LK76 - AWE - Pangea, No armies, Random Civ

[Arathorn]

Someone I trusted said the number of workers depends on number of non-resisting citizens which in turn depends on culture - can anyone verify this?

I've heard/read the same, Greebley, from someone I trusted pretty well, as I recall, but it was an offhand comment, so I'm not sure how true it is. I tend to believe it's probably the case, but I wouldn't be too shocked to find it was in error. Maybe we read it the same place.

It tends to support some anecdotal stuff I've noted, but I've not seen any real tests designed to show this is the case.

Arathorn

 

[Zwingli]

I've gotten through 3.5 turns, but they are taking longer than expected due to micromanagement. We can reduce lux tax by 10% and jack science by 10% by having used cavalry end their turn inside unhappy cities, but it is a headache.

1750 AD (0)
Rearrange some of the infantry to prevent further Babylonian infiltration along the mountain range. Wake a stack of workers and move into position to build extra roads or rails. Start an explorer, but decide to hold off on the TOE prebuild a couple of turns to allow us to research another tech while it is constructed.

IBT-1 arial bombardment and lots of ship bombardment, but no direct attacks. The Babylonians move a couple of their stacks onto flat ground.

1752 AD (1)
Kill 3 keish, 1 cav, 1 guerilla, and 1 rifle without loss. Severely damage some of the Bab stacks on flat ground. Build road to Ereen and move a settler into position

IBT- No direct attacks, Leerdam loses pop to ship bombardment.

1754 AD (2)
The Hague and Rotterdam begin wonder prebuilds.

Found New Rotterdam and use the new borders to shell Ereen, and the city is razed giving us 4 slaves and a disappointing 0g.
In all we destroy 1 mdi, 4 longbows, 6 riflemen, 6 cavalry, and 1 keish losing 1 cavalry.

IBT- Mongols begin to retreat, perhaps targeting New Rotterdam. Another Sumerian tank comes into view.

1756 AD (3)
Kill 3 guerilla, 3 cavalry, 2 flack, 1 rifle, and 1 mdi without loss gaining a leader who rushed Holwerd's factory. Set up to build roads to the other 2 front line Mongol cities.

IBT- We defeat the Sumerian tank in defense, but a 5 pack of Sumerian Mech Infantry come into view. Our Hoover prebuild is sabatoged and our military plans are stolen.

To be continued, but it will be difficult dealing with nearly invincible mech infantry. They can retreat to heal quickly too...

 

[Greebley]

We have a few choices of the Mech inf I think. Do one hp to them every time they come at us and let them pile up at the border while we kill more killable stuff, or we can try to defend. Attacking infantry they have a bit less than 50% chance to win. Damage all but 2 and try to get them to attack 2 infantry in a town? Only problem is the planes might do a lot of damage and allow them to take a town.

Another alternative is to expend our Artillery on them and get them to 1 hp and kill them. This seems prohibitively expensive. I would rather clean up the infantry first and simply drive them back for now.

A final alternative is to use TOE to get flight and use bombers to kill redlined intruding Mechs Infs (artillery redline and bombers kill). In that case we may want to get Refining and steel before completing TOE and take combustion and flight for the free techs. (or combustion and Mass prod and research motorized transport?)

Not sure if it is worth giving up Hoover for 2 less techs to get to tanks or planes. A tough call, I think.

[Edit: if it was a single player game, I would go for tinking them every few turns and let them build up. As long as we have more artillery than they have Mech Inf, we are ok. I would still go for Hoover and build more artillery. Once I got planes and tanks, I would start trying to kill them. In the meantime I would continue to work on Mongol cities to increase my base production and support for the required artillery].

 

[LKendter]

Wake a stack of workers and move into position to build extra roads or rails.

Did I make a mistake and have idle workers?

Another alternative is to expend our Artillery on them and get them to 1 hp and kill them. This seems prohibitively expensive. I would rather clean up the infantry first and simply drive them back for now.
...
In the meantime I would continue to work on Mongol cities to increase my base production and support for the required artillery.

I think combination of these to part of the quotes sum up my position. My whole turns was pinging the big stacks and picking off the isolated pockets. That is how I cleaned up all the Sumerians near the furs and managed to raze Umma.

One Mongol city gained us 4 free workers , and is giving our second ring cities a breather. IMO we should continue to push on the Mongols as the ultimate way to stop the troops overload is to stop the AIs from building them.

I wouldn't worry about attack 12 mechs going for fortified defense 10 infantry behind walls with bombardment support. Just make sure we are infantry heavy in those cities. Let them go a bit into out territory, and then ping them. The key is to concentrate the artillery on the isolated pockets. That was how I got the awesome kill ratio. We need to destroy sheer numbers of AI units while the factories continue to come on-line. I noticed Zwingli rushed even another one.
If we run out of logical factories we always have missing stock exchanges, universities, etc.


If I counted correct Zwingli had an awesome 32-1 kill ratio. The AIs will eventually run out of troops if everyone can keep up these type of ratios.

 

[meldor]

I am back! Not that it looks like you missed me much...

 

[Zwingli]

I decided to go 10 turns again, but this will probably be the last time.

1758 AD (4)
Recheck the situation. Sumeria is down to 121g after all of their sabatoge expenditures.

The Mech Infantry can cut our rubber supply at any time, so I build a fortress + forrest on the rubber and garrison it.
Kill 5 rifles, 2 guerilla, 2 longbows, and 1 cav without losses.

IBT- Kill 1 keish in defense
Babylon fails in sabotaging our Hoover prebuild.

1760 AD (5)
Found New The Hague
Shell Baruun and destroy the city gaining 5 slaves. Also build roads toward Tesetserleg.

In all we destroy 4 keish, 4 riflemen, 1 lb, 1 jaguar, 2 guerilla, and 1 infantry (no losses).

IBT- A couple Babylonian Mech Infantry show up (they may have swapped free techs with Sumeria).

1762 AD (6)
We learn Scientific Method and start TOE. We should be able to learn Refining before the wonder completes.

Found New Utrecht and New Groningen, then use the cultural boundaries to shell Tesetserleg.
The city is razed and we sink a ship, but there are no slaves (maybe something to do with coastal cities).

In all we destroy 4 riflemen, 3 cavalry, 1 longbow, 1 infantry and 1 tank for 1 lost cavalry.

IBT- 4 mechs attack our walled cities. We kill 2 and 2 retreat.

1764 AD (7)
Found New Eindhoven to complete the new front line of cities. The Babylonians nearly cut off one of our rear cities from reinforcements, but we have just enough forces to remove their blockade.

5 Cavalry, 2 infantry, 3 riflemen, and 1 knight destroyed without losses.

IBT- We fend off 1 mech, and 2 infantry without losses (it was close though).

1766 AD (8)
Found New Arnhem to trap large stacks of healing Babylonian infantry/riflemen in our territory.

Our cavalry are battered by Mech Infantry ZOC shots, but we still manage to kill 2 guerilla, 3 infantry, 2 keish, 1 rifle, and 2 cavalry without losses.

IBT- We hold off a tank (retreats) and a Mech Infantry (destroyed). Sumerian bombers destroy one of our front line walls.

1768 AD (9)
Mechs aren't all retreating after injury and their ZOC is making movement difficult. I take a stab at one of the redlined Mechs, but lose an elite cavalry and decide it isn't worth it. Also begin railing to push into the next line of Mongol cities.

In all we kill 3 rifles, 2 keish, 1 MDI, 2 cavalry, 1 tank, and 1 infantry for 2 lost cavs.

IBT- Sumeria is up to 4 bombers again, and destroys the temple in Gordium before borders expand.

1770 AD (10)
Found New Maastricht to gain access to Mandalgovi. We raze the city gaining a treb + 5 slaves.

In all 4 rifles, 3 keish, 1 cav, 1 MDI, and 2 longbowmen are killed for no losses.

Post-Turn
By blocking the southern mountains, you can prevent the Babylonians from forming a conga-line to the core cities. A damaged Bab stack is heading toward the northern mountains outside of our culture borders, but stationing a couple units (once we have spares) will turn them around. I have stationed many of our damaged cavalry in coastal cities in order to serve as police units, as well as a cardbord defense against marines.

 

[Greebley]

Welcome back, Meldor. The enemy units have gotten nasty. We can definitely use your (what I consider) solid careful play style. Losing units is going to be way to easy.

[Edit: Cross-post...

Excellent work vs the Mongols Zwingli!

It looks like a city on the hill near Tabriz and then a line across from the inland sea will greatly reduce the size of our front line which will definitely help.

The power graph is very encouraging. We are finally picking up steam it seems and gaining in power.

 

[LKendter]

A positively awesome kill ratio of 114-4.

I would say the Mongols were well

I notice the nice stack of dyes on the map. Taking control of a fifth luxury would really help us. That is probably the majority of the worlds dyes so we can really screw the AIs by taking it over. Nothing kills AI production faster than lack of luxuries.


My only current worry is more infantry. We are really gambling here. Sooner or later we are going to crap out with marines and watch a core coastal city be captured, or even razed.

==========================

Signed up:
LKendter
Greebley
Zwingli
hotrod0823 (currently playing)
Meldor (on deck)

Our general game plan:
1) Science research must be very aggressive with deficit spending if we can afford it. Please - NO taxmen.
2) Try to build the roads before the city to take maximum advantage of the 3 tile city plans.
3) For the most part raze all cities unless they have a useful wonder

Remember 5 to 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
Additional restriction: No armies

 

[hotrod0823]

I've got it

Hotrod

 

[LKendter]

The good news is the stats are finally moving big time. We gained 4% of the world area in just 10 turns. 31% is still a long way from winning, but we are heading the correct direction.

We have dyes visible for luxury #5. There is a visible backup source for rubber. The resource situation improved quite a bit.

Zwingli turn ending at +2 cavalry, +4 artillery and +11 infantry. That is despite two cities tied up on wonders. The best news of all is the free worker count went from 17 to 31. That count almost doubled. We can always use more workers, but at least the numbers improved a lot.

 

[Zwingli]

Assuming we can keep juggling the Babylonian stacks, I think this is a reasonable settlement plan to secure rubber and dyes (red dots) and fill up the vacant land. In order to come up with 9 settlers, we will have to skim a few off of large cities. Eindhoven, Middleburg, and Haarlem can each build a settler while losing only unimproved tiles or specialists from pop loss. I suspect that the dye city will quickly become the focus of Sumerian attacks, so we should have plenty of infantry ready when we found it.

 

[LKendter]

It is hard to judge the dyes city without seeing exactly where the Sumerian city is. I would prefer setter on the dyes, but can't tell what type of danger that puts for a flip and / or attack.

I agree we have several cities that we can peel settlers from. I know the old border cities were suffering citizens that weren't that well used. We may need to get the marginal courthouse cities building some settlers...

Either way I will be very happy to have a spare rubber source.

 

[LKendter]

Signed up:
LKendter
Greebley
Zwingli
hotrod0823 (currently playing) Looking for at least a partial update. Had 2 nights to play so far.
Meldor (on deck)

Our general game plan:
1) Science research must be very aggressive with deficit spending if we can afford it. Please - NO taxmen.
2) Try to build the roads before the city to take maximum advantage of the 3 tile city plans.
3) For the most part raze all cities unless they have a useful wonder

Remember 5 to 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
Additional restriction: No armies

 

[hotrod0823]

Working on it will have it back tonight.

 

[hotrod0823]

1770 AD (0): Scope things out and there is nothing to change . Take out a redlined mech but

get no leader. 2 other mechs are redlined but decide I can't spare the units right now.

INBT: Not much to speak of some bombings but minimal damages. Lots of movement but no

attackers.

1772 AD (1): Amsterdam builds infantry starts another. Maastricht builds cavs starts another. Kill

2 redlined Mechs and the second gives us a Great Leader. Bomb and raze Batshireet. Take out

another redlined mech. Take 2 Keshiks. Wound a bunch of other units in the north.

INBT: Sidon is hit and captured because I moved the infantry to cover the new worker

stack. will take it back next turn.

1774 AD (2): Not sure what changed but 1 town riots and scroll to see another that almost did.

. Sidon is our again. More bombings but there are not many units to kill. Take 2 longbows out, take out a redlined mech. Moving a small exploring stack into Mongol territory next to the new size 1 town. Pillage Mongol rubber with our explorer. Need to get a force of artillery together and think about making a move on the dyes town. Settlers are in the works and should be ready soon but not sure if it is soon enough. Hate to use gold to rush them .

Continues... Had some problems with my civ disk but got them straightend out so I can continue.

 

[LKendter]

1770 AD (0): Take out a redlined mech but get no leader.

How bad of losses are we taking here? Cavalry vs. 1 hp mech is 50 / 50 at best.


72 hours and 5 turns not completed.

 

[hotrod0823]

INBT: More of the same retreat, move in bomb etc etc. Lose a merc to a Mongol infantry. Take out about 3-4 Aztec cavs in defense but lose 2 merc.

1776 AD (3): More bombings. Kill Aztec rifles, Mongol longbows. Cleanup about 6 Mongol rifles and start assembling a stack to go for the dyes. The babylon stack is still strong and may be a problem. Reinforce the Northern town of Samaria.

INBT: More bombings. Babs it appears are heading to north Mountains to get to the last area that can heal up.

1778 AD (4): Continue to bomb the Babs stack heading north. Take out half a dozen Aztec cavs, along with 5 mongol rifles on the way to the dye towns.

1780 AD (5): The Sumarian mechs make a play for our rubber source 2 vet infantry are killed. Can't remember when I took the elite off but it was foolish. Make the rubber our priority and it is our again but had to kill 3 red lined Mechs at a cost of 1 cav and 1 infantry. Fortunately these were the only loses this round. Bomb the babs and continue to take random Mongol and Aztec units out. Moving to get a stack to take Choyr and then head north on Almarikh.

 

[LKendter]

Take out about 3-4 Aztec cavs in defense but lose 2 merc.

Sounds like we still badly need more infantry.

============================

Signed up:
LKendter (on deck)
Greebley
Zwingli
hotrod0823
Meldor (currently playing)

Our general game plan:
1) Science research must be very aggressive with deficit spending if we can afford it. Please - NO taxmen.
2) Try to build the roads before the city to take maximum advantage of the 3 tile city plans.
3) For the most part raze all cities unless they have a useful wonder

Remember 5 to 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
Additional restriction: No armies

 

[Greebley]

In Roosendaal, switch 1 or 2 citizens to Civil Engineers. Lets get the temple built quickly so the enemy can't heal in our backlands.

I think we need more defense in Sidon. During my turns, I would have lost the city with the defense as low as it is now to Aztec Cavalry. I see one or two that can be spared - there are two guarding 1 mountain vs a 1 hp Mech Inf. Enshede can have a lesser unit for a turn or two. draft, etc.

 

[meldor]

I see it and will get to work on it.