Is there really racism in America?

[Turner]

This came up in the To all supporters of the 2nd Gulf War - Prove that Saddam had WMD's and helped Osama! thread. sims2789 said:

Originally posted by sims2789
by the way, i think that it is pathetic that Israelies and Palestineans can't live together. In America, almost everyone thinks that it doesn't matter what your race, religion, or gender is. its absolutely pathetic that two groups of people can't live together just because of skin color and religion. however, i do support creating a Palestinean state(and keeping the Israeli state) just so that there is peace.

To which I replied:

Originally posted by Turner_727


You think racism isn't a problem in America? Man, I wish I lived in your world!

He came back with:

Originally posted by sims2789


true, it is a problem, but blacks and white and Asians and all the other groups can live together. aside from a few groups like the National Alliance(a neo-Nazi group) and the KKK(a group against all non-white non-Christian people and against gays) people can live together. in Calfiornia, you'll get beat up for saying something rascist. maybe it is just in the San Francisco Bay Area where rascism isn't a problem. there are still racsist people, but 99% of the population doesn't give a f*** about what color someone is.

i have friends of all races. i don't care what religion you are(or what your sexual orientation or gender is[unless i am looking for a date, then you must be a girl]). that's how most of my whole area is.

My response:

Originally posted by Turner_727
I still want to live in your world.

So what nationality are you? Caucasian? Have you ever tried walking through Oakland? How about EPA?

I grew up rather sheltered in Fremont. Nothing ever happened there. I could still see the racism. Especially now, after that area has a lot of minorities moving into it.

I really think you need to look around again with open eyes, and tell me that racism isn't a problem there.

XIII felt that we were moving OT (I've always wondered, how can you go off topic in the off topic forum? ) and said:

Originally posted by XIII
Guys, pls keep it on-topic. If you want to discuss racism in America, pls start a new thread. Thanks.

So I was fine with leaving it like that. However, sims2789 said:

Originally posted by sims2789


yes, i am white. and i live in Alameda(it's that island near Oakland). i've walked through the only black neighborhood in the city(most neighborhoods in Alameda are mixed, except there aren't that many blacks on the East End and on Bay Farm Island) and there is rascism. rascism is not a problem in my neighborhood, but if i go a few blocks toward Chipman Middle School, then there is rascism. however, i don't think it is a huge problem, but it is one that needs to be addressed in my city. and Alameda is one of the more conservative Bay Area cities.

So that's the story of this new thread so far, kiddies. Since Moderator 13th requested we take it to a new thread, I have done so. (yes, I'm )

Here's my fresh new brand spankin' new reply:

Dude. . .racism is a problem everywhere. Sure, it's of varying degrees. And yes, some places would experience less than others.

However, you're delusional if you think that it doesn't exist in this country. You contridict yourself by saying first "In America, almost everyone thinks that it doesn't matter what your race, religion, or gender is." And later you said "I don't think it's a huge problem, but it is one that needs to be addressed in my city." So which is it?

I say you're wrong.

I saw it everywhere. Hell, we grew up calling Mexican's Spics, and at the time I didn't know it was wrong. Everyone else did it, including the Mexican's, so we thought it was okay. And this was in a private school in Fremont. Even the neighborhood kids said it. Racism towards blacks wasn't as obvious, but it was still there. I remember when Dave Stewart went four years straight winning 20+ games for the A's, and his accomplishment was downplayed because he was black. I even remember talk that he didn't get it because he was black. Racism? Or a popularity contest? Racism in my book. I don't remember who won it that year, but I remember that Stewart had the better year, and years to it, and was more deserving. (Of course, this could just be because I was a fan at the time.)

My great grandmother lived in Oakland for something like 70 years. She was the only non-black person in the neighborhood. We were only tolerated there because of her. Now, she wasn't white (Portugese immigrant) and neither am I (Indian/Portugese mix) but we were certainly the lightest people there. I'm not going to say that we experience racism there, but there were times when neighborhood kids would try and start something, but was stopped by another kid because of my great-grandmother.

I used to work at a 7-11 in Fremont. Numerous times I've had immigrants come up to me and talk to me in there native languages, expecting me to understand them. Then snubbing me when they found out that I wasn't "One of them". Racism?

I even saw a lot of Stateism there. We were constantly dogging poor drivers, asking them if they learned to drive in Oregon, or calling them Oregon Drivers. Racism here? (okay, not exactly racism, but the same king of mentality that leads to racism.)

Granted, I haven't lived in the BA for 10 years. I do spend a lot of tiem back there, about two months last year, so while I don't live there, I do go there and see it. But I do see it, I have seen it, and I have experienced it.

And that's just the BA. I won't get into what it's like here in Kansas City. But consider this: A city about 1/3 the pop of the BA, 1,800 miles away, and still I can see simularities in Racism. So is racism alive and well in the US? Contrary to what you say, I say yes.

 

[Perfection]

I've seen the N-word said in our school, the result was not pretty

 

[Plexus]

I even saw a lot of Stateism there. We were constantly dogging poor drivers, asking them if they learned to drive in Oregon, or calling them Oregon Drivers. Racism here? (okay, not exactly racism, but the same king of mentality that leads to racism.)

Stateism is a good thing.


Dang Northern Californian drivers...

 

[Stapel]

Racism is everywhere...

Even in the liberal and progressive Netherlands. When I walk 10-15 minutes from my home towards the Schilderswijk (Painters Quarter) in The Hague, only 1 in every 100 persons I encounter is white. This obviously means segregation. I know that is not the same as racism, but in such a discussion the two cannot be seperated.

People of another race mostly have another culture. I think the difference in culture contributes more to racism, than the difference in skin colour. People feel more comfortable when people around them dress the same, behave the same, eat the same food, use the same language and pray to the same God.
That may be wrong or not, but it is, imho, a natural thing to do.

 

[dannyevilcat]

Give me a break. Racism is a problem EVERYWHERE, blacks, whites, arabs and asians. And the more isolated and happy whatever little white town you come from is, the more the opinions of those people would shock you if different cultures started moving into the neighbourhood and bringing change.

If by lynchings you mean racism isn't that big of a problem, then no, it isn't. But racism is way more complex than that, and the effects are diametrically opposite of whatever form it takes... and they ALL have a negative impact on the other guy.

 

[Student Driver]

Ok, here it is...

1. I understand Sims2789's point. He is pointing out that America is not divided by a fence in which black people are on one side, white people are on another, there is a fence for chinese, and a fence for this group, etc.

2. It is said any person who believes there is no racism in America has to be white. That has been shown to be the case.

3. Racism is within every person, everywhere at one time or another...usually without their realization. For most it is very minor. The majority of people (in America) are not too terribly racist and/or can live in peace alongside of other races.

4. Even so, racism is still somewhat of a problem. Economically, non-whites make less than whites. It has been shown that law enforcement does not give the same treatment to minority communities. Also, almost any clear-thinking person would acknowledge that it is harder for non-whites to be successful in general than whites. A disproportionate number of minorities, blacks especially, are involved in our criminal corrections system (prison, parole, etc) compared to whites.

moderate peaceful racism (USA) V. extreme violent racism (Israel)

 

[Simon Darkshade]

Racism certainly exists in America, and exists everywhere. There are few more racist groups than elite private schoolboys; "N" and all other sundry terms were used to our hearts content.

 

[erez87]

There is rascism everywhere, since ever and forever.

And belive me, were learning about the hate for jews (wich is PART of rascism) for all years in school... a reason to hate history lessons, all we do there is learn how much everyone hate us..........

And yes, in jews there is rascism to (mostly against arabs, french and belgiums... they hate us, what can we do?)
Show me a place without rascism and I will proove this place don't exist.

Every try to fix part of rascism (like the creation of Israel) just brought more rascism.....
So as I said rascism is everywhere since ever forever.

 

[polymath]

When I was working on boats in Florida I heard and saw some appalling racism.

Racism exists everywhere, but it was bad in Florida.

 

[Xen]

It depends on where you are in Florida, in my area, there is definantly racism, and yet one of the candidates for prom royalty was a mixed couple of a white dude, and a black chick. Most racists i know, are "limited" if suchga word can apply- they do not apporve of mixed couples, but dont hate everyone either- just those who conform to one of the stereotypes (like wiggers-ya know white trash posers- for instance), though foe me I just dont see the point, we're all human, and colour,and religion dosent matter dosnt matter at all (there is some, but not a great deal religios prediduce too, but even less then the race based stuff

 

[Stapel]

Originally posted by Xen
[B...we're all human, and colour,and religion dosent matter dosnt matter at all (there is some, but not a great deal religios prediduce too, but even less then the race based stuff [/B]

Since we cannot choose race, but can choose religion, I think discrimination based on race should not be compared with discrimination based on religion.

Back to topic:

@polymath: What did you hear or see in Florida? I think we aren't able to discuss this without knowing what is going on exactly.

 

[polymath]

Good point Stapel.

For example, the woman my brother and I were renting an apartment off told us she would never rent out a room to a black guy. She also told us that one of her white female tenants had a black boyfriend (who wasn't staying there) so she (the landlady) asked her to leave.

She claimed this was at least half peer-pressure racism, as her neighbours would have cut her dead socially if, for example, she had let the girl stay. But she also said she didn't want to live in the same area as blacks for some B***S*** reason that I forget right now.

And she's telling us this in the car the first time we'd met her, cheerfully admitting this racist crap.

As you can imagine, my brother and I were in the back of the car giving each other the 'WTH is this place and this dame?' kind of eye. We didn't stay long.

 

[Hygro]

I live in the eastbay, near oakland, richmond, berkeley, etc. so I get various cultural influences nearby. So if its berkeley then you see a more racially mixed city, if oakland it seems more segregated, etc.

But even here were the place is very liberal you will find racism, and "reverse racism" such as berkeley high were my older brother went to for a year where he was attacked by a black kid and the school says its ok because there was slavery in the past.

So yeah racism can be significantly improved but it sure aint gone, and won't be gone for a long while.

I do however agree a good portion is cultural and not color based.

 

[Stapel]

Polymath: Wow, I don't think I have ever encountered something like that myself.

Unfortunately, one thing is missing in your story: Why is this lady so frightened of living near black people? What makes here thinking in a racist way?

I live in a neigbourhood with 50% whites and 50% 'coloured' people, mostly from Morocco. Some things I encounter pretty much on a daily basis are quite disturbing: Many of the Moroccan youngsters stay out on the street, just being noisy, until 2am.
Another thing I dislike is women wearing headcovers, which is imho merely a sign of male suppression, than a way of expressing a religion.

This simply makes my neigbourhood less attractive to me. I'd rather live in the same neighbourhood, without Morrocans. But does it imply I am racist? I don't think so.

I simply don't like certain ways of the daily routines, some (or most?) of them have.

This Florida lady story may be different though....

 

[Hitro]

I find it odd to measure racism by the use of certain words. After all I and friends use all kinds of such words all the time, and we actually are of different "races".

 

[Bozo Erectus]

Originally posted by Turner_727

My great grandmother lived in Oakland for something like 70 years. She was the only non-black person in the neighborhood. We were only tolerated there because of her. Now, she wasn't white (Portugese immigrant) and neither am I (Indian/Portugese mix) but we were certainly the lightest people there.

Hi Turner, uh, since when are the Portugese not white? They are just as white and European as the French, Germans, Italians, Spaniards etc. Being Caucasian has nothing to do with culture or language. Now if she was a mixed race Portugese from Brazil that would be different. But a Portugese from Portugal is no less white than a Frenchman from France.

 

[Stapel]

Originally posted by Dumb pothead


Hi Turner, uh, since when are the Portugese not white? They are just as white and European as the French, Germans, Italians, Spaniards etc. Being Caucasian has nothing to do with culture or language. Now if she was a mixed race Portugese from Brazil that would be different. But a Portugese from Portugal is no less white than a Frenchman from France.

I think I can easily recognize a Portuguese from a Dutchman! I admit that in some cases it is hard to tell, but 95% not. Caucasians come in different types I guess. Just like Kenyans and West-Africans are different by the looks.

 

[MarineCorps]

Sadly it tried to come up here to Maine (the whitest state in the US). In Jan. the National allince started to drop off leaflets in Portland, our biggest city (city by Maine standerd, in any other state it's a town), and the world church of the creator held a rally in Lewiston. However people in Maine were not happy about it, so we held a counter rally. Only 50 people showed up at the racism rally while over 4000 people attend the counter rally. It was a good day.

 

[Turner]

Originally posted by Dumb pothead


Hi Turner, uh, since when are the Portugese not white? They are just as white and European as the French, Germans, Italians, Spaniards etc. Being Caucasian has nothing to do with culture or language. Now if she was a mixed race Portugese from Brazil that would be different. But a Portugese from Portugal is no less white than a Frenchman from France.

Every Portugese that I know, mostly on my mom's side of the family (and the rare classmate) were more darkly complected, almost a Spanish type, which I don't consider Caucasian (because of the darker skin tone.) So maybe they're 'white', but I"ve never thought of it that way.

 

[Lefty Scaevola]

Plenty of racism to had in USA, less per capita than most of the world.