King Attempt: Need advice

[GunnarStahl]

Hey guys!

One of my newest attempt at KING difficulty.

I'm not sure on how well it's going for me. As you can see, Indonesia came from nowhere to settle near me. I was quite confused with this move to be honest.

Then, on T90, he DoW. I was able to kill his units, and when I took the screenshot, I just rejected his Peace Treaty demand.

I planned I could take his city to raze it and establish a coastal for myself, as I planned to expand in the northeast corner too so I can have a 4 city empire.

What do you guys think?

I know I am pretty late in that game and such but then again, it's my first game on KING, so any constructive advice is appreciated.

Screenshot is attached!

Thanks!

 

[KingKong76]

You are definately a bit late in your developement, but its King, nothing is lost...
You have NC yet? if not rush it...
Make sure you have 2-3 land units... 3-4 archers and a siege unit or 2 and take down that stupid Indonesian city.

then you have space fora 4th city east and grab that gems tile.

Then back to regular buisines growing your cities, maxing your trade routes and make sure you have enough army to sustain an attack from Darius or even go after him if if falls behind you...

Thats what i would do!

 

[b7fanatix]

I don't normally raze cities unless they're in a bad location, for example if he'd settled Makkasar a few tiles North or South you wouldn't be able to get all 3 luxes with it, so i'd raze and start over.

In this case he's sited it perfectly, to nick the Cotton, Cocoa and Silver from under you, it also has a Bananas, Hill and Fish for good yields. So, i'd just be looking to puppet the city then get a courthouse in it ASAP, then Annex. An annexed city with a courthouse is no different to one you founded yourself isn't it? Saves the cost of building a settler, and the time to raze, build settler and grow back to size 3.

In terms of capturing it, i can see three tiles where it can be bombared - the hill west of Makassar's cotton, the coastal tile east of Makassar's silver, and the jungle tile north east of the silver.

So, if you're patient and rotate damaged ranged units in and out of the attack, you should be able to bring the city down to 0 hp then rush in and capture it with a melee.

I wouldn't found any more cities in that general direction though, that's just asking for more wars. I've won plenty enough games with three good tall cities.

 

[phillipwyllie]

You are definately a bit late in your developement, but its King, nothing is lost...

Yes you are, and that is the reason for the forward settling and subsequent DOW. I'd get out 2 more cities and the NC before anything else.
In saying that this is a bad map for the Inca as there is very few hills and there seems to be no mountains nearby, add in the jungle.

 

[beetle]

In this case he's sited it perfectly, to nick the Cotton, Cocoa and Silver from under you, it also has a Bananas, Hill and Fish for good yields. So, i'd just be looking to puppet the city then get a courthouse in it ASAP, then Annex.

Makassar is in a good spot for Indonesia, but a poor spot for Pacal, so I would raze it asap. Overlap on the cotton is weak, and too much jungle. IMHO, your next expo should be on the tile 2 hexes SW of where Makassar is now. That still gets you the bananas, fish, and silver. You will miss one of the cocoa for a city, but still get it soon enough for trading.

Your 3rd expo / 4th (and last founded) city I think should be on the desert hill in NE, next to sheep and fish, 2 hexes from gems, horse, and another fish.

FWIW, I would have settled Tiwanaku 1 hex E on the cotton. That would have picked up a bison and that cocoa Indonesia was trying to snipe (which in turn, might have prevented the forward settle, or maybe just pushed Makassar 1 hex SW [which would put it in an okay spot to puppet]). Hindsight is 20/20 as they say.

 

[GunnarStahl]

You are definately a bit late in your developement, but its King, nothing is lost...

Yes. Very late. First game on King I wasn'T DoW on T70 hehe! I focused a bit on getting Slingers and Spearmen so I could resist a DoW, which I did. But I got late. Very late.

I'm very far from NC and I'm still wondering how I could get it while getting units for my army...

Makassar is in a good spot for Indonesia, but a poor spot for Pacal, so I would raze it asap. Overlap on the cotton is weak, and too much jungle. IMHO, your next expo should be on the tile 2 hexes SW of where Makassar is now. That still gets you the bananas, fish, and silver. You will miss one of the cocoa for a city, but still get it soon enough for trading.

Your 3rd expo / 4th (and last founded) city I think should be on the desert hill in NE, next to sheep and fish, 2 hexes from gems, horse, and another fish.

FWIW, I would have settled Tiwanaku 1 hex E on the cotton. That would have picked up a bison and that cocoa Indonesia was trying to snipe (which in turn, might have prevented the forward settle, or maybe just pushed Makassar 1 hex SW [which would put it in an okay spot to puppet]). Hindsight is 20/20 as they say.

I wasn't sure if it was better to sit directly on the cotton or not... I have my answer now!

But yeah, my plan was to get that Silver and that Gem as my 3rd and 4th expo.

I have good ideas, I just can't execute them well!

EDIT: Here what it looks like on T227. Wow, I had so much difficulty taking the city because of the jungle and there was a Comp Bow in the city. I figured I could bait him out of there with a worker, and it worked. It was easy to take the city then. However, I'm still so much behind... but finally, I could get my hand on some tourism and culture. Maybe I could bounce back, but I am pretty far for my personal best of T280 Cultural Victory!

 

[Sessy]

I just want to know where are you sending the trade routes? city placement looks pretty much fine but pop is much lower than expected, and seeing that persepolis is only 34 defense, you can try taking it for some great works (good way to boost tourism is to take it away from AI).

also try to get your science buildings. the beakers you have right now probably won't get you to the internet or radar fast enough.

 

[GunnarStahl]

I hope you will have the infos your are looking for to advice me Sessy.

Thanks for your time! Much appreciated!

Also, you really think I can take Persepolis? I thought 34 defense was scary....

 

[stormtrooper412]

Wow, no mountains anywhere, pretty crappy start I guess

Anyway, you're a fair bit late with your expansions, but then again, that's an unusually crowded piece of land for a King game

 

[Sessy]

I hope you will have the infos your are looking for to advice me Sessy.

Thanks for your time! Much appreciated!

Also, you really think I can take Persepolis? I thought 34 defense was scary....

ok, you have a lot of GPT, but it's mainly because of the trade routes. I would suggest getting granaries up in your expansions and sending trade routes back to the capital for food. you can maybe afford one to send to city states to complete quests, but in order to grow your cities, internal trade routes are essential.

Sorry, I thought you had cannons, but with the way your tech tree is developing, you probably won't want to go to war yet. Try to build universities in all your cities if you haven't done so, science buildings cannot be stressed enough.

 

[GunnarStahl]

Anyway, you're a fair bit late with your expansions, but then again, that's an unusually crowded piece of land for a King game

What do you mean?

I expanded very late yeah, because I was focusing getting Slingers so I could get rid of Indonesia...

ok, you have a lot of GPT, but it's mainly because of the trade routes. I would suggest getting granaries up in your expansions and sending trade routes back to the capital for food. you can maybe afford one to send to city states to complete quests, but in order to grow your cities, internal trade routes are essential.

Sorry, I thought you had cannons, but with the way your tech tree is developing, you probably won't want to go to war yet. Try to build universities in all your cities if you haven't done so, science buildings cannot be stressed enough.

I have University in 3 of my 4 cities, 4th one is one the way! I just got the tech for Uffizi and was aiming for Archeology next.

Are internal routes are used all game long? Or should I always use internal trade routes from the beginning? I'll have to double check but I am rpetty sure I have Granaries everywhere since I used a few trade routes internally earlier on.

 

[stormtrooper412]

If I remember correctly, on King you had all the time in the world to expand because there was nobody around you and wouldn't be for a while.

 

[GunnarStahl]

Yeah maybe. But I read here on some threads that the reason they DoW me in other attempts was because I expanded too quickly. So I decided to wait a bit before expanding and then, Indonesia came and put a city where I was.

There is no denying there, I am late. I focused a bit too much on army I think, but then again, I was DoW'd.

 

[GunnarStahl]

Finally did it!!

First KING victory using Darius (spamming Golden Ages with Great Artists + Chichen Itza and another thing that make Golden Ages longer I can't quite remember). I was rich as hell, so I could get my spaceship parts with money.

Got a Science Victory (Spaceship one) on T353! On King!

I wasn't DoW at all. Only denounced!

Yay!

 

[lockandload]

Yeah maybe. But I read here on some threads that the reason they DoW me in other attempts was because I expanded too quickly. So I decided to wait a bit before expanding and then, Indonesia came and put a city where I was.

There is no denying there, I am late. I focused a bit too much on army I think, but then again, I was DoW'd.

I don't think they will DOW you just for early expansion, unless you expand up next to the AI.

 

[reddishrecue]

Finally did it!!

First KING victory using Darius (spamming Golden Ages with Great Artists + Chichen Itza and another thing that make Golden Ages longer I can't quite remember). I was rich as hell, so I could get my spaceship parts with money.

Got a Science Victory (Spaceship one) on T353! On King!

I wasn't DoW at all. Only denounced!

Yay!

Well thats great, well done. Im proud of you.

 

[GunnarStahl]

I don't think they will DOW you just for early expansion, unless you expand up next to the AI.

I expanded my 3rd city pretty close to Palenque and he never DoW'd. Surprisingly, he DoF'd me instead.

 

[reddishrecue]

I expanded my 3rd city pretty close to Palenque and he never DoW'd. Surprisingly, he DoF'd me instead.

Well, yeah, as a gnk civilization, he would try to convert your city instead.

 

[GunnarStahl]

Well, yeah, as a gnk civilization, he would try to convert your city instead.

Indeed.... and he did... many many times!

 

[reddishrecue]

Indeed.... and he did... many many times!

Why? You made your own religion?