LK147 - world map, China

I prefer Espionage or even Medicine to Steel. We have several cities that could benefit from hospitals and we could use access to Battlefield Medicine as a placeholder for the UN. We might be too late to pull one of those 2 first, though, but, we may not either. India seemed to be in running away mode, not sure anyone else is a great researcher. Russia is my guess for being the new lead researcher going forward.

Of course, definitely we would not get Refining first.

Lee, I agree we need to go island hopping for cash, but, as he says, cavs are scarce. I tried to start that campaign, but that island city was BETTER defended than any of their core cities (yes,really), so I pulled the wounded units back to the mainland to heal... Then ended up using them elsewhere...

You might have noticed, I had really rotten luck losing rifles to cavs despite being fortified in size 2 cities on my turn, Loke, they lost a lot more than they won, which is crap luck. So I had to keep pumping out replacement rifles. I think having so many cav armies now might mean we don't need as many "loose" cavs at home, though, so that would help.

I endorse the 3 cav armies, but wouldn't disband a sword one at this point. They are great for protecting workers and artillery stacks. I thought about 3 cav armies on my turn, but didn't go that route. I was not expecting to have to beat 6 or 7 units on an island... Of course, assuming we have rubber (sounds like we do), infantry are just fine to take out island cities too imo. Infantry vs rifle is pretty effective, especially if we have enough frigates and 3-4 arty so we can bomb the cities down a little.

Regarding Egypt. I'm in no hurry to kill them. Plenty of other targets. IMO an alliance with them NOW would be fine if it helps us, but if we wait any longer, then I wouldn't do it. Of course, I don't know how much of Persia you have taken out, so...

My biggest concern right now is actually Argentina. We can chop up Persia, Russia, Egypt and Germany. They are close at hand (even Germany now with the rails). I worry about Argentina building the UN and winning that way. I doubt they get the votes, but I'd rather not chance it.
 
Lurker:

Maniac, the AI will attack armies that do not have a defense 3 unit in them, once they get cavs. Maybe even with knights but cavs for sure. I would not rely on sword armies for defense once cavs come around.

If you had been able to stick a knight in the sword army, then you would be safe (at green, not yellow).
 
Lurker:

Maniac, the AI will attack armies that do not have a defense 3 unit in them, once they get cavs. Maybe even with knights but cavs for sure. I would not rely on sword armies for defense once cavs come around.

If you had been able to stick a knight in the sword army, then you would be safe (at green, not yellow).

That's interesting, because they have not so far, and I gave them ample opportunity to do so on my turn, They;ve been protecting 20 cannons at a time. Are you sure they will attack a FOUR unit sword army with a cav?
 
They AI ignored my sword armies protecting large worker stacks that would had really hurt to lose.
 
Ya, I think defense 2 armies will not be attacked by cavs unless they have somewhere around 9-7 hp or less (I think this is with 4 units and small wonder/mil acad boost)

I will not disband sword. We are gaining cities fast enough that I can wait a turn or two and build the Army.

Going with Espionage. You are right though that Hospitals are attractive. I will get from the AI if possible.

I will continue to play tonight but probably won't finish.
 
We will want to replace the sword armies soon - I can't recall if infantry / tanks will ignore them.
 
Tanks will attack even 4-unit, fully healthy sword armies. I don't remember if they'll attack healthy cav armies. Infantry attack the same as cavalry, so they may ignore our fully healthy sword armies, but they and cavalry will kill damaged armies.

Also, flight is near, probably nearer than tanks. The AI will bomb armies, and wounded armies get swarmed.
 
Once we get infantry we will want some 4 unit armies with them. We need the ability to protect our stacks near the front. My start at breaking India including completing missing rails along the border so I could get to the nearest city. No armies, and our attacks are slowed down.
 
Lurker:

Never had a cav army attacked by anything (in the field and not red), except by accident. Once a cav army had a few swords run into it and it got dropped to red and was then killed by a cav.

This was ( I believe) a function of the NOAIPATROL and a goto by the ai to a spot, before the army was there.

I have had a 4 man full health sword and mdi army attacked deliberately by the ai (different games). I cannot say for certain, but I am quite sure it was not a goto accident. Now of the many many hundreds of armies I have had, 3 is not a lot and you may never see it.

These were all AW games and btw the cav army was on a hill. I still remember that one as I was shocked.

Edit:
BTW I never had a knight army attacked by anything, not even a modern armor. I do not recall any MDI/knight mix armies being attacked, but I still worry a bit as I have not fielded them in open areas after tanks. Cavs and knight armies I do not worry. Just that again you have a tiny chance of a noaipatrol. It is real tiny as the armies do not stay in one spot that long.
 
Now that vxma mentions it, there is one condition where I remember any army can be attacked. If the AI completely controls a continent, there is a good chance that a stack will be attacked.

In other words, the AI is willing to attack the weakest stack it can get to by land - no matter how strong that weakest stack is - something like that.

I am not completely sure it will attack a stack on a choke point - the definition of 'get to' may or may not include enemy units blocking access.
 
Preturn: Last time I played we were starting our walk toward Berlin. Quite a difference.

Things mostly look good.

I think our biggest current lack may be Workers. We have 29 and I prefer more than that once rails come in. I think I will work on this rather than drafting. It slows us in the short term, but will make us strong in the long.

Ta-Tu-Two has high food and lower shields. It is a good city for worker production. I think we can dedicate that city to Workers. I also switch the captured Indian cities we are starving to Workers whereever it makes sense (no huge loss of shields). It starves them faster and gets us workers. Also 2 go to settlers.

Rush Factories and other stuff (such as the temple for the Whale town so it can reach the whales), Spent about 6k gold to do so.

Also I like taking the techs for Hoover from Sci Method, so I start prepping Canton for building Hoover by rushing a coal plant - It will start the prebuild next turn using the Palace. If I also use workers to maximize shields in the near future we will get it sooner. Will likely trade Atomic Theory for Rep Parts and other techs that we need.

Send some units toward Delhi including the Cannon mentioned by Todd.

Science rate can be 70% and still get Sci Meth in 2.

Also some towns had fortified MDI and Rifles. I wake these and use them to fortify the Vulnerable towns.

Agree with starving Indian towns to size 1. India is far from being eliminated.

IBT: Zulu declare on the French. A single Indian Cavalry kills a Rifle in Bangalore. Persian Cavalry attack and retreats against Rifle in Calcutta, kill a Cavalry near Hovd, and appear near Kaifeng.
Zulu and Aztecs are now at peace. Australia and Egypt ally vs Iroquois. Venezuela and Egypt are at peace.
Madras deposes us I think we lost 2 rifles including an Elite one.
Oh and Argentina declared war on the Aztecs. Not sure why this occurred after our city builds.

1300 AD: Well the flip of Madras was not good at all. Infantry appear in Madras and Delhi, so Madras does have Rubber for sure.
Capture back Madras and capture Jaipur using the Armies. Cavalry capture Punjab at the loss of one Cavalry. We gain a Leader for another Cav army. Sardis is a bit of a thorn in our side, so I use a 12 and 9 hp Cav armies to capture it.
This puts us back to 3.6k gold from 1.5. Capture 2 workers and kill of 2 Cav still on our Territory. Spend down to 2.4k for needed libraries,temples, courthouses, and such.

IBT: Indians ally the Zulu against us
Kaifeng holds off a Persian Cavalry as does Calcutta. A landing of Knights on some Island (next to the
France and Babylon at peace. Zulu declares on Aztecs again.

1305 AD: Big battle this turn is for the Indian Capitol with Infantry. Cannon bombard the city and knock 3 Vets to 4 hp.
We lose 12 hp to one Infantry. Fortunately that one was healthy. For the final defender I use a full health Sword army and win. We capture Delhi.
The knight on the island along with a Cavalry are on a Mountain so we have even odds. However, our Cavalry win both battles.

Several armies are healing.

TOE in 2 turns. Canton is now at max shields of 58 with Factory and Coal Plant. It will take aproximately 12 more turns to complete. Next player will want to sell the Coal plants (I think we have 2 - capitol and Canton) when we build Hoover


IBT: Venezuela signs peace with Aztec and Germany. France and America give peace a chance.
Lose a Rifle to a Persian Cavalry.

1310: Capture tyre, nearly losing a Cav Army (small hill town). This was allowing Persian units into our territory from the mountains around us.
Ok, that was absurd. We lose a ~14 hp sword army vs a single Cavalry on a mountain.
Attacks on Persia:
Capture Pasargadae and Antioch and Gordium.

Move 4 Cannon onto our long thin island to handle landings like last time.

Did more rushing including some Cavalry as we are low.

I am also using Conscript Rifles for easy attacks (1 hp guys). Since we are Military, i remember we have 100% chance of them becoming Regular.

IBT: Russia and Zulu Embargo us. America and India Embargo us. America is at war the the Babylons. Trade Embargo between America and Germany ends as America declares war on Germany.

Delhi deposes us. We lost an MDI and a Rifle.

1315 AD:
Big news of course is that we complete TOE and get Atomic Theory and Electronics.

Trades:
Argentina (making peace as well): Sci Method for Refining, 452 gold, and World Map
Russia: Sci Method and Refining for Rep Pars, 760 gold, Alliance vs Indians, and World Map
Egypt: Sci Method for 3470 gold, Wines, World map
Germany: Sci Method and Refining for Communism, 69 gpt, and 96 gold
Aztec: Electricity and Communism for Fascism, World Map, 20 gpt, 40 gold
Brazil: Fascism for some 270 gold, 7 gpt, and Dyes
Australia: Facsism for 1006 gold
Venezuela Fasism for 94 gpt, 140 gold, world map
Egypt 2: Atomic Theory for 22770 gold (all gold but close to full price)
Russia 2: Atomic Theory for 223 gpt and 1 gold

We have 30641 gold and 652 gpt at 100% science.
Steel is 27 turns so tanks are far away, so I go for Espionage at 17 turns. We have enough cash to steal techs if the AI gets them.
There is no Rubber near Madras, so they got it somewhere else and other Indian towns can be expected to contain Infantry.

I decided not to get 20 turn Alliances with Egypt as they are now one of the closest to us.

Build a new city in a place our cities don't currently cover called Tree.
Upgrade 39 cannon for 4.7k gold Spend 1.56 k to rush an Army, Spend 1k to Update some Rifles to Infantry.
Upgrade a few more useful buildings - we are now at 21.2k gold
Two armies are not healing. One attacks Persepolis the Persian Capitol and the other take back Delhi.

IBT: Indians pull Americans into war with us. Iroquois deal of Silk for Spices come up. I instead give the Communism.
Persia attacks and kills a 4 hp Infantry and Rifle with 2 Cavalry.

1320 AD:
Capture Persepolis, but lose 2 Cavalry against a single Cavalry. Capture 4 Cannon and 2 Trebs that I upgrade.
Capture Karachi an Indian town.
Did some drafting as we are having shortages of Infantry.
Rushed a second Army.

IBT: Russia and Germany are now at peace. Several attacks by Persia Cavalry vs Infantry. We win them
Punjab deposes us. Lose an MDI
Aztecs complete Universal Sufferage.

1325 AD: Dalandzadgad is a Persian town reachable by Artillery because of Egyptian borders. It does have one Egyptian city between it and our home but I think that would be relatively easy to take if at war with Egypt. We Bombard and then Capture with an Army - note that this was their new capitol after Persepolis fell.. This brings the town of Hamadan close enough for Artillery. We Capture this town getting a Leader in the process for another Army.
We also capture Bangalore, India's current capitol

I made the new Army 3 Infantry which I will use to island hop (can later be brought back for defense) and another one rushed to be a 4 Cavalry Army. We need more Cavalry.

Capture Punjab again.

Land 2 Armies next to Indian cities including the Infantry one. Bringing Artillery along for bombardment

Sold Refining to France for 174 gpt. Note that Egypt and India both which don't have electronics would give us 500+ and 1200+ gpt for it, but I am not selling.

IBT: Persia and Argentina ally vs Brazil. Persia declares war on France.
Germans destroy Americans
Lose a Cavalry to Persia. Infantry wins against Persian Cavalry
Indus deposes us. This is unfortunate as its size 1

1330 AD: Capture Sidon from Persia. This allows us to bombard and capture Arbela from them gaining a leader for an Army
Take back Indus.
The 3 unit armies aren't very strong so I add some more Artillery to go with it (from 2 to 6 - the other one is within reach of our island). We did kill 2 units in each town.

IBT: Russian and Argentina ally against Aztecs. France & India vs Australia. France & Germany go for peace.
Iroquois and Aztecs are at peace, Venezuela and Russia vs Babylon, remember there will be a quiz on this in your history class so you better have it all memorized, Venezuela and Russia vs Brazil.

Lost a Regular Rifle to a Persian Cavalry. See the Babylons kill an Indian Rifle
Bangalore deposes us this turn ( with Magellaen) - note that the good point of all these flips is its shrinking the cities.

1335 AD: Kill 2 more units in New Delhi the island being attacked by the Infantry Army Raze the Island town of New Bombay. Keeping it is too expensive - we would have to station enough units to take it back if it flips.
Capture Ullangom from Persia after bombardment. it was close to the Egyptian Borders. Razed New Kolhapur as its useless Tundra and we are short on town defenders. Capture Persian town of Samaria and Avignon without loss.

I had some Artillery that ended their turn in size 9 Dalandzagdad, so I decided to replace it - except I fail because the land is now in Egyptian territory

Notes:
I didn't finish 10 but I have had the game long enough.
The position is pretty disordered with Egypt being in the middle and having ROP's with both us and Persia. Be careful. Persia has been showing up with 3-5 Cav a turn, though most recently it has gone down. I think we are making a serious dent in them.
I made some move errors at the end that I had to cover. We are definitely short on Infantry but not quite as short as it appears if you look at our homelands. Some infantry should be sent back to cover cities.
I also used the Conscript Infantry to attack red-lined units. For that reason and the fact we are military, we have a lot of regular infantry instead.
I checked trades and made those that made sense on the last turn. We could trade Electronics for a bit less than 300 gpt from Egypt, or for nearly 3000 gold and over 1220 gpt from India. India sounds tempting after we have hoover and electronics is non-vital. problem with that is city flips. We would want to replace all the big ones losing their improvements - but could do so over the next turns. Myself, I would probably stay at war and try to eliminate India over the next 20-30 turns.
I have been starving the cities down to size 1. Had a size 1 flip but it had overlap with the island town.
There are Artillery with the Infantry Army but no Galleon. We really need another Galleon and Frigate for that war. We could also take some Infantry for attack vs 1 hp units.
I only have 2 armies going for the islands. I was thinking of sending the next one to sea, but it would need Galleons, Frigates to carry the Army and some Artillery. Six Artillery seemed a good number.
Egypt is at war with someone in our Area, I am not sure who - they have a lot of troops and use our ROP with them
Babylon and India are fighting. Babylon is also sending a bunch of troops.
I was going to check if we needed Embassies, but forgot. An embassy with each wouldn't be a bad idea.
7 turns to Hoover, 11 turns to Espionage. We could start a pre-build for the intel agency.
Iroquois troops are still sitting in our lands. I didn't boot them as they would likely end up somewhere else annoying and didn't want to lose their gpt. They are not a threat to us at the moment, so I would leave them be unless we want the war weariness in the future.
As you can see by the screen shot we have about 10k left. I have been rushing stuff.
I have especially been rushing units as we are so short. All the Cav have gone to Armies except a very few.

LK147_AD1335.jpg
 
The new Indian capital is a six size city on an island. Indian if officially broken!

It is another round with great progress vs. India / Persia. :goodjob:

It is 7 turns to Hoover Dam. I can't see any AI beating us there. :)
Glad to see the army hitting New Delhi. That city is really screwing with our ability to get 21 tiles under our control in Indus.

We have NO oil; however the Persia city of Choy... has it. Please wake out settler and get it underneath those two infantry. Oil is too important to risk a flip.

I agree with the need for more workers. I was peeling them from some of the cities that were either totally corrupt, or food heavy.

Our troop situations scare me to death. The number of naked towns in our core is too much. Please, rush infantry like crazy and at least get a token infantry and each border town and coastal town. I don't like it, but I can deal with interior cities naked.

What happened to all of our obsolete units that were helping to suppress resistors? Did we lose them all during the flips?
 
We are now large with 60 cities. Egypt has 53. On sheer size they are our number one threat at this point. Plus they have 65K culture. If we don't go after them soon, we could lose to culture.

I caught one very nice thing in trade possibilities. Egypt needs rubber from us. :)
I would really like to hit them before they get some. It sucks we still have 16 turns to go on deals.
If we take Atlay and Argos we won't need the RoP with Egypt anymore.

Please, NO more deals with Egypt! I hate our front right now, and want to take Egypt out.

ROSTER:
LKendter (on deck)
Todd Marshall
Greebley (just played)
CKS (up)

There is a 5th slot still open if somebody interested.
 
Great progress. I expected the Persian core would be taken out, but you even took some other cities, so that's awesome. With all the cav armies now, and with artillery, I figured cities would start falling quickly, especially as long as we're only staring down rifles.
 
Please, NO more deals with Egypt! I hate our front right now, and want to take Egypt out.

With them lacking Infantry, they need to be next before someone comes up with rubber to trade to them. We need to get anyone who might trade them rubber either on our side or embargo vs them when we declare. After Egypt, Babylon is next. Try to stay friendly with Russia and France and anyone on other landmasses that has anything to offer us, but everyone else in Eurasia/Africa needs to go.

Just to be certain, we are allowed to walk out on things where we're only RECEIVING and not SENDING right? We're getting Wines for 16 turns, but we're not sending them anything for them. If so, we could declare on them as early as 3 turns from now.
 
Just to be certain, we are allowed to walk out on things where we're only RECEIVING and not SENDING right? We're getting Wines for 16 turns, but we're not sending them anything for them. If so, we could declare on them as early as 3 turns from now.

That's right; we can break deals where we don't give anything any time we want.

I've got the save.
 
Our troop situations scare me to death. The number of naked towns in our core is too much. Please, rush infantry like crazy and at least get a token infantry and each border town and coastal town. I don't like it, but I can deal with interior cities naked.

What happened to all of our obsolete units that were helping to suppress resistors? Did we lose them all during the flips?

The situation is not quite as bad as it looks. There are units for all of them, but I made some errors on the last turn that had to be covered by 2 Infantry - such as trying to replace Dalandgadzad - I moved the settler onto the square and abandoned the city... and then moved them off and so the settler had to be covered.

Move the random junk next turn will free up enough infantry to cover certainly all the coastal cities and foreign cities at the very least.

That being said our abiltiy to expand greatly outweighs our ability to guard the cities. I started razing junk cities and I think we may have to do that even more.

Tyre in particular is no longer needed strategically. We may want to get rid of it.

For old units, we had enough cash that everything was upgraded except the MDI which still guard some of the cities that can flip. That said flips did remove a lot of the old ones. I did upgrade the Elite Horseman before it got a leader. At the time no opportunities were coming by that he could attack and I needed Cavalry. Otherwise I tried not to upgrade the Elite. Not sure if we still have the Elite Spearman for example, but I don't remember it dying.

All deals with Egypt should be non-turn based on our side. The reason we didn't ally them against our foes was so we could attack them any tiime. If this isn't the case then it was a screw-up on my part that I didn't intend.
 
Razing junk cities get tricky. To get domination we need these cities. Now if we are getting rid of oddball cities (such as Siberia, islands) disconnected from the front that is fine for now. If we can get rid of cities from India / Persia, then it is worth it. Ultimately we want them out of the game.

Even if the city is junk, but fits the front well keep it. Things should get a lot simpler once we grab Egypt's possessions in the middle of our empire. IIRC Egypt also has some pass the Persian oil city. Those are also good to grab.
Egypt / India / Persia are the main civs on the islands. Targeting Egypt also helps with operation island hopper.
The Egypt core in Africa is the next tough call with Babylon in-between.
For now let's kick Egypt out of Asia during CKS turn. We can look at the start of my turn.
IIRC Tyre is in the middle of the empire. Once we hit Egypt we don't have to worry about it.

I would have no issue with another draft round to get more units stomping out Indian resistance. That count was a lot higher then the end of Todd's turn. Not unexpected with all the gains, but I still want them gone.

I didn't think about wines from Egypt wasn't something we committed. We can go after Egypt sooner, then later. I just saw 16 turns when I looked at the game last night.
 
Sorry, I'm going to need a skip. I've come down with whatever my son has, and I'm too sick to play.
 
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