Lib Dems and Tories in green spat

ComradeDavo

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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4762835.stm

Lib Dems and Tories in green spat

A bid to reach a consensus on green issues between David Cameron's Tories and Sir Menzies Campbell's Lib Dems may have fallen at the first hurdle.
The Conservatives reacted angrily to Lib Dem claims they will use a meeting between the two leaders to test the extent of Mr Cameron's green beliefs.

While a Tory environment spokesman accused his Lib Dem counterpart of "playing politics" with climate change.

There is also some dispute over who actually called the meeting.

Tory spokesman Peter Ainsworth said: "It is disappointing that [Lib Dem environment spokesman] Chris Huhne has chosen to play party politics with the serious issue of climate change.

"We will continue to work constructively with politicians from any other party that is prepared to put the environment at the very top of its agenda."

The Conservatives maintain they called the meeting between the two leaders but the Lib Dems say it was in response to a challenge by Sir Menzies during the recent local election campaign.

Mr Huhne meanwhile claimed there had been a "string of contradictions" between Mr Cameron's "green words and his party's blue actions".

Agreement?

"The Liberal Democrats are very much in favour of the cross-party agreement on climate change. People want parties to work together on solutions to the pre-eminent challenge of our time," said Mr Huhne.

"We believe that the cross-party agreement can, in principle, make it easier for parties to propose difficult measures that could otherwise fall apart in the face of vocal but minority opposition.

"However, it is important that the parties who are signed up have faith in each others' fundamental commitment to the long-term goals. Otherwise there can be the worry that it is being used as a camouflage for not taking decisions, rather than a way of taking tougher ones."

The Lib Dems want to know where Mr Cameron stands on key issues such as nuclear energy and vehicle excise duty.

There is a climate change agreement between Tories, Lib Dems, the SNP, DUP and Plaid Cymru.

"For the consensus to work we need clear policy commitments from David Cameron's Tories, not just warm words," added Mr Huhne.
Anyone hear actually believe Cameron's 'vote blue go green' stuff?

And opinions on the cross party consensus?

I personally don't think that the Tory party are 'green' at all, though it is good to see the Lib Dems and those 3 otehr parties talkign to each other.
 
Dave you missed the perfect opportunity to do a non-spam thread with the title Yellows and Blues collide in Green Splat!!
 
LOL I just made a major boob. I thought Mobboss had started this thread, but his is the one underneath. Now that would would have been interesting!

Anyway it looks to me like the LD's are rattled and they know that Cameron will win the next general election. The media like Cameron and that's really all that matters. Green issues are one way in which the Tories can cast off the shadow of Thatcher. Going green/pretending to be green is a purification process for them, but it's all PR.

There is a climate change agreement between Tories, Lib Dems, the SNP, DUP and Plaid Cymru.

What a coincidence, all of the parties out of office talk green. When they get into power, we'll see the difference. That's democracy!
 
PrinceOfLeigh said:
Dave you missed the perfect opportunity to do a non-spam thread with the title Yellows and Blues collide in Green Splat!!
Damn!:lol:

Xenocrates said:
Anyway it looks to me like the LD's are rattled and they know that Cameron will win the next general election. The media like Cameron and that's really all that matters. Green issues are one way in which the Tories can cast off the shadow of Thatcher. Going green/pretending to be green is a purification process for them, but it's all PR.
2 things there...

1- The Tories are far from assured an election victory, they may be on track to win a fair few more seats but at current they still aren't doing well enough to actually get a majority

2- The liberal and the Labour supporting media hate Cameron.
 
Xenocrates said:
What a coincidence, all of the parties out of office talk green. When they get into power, we'll see the difference. That's democracy!
Oh, and the Lib Dems are in office in the Scottish parliment remember....
 
I think Ming's lost the plot since he was elected leader. It's a shame as he was my preffered candidate. I can't prove that the Tories are going to win next time, but I have a sneeking feeling that they'll magically reform using the green agenda and leave the Labour party knee deep in excrement of their own making.

:) The Tories are using 'greenwash' to dissolve those stubborn stains of Thatcher, the miners/teachers strikes, the poll tax and privatisation etc. It's better than bleach! Look how shiny they are becoming. :D

I'm not sure about the LD's response, but history suggests that it won't be effective. :mad: If I was the LD's I would use the idea above about 'greenwash' to ridicule the Tories, but they never listened to me before and I'm sure they won't now.
 
Enviromentalism is an issue that everyone likes the sound of, but few care greatly about. The Tories are just making these green promises to curry favor among the unsure voters with little intyention to carry them out should they enter office. If they get in, they'll get away with it aswell.
 
Truronian said:
Enviromentalism is an issue that everyone likes the sound of, but few care greatly about. The Tories are just making these green promises to curry favor among the unsure voters with little intyention to carry them out should they enter office. If they get in, they'll get away with it aswell.


I agree. There's no way DC is goin to alienate his core constituency with reall action.

He's not about to make fuel more expensive, that would alienate business, small-large, and those two car owning tory voting non-progressive types. To be honest, a great deal of people don't give a f*** about global warming.

And I don't see him telling Henrietta in Chelsea that she can't pick up her sproglets from school in a 4x4.

It's just hot air.
 
ComradeDavo said:
Anyone hear actually believe Cameron's 'vote blue go green' stuff?

I was most amused by hearing about Labour's "Vote Green, get Blue" counter-campaign during the locals. Obviously, it didn't work too well; the Greens made greater gains in the popular vote than any other party.
 
I don't believe Cameron can make the Tories an environmentally friendly party, though I'd be happy to be proved wrong. I can also see why the LibDems are worked up about this - being a genuinely green party is difficult in mainstream UK politics (and is far, far harder when you're in government - and, no, CD, part ownership of a coalition in the Scottish parliament isn't a place where people have to make hard choices between idealism and what actually is practical), and the LDs have had a USP of being greenest for quite a while now.

Cameron is (probably) trying to (a) steal LD votes, and (b) negate what the government has done towards achieving Kyoto. Even if he is green by nature (and I doubt this), I just can't see how he can bring his party with him as soon as the tough issues and decisions come up.
 
Xenocrates said:
I think Ming's lost the plot since he was elected leader. It's a shame as he was my preffered candidate.
Just to respond to this bit - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4766387.stm
'Too soon' to judge Sir Menzies

Lib Dem MPs discussed their leader's Commons performances
The Lib Dems should not be too quick to judge new leader Sir Menzies Campbell, a former leadership contender has said.
The time to assess his performance was after six months - not "a few weeks", Simon Hughes told GMTV's Sunday Programme.

On Wednesday, party MPs discussed Sir Menzies' Question Time performances after they came under fire.

But frontbencher Ed Davey said that the party's problems dated from Charles Kennedy's time as leader.

Mr Kennedy stepped down after it emerged that he had a drink problem.

Mr Davey said: "You have got to remember where we were three or four months ago. We have had a pretty traumatic time in the party.

"For some of us it actually went back quite a few years. The party hadn't been managed as well as it should be," he told BBC Radio 4's Today programme.

The Liberal Democrat press office said it was looking at ways to improve Sir Menzies' performance at Prime Minister's Questions (PMQs). Possible changes might include to the sort of questions Sir Menzies asked.

And his chief of staff Norman Lamb has advised Sir Menzies to "relax and be himself" in the "bear pit" of the Commons.

'Take stock'

Mr Hughes, who came third in the recent leadership contest, said the party should "take stock" of Sir Menzies' progress at the Lib Dem's annual September conference.

In a pre-recorded interview, he told the Sunday Programme that Sir Menzies' political experience was in foreign affairs and defence.

[Sir Menzies] is a leader who is decisive and confident and making the right decisions

Ed Davey

"That's his expertise and on that ground there's nobody who can better him and that remains the case. Obviously as leader you have to progress."

Mr Hughes said it was "fair comment" to suggest more effort should be put into improving the leader's performance during his weekly clashes with Prime Minister Tony Blair.

"Ming is fully aware of that. He will now have time to be in Westminster and concentrating, but it's not to be underestimated the work that needed to be done behind the scenes for getting the policies sorted."

Mr Davey, the party's trade and industry spokesman, defended his leader's performance.

"Some of us are judging Ming now and we are seeing a leader who is decisive and confident and making the right decisions," he said.

'Bear pit'

Mr Lamb, who was promoted to chief of staff after Sir Menzies became leader in March, hit back at suggestions his boss was not dynamic enough.

Conservative and Labour backbenchers are out to get him - it's a bear pit that place

Norman Lamb
Lib Dem chief of staff

Like every leader, Sir Menzies had advisers to help assist him in coming to terms with the "rather unusual environment" of PMQs, Mr Lamb told BBC Radio Five Live.

"Ming Campbell, I think most people would agree, has been one of the most pre-eminent parliamentary performers in recent years and I think it is a question of getting used to a slightly different environment.

"Both Conservative and Labour backbenchers are out to get him - it's a bear pit that place."

He added that one of his predecessors, Paddy Ashdown, had hated Parliament and PMQs, and yet had ended up as an "impressive and successful" leader.

Personally, I still wish Hughes had won it, I think he's better and getting in the spotlight and getting the point across.
 
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