the map.

Really, having been born in Argentina, I´ve really come across much about Mapuches, but I should say that they migrated from the north, established themselves in Chile (the non-Incan part), then they waged war against the Tehuelches and Pampas in Patagonia, and nowadays they live in Southern Chile and in Patagonia. The Chilean and Argentinian governments (I shouldn´t call it Argentinian, it was only the Buenos Aires government, the regional warlords and the like were fighting for autonomy against the tiranny) split the spoils of their wars with the Mapuche and so we have come to the present situation.

 

[RedAlert]

Here is the result of today's work:

I have fleshed out the unit lines for the central american civs (Aztecs, Mayans, Olmecs, Tarascans, Teotihuacan, Toltecs, and Zapotecs). Not included are any worker/settler units, which I will post later seperately (there are several types).

As always, there are a few things to note:

- guide to unit pics:

Unit name
(Technology required)
Attack-Defense-Movement(Bombard), hit points
*Available exclusively to

- I haven't included resources, as I do not know yet all the resources that will be in, although I have an idea.
- I haven't included unit costs, as I have no idea what a good way to figure out unit costs would be! Help please?
- Atlatlman has been left as '?' because I do not know what it will look like/what graphics I will use for it, and so cannot determine it's stats.
- I used my own specialized system for figuring out unit stats, so it may not be balanced, although I find that completely o.k.

Other than that, any suggestions on changes or additions are welcome.

 

[utahjazz7]

You might not have much choice, but I'd recommend staying away from the AOK units. I just personally don't like them. Other than that, this scenerio looks pretty good.

 

[Takhisis]

Macehualli were aztec peasants , the base of the society, who didn´t fight, so they would be better off as Aztec workers.