Is there a custom Israeli Empire?

[devilhunterred]

Is there? I am so desperate to have one for my game so I can play as Egypt, Persia or some custom Middle Eastern empires and crush the nation with tanks and rockets. Sign cease fire, give back Israel all its conquered cities, just so I can crush them all over again after 10 turns.

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[Dumanios]

There are a ton of Israelite Empires,Just check the civ 4 new civ area or check mods because most have Israel in 'em.

 

[Napoleon4444]

Is there? I am so desperate to have one for my game so I can play as Egypt, Persia or some custom Middle Eastern empires and crush the nation with tanks and rockets. Sign cease fire, give back Israel all its conquered cities, just so I can crush them all over again after 10 turns.

I think I know what you're getting at and I think you need to look at the facts...

In the last year Israel and Hamas have had a "cease fire" with each other however during that one year of "peace" Hamas fired 3,000 missiles into Israel! Israel repetadly warned Hamas that if they continued to fire missiles into Israel that they would retaliate TO PROTECT THEMSELVES!

If you were playing Civ 4 would you tolerate terrorists blowing up your cities, killing your civilians and breaking cease fires? No you wouldn't. Israel is not the aggressor, Hamas is and before you go on saying that Israel is attacking civilians please note that Israel drops warning pamphlets before they bomb and area.

 

[MosheLevi]

I think I know what you're getting at and I think you need to look at the facts...

In the last year Israel and Hamas have had a "cease fire" with each other however during that one year of "peace" Hamas fired 3,000 missiles into Israel! Israel repetadly warned Hamas that if they continued to fire missiles into Israel that they would retaliate TO PROTECT THEMSELVES!

If you were playing Civ 4 would you tolerate terrorists blowing up your cities, killing your civilians and breaking cease fires? No you wouldn't. Israel is not the aggressor, Hamas is and before you go on saying that Israel is attacking civilians please note that Israel drops warning pamphlets before they bomb and area.

Very true.

The US would have retaliated much stronger.

One more fact that many don’t know – Hamas is placing weapons and rockets inside their schools.
Why? Because they know Israel won’t bomb these schools….
They therefore put Israel in a very tough situation.
All those weapons are placed in civilian areas in order to force Israel to kill civilians.

There were also many cases where Israel warned the civilians and asked them to evacuate a certain area.
Yet, Hamas prevented these civilians from leaving the area in order to force Israel to inflict civilian casualties.

These are commons tactic implemented by Hamas – they sacrifice their own civilians in order to make Israel look bad, and the world falls for it.

 

[Joecoolyo]

Very true.

The US would have retaliated much stronger.

One more fact that many don’t know – Hamas is placing weapons and rockets inside their schools.
Why? Because they know Israel won’t bomb these schools….
They therefore put Israel in a very tough situation.
All those weapons are placed in civilian areas in order to force Israel to kill civilians.

There were also many cases where Israel warned the civilians and asked them to evacuate a certain area.
Yet, Hamas prevented these civilians from leaving the area in order to force Israel to inflict civilian casualties.

These are commons tactic implemented by Hamas – they sacrifice their own civilians in order to make Israel look bad, and the world falls for it.

You left out that they hide weapons in Mosques, Apartments, etc. Hamas also use civilians as human shields.... the thing is though, Israel is trying to make sure that there are no civilian deaths, from dropping pamphlets in the cities their going to bomb to talking on radio and TV saying not to listen to the Hamas and don't volunteer as a human shield. Its a very tough situation and I beleive Israel responded in the only way sensible... to take out the weapons threatening the peace in the region.

 

[Napoleon4444]

You left out that they hide weapons in Mosques, Apartments, etc. Hamas also use civilians as human shields.... the thing is though, Israel is trying to make sure that there are no civilian deaths, from dropping pamphlets in the cities their going to bomb to talking on radio and TV saying not to listen to the Hamas and don't volunteer as a human shield. Its a very tough situation and I beleive Israel responded in the only way sensible... to take out the weapons threatening the peace in the region.

Very true, very true.

 

[Darvon]

Blah blah blah melodrama

Ottoman Empire.

Next question?

 

[devilhunterred]

Here're the facts:

- In 1948 Britain proposed the creation of Jewish state of Israel within the borders of Palestine, despite the fact that the population living in the region were 95% Arab

- Before the 1948 British proposal of Israel. Several Jewish zionist extremist groups such as the Lehi, Irgun and Hanagah, carried out assasinations, bomb attacks, and various other acts of terrorism against the British and Arabs. Their intention was to evict the British authority out of Palestine through terror, thus allowing the creation of Israel.

Lehi, Irgun and Hanagah were all universally recognized as dangerous extremist terrorist groups. Today, Lehi founders and members are remembered and honored as Israeli national heroes

- Palestine has been land and homes to the Palestinian arabs for approximately 1,700 years since the Jewish Diaspora in 70 C.E

- Since the UN agreement of the Israeli borders in 1949, Israel has expanded its territory illegitimately by as much as 40% through several military campaigns in Palestine

- Today, there are approximately 7 million registered and unregistered Palestinian refugees living in refugee camps scattered around in the remanants of former Palestine: Gaza strip, West Bank, Golan Heights, and neighbouring states such as Syria and Lebanon. Of those, 850,000 Palestinian refugees are created by what UN recognized as ethnic cleansing by the Israeli forces.

More than 63% of these 7 million refugees have no running electricity, running water, housing or education. Their only source of food is supplied regularily by UN and various other humantarian groups

- (Taken from the UN website): [A study on the demography of Israel] shows that 78% of Israelis are living in 14 percent of Israel and that the remaining 86% of the land in Israel is mostly land that belongs to the refugees on which 22% of the Israelis live. 20% [of the Israeli population] lives in city centers, which are mostly Palestinian such as, Beer Al Saba', Ashdod, Majdal, Asqalan, Nazareth, Haifa, Acre, Tiberias and Safad. As for the remaining 20%, they live in Kibbutzes and Moshavs.

- (Taken from Amnesty International): More than 2650 Palestinian houses have been destroyed since 1987 by Israel in the West Bank, including east Jerusalem, on the pretext of not having building permission. Further thousands of acres owned by Palestinians have been confiscated to build settlements in the occupied territories in contraventions to the 4th Geneva convention Article 49 stating that the "Occupying Power shall not transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies."



Thank you very much guys, but I have studied the middle east conflict for the entire semister for my undergrad history course and I don't need anymore facts.



As for the current rocket attacks in Gaza, I recommend you read this:


(Taken from the Canadian Justice and Peace in the Middle East website): Since 2001, Palestinian militants have been launching small rockets – typically referred to as “Qassam Rockets” – from Gaza toward nearby Israeli population centers, notably Sderot and Ashkelon.

As of April 27, 2008, a total of 13 Israelis have been killed by Qassam rockets since the attacks started in 2001.1 As indicated in the graphs at the right, for every Israeli killed by Qassam rockets, Israel has killed about 100 Palestinians through various means.

For the full report, http://www.cjpme.ca/documents/35 En Qassam Rocket Attacks v.1.pdf

 

[Roller123]

lol.

"I have studied the middle east conflict for the entire semister, I don't need anymore facts"

Sig worthy.

 

[Gral]

Hm . . . this is not a place to discuss these things. I have my opinion about war in Gaza, but I will keep it for myself.

I don't know about you, but I survived one war and I know that every side has it own version of truth. And I know that the truth cannot be hidden - it is obvious, but some people are dening it.

I think these kind of discussions should be banned at this forum.

Best regards for all "experts" for international conflicts.

 

[Roller123]

Tbh its pretty hard to see a palestinian side of truth in this particular case. Second Somalia in miniature. Noone wants this mess. Whats worse noone wants the mess to go away. Israel got the arse card here. Sad.

 

[Joecoolyo]

Here're the facts:

- In 1948 Britain proposed the creation of Jewish state of Israel within the borders of Palestine, despite the fact that the population living in the region were 95% Arab

- Before the 1948 British proposal of Israel. Several Jewish zionist extremist groups such as the Lehi, Irgun and Hanagah, carried out assasinations, bomb attacks, and various other acts of terrorism against the British and Arabs. Their intention was to evict the British authority out of Palestine through terror, thus allowing the creation of Israel.

Lehi, Irgun and Hanagah were all universally recognized as dangerous extremist terrorist groups. Today, Lehi founders and members are remembered and honored as Israeli national heroes

- Palestine has been land and homes to the Palestinian arabs for approximately 1,700 years since the Jewish Diaspora in 70 C.E

- Since the UN agreement of the Israeli borders in 1949, Israel has expanded its territory illegitimately by as much as 40% through several military campaigns in Palestine

- Today, there are approximately 7 million registered and unregistered Palestinian refugees living in refugee camps scattered around in the remanants of former Palestine: Gaza strip, West Bank, Golan Heights, and neighbouring states such as Syria and Lebanon. Of those, 850,000 Palestinian refugees are created by what UN recognized as ethnic cleansing by the Israeli forces.

More than 63% of these 7 million refugees have no running electricity, running water, housing or education. Their only source of food is supplied regularily by UN and various other humantarian groups

- (Taken from the UN website): [A study on the demography of Israel] shows that 78% of Israelis are living in 14 percent of Israel and that the remaining 86% of the land in Israel is mostly land that belongs to the refugees on which 22% of the Israelis live. 20% [of the Israeli population] lives in city centers, which are mostly Palestinian such as, Beer Al Saba', Ashdod, Majdal, Asqalan, Nazareth, Haifa, Acre, Tiberias and Safad. As for the remaining 20%, they live in Kibbutzes and Moshavs.

- (Taken from Amnesty International): More than 2650 Palestinian houses have been destroyed since 1987 by Israel in the West Bank, including east Jerusalem, on the pretext of not having building permission. Further thousands of acres owned by Palestinians have been confiscated to build settlements in the occupied territories in contraventions to the 4th Geneva convention Article 49 stating that the "Occupying Power shall not transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies."



Thank you very much guys, but I have studied the middle east conflict for the entire semister for my undergrad history course and I don't need anymore facts.



As for the current rocket attacks in Gaza, I recommend you read this:


(Taken from the Canadian Justice and Peace in the Middle East website): Since 2001, Palestinian militants have been launching small rockets – typically referred to as “Qassam Rockets” – from Gaza toward nearby Israeli population centers, notably Sderot and Ashkelon.

As of April 27, 2008, a total of 13 Israelis have been killed by Qassam rockets since the attacks started in 2001.1 As indicated in the graphs at the right, for every Israeli killed by Qassam rockets, Israel has killed about 100 Palestinians through various means.

For the full report, http://www.cjpme.ca/documents/35 En Qassam Rocket Attacks v.1.pdf

Heres some facts that even you, an "expert" might not know:

- After 6 Million of my People were killed, the British and the world felt like we needed a homeland, so why not propose the one that we were promised? So they gave us half he city of Jerusalem and a couple small scattered spots all over Israel. But of course, the Arabs didn't like that we got half a city to ourselves, so the Palestinians declared war on us, and we expanded to our current borders.

- The land of Palestine has been throne around from empire to empire for the last 1,000 years, from the Romans, to the Arabs, to the Crusaders, to the Ottomans

-Since 2007, over 4681 Rockets and Mortars have hit Israel from Gaza by the Hamas... 8706 have hit since 2000, the only reason that Israel has had so little deaths is because of how protective the government is. By law every Apartment building in Israel is required to have a safe-room which can withstand a rocket attack, radiation, and chemicals.

- Israel is protecting our only homeland, and it saddens me that people still can't just let us go, the Palestinians have their land, we have ours, but the terrorists can't let it go and just have to stop us. And the only way to protect ourselves and the country is to stop the terrorists. The civilian deaths have been because of the Hamas. Anyways Palestinians and Israelis have agreed to the current borders for years, its just the terrorists that keep pushing the wars. We have one homeland, one homeland. And we need to protect it, and if force is needed than force will be used for protection of the Israeli Citizens, may it be a Palestinian, an Arab, a Jew, a Christian, its Israel's duty to protect them if they live in Israel.

I have to agree with Gral, this isn't a political discussion forum, its a forum for discussing civ, go troll some where else where the topic seems a little more appropriate.

 

[Napoleon4444]

Here're the facts:

- In 1948 Britain proposed the creation of Jewish state of Israel within the borders of Palestine, despite the fact that the population living in the region were 95% Arab

- Before the 1948 British proposal of Israel. Several Jewish zionist extremist groups such as the Lehi, Irgun and Hanagah, carried out assasinations, bomb attacks, and various other acts of terrorism against the British and Arabs. Their intention was to evict the British authority out of Palestine through terror, thus allowing the creation of Israel.

Lehi, Irgun and Hanagah were all universally recognized as dangerous extremist terrorist groups. Today, Lehi founders and members are remembered and honored as Israeli national heroes

- Palestine has been land and homes to the Palestinian arabs for approximately 1,700 years since the Jewish Diaspora in 70 C.E

- Since the UN agreement of the Israeli borders in 1949, Israel has expanded its territory illegitimately by as much as 40% through several military campaigns in Palestine

- Today, there are approximately 7 million registered and unregistered Palestinian refugees living in refugee camps scattered around in the remanants of former Palestine: Gaza strip, West Bank, Golan Heights, and neighbouring states such as Syria and Lebanon. Of those, 850,000 Palestinian refugees are created by what UN recognized as ethnic cleansing by the Israeli forces.

More than 63% of these 7 million refugees have no running electricity, running water, housing or education. Their only source of food is supplied regularily by UN and various other humantarian groups

- (Taken from the UN website): [A study on the demography of Israel] shows that 78% of Israelis are living in 14 percent of Israel and that the remaining 86% of the land in Israel is mostly land that belongs to the refugees on which 22% of the Israelis live. 20% [of the Israeli population] lives in city centers, which are mostly Palestinian such as, Beer Al Saba', Ashdod, Majdal, Asqalan, Nazareth, Haifa, Acre, Tiberias and Safad. As for the remaining 20%, they live in Kibbutzes and Moshavs.

- (Taken from Amnesty International): More than 2650 Palestinian houses have been destroyed since 1987 by Israel in the West Bank, including east Jerusalem, on the pretext of not having building permission. Further thousands of acres owned by Palestinians have been confiscated to build settlements in the occupied territories in contraventions to the 4th Geneva convention Article 49 stating that the "Occupying Power shall not transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies."



Thank you very much guys, but I have studied the middle east conflict for the entire semister for my undergrad history course and I don't need anymore facts.



As for the current rocket attacks in Gaza, I recommend you read this:


(Taken from the Canadian Justice and Peace in the Middle East website): Since 2001, Palestinian militants have been launching small rockets – typically referred to as “Qassam Rockets” – from Gaza toward nearby Israeli population centers, notably Sderot and Ashkelon.

As of April 27, 2008, a total of 13 Israelis have been killed by Qassam rockets since the attacks started in 2001.1 As indicated in the graphs at the right, for every Israeli killed by Qassam rockets, Israel has killed about 100 Palestinians through various means.

For the full report, http://www.cjpme.ca/documents/35 En Qassam Rocket Attacks v.1.pdf

Ya but Israel isn't trying to kill civilians like the Palestinian government is. Like I said before Israel WARNS civilians BEFORE they bomb an area!

Furthermore even you should know that Israel has illegally expanded, Israel didn't declare war on anyone. The Palestinians and other Arab states did though and Israel won that land fair and square! Blame the Palestinians for that.

And actually former Palestine was supposed to be split in two, an Jewish state and a Palestinian one it's just that the Palestinians wouldn't share even though the half of the land they would have given away was already occupied by many Israelis.

Excuse me for saying this but is there any uniqueness of Palestine to the arabs? Besides the temple of mount or whatever it's just land. The Arabs in Palestine already have homelands and they occupy most of the middle east they can go live there. But for Israelis this is their ONE homeland and ONE chance.

You clearly studied with such a huge initaial bias you leaned nothing.

 

[PieceOfMind]

lol.

"I have studied the middle east conflict for the entire semister, I don't need anymore facts"

Sig worthy.

Agreed. This thread is bait. Anyone who reads the above quotation should know why.

 

[devilhunterred]

After 6 Million of my People were killed, the British and the world felt like we needed a homeland, so why not propose the one that we were promised? So they gave us half he city of Jerusalem and a couple small scattered spots all over Israel. But of course, the Arabs didn't like that we got half a city to ourselves, so the Palestinians declared war on us, and we expanded to our current borders.

You speak with rational hindsight. Given the Palestinian perspective, I'd imagined your reaction wouldn't be so disimilar to the Arabs' if overnight the land and home your family and your ancesetors have been living on for 1700 years are suddenly given to an ethnic minority in the region.

Just because your race was systematically exterminated by the Nazis doesn't give you a God given right to establish a homeland in Palestine in which millions of Arabs have already lived for more than seventeen centuries. More than 500000 Gypsies were also murdered by the Nazis, yet they weren't bestowed with the homeland of Roma.

Since 2007, over 4681 Rockets and Mortars have hit Israel from Gaza by the Hamas... 8706 have hit since 2000, the only reason that Israel has had so little deaths is because of how protective the government is. By law every Apartment building in Israel is required to have a safe-room which can withstand a rocket attack, radiation, and chemicals.

The main reason why there have been so few Israeli casualities involving with the Quassam is because of how inefficient and inaccurate they are. Quassam are homemade rockets build in backyards, they are no more sophisticated than the water pressure rockets 4th graders build in their elementary schools. They completely lack guidance system and has less accuratcy than an arrow in a hurricane. If Hamas has the ability to build Tomahawks, having a safe-room wouldn't save you at all since you wouldn't have time to react anyhow.

The Israeli military responce to the so-called Hamas rockets "threat" is so blown out of proportion it's not even funny. It's the identical scenario where a 4th grader shoots me with a water pistol, and I take out my .357 magum and shoots him in the hands.

Israel is protecting our only homeland, and it saddens me that people still can't just let us go, the Palestinians have their land, we have ours, but the terrorists can't let it go and just have to stop us. And the only way to protect ourselves and the country is to stop the terrorists. The civilian deaths have been because of the Hamas. Anyways Palestinians and Israelis have agreed to the current borders for years, its just the terrorists that keep pushing the wars. We have one homeland, one homeland. And we need to protect it, and if force is needed than force will be used for protection of the Israeli Citizens, may it be a Palestinian, an Arab, a Jew, a Christian, its Israel's duty to protect them if they live in Israel.

Right, but you fail to mention that your "homeland" was in fact taken unwillingly from a people who have been living there for more than 1700 years before your arrival in 45.

Yes, the State of Palestinians have already agreed to the current borders. But they aren't the ones possessing Abrahams tanks, Phantom jets and an unknown arsenal of nuclear warheads since Israel has rejected all UN WMD inspections since 2000.

 

[devilhunterred]

Ya but Israel isn't trying to kill civilians like the Palestinian government is. Like I said before Israel WARNS civilians BEFORE they bomb an area!

Hmmm, correct me if I'm wrong, but I turned on my TV to BBC today and it's the news of IDF bombing UN school and UN headquarters in Gaza that I see, not Hamas.

Furthermore even you should know that Israel has illegally expanded, Israel didn't declare war on anyone. Blame the Palestinians for that.

My memories can be rusty, correct me if I'm wrong. October 29th, 1956, Israeli declared war and invaded Eygpt via th Sinai desert, eventually took Gaza and Sinai from Egypt sometime between June 5th-10th, as well as West Bank from Jordon and Golan Heights from Syria.

I think it was also June 7th, a day after my cousin's birthday, in 1981 that Israeli attackd Iraq in a surprise raid.

After a year in 1982, June 6th, Israel invaded Lebanon and had its infamous 2 months Beirut siege which killed over 12000 Lebanon civilians. One of my dad's friends lost his leg from a shell during the siege as a foreign reporter.

Excuse me for saying this but is there any uniqueness of Palestine to the arabs? Besides the temple of mount or whatever it's just land. The Arabs in Palestine already have homelands and they occupy most of the middle east they can go live there. But for Israelis this is their ONE homeland and ONE chance.

You are right. Who gives a **** about the Palestinians. They aren't God's people, they aren't promised land by God, hell, they are barely even mentioned in the Bible.

On the other hand, Jewish are special. We are promised land by God in the Bible, we are God's chosen people, we have every right in the world to take over land from whoever we want. We have every right to kick those dirty Arabs out of their homelands and make them live in refugee camps made of canvas.

 

[MosheLevi]

I think it was also June 7th, a day after my cousin's birthday, in 1981 that Israeli attackd Iraq in a surprise raid.

Because they developed atomic bomb and intended to use it against Israel.
That was an act of self defense.

Right, but you fail to mention that your "homeland" was in fact taken unwillingly from a people who have been living there for more than 1700 years before your arrival in 45.

We arrived there in 45? lol.
Now you telling lies?
You forgot to mention that the Israeli people leaved in Israel 2000 years ago long before the Arabs came to Israel.
We were there first.

Israel is wiling to allow the Palestinians to form a Palestinian state.
Hamas on the other hand doesn’t recognize Israel’s right to exist.
Hamas wants to destroy Israel and doesn’t want piece while Israel wants piece.

This sums it all.

As long as Hamas seeks war the Palestinians will continue to suffer.

 

[Turner]

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