Liberty Domination Walkthrough

[Fragamemnon]

AA guns? I've seen the flight beeline in my domination games and usually can get to ballistics around the time they get a mass of planes going. AA guns do a real number on their air force and capture cities just fine as a frontline melee unit given how late they get Plastics.

 

[Moriarte]

Really well done guide.

I've really not had much time to play outside of LPing lately but I've been doing a similar build to this in BNW like I did in G&K and you can get rolling pretty fast as long as you don't get blocked off by something annoying(like I dunno, Austria with the Great Wall )

My only concern is that on Deity the AI seems to have a borderline fetish for Flight and loves to push there so hard, and even though Great War Bombers aren't super strong a big mass of them can do a real number on your Artillery so I often find myself having to go Flight first. Like really 99% of the time the AIs go Flight before Dynamite and often hit Modern with it(or Radio if culture inclined) .I've seen this since G&K. Do you have this problem particularly often and how do you go about dealing with it?

Thanks. To be honest , I am yet to see AI reach flight faster than I do (before turn 200), and, provided I push scientific theories first (which I tend to do more often lately) flight can be reached on t.190-200 or so. From there it's just snowballing airforce, so no one stands a chance. Artilleries are basically redundant when AI starts producing them GWBs, so I just just use landships, maybe few gatlings, and beeline AA's. Also, whenever I get to pick Arts funding (or someone proposes it) I always try to get it working, as early as possible, preferably. (And they all will love you for it)

The only safe way to use artillery in situation you describe is with heavy support from AA and triplanes.

 

[peddroelm]

Very nice guide . Been struggling with domination victory on deity ever since BNW came out . So far only succeeding with the OP Assyrians after an overly long 324 turns nuke-fest struggle .. (had a rough ~100 turns of unhappiness until Prora+Neusch..)


Minor nitpicks:

...
Now it is turn 50, you should have 3 - 4 cities, 3+ workers, working on granaries/libraries and we move on to the next part.
...

- your proposed tech patch doesn't have writing before construction so libraries at T50 only possible with some Techs from ruins or lucky incoming beaker buffs from neighbour caravans (and you're probably going to be at war with the closest neighbour for stealing worker(s))
- 3+ workers steals at T50 seems a bit exaggerated for my level. 2(one from neighbour AI one from CS) is what I can reasonable achieve
- 4 cities down on turn 50 again a bit overoptimistic - unless early culture ruin and/or lucky culture CS state quest.. Even so 4 cities down before T50 seems a bit off. -> 3-rd settler will have most ground to cover (do you send the first settler to the farthest location ?) over what could be a lot of rough terrain infested with barbarians... Your guide provides a few archers before T50 not to lose workers to barbs//get delayed too much by them but it won't magically clear paths for settlers when barb camp +2 extra barbs is in the way...

Yes 2 scout opening on pangea will eventually get you a culture ruin most of the times ->but that culture ruin doesn’t always come early enough ...

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Still a great opening overall (not that convinced about the artillery part yet - flight seems a much safer bet ) - my first Japan attempt got me 2 workers, 3 cities and 5 CBs at turn 56 and it looks Sweden (my closest neighbour) will soon be in some serious pain ...

About the Med-Late Game: -here's what I've been doing

(keep the peace for a bit and milk the external trade routes to be able to stock up on some cash + sell luxuries& strategics ~3.5 k should be OK - not that many trade-routes available for food buffs)

-beeline industrialisation (you speak of commerce) and hard build Big Ben (got it like 4 times out of 4 ) while using less potent openings so it should be gettable most of the time (switch a trace route to hammer buff for building it if another commerce civ got industrialization before you).. Get coal ASAP mine it// pay an allied CS to get it (improve it) ... A rush brought factory will help getting Big Ben ..
When enough cash buy the other 2 and get the 2 free ideology tennets .. (getting to Mercantilism (25% reduction) before buying the factories helps but it means sacrificing consulates).Still finishing commerce "early" provides significant GPT for mass puppet trading post spam autocrats ...(also only answer to double embargo civ/city states from the world congress bans )

So soon you should be set with triple military unit rush buy reduction (15% big ben, 25% Mercantilism and 33% from Autocracy) ..When you reach flight oil (had to settle 2 cities in the snow in my Assyrian game for it) and happiness will be the limits to your conquest )... Not only will the units be cheap to buy, but again thanks to autocracy will have 3 promotions out of the gate (air repair) (need a bit of a detour for the military academy - extra worthwhile because of the happiness it provides) ...autocracy super spies should help fill in the holes left by your flight beelining (including eventually artillery)

Happiness wise Prora(again flight) + Neuchwe.. should provide a good buffer ... (will kind of struggle a bit till you get them )

 

[Moriarte]

your proposed tech patch doesn't have writing before construction so libraries at T50 only possible with some Techs from ruins or lucky incoming beaker buffs from neighbour caravans (and you're probably going to be at war with the closest neighbour for stealing worker(s))

Perhaps I was misleading. Usually I start on libraries @ around t.60 or close to that. In any case, I feel I don't need to rush them in BNW, as finishing NC @ turn 85-95 is perfectly fine, in all games I played so far.

3+ workers steals at T50 seems a bit exaggerated for my level. 2(one from neighbour AI one from CS) is what I can reasonable achieve

Agreed. These things are highly random. But 2 workers (+1 free from citizenship) is almost guaranteed.

4 cities down on turn 50 again a bit overoptimistic - unless early culture ruin and/or lucky culture CS state quest.. Even so 4 cities down before T50 seems a bit off. -> 3-rd settler will have most ground to cover (do you send the first settler to the farthest location ?) over what could be a lot of rough terrain infested with barbarians... Your guide provides a few archers before T50 not to lose workers to barbs//get delayed too much by them but it won't magically clear paths for settlers when barb camp +2 extra barbs is in the way...

Yep, that's another reason why archers are there. To magically clear paths, before settlers start moving. I don't see how it is difficult to plop 4 cities before turn 50 with liberty. Maybe to speed things up a little bit there can be: scout - monument - scout (skip shrine) opening.

Anyway, 3 cities are enough, if they are in good spots. Later, 4th and 5th can be settled, so no need to rush t.50 deadline.

Still a great opening overall (not that convinced about the artillery part yet - flight seems a much safer bet ) - my first Japan attempt got me 2 workers, 3 cities and 5 CBs at turn 56 and it looks Sweden (my closest neighbour) will soon be in some serious pain ...

If you skip artilleries the game will likely last longer, I think. There is this gap between Xbows and flight and you need to fill it with something powerful to be able to wage war and slowly acquire these enemy cities, filled with scientific buildings and works of art. That really boosts your economy and science, and even though it seems like a slower path, it really isn't. Otherwise, AI will just be spamming units in your way, and it's not like GWB one - shot kills them.

Basically, between turn 150 - 210 there is nothing that can stop them, and it isn't hard to unlock them in t.150 - 180 range. And then GW bombers arrive to finish what artilleries started.

I like your general approach with full commerce and big ben, rush buying auto repair GWB's is always fun. Sometimes I rush/build Brandenburg for that.

I like going for rationalism + order lately. Happiness perks from monuments, workshops, factories and public schools are pretty decent. And that -33% cost reduction from buildings allows me to annex lots of cities at one point, which speeds up science as well. Too bad nothing special on level 3 for warmongers. But it usually won't matter at that point.

 

[peddroelm]

There is this gap between Xbows and flight and you need to fill it with something powerful to be able to wage war and slowly acquire these enemy cities, filled with scientific buildings and works of art. That really boosts your economy and science

+1 range frigates ? need to be Assyria to do it without military academy (library/barracks/armoury/autocracy) {Assyria the scourge of the seven seas}

+1 range gatlings can work for a few cities and you do get them early (this is a Big Ben/Gatling gun beeline) (they need 4 promotions for range so you'll need to upgrade from highly promoted crossbows)


This has to be the way to play England .. lol even an extra spy for autocracy super tech stealers .. England is OP

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Autocracy is no slouch at annexation either (50% production when building courthouses // 15%+25% reduction for rushing buildings (commerce&BB) //+3 happy from courthouse // +2 happy from barracks (lowish hammers/cheap to rush) ) ..
The lvl3 tenet 50 turn 25% attack bonus works with the bomber line as-well ...

 

[Makaz]

Try this

+ turn 15 - DoW Attila and enslave his workforce.
+ turn 59 - Attila's court is surrounded by 7 CB's a spear, scout and a warrior.

I feel like I m getting much better but not there yet.

Tried again tonight and askia was taking the role of Attila. Bullied him a bit at the beginning then 3 archers then 4 cities and 3 more archers.

Turn 64 he arrives with all his mass of swordsmen and co and get beaten up (was close, left my city at 0 life but without being able to take it).

Turn 70 I m marching on his cap with 6 cb 2 warriors. However his cap is def 28 and has an un-upgraded archer in it. I tried it but I hit his city for 9 and he hits back for over 80 with the city and enough to finish 1 cb in 1 turn. No way to take it.

Finish my NC while learning math, getting 3 catapults in addition to the above. Gao is now def 30 and still the lone archer. I move in position and 2 swordsmen pop nuking 1 catapult while the city and archer nuke another...

Guess I m just useless at deity rushes :s Thinking of going back to immortal as this is getting frustrating really.

 

[theozagem]

In my last game with Rome i got caught by a bunch of Samurais, trying to defend with CBs and pikes while going for education..it hurts!

i'm really not sure whether to go education or chivalry/machinery first, the second is great to still alive but postponing education can be very hurtful in the long run.

What are your thoughts about that?

 

[Fragamemnon]

Was Japan near you? If so you enslave his workers ASAP, choke him off settling your way, and then smash him at turn 60/65-ish with five composite bows. Take his capital, take another one of his cities as part of the peace deal, then burn it to the ground. You can not coexist (at least on Deity) with a non-crippled warmonger AI neighbor right next to you and they get exponentially harder to deal with efficiently as the game goes on.

One thing to keep in mind is that these kind of rushes have the potential to fail hard against any civ with a Chivalry UU-Arabia, Askia (which you ran into) , Spain , Mongolia, Siam. They will beeline that and can sometimes with a strong start have a castle up or rush bought before you can get to them. That + tradition Civ for the ranged attack bonus makes for some real pain. I would not try to get four cities of your own against these Civs, one settler after the free one and then pour every hammer and gold you have into units and the archer-CB upgrades.

 

[peddroelm]

did my England test run yesterday

another narrow failure

Started isolated on the top of a peninsula with a central mountain range and barb infested rough terrain on the coastlines (lots of choke points) .. Only stole 1 worker from a distant CS and took a huge while to bring him into my territory ..

So the nice rush plan broke into little pieces when confronted with the map ... Decided to take a huge detour to optics to settle a really nice piece of estate over some narrow waters ... By the time I've managed to finish liberty The NC was built the hard way (4 cities).. So I've settled a GS ..

Got a 5-th after NC for 12 iron in snow territory .. Had 2 cultured CS allied from ~turn 100 till the end (finished liberty/commerce(without puppets )/got a few in exploration and a few more in autocracy (won world fair or something) )

Stayed at peace for the first 200 turns.. ~Turn 200 decided to go after Alexander (nice +7 oil coastal city) with 14 +1 range frigates and some other fluff (ironclad,privateer) .. And after an initial promising start (sank his fleet and lots of ships from his CS allies) he purchased like 4 defensive structure in that city (58 to 120+ defence climb) and a few bombers ..

Those 2-3 bombers lost me the war/game .. I've had a capital that could kick a frigate every 2 turns // GWB every 3 turns, could buy them at crazy low prices BUT HAD NO OIL.. (got BigBen and first ideology) 3 oil would won me the game (had city in range to provide intercept for the fleet.. or provide the extra damage on the target city with own bombers) ...

Had 7 oil in citadel bomb range but no GG (no early war) ..Pretty frustrating way to lose the game (6 hours in) .. Will try again ..

 

[Caboose]

Thank you for this strategy, Moriarte!

And, btw - hi Peddro Thanks for doing such awesome work for us in the Mass Effect community!

 

[peddroelm]

..
And, btw - hi Peddro Thanks for doing such awesome work for us in the Mass Effect community!

 

[Makaz]

I am doing some progress now with this strategy.

On the first attempts I was being nuked by the AI early (t60)
Once I beat that stage, I was able to bring the fight back to the AI but too late to take any city.

In my last groups of tryouts, I manage to kill the 1st AI (take capital + 2 cities) round turn 60-75 with CB all in good time. The trick was to avoid working simple 2 food tiles after size 3 (as 3 hammers for 15 turns at this stage is better than having an extra pop later on) and ignore purposely 2 of the 3 following tech (calendar, sailing, tracking) to get construction in time.

However I face another problem. At this stage (1st AI surrenders), I suddently get DOW by the rest of the world alltogether (2 or 3 on continents) and whilst the first waves can be taken out, there is always a KNIGHT heavy wave that ultimately gets through and punches my lines of upgraded CB. I think I should be more wary of diplomacy at this stage. I tend to be too much focus on the on-going war and getting education before T110 that I forget to look around who is massing armies like a madman and getting ready to move on my lands.

 

[Arazok]

I tried this strategy last night on Immortal. I think I still need a bit of work to quite master it, but I’m impressed.

Playing Poland, I have Russia to my south, Netherlands to my east, and England to the far east.

I was a little put off at first as I was unable to find any settlers to steal for quite some time. Russia had one, but it was guarded by 3 warriors. I had to steal one from a CS at turn 30, which is really late in the game to get a first settler (from what I’m used to). I was questioning this strategy at that point.

Still, I left a scout near Russia to see if an opportunity would arise, while I explored with the other settler who had an archer upgrade.

Around turn 40, my archer scout found a new CS who had a barbarian camp harassing him. I took that out and got friendly from the quest. Then I saw a barbarian had taken a settler. Took that out and swiped him.

At the same time, a camp popped up near Russia, and he sent his warriors off to kill it, leaving his capital open. Just as I moved in to take his worker, a settler popped. I took his worker, and the next turn took his settler. All with a scout! I made a nice clean escape as his warriors were to busy fighting barbarians. Peace offer came 4 turns later.

So now I’m sitting on 5 workers (1 from policy) and 3 cities at turn 55. I have the warmonger label, but nobody seems to care. I’m neutral with all the other civs.

By turn 70, I had my 4th city. I have 6 archers. Russia was crippled by my swipe, only at 2 cities now, and his score is half everyone else’s.

I can’t wait to see how this turns out. I’m running a small deficit and behind in science, but with my 4th city down I can focus on economy and getting NC. Meanwhile, I’m going to get friendly with England in the hopes I can eventually use them to squeeze Netherlands from both sides, but before that I’ll probably take the hammer to Russia and secure my half of the continent. That will depend on how well Netherlands does, I can’t let them get to strong. A limited war to knock them down a notch or two might be prudent.

The downside of this strategy is that all these workers and archers cost a lot of cash. I’m running -5gpt, but I’m able to keep my gold around 150 by taking huts. It’s a minor downside that is easy to fix once you get your 4th city down and you change focus to economy. Not building workers, ever, is amazing.

 

[Caboose]

In my last groups of tryouts, I manage to kill the 1st AI (take capital + 2 cities) round turn 60-75 with CB all in good time. The trick was to avoid working simple 2 food tiles after size 3 (as 3 hammers for 15 turns at this stage is better than having an extra pop later on) and ignore purposely 2 of the 3 following tech (calendar, sailing, tracking) to get construction in time.

Tbh, I don't think Sailing is ever a good tech to do if you wanna go to early CB war. Hasn't this pretty much been proven already, that sailing and fishing boats is for booming, not for rushing?

 

[peddroelm]

another fail - this time Runaway Russia launched ship ~ T275 .. She went onto a massive conquering spree but refused to be bribed onto useless wars -stayed focused and won ... Had 10+ Stealth bombers + extra fluff (modern armor//rocket artillery quite a few subs) (again low oil) ...

Starting to think tradition + rationalism would be a much better bet for my 150 turns turtle style than commerce that doesn't help until you start getting the puppets ...

-------------
relevant to thread - had the CBs ready for rush but could not take Seul because it was surrounded by hills and marshes ... Kept the war going and was eventually gifted an 11 pop city as a peace deal (with artist's guild)... Messed up the religion (had tons of quarries but went with silver gold pantheon since I did not trust my ability to get and keep a religion - my religion not only passively spread to my cities but it went on Korea and some city states aswell ..)

Another massive factor was Russia going order (and later firewall) - she got to kill a lot of my super spies and delayed my stealth bombers too much ...

 

[Buccaneer]

It seems to me, based on experience, that gold is the key to have enough to upgrade to CompBows. I had built Construction at turn 49 and had 6 Archers. However, I only had enough to upgrade three Archers and that was not enough to take out a very aggressive, spamming Japan. Everything else fell into place, including a third city at turn 51, a religion at 58 plus monuments and a granary. Only one worker though since I don't steal them. I hope that was simply bad luck.

 

[Caboose]

I got enough gold by having 2 leaders friendly to me trade gold for excess luxuries. (In addition to demanding tribute by putting 2 units within 8 tiles of City States.)

 

[Moriarte]

I see few people struggle with this strategy. I decided to record a full game let's play, with Denmark, on Pangaea map, using this strategy as a foundation. You can see part 1 here.

Link to the stories and let's plays forum.

 

[peddroelm]

I see few people struggle with this strategy. I decided to record a full game let's play, with Denmark, on Pangaea map, using this strategy as a foundation. You can see part 1 here.

 

[Buccaneer]

I got enough gold by having 2 leaders friendly to me trade gold for excess luxuries. (In addition to demanding tribute by putting 2 units within 8 tiles of City States.)

I think getting the extra 240 gold would not have been difficult but the map couldn't do it for me. I traded an extra Salt to Venice for 6gpt; the Ottomans never had any more than 2gpt and Japan was building to conquer from turn 1. I think I need to try tribute but had been reluctant to do so as I typically want to get friends with neighboring city-states as quickly as possible.