Is Planetary Occupation Possible?

Commodore

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Well is it? If a planet were to be invaded could it be successfully occupied? I would say it could be possible but would cost so much (both in resources and manpower) that it would not be very practical or profitable unless the entire native population were exterminated first. I mean, just look at how many men are needed to secure a small area of a planet like Iraq. Now, if we were to extrapolate that number to an entire planet, the numbers needed to occupy are just simply too large for any force to deploy.

Basically, the point of this thread is to discuss the practicality of the interstellar wars seen in various sci-fi movies, specifically the Clone Wars of the prequel triliogy of Star Wars.
 
I don't know, one country may not be able to occupy an entire planet... but what if the entire planet (Earth) tried it? I'm sure we'd have enough troops that way. I would imagine "successful" occupation to be fairly brutal though, "crush anyone who resists!".
 
With sufficently large empires, and thus sufficienly large armies, any campaign is possible. Star Wars takes place across an entire Galaxy, that's hundreds of millions of stars! In a conflict of that scale, fighting over a handfull of planets is like trying to Occypy a nation the size of, say, Switzerland. Also, though we never get to see it on screen, the Novel versions of the films reveal that worlds were frequently bombed into a pulp as the war went on.
 
This is much to broad a question to have a coherant answer. Who is the attacker? Who is the defender? What are their technical capabilities? What are the motivations behind each side? What is the planet like? You'd have to answer these questions before you could begin to realisticly look at what is possible or not.
 
Assuming we're talking about a planet of roughly equal size and population as Earth:

If you had more advanced technology, military doctrine aimed at countering a world-wide insurgency, complete political support back home, and a couple hundred millions combat troops, then sure.
 
Perfection, that's true. But has that ever stopped us before? :crazyeye:

I would imagine the invaded planet loses substantial numbers because of unknown Earth diseases. Or we would. whatever.
 
Depends on the nature of the alien, if it's means of conquest is simply to anihilate a planet and then to occupy rape it's resources and move on like insects, then easilly possible but would require a large base of conquerable worlds or a way to become sustainable given enough fodder. To hold and to control a planets populace, now that is much more difficult, in space empires just as in land empires it's incredibly complicated, but that's not to say an alien might have more luck than us.

Imagine if an alien could alter the genetic structure of all sentient life on a planet, by mutating it to be something simillar to it's own form by using mutagens that would totally infect the whole ecosystem of a planet, also with this comes an understanding that to really grow it must take the best parts of a race but control the beings, ruthlessly supplanting individual will but keeping traits that help it to grow: in essence, you become the alien and somewhat keep the traits that benefit your masters. It would be easy to control a race if you had mutated them into a form where they were alien enough to obey completely.

Without such unimaginably alien means though they would have little more success than the empires of Earth and constant war would mean an ascendence of one race over another throughout history much as it is on Earth.

Another means is through a host system or a mutual symbiosis, but this would take free will of the people you are controlling, in a large stretch of races, it would become easy to overthrow such a race if you were technologically simillar, as they relly too much on a host.

Another way is to form a loose confederation of like minded worlds into an Empire, as far as Earth goes this is the most likely to be successful in the long term, but it does need some serious diplomacy skills and again it may well lead to overthrow and constant changing of figureheads.

Of course if your alien had powers of the mind that far exceeded human abilities it may well use these to control it, but this would be difficult to maintain unless the race had some sort of hive mind, like the Borg.

I can only see complete anihilation of a species as viable for conquest in the long term. Slaves rebel.

Perfection said:
This is much to broad a question to have a coherant answer. Who is the attacker? Who is the defender? What are their technical capabilities? What are the motivations behind each side? What is the planet like? You'd have to answer these questions before you could begin to realisticly look at what is possible or not.

Use your imagination I guess?
 
Yuri2356 said:
With sufficently large empires, and thus sufficienly large armies, any campaign is possible. Star Wars takes place across an entire Galaxy, that's hundreds of millions of stars! In a conflict of that scale, fighting over a handfull of planets is like trying to Occypy a nation the size of, say, Switzerland. Also, though we never get to see it on screen, the Novel versions of the films reveal that worlds were frequently bombed into a pulp as the war went on.

My impression of the Clone Wars was that it spanned the entire galaxy, not just a handful of planets. If I recall, the CIS was described as being comprised of thousands of star systems.

Yeah, but one thing that they never really explained is how insurgencies were dealt with. It would seem to me that you would spend so much just trying to occupy the planets, that any offensive campaigns would come grinding to a halt. It also seems that the only practical solution to avoid insurgency, would be complete extermination of a planets population (ala GalCiv2).
 
QuoVadisNation said:
Perfection, that's true. But has that ever stopped us before? :crazyeye:
Well, I'm trying to narrow it down into more imaginable systems, because there's a very large amount of possilbities.
 
I'd say that once we have robot armies as a forefront of our armed forces (Within 20 years), we can stand a chance of holding a planet.

Even controlling the moon can be a smart thing: Block the moonlight that shines upon your enemy's nations! By doing that, you effectively cripple the country at night, AND they cannot hold you responsible because the Moon is outside International Jurisdiction. Space Combat will be more important than Earth combat for sure.

If there is no need for continual supplies, I'm sure that another planet could be held.
 
Perfection said:
This is much to broad a question to have a coherant answer. Who is the attacker? Who is the defender? What are their technical capabilities? What are the motivations behind each side? What is the planet like? You'd have to answer these questions before you could begin to realisticly look at what is possible or not.

We will say both the attacker and defender are similar to humans in how they fight wars and behave. Both have equal technology, but the defender's military has already been defeated and now an insurgency has risen. The attackers have complete control of orbital space and the skies and the planet has roughly the same population density as Earth.

EDIT: The attacker is also waging an ongoing war with the rest of the defender's empire in other parts of the galaxy.
 
That depends entirely on the resources available to the occupier. If you are running an interstellar empire such as seen in Star Wars, then planetary occupation would be a trivial expense.

On the other hand, there are planetary occupations such as recently seen in Battlestar Galactica. In that case,
Spoiler :
...humans numbered a bit over 40,000 and were huddled in a single "city" made mostly of tents and parked starships. For a military capable of wiping out twelve planets in a matter of hours, occupying such a planet would also be trivial.
 
Commodore said:
We will say both the attacker and defender are similar to humans in how they fight wars and behave. Both have equal technology, but the defender's military has already been defeated and now an insurgency has risen. The attackers have complete control of orbital space and the skies and the planet has roughly the same population density as Earth.
Where's the nearest planet of the attacker? How much troops do they have there? What sort of control do they currently have on planetary affairs?
 
Perfection said:
Where's the nearest planet of the attacker? How much troops do they have there? What sort of control do they currently have on planetary affairs?

Nearest planet is far enough away to make logistics a small problem, but it is being managed with success. They brought enough to defeat the planet's garrison and establish basic control, so I would estimate about 500 million to 1 billion soldiers. They have been able to set up a provisional government and control most major cities, but it is a tenuous control.
 
Commodore said:
Nearest planet is far enough away to make logistics a small problem, but it is being managed with success. They brought enough to defeat the planet's garrison and establish basic control, so I would estimate about 500 million to 1 billion soldiers. They have been able to set up a provisional government and control most major cities, but it is a tenuous control.
It's probably possible provided they don't act like totall jerks to the native populace.
 
Perfection said:
Should we unrealistically assume FTL travel is possible in this thread?

Yes, I don't think interstellar wars would even be possible unless you could get to the enemy's planet in a reasonable amount of time.
 
Of course it's possible (planetary occupation). It would be purely ridiculous to assume that an interstellar empire couldn't devote the raw material to occupying a single planet, or even countless hundreds of planets.
 
Commodore said:
Yes, I don't think interstellar wars would even be possible unless you could get to the enemy's planet in a reasonable amount of time.
Surely, it's possible, just more bizzare. I'd imagine an intersteller war wouldn't be faught between two creatures like humans, but rather two different types of nanotechnological life forms. I wouldn't dare speculate what sort of tactics could be used there.
 
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