[LP] Leader Pass Pack 5: Great Builders Revealed (Coming Mar. 15th)

[UWHabs]

I really hope that Ed and his team can really pull off a great Live Stream for this DLC. My only rant about the live stream is that they are way too short. In reality they are 40 minutes and only looks at about 5 turns or so per Civ Leader before jumping to the next. They really don't do justice to the new leaders. I would like to see a full 90 min live stream.

It's really hard to show off 3 leaders in the time. Honestly most of the time they end up just using the basic civ ability and not really able to focus on the new abilities.

But overall, it's mostly just about seeing the abilities, and getting a little bit of Q+A in with the devs/designers. I really hope that @Andrew Johnson [FXS] is on the stream again - if so, then make it 3 hours and let him just talk about history. I'd watch.

 

[Hellenism Salesman]

Those models are… official??

Poor Ludwig… he looks like one of those fanmade models that awkwardly tows the line between portrait accuracy and stylization. The result is a sort of uncanniness.

I mean no offense to the artists who made these, and judging by previous passes, this is a fluke or the product of an unreasonable deadline. But, these leaders stick out like a sore thumb.

If they get spiffed up for their arm movements, I’ll be happy. Otherwise, their abilities better be good. I’ll just… keep my eyes on the text. Looking at them gives me pity.

 

[Potworny]

Something feels different and wrong about the eyes of LP leaders. And their facial features seem too sharp yet not detailed enough? I don't know. They're cool, but we are used to a much higher level of art with Civ VI.

 

[Xandinho]

Ludwig's portrayal strikes me as a poorly detailed cross between Peter and Simon.

 

[bite]

The designs might also look better when you see them in motion

 

[Urlance Woolsbane]

I think these leader models look fine; Sejong's does bear a distinct resemblance to Yongle's, and I wouldn't be surprised if one was a reworking of the other, but I don't think it's a poor depiction.

When compared with historical images, I don't think any of these can be plausibly accused of not looking like the leaders they are meant to portray (whether they're too plasticy or whatnot is obviously a different, more subjective, matter.)

Spoiler Theodora :

Spoiler Ludwig :

Spoiler Sejong :

 

[Uberfrog]

Oh dear, those are some pretty shoddy models.

Theodora’s skin is a bit porcelain, but what’s she wearing? Aside from the cartoony jewellery the dress is extremely plain. Not at all fitting for a Byzantine Empress.

Ludwig looks like he’s a puppet from Thunderbirds.

Sejong is fine. I suspected he’d end up looking very similar to Yongle, but that’s mostly his outfit, which is based on the famous (but not contemporary) portrait.

 

[pokiehl]

I think these leader models look fine; Sejong's does bear a distinct resemblance to Yongle's, and I wouldn't be surprised if one was a reworking of the other, but I don't think it's a poor depiction.

When compared with historical images, I don't think any of these can be plausibly accused of not looking like the leaders they are meant to portray (whether they're too plasticy or whatnot is obviously a different, more subjective, matter.)

Sure but no one complained about accuracy. We’re saying they just look underwhelming. Your own post attests to this: “they look fine” isn’t exactly an enthusiastic endorsement.

 

[Uberfrog]

Like seriously, is there a texture missing from Theodora’s model?

The only vaguely similar depiction of an Augusta’s dress is this one of Irene, and her dress is not just plain white cloth.

 

[Urlance Woolsbane]

Sure but no one complained about accuracy. We’re saying they just look underwhelming. Your own post attests to this: “they look fine” isn’t exactly an enthusiastic endorsement.

A lot of other people in this thread seem to think they don't look fine, and Xandinho called Ludwig's model "a poorly detailed cross between Peter and Simon", which I think insinuates that he doesn't look enough like his historical counterpart. But at any rate, I wasn't at all underwhelmed, and was therefore surprised to find so much vitriol aimed at them in this thread.

 

[Josephias]

Indeed, the tone of the thread is of very much complaining, but it has been usual when we have only still images of the models to discuss. I've to say, at first looks the images presented look quite meh, but I'd rater be betting on half-done models than badly done models. As @Kwami said some posts above, models in previous packs have been "evolving" from the initial image to the final in-game rendition, and I expect a bit more of texture and detail polishing will be added to these as well to make them pretty decent-looking. As @Urlance Woolsbane reflects, clear inspirations have been found for all the portraits (and yes, Theodora's tunic is plain withe in the mosaic - albeit she has the elaborate purpure mantle above that plain white dress, and that is missing in the 3D model), therefore design principle is in line with most of other leaders in the game.

Video preview will show movement, and then we'll be able to confirm (or not) if Theodora copies Tamar; Sejong, Yongle, and Ludvig Pedro/Bolivar

 

[Futumch]

My first reaction was "hey, it's Yongle again!"
Gotta go to work. Will catch up later.

 

[queenpea]

Theodora must shop at the same jewelry store as Ramses. These textures need…work. Her skin also looks very plastic, and the hair is a mess. Hopefully she gets touched up before the release. There is no hope for her dress, however.

I’m pretty pleased with Ludwig, though I think he looks a bit too bronzed.

It looks like they’ve put the least amount of effort into Sejong. He looks far too similar to Yongle. Jarringly similar.

 

[Venceslau Pietro Pietra]

Ludwig colour pattern is basically the same as Bolivar, a shame, the background looks pretty atleast, the rest is ... okayish, i guess? Hoping to see good arms moves

 

[AntSou]

I was afraid Sejong might turn out too similar to Yongle and, well, he does look like a younger brother... which might actually be a good thing, since the model looks fine to me. But that book... what is that? A first draft? It's a terrible, featureless model. At least it seems to be, might look different in the First Look.

p0kiehl said Ludwig's head is too big... to me it looks like his body is too small. I felt the same way about Lincoln. Also, the hair is... basic? Hopefully it's just the angle and the texture will pop out in motion, like in his pictures. The facial hair looks painted onto his face, and it doesn't help that the clothing and colours are basically Bolivar, only actually much more basic. The fabric is as plain as Kublai's.

I have the exact same complaint as queenpea regarding Theodora's jewellery. It was the first thing that came to mind when I saw her. It's so jarring. It looks like plastic, the type you might give a child to play at pretending to be a queen. The face looks fine.
---

This is a big oof.

 

[InsidiousMage]

I feel like the problem with Theodora is that they tried to hard to make her model a one-to-one creation of the Ravenna mosaic.

 

[Donny Hayes]

What happened with FXS designers? I feel like the last LP models were made by Steam Workshop. What is it? Just good fanmade models. If you don't want to do it, then why did you start? Just to drop your fans a bone so we don't get so bored waiting for the next civ game or what? I don't think it's better than nothing. To me it's like some kind of insult, as a true fan of the series. Really weird. Theodora is a plastic doll. Ludwig made by a beginner in 3D modeling. Sejong is CTRL+V from Yongle but with new clothes. I don't even talk about Ramses

 

[Republic of San Montuoso]

For those "complaining" that Yongle and Sejong look too similar...

Two chubby, pointy-bearded guys in the same simple tunic that just swapped colors, and quite literally the same hat.

Of course they look alike! They were bound to look alike! I don't know why people seem so surprised about it: what did you thought would happen when they put in the same game two leaders that, quite frankly, had distinguished characteristics that are so similar?

Edit: On another hand, I find the models, yes, quite off, but I quite dig Ludwig (just sad he's already in his post-twink era, unfortunately...).

By the way, if Sundiata Keita wasn't the "Great Works of Writing" leader, I would have said that those three leaders would have been perfect to represent each a type GWAM: Sejong with his library would have got bonuses from Great Works of Writing, Theodora with her basilicas would have filled them with Great Works of Art, and Ludwig, patron of Wagner, would have got bonuses towards Great Works of Music.

 

[BigChinggis]

Indeed, the tone of the thread is of very much complaining,

Its been this way every time they post these release announcements. Then we see the models in action and some people are like "these suck" or "these don't look as bad in motion" and then everyone forgets once we get the abilities. Wash, rinse, repeat.

 

[The_goggles_do_nothing]

For those "complaining" that Yongle and Sejong look too similar...

Based on a quick internet search Yongle and Sejong lived and nearly the same time. So it could be there images look similar because it's what people expected the leader would look like at the time. It's the reason why the images we have of different Roman Emperors often look the same.