LK82 - Science Experiment II Invitational, Spain, Deity

[Greebley]

I would give Seville the 2 shield square from Barcelona to speed the FP.

I would buy Theology for 639 gold from Carthage. It seems worth cutting 5 turns off our research. We really want to keep up. Note that this is easily less than 1/2 (it is less than half of monotheism). The tech tree narrows here so we are unlikely to be first.

After buying gunpowder(assuming we can without killing research), I would go Education, then banking in the hopes we can be the first to banking doing this.

 

[LKendter]

70 AD
(IT) America and the Vikings ally vs. the Zulu.
The palace gets its first expansion.


110 AD
I doubt the Zulu will collapse in 20 turns. I ship them horses for Silks and Ivory. The luxury tax drops to $0.


130 AD
(IT) Theology completes, and education is next. I want to get to astronomy and our UU.


150 AD
I ship the Iroquois Theology and $60 and we get gunpowder. We have no saltpeter, and I can't even spot a nearby source.

American has chemistry for sale, but theology isn't close to half the price.


170 AD
I give America theology for Gems and $12. Based on how little they valued it toward gunpowder, I suspect they are researching it right now.
(IT) We are starting to slip on tech as Carthage is building Copernicus.


==========================

Summary:
When the luxury deal runs out with the Zulu we may want to turn on them. They are starting to lose the edge. DON'T renew the luxury deal if they are still at war. I am not so sure about them last much past 20 turns.

My push we to get cheap churches built. I upgrade our horseman to knights. I starting replacing our warriors with pikeman and disbanding the obsolete regular warriors.

I switch the worker city to Vitoria as it is on a good every 4th turn cycle. I hated having Toledo with completed buildings on working duty.

Signed up:
LKendter
Greebley (currently playing)
Microbe (on deck)
Gozpel
Kaiser_Berger


Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
Don't forget the variant rules listed in the first post.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/LK82-250AD.zip

 

[gozpel]

The traditional Printing Press?

That cracked me up!

 

[Kaiser_Berger]

Indeed, nearly fell off my chair myself

 

[LKendter]

I am glad some people enjoyed printing press. That was such a sore subject with me last game that I can't laugh at it. Didn't matter in the end cause we couldn't do a thing against the monster Iroquois...

 

[Greebley]

Ok I got it.

If we get Education and we find that Banking isn't yet known do we want to go for Astronomy even though it is known, or do we want to try to do a run on Banking for trading?

 

[LKendter]

If banking isn't known, then go for banking and hope we can get astronomy in trade.

I would like our UU and to have the option for a GA.

 

[Greebley]

Preturn: Everything looks in shape.
This Lux deal with the Zulu looks very dangerous. It also means we won't get any of their cities. We will see. Maybe they can hold on.

IBT: We get disease in Murcia

260 AD: Not much

IBT: A minor Zulu city falls on our border.

270 AD: Move some Knights.

IBT: We lose our Ivory

280 AD: Well our deal with the Zulu is gone. I am not sure if we took a rep hit... Hmmm, we seem to be ok. They may have lost the Lux or it may have been a pure per turn deal. In any case we get riots and have no deal with the Zulu.

Declare war on the Zulu. 2 of the 3 towns on our border have fallen. I want some of the spoils.

We attack and Capture Alesund.

IBT: Americans moving on the Zulu

290 AD: Head to the next closest town. We may not get it due to competition.

IBT: Zulu kill a knight with a longbow. The longbow is killed by American horses.

300 AD: Don't attack as I don't think we have a chance of taking the city. If it doesn't fall, I will attack next turn.

IBT: City doesn't fall this turn. It will fall next turn as the Vikings have a big stack next to it. Another nearby city falls. We get Education.
Forbidden Palace Completes!

310 AD: We can trade Education, 16 gpt, and 22 gold for Chemistry. Banking is known.
I trade Education, 46 gpt, and 7 gold for Metallurgy. Think hard on this one. Education is over half, but 46 gpt is still steep
I get 10 gpt and 25 gold from the Iroqois from Metallurgy.

Carthage and Vikings have Mil Tradition, Banking, and Astronomy over us.

The next tech will be Astronomy for our UU (29 turns). We need a golden age.

We capture the Zulu town Zanguin. I start a settler to try to grab another badly needed Lux.

320 AD: Healing and moving up new units.

330 AD: Still moving up units

340 AD: Send our Knights off again.

350 AD: Find a Zulu City with Saltpeter!! We have a good chance of grabbing this city and may be able to make Cavalry soon.

Notes:
The settler and Pike are heading to the S of the Ivory near Zanguin. That square is civ distance 3 or more from the Viking cities and claims us a lux. We badly need another lux.

 

[LKendter]

The next tech will be Astronomy for our UU (29 turns). We need a golden age.

The killing of the GPT deal even if it was "under half".

How did the attacment sneak it? I didn't see it when I first read the post.

==============================

Signed up:
LKendter
Greebley
Microbe (currently playing)
Gozpel (on deck)
Kaiser_Berger


Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
Don't forget the variant rules listed in the first post.

 

[Greebley]

Here is our chance for Saltpeter and another Lux:

 

[LKendter]

If Blue dot is your proposed city for Ivory, then DON'T build it. That site overlaps the first ring of Zimbabwe. I saw the obscene stack of Viking Berserks heading toward the Zulu cities. That stack would eat us alive. I simply don't want to annoy the Vikings at they strongest point in the game.
That city won't be around if it get to my turn. The Vikings scare me to death at this time.

Signed up:
LKendter
Greebley
Microbe (currently playing)
Gozpel (on deck)
Kaiser_Berger

 

[microbe]

oooo~I've been waiting for this. Got it.

 

[microbe]

Notes:
The settler and Pike are heading to the S of the Ivory near Zanguin. That square is civ distance 3 or more from the Viking cities and claims us a lux. We badly need another lux.

But the dot is 2-tile away from Zimbabwe. Do we still want to found it?

 

[microbe]

I'm posting a partial report as I have some questions.

preturn: nothing to change. IBT a Zulu longbow comes out of Bapedi and kills someone in the fog. Lots of Viking units move toward Zulu.

(1)360AD: We kill two impi and capture Bapedi. Two resistors. One knight retreats but the other kills pike and we capture Isipezi. We have saltpeter now.

IBT Vikings retreat? Zulu and Netherlands make peace.

(2)370AD: Bapedi flips back to Zulu. We lost two knights.

(3)380AD: we kill a musket and capture back Bapedi.

(4)390AD: nothing.

IBT Netherlands declare on Vikings. Carthage wants to exchange TM and I decline.

(5)400AD: we give 24g to Netherlands.

11gpt+92g to renew lux deal with America.

(6)410AD: America declares on Vikings. Aztecs start Copernicus.

(7)420AD: Aztec doesn't have Banking or Military Tradition, but it doesn't know America. We have 7 turns left for Astronomy.

Now come the questions.

1. We can buy Astronomy by 37gpt from Aztecs, trade for Banking or Military Tradition and hopefully get our money back by trading back to Aztecs.

The problem is that I do not know for sure if this falls into "half price" since Greebley didn't tell the number of beakers needed when he started the research. Also, as more and more AI know about it the price has been constantly declining, so the whole method isn't accurate. I'm a bit lost here. But given the turns we've researched, and the gpt we paid for Education, I think it's over half now. [on the other hand, self-research would cost 7 turns with 68 beakers/turn, seems cheaper than buying.]

I hope we can make the trade as that allows us to trigger our GA.

And if we trade, I guess we should be able to get both Banking+Military Tradition from America by our only iron plus Astronomy.

2. I haven't founded the ivory town as it's too flip risky and irritating to the AI. I might try to raze the wines city and replace it there.

 

[microbe]

Anyway I believe 37gpt is less than half of the tech cost, and I'm impatient so I went ahead and played the rest of the turns.

Reasons: 1. Greebley researched 5 turns and I did 6 turns, and only 7 turns were left.
2. Greebley paid 46gpt for Metallurgy. Given Metallurgy tech cost is 64 and Astronomy is 56, we should be able to buy Astronomy by no more than 40gpt.

However, if there is a remote chance that this is considered invalid I could always replay.

I buy Astronomy+2g from Aztecs by 37gpt. Iron+Astronomy give us Banking+Military Tradition from America. With saltpeter we do not need iron for the next 20 turns.

Aztec has an extra iron. Good thing it doesn't know America. I sell Banking back to get 20gpt+1g. So in the end we only paid 17gpt to Aztecs.

Vikings have Physics and some have Navigation.

Set research to Physics in 38 turns (with 45 beakers/turn).

I start our UU.

(8)430AD: I sign RoP with America to get to Zulu faster. Vikings have 3381g.

IBT Vikings and America make peace with Zulu. Yeah they should focus on each other. But I wish I had MA'ed with America in the iron deal.

(9)440AD: more knights group next to Tugela.

(10)450AD: 6 knights attack, kill 2 pikes and 1 impi, and we raze the city by only one hp, losing one night in the process. We gain 6 slaves. Settler goes to claim the wines.

Note: we have 5 knights healing. Settler should go to the red dot to settle (which has no culture conflict with adjacent towns).

Our UUs are on the way toward Ibabnago. Let's use knights (you can try to upgrade 1 or 2) first, and use UU to kill impi or LBM or injured pikes. During GA we can push for universities and banks.

We have another settler on the way too.

We better send a couple more units to the saltpeter town to avoid flip risk.

 

[microbe]

 

[Greebley]

Lee,

That city does not actually overlap the first ring of Zimbabwe. It is civ distance 3 even though it is 2 movement. I have done testing on this and it is as safe as any other distance 3 city. We could really use that Lux. Also I feel we will be at war with the vikings soon enough so we can destroy the nearby cities to the Ivory and reduce the flip chance. I still think we should build it.

Your deal is safe Microbe. When I looked on my turns, astronomy was one more turn to research than Metallurgy, so you could have paid up to 50gpt and been under. Grabbing the trade was the right thing.

Our next step is to get a golden age so we can research at a normal pace even with our outstanding gpt.

Given that everyone is attacking the Vikings, I feel that should be our next war and should start as soon as the deals run out and Zulu's are taken care of. Cavalry vs berserkers will be easy. Our long line of defense will be the only issue.

 

[microbe]

We do not have any deals with Vikings. However, we need a lot more military and in GA I would assume we should push for banks and universities?

I do not understand why you say the proposed ivory town doesn't overlap with Zimbabwe's first ring. As far as I can see, it does.

 

[LKendter]

I buy Astronomy+2g from Aztecs by 37gpt. Iron + Astronomy give us Banking + Military Tradition from America. With saltpeter we do not need iron for the next 20 turns.

This was technically a rules violation. However, the logic for the deal is valid about iron being unneeded. Effective immediately I am removing the below rule.
4) We can't trade away our only resource / luxury to get techs.
I still hate the fact that we are playing Russian roulette with our rep. If the iron expires we are in deep trouble.
However, I can't make avoiding Russian roulette one of the variant rules.

 

[LKendter]

That city does not actually overlap the first ring off a city.

I am still totally baffled on what you see. Either red dot on the below map would overlap with a first ring city. Can you show me a close up picture with the grid on to explain the spot you see.

I would move Microbe's proposed red dot to yellow dot. Red dot overlaps with America at the spot marked X. Yellow dot insures all 21 tiles after that annoying Zulu city is gone. Yellow dot gets us BOTH wines for more trade potential in the future.