LotR 2 - Zealous Zulus (Monarch variant)
- Thread starter Arathorn
- Start date
Sirian
Designer, Mohawk Games
I won't have time to play today, Arathorn. I should be able to squeeze a turn in in the next 48, but no sense cutting Jester off this afternoon unless you plan to skip me, too.
That does bring up a point, though. A number of SG's in which I am playing have gone astray. Players taking extra time, lots of defaulted turns, and rarely are players figuring out up front (and announcing immediately, much less ahead of time) that they can't play. So it drags for days and then maybe they figure it out and say Skip Me. That's rather too late, the rhythm of the game gets interrupted.
The RBD players were collectively very pumped up and into it on a daily basis for a while. We seem to have cooled our jets, and some maybe more than others. I would think that in our games, we're going to have to recognize that and do something about.
One idea I have is hard deadlines. No more flexibility, no more patience. Post got it within the specified limit or you're passed, post your result within the specific limit or you're passed. The flexible way worked out for a while, but players' attention, at least in the RBD games, has... wandered. And waned. Still some good interest, but not as much hunger.
The other idea I have is longer times. Coupled with the hard deadlines, and an understanding that players are supposed to make every reasonable effort to stay on time.
No idea if these would help or be futile, but those are the best plans I've come up with to do something about it.
There's even one game (one of my babies) in which I'm up and have been up for over a week. I did say to skip me, though, as soon as the next player is ready, or really anybody ready to take a turn, and that hasn't happened yet. But I have too many other concerns to worry about it, so even though I CUT BACK on my SG's I still seem to have too many.
RBD19, with a HARD one-strike-you're-out deadline, but a ten day time limit, has so far seen nobody late or MIA. Whether that's an indication of anything or not... I'm too busy to figure out!
- Sirian
That does bring up a point, though. A number of SG's in which I am playing have gone astray. Players taking extra time, lots of defaulted turns, and rarely are players figuring out up front (and announcing immediately, much less ahead of time) that they can't play. So it drags for days and then maybe they figure it out and say Skip Me. That's rather too late, the rhythm of the game gets interrupted.
The RBD players were collectively very pumped up and into it on a daily basis for a while. We seem to have cooled our jets, and some maybe more than others. I would think that in our games, we're going to have to recognize that and do something about.
One idea I have is hard deadlines. No more flexibility, no more patience. Post got it within the specified limit or you're passed, post your result within the specific limit or you're passed. The flexible way worked out for a while, but players' attention, at least in the RBD games, has... wandered. And waned. Still some good interest, but not as much hunger.
The other idea I have is longer times. Coupled with the hard deadlines, and an understanding that players are supposed to make every reasonable effort to stay on time.
No idea if these would help or be futile, but those are the best plans I've come up with to do something about it.
There's even one game (one of my babies) in which I'm up and have been up for over a week. I did say to skip me, though, as soon as the next player is ready, or really anybody ready to take a turn, and that hasn't happened yet. But I have too many other concerns to worry about it, so even though I CUT BACK on my SG's I still seem to have too many.
RBD19, with a HARD one-strike-you're-out deadline, but a ten day time limit, has so far seen nobody late or MIA. Whether that's an indication of anything or not... I'm too busy to figure out!
- Sirian
Jester is skipped! The 24/72 rules announced at the beginning will be enforced, barring an announcement BEFORE the delay that it will occur (e.g. saying "I'll be gone all day Friday but will get it Saturday if I come up" is perfectly acceptable and counts like an "I got it" before the fact). 72 hours to play is pretty reasonable -- that's three days. The 24 to claim is to keep things moving.
Sirian, you have 24 hours to post "I got it" and 72 to play. You said you needed 48 hours; you've got more than that.
I hate to be a hard-@$$ about this, but I think enforcing the rules is the best way to go. I probably would have done it earlier, but I was off the 'Net all weekend.
Jester, you're still quite welcome to play the next round.
Everybody, please patch. We will continue this game 1.21f.
Arathorn
Sirian, you have 24 hours to post "I got it" and 72 to play. You said you needed 48 hours; you've got more than that.
I hate to be a hard-@$$ about this, but I think enforcing the rules is the best way to go. I probably would have done it earlier, but I was off the 'Net all weekend.
Jester, you're still quite welcome to play the next round.
Everybody, please patch. We will continue this game 1.21f.
Arathorn
"Apr 20, 2002 04:00 AM"
That's the date-posted for my "got it" post.
That means that, it being not yet April 23, I have at least another day left, right?
Am I missing something here? I'm not overdue, and I'm certainly not WAY overdue.
Not that I would mind being skipped if I was (or even, really, if I wasn't, I'm not uptight about this stuff), but I believe I'm still in the running here.
Correct me if I'm wrong.
Jester
Edit: Oh, I get it!
"Progress may seem slow...
... but this game comes around FAST!
Or is it just me?
Regardless, I've got it.
Jester"
That post was my "got it". Sorry if I didn't get to the point quickly enough. I usually just use a succinct "got it" in the title. Apologies for the confusion, it now makes sense why you thought I was overdue.
That's the date-posted for my "got it" post.
That means that, it being not yet April 23, I have at least another day left, right?
Am I missing something here? I'm not overdue, and I'm certainly not WAY overdue.
Not that I would mind being skipped if I was (or even, really, if I wasn't, I'm not uptight about this stuff), but I believe I'm still in the running here.
Correct me if I'm wrong.
Jester
Edit: Oh, I get it!
"Progress may seem slow...
... but this game comes around FAST!
Or is it just me?
Regardless, I've got it.
Jester"
That post was my "got it". Sorry if I didn't get to the point quickly enough. I usually just use a succinct "got it" in the title. Apologies for the confusion, it now makes sense why you thought I was overdue.
Sirian
Designer, Mohawk Games
I'm not patched yet. Skip me until further notice.
- Sirian
- Sirian
WHOOPS! MY BAD! 
Very sorry, Jester. You did indeed claim the game. I just flat-out missed that post. You are absolutely correct.
It has been close to 72 hours since your claim, but please go ahead and play.
If you've not patched yet, Jester, play with 1.17f so Sirian can get one more turn before we patch. If you have patched, that's fine, just play with 1.21f and we'll skip Sirian until he has patched and notifies us.
UGH! What a mess I've made of this.
Arathorn
Very sorry, Jester. You did indeed claim the game. I just flat-out missed that post. You are absolutely correct.It has been close to 72 hours since your claim, but please go ahead and play.
If you've not patched yet, Jester, play with 1.17f so Sirian can get one more turn before we patch. If you have patched, that's fine, just play with 1.21f and we'll skip Sirian until he has patched and notifies us.
UGH! What a mess I've made of this.
Arathorn
I'll play this game tonight, really I will. I've got the time to do it and everything! But it's going to get pretty close to the 72 hour mark.
Just to check in!
Jester
Edit: This just got a little muckier, wasn't expecting to be playing diablo quite so late... I might need a little more time, but I'll try to get it done before the evening is out. If not, early tomorrow, don't want to slow the game down too much. Thanks.
Just to check in!
Jester
Edit: This just got a little muckier, wasn't expecting to be playing diablo quite so late... I might need a little more time, but I'll try to get it done before the evening is out. If not, early tomorrow, don't want to slow the game down too much. Thanks.
Sorry, guys. I was going to play this last night, but RL got in the way, and now I'm not going to be at a computer with my CD until late tonight, at best.
My bad, I thought I had it planned out, but, as Bob Dylan said, Things Have Changed.
Skip me if someone can pick this up quickly, I wouldn't want to slow the game down. If I'm not skipped, I'll play it as soon as I can.
Jester
My bad, I thought I had it planned out, but, as Bob Dylan said, Things Have Changed.
Skip me if someone can pick this up quickly, I wouldn't want to slow the game down. If I'm not skipped, I'll play it as soon as I can.
Jester
Boy, what a wall we've hit here...
Sirian said to be skipped until further notice.
cpp1, that would mean you can jump in here if you've got the time to play before tonight. If you do so, PLEASE post as soon as you've grabbed the game, so that you and Jester don't both play.
Jester, please check before playing and post (or edit your last post) that you have started.
cpp1, if Jester hasn't posted by 11:00 pm the 25th, we'll consider him RL'd to death this round and you can go.
Oy.
Arathorn
Sirian said to be skipped until further notice.
cpp1, that would mean you can jump in here if you've got the time to play before tonight. If you do so, PLEASE post as soon as you've grabbed the game, so that you and Jester don't both play.
Jester, please check before playing and post (or edit your last post) that you have started.
cpp1, if Jester hasn't posted by 11:00 pm the 25th, we'll consider him RL'd to death this round and you can go.
Oy.
Arathorn
Toecheese3
Stinky Feet
When my turn comes around - please skip me this round as well. I'm on mandatory overtime right now and rarely have time for my wife let alone Civ.
I'm not going anywhere, just this turn (and maybe the next depending on work load)
I'm not going anywhere, just this turn (and maybe the next depending on work load)
cpp1
Warlord
In the interest of keeping the game moving, I've picked it up. It's past the 72 hours for Jester to play, and Sirian said to skip him until further notice. However, it won't be long until its back to Jester because I'll play, ToeCheese asked to be skipped, Arathorn plays, and then it's Jester's turn.
This will be the first 1.21 turn, so please update your Civ3 for future turns everyone!
This will be the first 1.21 turn, so please update your Civ3 for future turns everyone!
cpp1
Warlord
Here's the executive summary: Cumae flipped to us again (3rd time?) and we are holding it. We conquered Xinjian in the south. It still needs a road to it and the ivory connected. We have Smith's Trading Post and Wall Street. The 3rd leader was used for a bank. The Romans showed up with an army that gave me fits but we destroyed it.
1250AD Preturn: Shuffle a musket to Hlobane and Hlobanes pike to Unfolozi. I want to have 2 garrison units in Umfolozi so that if Cumae flips again the caravel there can bring in reinforcements in 1 move. Also change Intombes production to musket since I pulled one out and its at 12 shields/turn, perfect for the 60 shield musket. At New Bapedi, I move a musket further into the mountain chain so the 2 Greek longbows cant get to a another mountain this turn. The mountain the musket left is then covered by an impi and an elite knight.
Russia - +Chemistry, +Economics, +Democracy, 18 cities, Monarchy, weak military
China - +Democracy, +Economics, 11 cities, Republic, weak military
Greece - +Chemistry, +Economics, +Democracy, 17 cities, Monarchy, weak military
Iroquois even tech, 14 cities, Republic, weak military
Rome - +Chemistry, +Economics, +Democracy, 15 cities, Republic, weak military
Aztec - ?, ?, Monarchy, strong military
English - ?, ?, ?, ?
Egyptians - ?, ?, ?, ?
Had to increase science to 60% (+12 gpt) to get Economics in 2 turns, before 1.21 it was 40% to get Economics in 2 turns.
1250-1260AD 2 Greek longbows attack New Bapedi and lose. Ulundi produces a knight. Intombe produces a musket. New Bapdi gets walls. People plant nices shrubs in front of the palace. Greeks are building Smiths Trading Company. Greeks sending a hoplite and 7 longbows towards New Bapedi. Russians sending 2 spears and 5 longbows to New Zimbabwe, and Romans have 2 longbows and a knight going towards New Zimbabwe and an honest-to-goodness army with 2 knights and a longbow going towards New Ulundi or Intombe. Why did they stick the longbow in? Now their army says a defence of 2 and movement of 1. Do individual units defend at their regular values or at the army value, I wonder. Along with the army is a pike and knight.
1255AD Down south, I move a musket to the mountain just SW of Tientsin to guard that tile and then move in 3 catas from Tientsin. They take 3 shots at an elite Iro spear and knock of 2 hp. I move the knight army and 2 other knights onto a hill 2 tiles from Xinjian hoping to take a shot at it next turn. I change Khambula to a musket, need more garrison troops here to hold mountains and cities. Nothing to do around New Bapedi but wait for attacks. At Yakutsk, an elite knight goes after a Russian regular spear and just wins with 1 hp left. Move a knight and cata to safer spot near Intombe and wait to see what Romans are up to.
1255-1260AD Romans ask for peace, rejected. Roman knight dies attacking Yakutsk. 3 Russian longbows die attacking iron hill where 2 muskets are fortified. We learn Economics. I go for Democracy next, we seem to be holding our own militarily and I want to get Shakespeare if possible. Mpondo builds a knight. Anyang goes into anarchy because it grows 1 and I didnt check. An entertainer is hired. Cumae revolts to our side. We have an impi as garrison, I order walls and hurry them for 80 gold. We capture 3 workers just outside Cumae and I bring them into the city. Our caravel will transport them home next turn. Now we have an impi and musket fortified in the city and another musket on a mountain nearby, where he captured a worker.
Around Intombe is a dilemma. I dont have enough troops to take out the 3 knights, 1 pike, and the knight army this turn. I decide to go after the 2 forward knights, wait on the other troops, since theyre slower, with the exception of one knight who is further to the rear. 4 catas get 1 hit on 2 different knights. Our elite knight takes out a wounded Roman knight without taking any hits. Our vet knight from Intombe goes out and kills the other wounded Roman knight and becomes elite. An elite knight at New Zimbabwe attack a wounded longbow on a hill, wins losing 1hp and produces a Great Leader, Cetshwayo!
He is hurried to Ulundi for Smiths but doesnt make it there this turn. We change Ulundis production from knight (in 4 turns) to cata (in 1 turn) because production will be interrupted next turn anyway. Party time in New Bapedi! 3 Greek longbows just camped outside the city on grassland, tempting our 6 surrounding knights. Too bad theres only one vet knight there that can be promoted. He tries his luck and wins with no hp loss, but no promo either. 2 other elite knights take out the 2 remaining longbows.
The knight army in the south takes Xinjian. There are 2 resisters, I move in 2 more knights to help hold the city until some muskets get there. I decide to move 2 knights from New Bapedi down toward Ngome to help with enemy troops there know that the knight army and 2 other knights are in Xinjian. Road is completed to Anyang, so the entertainer is not needed anymore.
1260-1265AD We lose a pike near Intombe to the Roman army. We also lose a musket on iron hill to a longbow, but first it kills another longbow. Romans invade with more knights toward Intombe. Greeks seem to be running away from Anyang area. Ulundi builds a cata. Starvation at Cumae, and it builds walls. Starts on temple. Resistance ends at Xinjian. Anyang builds a cata.
1265AD First we must use the leader. He goes to Ulundi, and get Adam Smith to join him next turn to build the Trading Post. In Cumae, the impi goes to the Roman iron hill to try and pillage next turn. The 2 muskets fortify behind walls in Cumae. No sign of attack yet there. Once again at Intombe there are 2 knights, a pike, and the knight army. I decide to attack the 2 knights again because they can pillage but the army cant this turn. We again get 1 hp damage on each with the catas and kill them with our knights. I bring over an elite knight and elite musket from Yakutsk to help with fighting in Intombe. I hurry walls at Xinjian and note that the only possible attackers this turn are a musket, hoplite, and spear. Ill take my chances on defence with the knight army (10/18) and a healthy elite knight and healthy vet knight. I kill a longbow at Bapedi that wandered into grassland.
While attacking a longbow in plains near Khambula, our elite knight wins with 1 hp damage and gets a great leader, Mpand! I am probably going to send him to Ngome and build a bank there after the marketplace is done in 2 turns.
1265-1270AD Musket on our iron hill takes down 2 longbows but dies on the 3rd. Impi on Roman iron hill dies to longbow. First Russian knights spotted near Yakutsk. 2 Chinese riders show up near Xinjian. Roman army defeats our musket near Intombe but is down to (3/12) hp so Im going after it this turn. Catas bombard a protecting pike down to 2/4 hp. Our elite knight attacks and dies, their pike becomes elite, now 2/5 hp. My first loss of a knight so far. Another vet knight attacks and kill the pike. Another elite knight attacks the army and wins!
We kill 2 longbows down south near Ngome, and then facethe problem of the 2 Chinese riders.
1270-1275AD Russians lose 2 knights attacking Yakutsk. Greeks land hoplite near Hlobane. Zimbabwe has produced a knight. Ngome has produced a marketplace, just in time to use the leader for a bank.
1275AD I kill 1 spear and 5 longbows up north. Also kill the hoplite that landed near Hlobane. I bombard a stack of musket and hoplite down south but decide to hold off the knight attack because 2/3 catas missed. I hurry a cata in Yakutsk. Its under constant attack and only cost 20 gold.
1275-1280AD We build a musket, catapult, and bank in Ngome. Russians lose longbow trying out 2 muskets near our iron mountain. Cool, a Russian knight just ran past Yakutsk and took 1 hp of damage even though I had no catapult there!
1280AD Down south near Tiensin, catas get a pike down to 1hp, finished off by an elite knight. Catas also get a longbow down to 1hp, also finished off by an elite knight. In that battle we get our 3rd great leader Zwelithini! Since 5 banks will be done in 2 turns, I decide to send him up to Ulundi and build Wall Street there. Time to crank up the gold! Ulundi is changed from knight to musket, since that will also finish in 2 turns. Up north I kill a Roman knight and Russian longbow.
1280-1285AD One impi in the south kills a longbow and retreats before another. We learn democracy. Following the AI lead, I go for Chemistry next. I decline to change governments to Democracy. Hlobane builds a worker, Intombe builds a musket, Umfolozi goes into cicil disorder, I need 2 entertainers there! Any tips on how to quickly detect disorder next turn are greatly appreciated. Iro galley lets off a longbow near Umtata.
1285AD Feeling foolish, I bombard the Iro longbow with a cata before attacking with a vet knight. The cara hits, the knight attacks and loses! An elite impi attacks, and retreats with 1hp, but not before making the longbow elite. A vet impi attacks, and retreats with 1hp after not doing any damage. Another vet impi finally beats him. On the Roman front we bombard a pike to 1hp and send in a vet knight, since we already have a leader. He wins and is promoted to elite. I turn research down to 0% in preparation for Wall Street. One turn of 0% should be enough to build our reserves to 1000 gp. Near Khambula I bombard a hoplite down to 1hp, then attack with elite knight, losing only 1hp. I decide to attack a vet musket with the knight army out of Xinjian. No catas available for softening, but I cant let him run around and pillage everything. Army loses 6hp but finally kills him.
1285-1290AD Aztec cata fires at our caravel but misses. Lots of troops massing at our borders. Ulundi produces a musket. Bapedi produces a bank. Our people want to build Wall Street. Hlobane produces another worker. Mpondo builds a knight. Now Ibabbango goes into disorder, need taxman and entertainer there. Ulundi uses leader to get Wall Street next turn. I plan science rate to get to 1000 gp next turn, Chemistry in 5 turns.
1290AD On Roman front 2 knights and longbow show up. Catas bombard knights scoring 2 hits in 4 shots. Elite knights take out the 3 Romans. Down south, near Khambula, catas get hit on spear and 2 hits on hoplite. Elite knights finish them off. MMOW.
1290-1295AD We build Wall Street in Ulundi. Ibabango builds a bank, starts on a cathedral. Ispezi builds a knight. New Zimbabwe trains a longbow, order a cata next. New Ulundi builds a harbor, starts on aquaduct. Chemistry in 3 turns with a 147 gpt surplus, gold is at 1004. No attacks by the AI, but lots of forces moving in. Aztecs will talk to us, they have Free Artistry and Chemistry and have 34 cities. All the civs we know now have Chemistry and Free Artistry. After Chemistry we should research Free Artistry in 4 turns.
1295AD Checking infrastructure, I note Bapedi has no University so I start that. Also Mpondo has no bank so I start that also. Also change Isipezi to a library. Anyang also switches to a library. All is quiet on the Roman front. Around Yakutsk things are heating up. There are 7 Russian longbows, 3 knights, 2 spears, and a musket arrayed against us. Theres also a Roman pike and 2 longbows. The Greeks, not be left out, have 4 longbows. I dont see any reasonable attacks in that area yet, have to just bombard this turn. Down south the an Iro spear is threatening to pillage. 3 cata shots get 1 hit and an elite knight kills him. The Greeks move up a stack of 1 hoplite, 1 musket, and 4 longbows by the hill between Khambula and Xinjian. I decide to hold the hill and move 3 cats, 3 muskets, and 2 elite knights. The cats fire, getting one hit on the musket. Our caravel, down to 1 hp because of a catapult hit, is still exploring the Aztec continent.
1295-1300AD Greek longbows kill our 2 muskets on the hill outside of . Zimbabwe and Zenguin build knights. I tell Zimbabwe to build another and Zenguin to work on a library. The Greeks are building Shakespeares Theatre, must get that one.
1300AD I rush a cat in Yakutsk, its surrounded by enemy troops. 4 cats from Intombe take a shot at a pike blocking the road to Yakutsk, they all miss. The the cat at Yakutsk takes a shot and hits. An elite knight kills it and I send some reinforcements into Yakutsk. An Iro longbow move on to irrigated grassland in front of New Bapedi. An elite knight cant believe it, but kills him anyway. In the south a Chinese rider shows up as well as stacks of Greeks moving around, and 1 Iro spear. I decide to leave the rider alone this turn, I think it would expose Xinjian too much. The Iro spear dies after a cat hit and an elite knight attacks. On the battle of the hill between Khambula and Xinjian, 5 cats fire getting 4 hits. 2 elite knights attack getting a hoplite and longbow. I decide to attack with an elite musket on a wounded longbow. The musket wins but loses 2 hp. I also move 4 workers to the hill in an attempt to build a road to Xinjian.
Notes:
The settler is in Intombe, I never got a chance to use him during my turn. I was thinking of a city up by the cattle north of New Ulundi or on the old city site SE of New Zimbabwe but too many troops in both areas.
We have Wall Street so try and keep the gold above 1000 gp.
Greeks have started Shakespeare, my plan was to finish Chemistry, then Free Artistry and hope for a great leader.
The Roman front has been quiet for the last few turns. Hot spots around Yakutsk and in the south though. No action at all at Isand.
Lost 2 knights and about 6 muskets this turn, probably killed about 40-50 enemy troops. That Roman army was very tough to kill.
The next leader might want to rush temples at Cumae and Xinjian once we have some surplus gold to spend.
Here's the 1.21 save file and map:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/lotr2-1300ad.sav
1250AD Preturn: Shuffle a musket to Hlobane and Hlobanes pike to Unfolozi. I want to have 2 garrison units in Umfolozi so that if Cumae flips again the caravel there can bring in reinforcements in 1 move. Also change Intombes production to musket since I pulled one out and its at 12 shields/turn, perfect for the 60 shield musket. At New Bapedi, I move a musket further into the mountain chain so the 2 Greek longbows cant get to a another mountain this turn. The mountain the musket left is then covered by an impi and an elite knight.
Russia - +Chemistry, +Economics, +Democracy, 18 cities, Monarchy, weak military
China - +Democracy, +Economics, 11 cities, Republic, weak military
Greece - +Chemistry, +Economics, +Democracy, 17 cities, Monarchy, weak military
Iroquois even tech, 14 cities, Republic, weak military
Rome - +Chemistry, +Economics, +Democracy, 15 cities, Republic, weak military
Aztec - ?, ?, Monarchy, strong military
English - ?, ?, ?, ?
Egyptians - ?, ?, ?, ?
Had to increase science to 60% (+12 gpt) to get Economics in 2 turns, before 1.21 it was 40% to get Economics in 2 turns.
1250-1260AD 2 Greek longbows attack New Bapedi and lose. Ulundi produces a knight. Intombe produces a musket. New Bapdi gets walls. People plant nices shrubs in front of the palace. Greeks are building Smiths Trading Company. Greeks sending a hoplite and 7 longbows towards New Bapedi. Russians sending 2 spears and 5 longbows to New Zimbabwe, and Romans have 2 longbows and a knight going towards New Zimbabwe and an honest-to-goodness army with 2 knights and a longbow going towards New Ulundi or Intombe. Why did they stick the longbow in? Now their army says a defence of 2 and movement of 1. Do individual units defend at their regular values or at the army value, I wonder. Along with the army is a pike and knight.
1255AD Down south, I move a musket to the mountain just SW of Tientsin to guard that tile and then move in 3 catas from Tientsin. They take 3 shots at an elite Iro spear and knock of 2 hp. I move the knight army and 2 other knights onto a hill 2 tiles from Xinjian hoping to take a shot at it next turn. I change Khambula to a musket, need more garrison troops here to hold mountains and cities. Nothing to do around New Bapedi but wait for attacks. At Yakutsk, an elite knight goes after a Russian regular spear and just wins with 1 hp left. Move a knight and cata to safer spot near Intombe and wait to see what Romans are up to.
1255-1260AD Romans ask for peace, rejected. Roman knight dies attacking Yakutsk. 3 Russian longbows die attacking iron hill where 2 muskets are fortified. We learn Economics. I go for Democracy next, we seem to be holding our own militarily and I want to get Shakespeare if possible. Mpondo builds a knight. Anyang goes into anarchy because it grows 1 and I didnt check. An entertainer is hired. Cumae revolts to our side. We have an impi as garrison, I order walls and hurry them for 80 gold. We capture 3 workers just outside Cumae and I bring them into the city. Our caravel will transport them home next turn. Now we have an impi and musket fortified in the city and another musket on a mountain nearby, where he captured a worker.
Around Intombe is a dilemma. I dont have enough troops to take out the 3 knights, 1 pike, and the knight army this turn. I decide to go after the 2 forward knights, wait on the other troops, since theyre slower, with the exception of one knight who is further to the rear. 4 catas get 1 hit on 2 different knights. Our elite knight takes out a wounded Roman knight without taking any hits. Our vet knight from Intombe goes out and kills the other wounded Roman knight and becomes elite. An elite knight at New Zimbabwe attack a wounded longbow on a hill, wins losing 1hp and produces a Great Leader, Cetshwayo!
He is hurried to Ulundi for Smiths but doesnt make it there this turn. We change Ulundis production from knight (in 4 turns) to cata (in 1 turn) because production will be interrupted next turn anyway. Party time in New Bapedi! 3 Greek longbows just camped outside the city on grassland, tempting our 6 surrounding knights. Too bad theres only one vet knight there that can be promoted. He tries his luck and wins with no hp loss, but no promo either. 2 other elite knights take out the 2 remaining longbows.
The knight army in the south takes Xinjian. There are 2 resisters, I move in 2 more knights to help hold the city until some muskets get there. I decide to move 2 knights from New Bapedi down toward Ngome to help with enemy troops there know that the knight army and 2 other knights are in Xinjian. Road is completed to Anyang, so the entertainer is not needed anymore.
1260-1265AD We lose a pike near Intombe to the Roman army. We also lose a musket on iron hill to a longbow, but first it kills another longbow. Romans invade with more knights toward Intombe. Greeks seem to be running away from Anyang area. Ulundi builds a cata. Starvation at Cumae, and it builds walls. Starts on temple. Resistance ends at Xinjian. Anyang builds a cata.
1265AD First we must use the leader. He goes to Ulundi, and get Adam Smith to join him next turn to build the Trading Post. In Cumae, the impi goes to the Roman iron hill to try and pillage next turn. The 2 muskets fortify behind walls in Cumae. No sign of attack yet there. Once again at Intombe there are 2 knights, a pike, and the knight army. I decide to attack the 2 knights again because they can pillage but the army cant this turn. We again get 1 hp damage on each with the catas and kill them with our knights. I bring over an elite knight and elite musket from Yakutsk to help with fighting in Intombe. I hurry walls at Xinjian and note that the only possible attackers this turn are a musket, hoplite, and spear. Ill take my chances on defence with the knight army (10/18) and a healthy elite knight and healthy vet knight. I kill a longbow at Bapedi that wandered into grassland.
While attacking a longbow in plains near Khambula, our elite knight wins with 1 hp damage and gets a great leader, Mpand! I am probably going to send him to Ngome and build a bank there after the marketplace is done in 2 turns.
1265-1270AD Musket on our iron hill takes down 2 longbows but dies on the 3rd. Impi on Roman iron hill dies to longbow. First Russian knights spotted near Yakutsk. 2 Chinese riders show up near Xinjian. Roman army defeats our musket near Intombe but is down to (3/12) hp so Im going after it this turn. Catas bombard a protecting pike down to 2/4 hp. Our elite knight attacks and dies, their pike becomes elite, now 2/5 hp. My first loss of a knight so far. Another vet knight attacks and kill the pike. Another elite knight attacks the army and wins!
We kill 2 longbows down south near Ngome, and then facethe problem of the 2 Chinese riders.
1270-1275AD Russians lose 2 knights attacking Yakutsk. Greeks land hoplite near Hlobane. Zimbabwe has produced a knight. Ngome has produced a marketplace, just in time to use the leader for a bank.
1275AD I kill 1 spear and 5 longbows up north. Also kill the hoplite that landed near Hlobane. I bombard a stack of musket and hoplite down south but decide to hold off the knight attack because 2/3 catas missed. I hurry a cata in Yakutsk. Its under constant attack and only cost 20 gold.
1275-1280AD We build a musket, catapult, and bank in Ngome. Russians lose longbow trying out 2 muskets near our iron mountain. Cool, a Russian knight just ran past Yakutsk and took 1 hp of damage even though I had no catapult there!
1280AD Down south near Tiensin, catas get a pike down to 1hp, finished off by an elite knight. Catas also get a longbow down to 1hp, also finished off by an elite knight. In that battle we get our 3rd great leader Zwelithini! Since 5 banks will be done in 2 turns, I decide to send him up to Ulundi and build Wall Street there. Time to crank up the gold! Ulundi is changed from knight to musket, since that will also finish in 2 turns. Up north I kill a Roman knight and Russian longbow.
1280-1285AD One impi in the south kills a longbow and retreats before another. We learn democracy. Following the AI lead, I go for Chemistry next. I decline to change governments to Democracy. Hlobane builds a worker, Intombe builds a musket, Umfolozi goes into cicil disorder, I need 2 entertainers there! Any tips on how to quickly detect disorder next turn are greatly appreciated. Iro galley lets off a longbow near Umtata.
1285AD Feeling foolish, I bombard the Iro longbow with a cata before attacking with a vet knight. The cara hits, the knight attacks and loses! An elite impi attacks, and retreats with 1hp, but not before making the longbow elite. A vet impi attacks, and retreats with 1hp after not doing any damage. Another vet impi finally beats him. On the Roman front we bombard a pike to 1hp and send in a vet knight, since we already have a leader. He wins and is promoted to elite. I turn research down to 0% in preparation for Wall Street. One turn of 0% should be enough to build our reserves to 1000 gp. Near Khambula I bombard a hoplite down to 1hp, then attack with elite knight, losing only 1hp. I decide to attack a vet musket with the knight army out of Xinjian. No catas available for softening, but I cant let him run around and pillage everything. Army loses 6hp but finally kills him.
1285-1290AD Aztec cata fires at our caravel but misses. Lots of troops massing at our borders. Ulundi produces a musket. Bapedi produces a bank. Our people want to build Wall Street. Hlobane produces another worker. Mpondo builds a knight. Now Ibabbango goes into disorder, need taxman and entertainer there. Ulundi uses leader to get Wall Street next turn. I plan science rate to get to 1000 gp next turn, Chemistry in 5 turns.
1290AD On Roman front 2 knights and longbow show up. Catas bombard knights scoring 2 hits in 4 shots. Elite knights take out the 3 Romans. Down south, near Khambula, catas get hit on spear and 2 hits on hoplite. Elite knights finish them off. MMOW.
1290-1295AD We build Wall Street in Ulundi. Ibabango builds a bank, starts on a cathedral. Ispezi builds a knight. New Zimbabwe trains a longbow, order a cata next. New Ulundi builds a harbor, starts on aquaduct. Chemistry in 3 turns with a 147 gpt surplus, gold is at 1004. No attacks by the AI, but lots of forces moving in. Aztecs will talk to us, they have Free Artistry and Chemistry and have 34 cities. All the civs we know now have Chemistry and Free Artistry. After Chemistry we should research Free Artistry in 4 turns.
1295AD Checking infrastructure, I note Bapedi has no University so I start that. Also Mpondo has no bank so I start that also. Also change Isipezi to a library. Anyang also switches to a library. All is quiet on the Roman front. Around Yakutsk things are heating up. There are 7 Russian longbows, 3 knights, 2 spears, and a musket arrayed against us. Theres also a Roman pike and 2 longbows. The Greeks, not be left out, have 4 longbows. I dont see any reasonable attacks in that area yet, have to just bombard this turn. Down south the an Iro spear is threatening to pillage. 3 cata shots get 1 hit and an elite knight kills him. The Greeks move up a stack of 1 hoplite, 1 musket, and 4 longbows by the hill between Khambula and Xinjian. I decide to hold the hill and move 3 cats, 3 muskets, and 2 elite knights. The cats fire, getting one hit on the musket. Our caravel, down to 1 hp because of a catapult hit, is still exploring the Aztec continent.
1295-1300AD Greek longbows kill our 2 muskets on the hill outside of . Zimbabwe and Zenguin build knights. I tell Zimbabwe to build another and Zenguin to work on a library. The Greeks are building Shakespeares Theatre, must get that one.
1300AD I rush a cat in Yakutsk, its surrounded by enemy troops. 4 cats from Intombe take a shot at a pike blocking the road to Yakutsk, they all miss. The the cat at Yakutsk takes a shot and hits. An elite knight kills it and I send some reinforcements into Yakutsk. An Iro longbow move on to irrigated grassland in front of New Bapedi. An elite knight cant believe it, but kills him anyway. In the south a Chinese rider shows up as well as stacks of Greeks moving around, and 1 Iro spear. I decide to leave the rider alone this turn, I think it would expose Xinjian too much. The Iro spear dies after a cat hit and an elite knight attacks. On the battle of the hill between Khambula and Xinjian, 5 cats fire getting 4 hits. 2 elite knights attack getting a hoplite and longbow. I decide to attack with an elite musket on a wounded longbow. The musket wins but loses 2 hp. I also move 4 workers to the hill in an attempt to build a road to Xinjian.
Notes:
The settler is in Intombe, I never got a chance to use him during my turn. I was thinking of a city up by the cattle north of New Ulundi or on the old city site SE of New Zimbabwe but too many troops in both areas.
We have Wall Street so try and keep the gold above 1000 gp.
Greeks have started Shakespeare, my plan was to finish Chemistry, then Free Artistry and hope for a great leader.
The Roman front has been quiet for the last few turns. Hot spots around Yakutsk and in the south though. No action at all at Isand.
Lost 2 knights and about 6 muskets this turn, probably killed about 40-50 enemy troops. That Roman army was very tough to kill.
The next leader might want to rush temples at Cumae and Xinjian once we have some surplus gold to spend.
Here's the 1.21 save file and map:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/lotr2-1300ad.sav
cpp1
Warlord
Images don't seem to show up right. I'll try posting another image later.
Well, the uploads are there. I can't just click on your file to download it, but I was able to find it in the uploads directory. Odd... The picture (both, actually) is there, too, and I took a look at it.
I'm up? Umm...I just played right before you, cpp1.
<Scratches head>
Well, hopefully that will give the rest of the people time to get their affairs in order. Jester and Toecheese both have lives, curse them. And I think Sirian's really trying to finish his solo deity game in 1.17f before updating.
I guess I got it, but I'm declaring right now that I'll probably take the full 72 hours -- i.e. don't expect anything until Monday.
Arathorn
P.S. Looks like great game gains. Tons of infrastructure being built. Kinda odd but I agree that it's probably necessary.
I'm up? Umm...I just played right before you, cpp1.
<Scratches head>
Well, hopefully that will give the rest of the people time to get their affairs in order. Jester and Toecheese both have lives, curse them. And I think Sirian's really trying to finish his solo deity game in 1.17f before updating.
I guess I got it, but I'm declaring right now that I'll probably take the full 72 hours -- i.e. don't expect anything until Monday.
Arathorn
P.S. Looks like great game gains. Tons of infrastructure being built. Kinda odd but I agree that it's probably necessary.
cpp1
Warlord
Arathorn: Can you see if you can post the game image on this thread? I'd like to know if its a forum related problem or my own problem.
On the infrastructure, the civs on our continent are way behind us in infrastructure but the Aztecs (and maybe the English and Egyptians) have more cities and are more powerful than we are so we can't get too far behind them.
Militarily things are not so desperate as they were earlier but its still rather nerve-wracking, just not to the point where any mistake can result in an entire front collapsing. The Russians and Greeks gave me the most problems, except for that annoying Roman army.
There were 2 landings on our coast during my 10 turns. It looks like the Russians might land again, there are 2 knights "shadowing" the Russian caravel looking to attack any off-loaded troops.
Its not clear to me whether we want to attack the Romans or the Chinese when we get to that point. The Chinese are probably weaker but the Roman lands fit in with ours better, in that when we conquer the Romans we end up with a front to defend that not much bigger than what we already defend.
I think the Greeks have cascaded to Shakespeare from Smith's so it could be close as to whether we get Shakespeare in Ulundi before the Greeks get it.
On the infrastructure, the civs on our continent are way behind us in infrastructure but the Aztecs (and maybe the English and Egyptians) have more cities and are more powerful than we are so we can't get too far behind them.
Militarily things are not so desperate as they were earlier but its still rather nerve-wracking, just not to the point where any mistake can result in an entire front collapsing. The Russians and Greeks gave me the most problems, except for that annoying Roman army.
There were 2 landings on our coast during my 10 turns. It looks like the Russians might land again, there are 2 knights "shadowing" the Russian caravel looking to attack any off-loaded troops.
Its not clear to me whether we want to attack the Romans or the Chinese when we get to that point. The Chinese are probably weaker but the Roman lands fit in with ours better, in that when we conquer the Romans we end up with a front to defend that not much bigger than what we already defend.
I think the Greeks have cascaded to Shakespeare from Smith's so it could be close as to whether we get Shakespeare in Ulundi before the Greeks get it.
Sullla
Patrician Roman Dictator
Let's see if this works...
cpp1, the address for the pictures is case sensitive; you typed "1300ad" when the link needed "1300AD" to work.
cpp1, the address for the pictures is case sensitive; you typed "1300ad" when the link needed "1300AD" to work.
Way to go, guys, you've almost made it to the Industrial Age! Then it will be time to bring out a big ol' can of whoopass... I assume you're going to do the rails-factory-coalplant-hospitals-ToE-Hoover maneuver, with rifles and police stations thrown in for good measure, then hit wartime economy and go for the throat!
cpp1
Warlord
Sullla: Thanks for figuring out what I was doing wrong posting the save file and the world map! I was trying all sorts of stuff but never thought of the case sensitivity problem.
In the game, once the human players get railroads then the AI gets hopelessly outclassed. If we can hang on to steam power and industrialization then I think we're OK.
Also they don't seem to use artillery very much. The Romans captured some artillery from us once when we captured Aniteum and they captured it back, but that's the last I saw of it. What do they use it for if its not on the front lines?
As far as leaders after the 1.21 patch, I'm the only one that has played since the patch and I got 3 leaders during my 10 turns. That's probably above our average so I don't think the patch affected the number of great leaders that you get. I'd say we get one about every 12 or 13 elite attacks.
In the game, once the human players get railroads then the AI gets hopelessly outclassed. If we can hang on to steam power and industrialization then I think we're OK.
Also they don't seem to use artillery very much. The Romans captured some artillery from us once when we captured Aniteum and they captured it back, but that's the last I saw of it. What do they use it for if its not on the front lines?
As far as leaders after the 1.21 patch, I'm the only one that has played since the patch and I got 3 leaders during my 10 turns. That's probably above our average so I don't think the patch affected the number of great leaders that you get. I'd say we get one about every 12 or 13 elite attacks.
Executive summary:
Captured four cities and razed one. Founded zero but have one ready to go. 4 Great Leaders -- most early. Ulundi will give us cultural victory pre-1900, I believe.
Total casualties (I recorded because I was curious):
Zululand - 17
Russia - 28
Rome - 17
China - 7
Greece - 38
Iroquois - 7
Aztecs - 0
A kill ratio of less than 6-to-1, not the greatest. And some of it is my fault. I got overextended a bit and lost some troops I shouldn't have. Some of it was rabid PRNG rolls.
More details:
Arathorn the Great took power in 1300 and made a few micromanagement changes (Umtata was working a mined hlll that it shares with Mpondo and not working one it didn't. Changed hills in Umtata and then worked that hill in Mpondo, etc.)
1305 saw a lot of action in the jungles near New Zimbabwe and Yakutsk. Somewhere in the fighting, a Great Leader appeared. He became the great Yakutsk cathedral (the most expensive thing in the area).
The brilliant Zulu researchers discovered Chemistry and begin to look into Free Artistry. The prospect of hearing Shakespeare's plays exclusively in Ulundi was too valuable to pass up.
In 1310, the second leader of the Zulu forces appeared, in fighting by New Bapedi. He is sent to Anyang to build a university, after the library is completed this year. Anyang still lacks proper roading, but nowhere else near can use the shields. With 2 GLs in 2 turns, I expect more.
The nation also mourned the loss of the ship by the Aztec lands. It was sunk by another caravel, having survived multiple other attacks and made contact with a new world. Replacements are ordered.
1315 saw my third Great Leader. With FA due in a couple turns and with travel time to Ulundi growing, I decide to halt the production of GLs and send this one to Ulundi for Shakespeare's Theatre.
Eretria was captured from the Greeks. This is still near our FP and should be productive, once it gets hooked up. Arathorn is eyeing the distance to Isand and wishing to connect it to the rest of his mighty empire.
1325 saw the capture and loss of Rostov -- probably a bit premature on the attack. Still, I gave a lot better than I got on both the capture and recapture, so not all bad. Free Artistry completes and Physics is ordered.
In 1330, Shakespeare was enticed to Ulundi by the presence of a Great Leader. Despite his usage at the very beginning of the turn, no replacement leader is found. Arathorn is puzzled but recaptures Rostov anyway.
1335 saw the resumption of the leader brigade, with another leader on the Russian front. He is too far from the main nation and with no roads....he becomes a colosseum in Rostov (
probably should have been an army -- or moved elsewhere). Chinan, on the border of the same lake as Isand, is captured. As a bonus, it has wine under it, which can be shared with the whole nation, once the road network to the area is completed. This also cuts off one path of the Greek train to the north. This should ease the pressure on the New Bapedi area. We now have a four-city front to the south -- and workers/defended needed.
Syracuse, a worthless Roman city in the jungle, was razed.
I got a bit overanxious to resupply Chinan and left a few troops uncovered. Not a good year for the defensive Zulus. Probably half my casualties were in this off-year. Good idea, I think, to take Chinan and Rostov, but I got a bit overzealous.
In 1310, the forces were in place to capture Hispalis, so they did. Clean up other messes, reinforce new cities. Rest, revive. Clean up some Iroquois attackers (almost the first I've seen). Start sending a settler N of New Bapedi to settle more jungle. There's a hill out there I had my eye on, but it's gonna be up to the next leader to place him exactly.
In the year 1315, the most exciting happening was the discovery of Physics. Metallurgy is ordered, to be completed in 4 turns. A bit more killing but mostly trying to get things in order for the next leader. TWO armies now defend Chinan, the 4-knight army which captured it, and the newly-4-impi army from iron hill, which were no longer needed there. Greeks content themselves with pillaging around Chinan.
1350 was a boring year, so boring, in fact, that Arathorn stepped down from the throne, opening the doorway to the next leader. Arathorn had had a great run, but it was time for someone else to lead.
Arathorn
Captured four cities and razed one. Founded zero but have one ready to go. 4 Great Leaders -- most early. Ulundi will give us cultural victory pre-1900, I believe.
Total casualties (I recorded because I was curious):
Zululand - 17
Russia - 28
Rome - 17
China - 7
Greece - 38
Iroquois - 7
Aztecs - 0
A kill ratio of less than 6-to-1, not the greatest. And some of it is my fault. I got overextended a bit and lost some troops I shouldn't have. Some of it was rabid PRNG rolls.
More details:
Arathorn the Great took power in 1300 and made a few micromanagement changes (Umtata was working a mined hlll that it shares with Mpondo and not working one it didn't. Changed hills in Umtata and then worked that hill in Mpondo, etc.)
1305 saw a lot of action in the jungles near New Zimbabwe and Yakutsk. Somewhere in the fighting, a Great Leader appeared. He became the great Yakutsk cathedral (the most expensive thing in the area).
The brilliant Zulu researchers discovered Chemistry and begin to look into Free Artistry. The prospect of hearing Shakespeare's plays exclusively in Ulundi was too valuable to pass up.
In 1310, the second leader of the Zulu forces appeared, in fighting by New Bapedi. He is sent to Anyang to build a university, after the library is completed this year. Anyang still lacks proper roading, but nowhere else near can use the shields. With 2 GLs in 2 turns, I expect more.
The nation also mourned the loss of the ship by the Aztec lands. It was sunk by another caravel, having survived multiple other attacks and made contact with a new world. Replacements are ordered.
1315 saw my third Great Leader. With FA due in a couple turns and with travel time to Ulundi growing, I decide to halt the production of GLs and send this one to Ulundi for Shakespeare's Theatre.
Eretria was captured from the Greeks. This is still near our FP and should be productive, once it gets hooked up. Arathorn is eyeing the distance to Isand and wishing to connect it to the rest of his mighty empire.
1325 saw the capture and loss of Rostov -- probably a bit premature on the attack. Still, I gave a lot better than I got on both the capture and recapture, so not all bad. Free Artistry completes and Physics is ordered.
In 1330, Shakespeare was enticed to Ulundi by the presence of a Great Leader. Despite his usage at the very beginning of the turn, no replacement leader is found. Arathorn is puzzled but recaptures Rostov anyway.
1335 saw the resumption of the leader brigade, with another leader on the Russian front. He is too far from the main nation and with no roads....he becomes a colosseum in Rostov (
probably should have been an army -- or moved elsewhere). Chinan, on the border of the same lake as Isand, is captured. As a bonus, it has wine under it, which can be shared with the whole nation, once the road network to the area is completed. This also cuts off one path of the Greek train to the north. This should ease the pressure on the New Bapedi area. We now have a four-city front to the south -- and workers/defended needed.Syracuse, a worthless Roman city in the jungle, was razed.
I got a bit overanxious to resupply Chinan and left a few troops uncovered. Not a good year for the defensive Zulus. Probably half my casualties were in this off-year. Good idea, I think, to take Chinan and Rostov, but I got a bit overzealous.
In 1310, the forces were in place to capture Hispalis, so they did. Clean up other messes, reinforce new cities. Rest, revive. Clean up some Iroquois attackers (almost the first I've seen). Start sending a settler N of New Bapedi to settle more jungle. There's a hill out there I had my eye on, but it's gonna be up to the next leader to place him exactly.
In the year 1315, the most exciting happening was the discovery of Physics. Metallurgy is ordered, to be completed in 4 turns. A bit more killing but mostly trying to get things in order for the next leader. TWO armies now defend Chinan, the 4-knight army which captured it, and the newly-4-impi army from iron hill, which were no longer needed there. Greeks content themselves with pillaging around Chinan.
1350 was a boring year, so boring, in fact, that Arathorn stepped down from the throne, opening the doorway to the next leader. Arathorn had had a great run, but it was time for someone else to lead.
Arathorn
