LotR3 - SHADOW - Emperor training
- Thread starter Arathorn
- Start date
just make sure to take care of yourself first
I'm more or less back in action. I had played about 5 shadow turns and my wife deleted the save file, so I'm NOT going to shadow again -- too much effort invested with too little reward. But I am going to do reviews by tomorrow (I think/hope/expect).
Arathorn
Arathorn
Education purchase was probably premature. We could have easily waited -- we're not going to be building universities, are we? Not anytime soon, at the very least. You paid a pretty big premium for a tech we could've waited for and couldn't effectively shop immediately.
Kudos for getting the most out of our world map and using 20 turns of luxes/resources to cut costs. They're not doing us much (if any) good sitting around, so get full value for them. Some good, some bad. RoPs can improve tade rate, too. If it's an option, see if it raises or lowers our cost.
(150) I would've probably gotten a few more workers out, first. Architect and I disagreed about the necessity of a ton of workers, but 2-4 is probably a good option. Not a biggie, though, as the marketplace is also very important.
(110) It's unlikely we'll get Music Theory in 40 turns -- that's a LONG time and it's hard to keep a scientist going all the time. We probably won't try for Bach's, anyway, so you're essentially giving away 120 gold. Yeah, there's a chance it will pay off, but the payoff isn't that large (nor is the cost, as far as that goes, but...). I would not do this, personally.
(90) NF disorder is a bad thing -- it's an important city for us -- one of our top 3 easily. Of course, there are times a city goes into disorder and we mere mortals have no idea why. Citizen locations sometimes change (with enemy units or barbs) and can cause a disorder (loss of commerce being the usual culprit).
(70) One worker turn lost isn't the end of the world. Yeah, getting more luxes hooked up is definitely a higher priority than mining, but you recognized the mistake and corrected it, so no biggie.
(50) WOOHOO!!! That's very cool. Culture flips are always nice. And it's one less city we have to capture. I wish I could say this was as expected, but sometimes the PRNG giveth -- and we will always accept when it goes our way.
You didn't mention what you started building in Avaris. Since it's out in the middle of nowhere (errr...Egypt), walls, barracks, or temple would all make sense -- depending on whether the culture or the military is expected to hit first. Another defender there ASAP is also a very good idea.
(30) Oh, OK, here are the build orders. We're not cash-rich enough to go rushing TOO willy-nilly, especially in colonies (rushing things in core cities will often pay for itself over time -- the market in NF might be one good example of this, spending ~200 gold now to get an extra 10 gpt 10 turns earlier is a good deal, as it frees up 10 more turns of production AND helps with happiness).
If/when rushing is done, don't full-rush from a cold start. Avaris could/should have at least one shield. If so, rushing is OK. If not, and you feel the need to rush ASAP, rush a worker first (for 80 gold) and then change to what you want and rush again. This saves gold EVERY time. Rushing from a cold start costs 8 * shields required. Rushing with ANY shields dedicated costs 4 * shields remaining. For a temple in a religious civ, a cold rush costs 240 gold. Rushing a worker and then immediately a temple (no turn between -- just rush/change/rush) costs 160 gold (8*10 = 80 for worker then 4*20 remaining for temple).
When a lux deal is ended, you should check happiness of ALL cities immediately afterwards (or try to find another lux source immediately). Horses are probably worth one lux and our WM at this point, so no complaints there.
(10 ad) The jungle near OS is a time when it is probably worth roading before mining, as the luxury there can be traded immediately for something (quite possibly Furs from Egypt close to straight up). Since there's a SPECIFIC reason for the road, I would have done that first.
NF fell into disorder almost assuredly because of the loss of Furs in 30 ad. It seems to change whether loss-of-luxury affects happiness THAT turn or the next turn. In this case, it obviously waited a turn and I'd lay very good odds that the NF riot was caused by the loss of Furs and was, therefore, predictable and preventable.
is evident.
(30) I guess my discussion of rushing costs in 30bc was unnecessary, as you did the rushing the smart way (whether the rushing is worthwhile or not is another issue).
Av has had enough cash spent in it for the time being. It is no more (or little more) of a flip risk than Stevetown is. Spending money closer to the capital yields a much higher rate of return than wasting it all on colonies.
Save game notes:
- A Sala citizen can move from the forest to roaded/irrigated plains for 3 gpt, one "worthless" food (since Sala's already size 12) at the cost of one shield. Yes, shields are important but, before knights, the difference between 18 shields and 17 shields is unimportant -- specifically, MWs take 2 turns either way.
- There is a potential micromanagement opportunity in OS. Right now, OS is producing 8 shields and losing one to waste for a net of 7 shields -- 5 turns for a MW. However, by moving a citizen from the irrigated grasslands to iron mountain, the shields go to 10 gross and 8 net -- 4 turns for a MW...but at the cost of 3 food. Mix'n'match works well here, 2 turns on the grass for food and 2 on iron mountain gives a total of 30 shields, saving a turn on each MW and not costing growth much.
- You have too many defenders/units in the "rear" areas. Sala is under no threat of attack and that warrior (nee swordsman) at the front could make a big difference. Similary, the MWs up by MC are a huge waste. You mentioned something about waiting for a galley. WHY? Over land, they'll be at the front much faster and have a chance of a defender/numbers to protect them. On a boat, they're just asking to die -- and even if they do land, two unsupported MWs aren't much use. Definite here.
- There's a one-turn MM available at St. R. It only needs one turn to grow but has two extra food. Moving a citizen from an irrigated plains to a mined hill saves two turns on the aqueduct and has no influence on growth time. It may not matter, as growth happens before shields and the new citizen might work the hills anyway, but it's good to give the governor minimal chances to screw up. I don't MM every city every turn, but when they're close to growing, I try to look in on them -- just to eliminate the computer governor![[pimp]](/images/smilies/pimp.gif "Pimp [pimp]")
problems.
Arathorn
Kudos for getting the most out of our world map and using 20 turns of luxes/resources to cut costs. They're not doing us much (if any) good sitting around, so get full value for them. Some good, some bad. RoPs can improve tade rate, too. If it's an option, see if it raises or lowers our cost.
(150) I would've probably gotten a few more workers out, first. Architect and I disagreed about the necessity of a ton of workers, but 2-4 is probably a good option. Not a biggie, though, as the marketplace is also very important.
(110) It's unlikely we'll get Music Theory in 40 turns -- that's a LONG time and it's hard to keep a scientist going all the time. We probably won't try for Bach's, anyway, so you're essentially giving away 120 gold. Yeah, there's a chance it will pay off, but the payoff isn't that large (nor is the cost, as far as that goes, but...). I would not do this, personally.
(90) NF disorder is a bad thing -- it's an important city for us -- one of our top 3 easily. Of course, there are times a city goes into disorder and we mere mortals have no idea why. Citizen locations sometimes change (with enemy units or barbs) and can cause a disorder (loss of commerce being the usual culprit).
(70) One worker turn lost isn't the end of the world. Yeah, getting more luxes hooked up is definitely a higher priority than mining, but you recognized the mistake and corrected it, so no biggie.
(50) WOOHOO!!! That's very cool. Culture flips are always nice. And it's one less city we have to capture. I wish I could say this was as expected, but sometimes the PRNG giveth -- and we will always accept when it goes our way.
You didn't mention what you started building in Avaris. Since it's out in the middle of nowhere (errr...Egypt), walls, barracks, or temple would all make sense -- depending on whether the culture or the military is expected to hit first. Another defender there ASAP is also a very good idea.
(30) Oh, OK, here are the build orders. We're not cash-rich enough to go rushing TOO willy-nilly, especially in colonies (rushing things in core cities will often pay for itself over time -- the market in NF might be one good example of this, spending ~200 gold now to get an extra 10 gpt 10 turns earlier is a good deal, as it frees up 10 more turns of production AND helps with happiness).
If/when rushing is done, don't full-rush from a cold start. Avaris could/should have at least one shield. If so, rushing is OK. If not, and you feel the need to rush ASAP, rush a worker first (for 80 gold) and then change to what you want and rush again. This saves gold EVERY time. Rushing from a cold start costs 8 * shields required. Rushing with ANY shields dedicated costs 4 * shields remaining. For a temple in a religious civ, a cold rush costs 240 gold. Rushing a worker and then immediately a temple (no turn between -- just rush/change/rush) costs 160 gold (8*10 = 80 for worker then 4*20 remaining for temple).
When a lux deal is ended, you should check happiness of ALL cities immediately afterwards (or try to find another lux source immediately). Horses are probably worth one lux and our WM at this point, so no complaints there.
(10 ad) The jungle near OS is a time when it is probably worth roading before mining, as the luxury there can be traded immediately for something (quite possibly Furs from Egypt close to straight up). Since there's a SPECIFIC reason for the road, I would have done that first.
NF fell into disorder almost assuredly because of the loss of Furs in 30 ad. It seems to change whether loss-of-luxury affects happiness THAT turn or the next turn. In this case, it obviously waited a turn and I'd lay very good odds that the NF riot was caused by the loss of Furs and was, therefore, predictable and preventable.
is evident.(30) I guess my discussion of rushing costs in 30bc was unnecessary, as you did the rushing the smart way (whether the rushing is worthwhile or not is another issue).
Av has had enough cash spent in it for the time being. It is no more (or little more) of a flip risk than Stevetown is. Spending money closer to the capital yields a much higher rate of return than wasting it all on colonies.
Save game notes:
- A Sala citizen can move from the forest to roaded/irrigated plains for 3 gpt, one "worthless" food (since Sala's already size 12) at the cost of one shield. Yes, shields are important but, before knights, the difference between 18 shields and 17 shields is unimportant -- specifically, MWs take 2 turns either way.
- There is a potential micromanagement opportunity in OS. Right now, OS is producing 8 shields and losing one to waste for a net of 7 shields -- 5 turns for a MW. However, by moving a citizen from the irrigated grasslands to iron mountain, the shields go to 10 gross and 8 net -- 4 turns for a MW...but at the cost of 3 food. Mix'n'match works well here, 2 turns on the grass for food and 2 on iron mountain gives a total of 30 shields, saving a turn on each MW and not costing growth much.
- You have too many defenders/units in the "rear" areas. Sala is under no threat of attack and that warrior (nee swordsman) at the front could make a big difference. Similary, the MWs up by MC are a huge waste. You mentioned something about waiting for a galley. WHY? Over land, they'll be at the front much faster and have a chance of a defender/numbers to protect them. On a boat, they're just asking to die -- and even if they do land, two unsupported MWs aren't much use. Definite
here.- There's a one-turn MM available at St. R. It only needs one turn to grow but has two extra food. Moving a citizen from an irrigated plains to a mined hill saves two turns on the aqueduct and has no influence on growth time. It may not matter, as growth happens before shields and the new citizen might work the hills anyway, but it's good to give the governor minimal chances to screw up. I don't MM every city every turn, but when they're close to growing, I try to look in on them -- just to eliminate the computer governor
problems.Arathorn
(150) Good initial purchases. Less than 100 gold for two techs. Yes, we're helping China some with iron and a lux, but that's a good deal for us at this point. Excellent beginning.
(110) Cool! A revolt to us. We'll definitely accept Jaipur. If any city is intelligent enough to join us, we'll accept it. Sure, it's a fishing village, but some extra people and gpt never hurts. Just don't go hog-wild wasting gold in a low-value colony!
Rushing a worker from scratch is extreme....but to save a person, the 80 gold might well be worth it. Jaipur WILL riot, as happiness is checked before items complete, but an item with full shields will complete even in a rioting city, which should end the rioting at the end of next turn. Normally, I'd frown on cold-rushing a worker in a colony, but this seems like an appropriate time/use for that strategy. Good idea and well executed.
I think you mean N, NE to bonus grassland by Centralia. There's not much but water west of the poorly-named Centralia.
(90) I like the plan or bringing irrigation north to Awk's grassland. It's always important to get cities with limited food hooked up. It won't hurt StR to have a 3-food square, either. But Akw will never really have the oomph to require a barracks and cranking units. It's often good to have such a city simply do improvements and artillery units. I would heartily recommend a few catapults built here -- or a marketplace/infrastructure item.
I do not, however, agree with the forest chopping by GR. Where is GR going to get its shields? Its only source of real shields is going to be the forests (until RRs, of course). Roading the forest would give a few extra commerce, which is always good and not cost any shields. Yes, chopping the forest gives a one-time 10 shield surge, but after 10 turns (unless it's a bonus grass underneath, which we can't tell/guess), those would've been made up anyway -- and then we lose shields. Wrong choice here.
The three workers on the gold hill between All and Sala should NOT be sent to the jungle to connect with Russia. This makes it too easy to lose them in war, costs us development time (OS is still working undeveloped tiles!), and is very inefficient. We need those workers doing useful jobs NOW, not things that might or might not help much in 14 turns. Definite here. The jungle doesn't slow us much at all and having a road there just isn't that important. Our initial assault can (and should) form in the jungle at the edge or our domain before our attack anyway.
Waiting one turn for 30 gold is almost assuredly worth it. One turn of incense, at this point, when pop is still low, is worth maybe 3-4 gold. As populations grow, so do the values of luxuries (in the AI's mind).
(70) No, Sala can (and should) produce another MW. The only time the program checks for a resource is when a unit is started (or in the list of possible builds). Once you start the MW, you can finish it. We want to take FULL advantage of those horses, so build one more. Same deal for All and OS. We could've gotten 3 more (potentially) MWs by just continuing building them. More here. (Even if they couldn't finish, what would be the loss in trying to build them?)
AAARRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHH!!! Stevetown, we barely knew ye. The PRNG giveth and the PRNG taketh away. I'd rather neither Jaipur nor Stevetown flipped. Still, one of the dangers of a gambit like Stevetown is that it can always turn out badly. We invested pretty heavily there and it cost us. Not insurmountable but very disappointing. Those 4ish luxes down there would have been EXTREMELY helpful.
Hmm..when did you start that worker in Cent? Cent should not be producing workers -- it doesn't have the population base/growth rate to do so. Let each town go with its strength. After a harbor, courthouse, aqueduct, and marketplace, Cent might want to do a worker -- as it is, that just slows the poor city down.
On the lux score, we only lost one luxury, right? And you bought two more and were still having problems? That doesn't make sense... Your reasoning on when to go for the extra lux makes sense, but the implementation is questionable. Are you SURE the 10% lux tax was needed? If it's only 1 or 2 citizens, it might be worth running them as taxmen.
I have no complaints about trading for horses again. This whole set of trades, though, feels sub-optimal to me, like there were some things missing. I can't put my finger on what, though, so no weed calls.
(50) For something safe like territory maps, it's usually safest and best to simply make the trade. It doesn't actually COST us anything to give up our territory map, since Ghandi already knows the lay of the land and our improvements/defenses are all adequate. You get more AI brownie points that way. Techs, never sell on their turn, your territory map when they already have a comprehensive world map? That's OK.
More worker turns wasted on the road to Russia. It's not so important that it can't wait another 10-20 turns, during which time more important projects can be completed. Prioritizing worker tasks is very important, as it can easily mean a 10-30 gpt difference, which adds up FAST. Moreso, it can have an exponential effect on pop size and shields produced. Improve lands close to home first and then move to lower priority projects, like roading to Russia.
Good job keeping an eye on the cities later, max shields before aqueduct, commerce with no build-time penalties, etc. Those little moves are quite helpful.
Save game notes:
- St.R. is smaller than it should be. Keep cities on max food unless there's a good reason not to. It should be at least one, and probably even two, larger than it is. Lost people never come back -- lost shields are often returned with interest with larger populations.
- Tye is still undefended -- that's dangerous. Send one of our extra worthless units up there to guard the place (warrior out of Sala probably). And speaking of warriors, the warrior in Catt should be upgraded to a sword, so we have one more useful unit in our attacking force.
- There is a potential micromanagement opportunity in OS. Right now, OS is producing 8 shields and losing one to waste for a net of 7 shields -- 5 turns for a MW. However, by moving a citizen from the irrigated grasslands to iron mountain, the shields go to 10 gross and 8 net -- 4 turns for a MW...but at the cost of 3 food. Mix'n'match works well here, 2 turns on the grass for food and 2 on iron mountain gives a total of 30 shields, saving a turn on each MW and not costing growth much.
- That worker trudging through Russia is going to be a problem and will probably be captured when we declare war. Not sure what else you could've done with him, though. Cathy might actually flip out enough to capture him, since he's so unprotected.
Arathorn
(110) Cool! A revolt to us. We'll definitely accept Jaipur. If any city is intelligent enough to join us, we'll accept it. Sure, it's a fishing village, but some extra people and gpt never hurts. Just don't go hog-wild wasting gold in a low-value colony!
Rushing a worker from scratch is extreme....but to save a person, the 80 gold might well be worth it. Jaipur WILL riot, as happiness is checked before items complete, but an item with full shields will complete even in a rioting city, which should end the rioting at the end of next turn. Normally, I'd frown on cold-rushing a worker in a colony, but this seems like an appropriate time/use for that strategy. Good idea and well executed.
I think you mean N, NE to bonus grassland by Centralia. There's not much but water west of the poorly-named Centralia.
(90) I like the plan or bringing irrigation north to Awk's grassland. It's always important to get cities with limited food hooked up. It won't hurt StR to have a 3-food square, either. But Akw will never really have the oomph to require a barracks and cranking units. It's often good to have such a city simply do improvements and artillery units. I would heartily recommend a few catapults built here -- or a marketplace/infrastructure item.
I do not, however, agree with the forest chopping by GR. Where is GR going to get its shields? Its only source of real shields is going to be the forests (until RRs, of course). Roading the forest would give a few extra commerce, which is always good and not cost any shields. Yes, chopping the forest gives a one-time 10 shield surge, but after 10 turns (unless it's a bonus grass underneath, which we can't tell/guess), those would've been made up anyway -- and then we lose shields. Wrong choice here.
The three workers on the gold hill between All and Sala should NOT be sent to the jungle to connect with Russia. This makes it too easy to lose them in war, costs us development time (OS is still working undeveloped tiles!), and is very inefficient. We need those workers doing useful jobs NOW, not things that might or might not help much in 14 turns. Definite
here. The jungle doesn't slow us much at all and having a road there just isn't that important. Our initial assault can (and should) form in the jungle at the edge or our domain before our attack anyway.Waiting one turn for 30 gold is almost assuredly worth it. One turn of incense, at this point, when pop is still low, is worth maybe 3-4 gold. As populations grow, so do the values of luxuries (in the AI's mind).
(70) No, Sala can (and should) produce another MW. The only time the program checks for a resource is when a unit is started (or in the list of possible builds). Once you start the MW, you can finish it. We want to take FULL advantage of those horses, so build one more. Same deal for All and OS. We could've gotten 3 more (potentially) MWs by just continuing building them. More
here. (Even if they couldn't finish, what would be the loss in trying to build them?)AAARRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHH!!! Stevetown, we barely knew ye. The PRNG giveth and the PRNG taketh away. I'd rather neither Jaipur nor Stevetown flipped. Still, one of the dangers of a gambit like Stevetown is that it can always turn out badly. We invested pretty heavily there and it cost us. Not insurmountable but very disappointing. Those 4ish luxes down there would have been EXTREMELY helpful.
Hmm..when did you start that worker in Cent? Cent should not be producing workers -- it doesn't have the population base/growth rate to do so. Let each town go with its strength. After a harbor, courthouse, aqueduct, and marketplace, Cent might want to do a worker -- as it is, that just slows the poor city down.
On the lux score, we only lost one luxury, right? And you bought two more and were still having problems? That doesn't make sense... Your reasoning on when to go for the extra lux makes sense, but the implementation is questionable. Are you SURE the 10% lux tax was needed? If it's only 1 or 2 citizens, it might be worth running them as taxmen.
I have no complaints about trading for horses again. This whole set of trades, though, feels sub-optimal to me, like there were some things missing. I can't put my finger on what, though, so no weed calls.
(50) For something safe like territory maps, it's usually safest and best to simply make the trade. It doesn't actually COST us anything to give up our territory map, since Ghandi already knows the lay of the land and our improvements/defenses are all adequate. You get more AI brownie points that way. Techs, never sell on their turn, your territory map when they already have a comprehensive world map? That's OK.
More worker turns wasted on the road to Russia. It's not so important that it can't wait another 10-20 turns, during which time more important projects can be completed. Prioritizing worker tasks is very important, as it can easily mean a 10-30 gpt difference, which adds up FAST. Moreso, it can have an exponential effect on pop size and shields produced. Improve lands close to home first and then move to lower priority projects, like roading to Russia.
Good job keeping an eye on the cities later, max shields before aqueduct, commerce with no build-time penalties, etc. Those little moves are quite helpful.
Save game notes:
- St.R. is smaller than it should be. Keep cities on max food unless there's a good reason not to. It should be at least one, and probably even two, larger than it is. Lost people never come back -- lost shields are often returned with interest with larger populations.
- Tye is still undefended -- that's dangerous. Send one of our extra worthless units up there to guard the place (warrior out of Sala probably). And speaking of warriors, the warrior in Catt should be upgraded to a sword, so we have one more useful unit in our attacking force.
- There is a potential micromanagement opportunity in OS. Right now, OS is producing 8 shields and losing one to waste for a net of 7 shields -- 5 turns for a MW. However, by moving a citizen from the irrigated grasslands to iron mountain, the shields go to 10 gross and 8 net -- 4 turns for a MW...but at the cost of 3 food. Mix'n'match works well here, 2 turns on the grass for food and 2 on iron mountain gives a total of 30 shields, saving a turn on each MW and not costing growth much.
- That worker trudging through Russia is going to be a problem and will probably be captured when we declare war. Not sure what else you could've done with him, though. Cathy might actually flip out enough to capture him, since he's so unprotected.
Arathorn
(150) Very good trades. The including of a RoP with India earns extra kudos and a 
-- we will need those techs (at some point) and the price was right -- good shopping opportunity, too. Nicely done.
(130) The scout. You can use (abuse?) them to block resources occasionally. They upgrade to explorers, too, who can pillage. Worth keeping? I dunno -- I like to have an expendable unit to sneak in and look at a city's defender. No-attack units are less annoying/threatening to the AI than attack units, so he still has a purpose. Whether it's worth 1 gpt or not is another issue. Some say yes, some say no. It's up to you.
Nice little MM tricks here. Doing those a lot will get you a few gpt, which seems insignificant, but having that little extra oomph for a necessary upgrade or rush when you NEED it is huge.
(110) There are some grasslands near OS that have not been developed at all yet. Those are higher priority than jungle chopping or modifying existing improvements. It is often worthwhile to hone improvements around a city, but getting extra square being used improved (at all) is a higher priority. (Exceptions for getting luxuries/resources online.) The river is nice but doesn't justify ignoring good grassland.
And an abrupt stop. I looked at the save game, but two turns is too little to really comment on too much. It looks like a very good start.
Arathorn
-- we will need those techs (at some point) and the price was right -- good shopping opportunity, too. Nicely done.(130) The scout. You can use (abuse?) them to block resources occasionally. They upgrade to explorers, too, who can pillage. Worth keeping? I dunno -- I like to have an expendable unit to sneak in and look at a city's defender. No-attack units are less annoying/threatening to the AI than attack units, so he still has a purpose. Whether it's worth 1 gpt or not is another issue. Some say yes, some say no. It's up to you.
Nice little MM tricks here. Doing those a lot will get you a few gpt, which seems insignificant, but having that little extra oomph for a necessary upgrade or rush when you NEED it is huge.
(110) There are some grasslands near OS that have not been developed at all yet. Those are higher priority than jungle chopping or modifying existing improvements. It is often worthwhile to hone improvements around a city, but getting extra square being used improved (at all) is a higher priority. (Exceptions for getting luxuries/resources online.) The river is nice but doesn't justify ignoring good grassland.
And an abrupt stop. I looked at the save game, but two turns is too little to really comment on too much. It looks like a very good start.
Arathorn
Yeah, I think you should go ahead and move your post to the official thread. That way, the "official" thread will stay complete. And put a link to your save there, too. I think that will make it easiest to follow.
Sorry again about the long delay. I'd forgotten how time-consuming and exhausting newborns are.
Arathorn
Sorry again about the long delay. I'd forgotten how time-consuming and exhausting newborns are.
Arathorn
Due to an event beyond my control (IE a roommate) i no longer have net access. Because of this i am going to have to drop out of this and all my SG games. I have no idea when/if i will ever get a phone line back anytime soon. I wish you guys luck and may still say hi from time to time while im at work.
(0) 50 - Take a city tour.
Warriors in Sala, Allegheny, St. R waked. The one from All sent to defend Tye. The one from St. R. sent to defend Akw. The one from Sala sent to OS to become a swordsman.
StR MM'd for shields. Sala given extra commerce.
MWs in the MC area rerouted south -- or activated and told to await orders next turn.
Scout sent S to explore defense. I note both Russian cities are size 7 -- that means a bonus defense. Shoot!
I make the diplomatic rounds, too, but no good deals were available. Invention has only been partially shopped and Astronomy is unique to Russia.
I also spend 228 gold to rush the marketplace in NF. I keep the min sci gambit on Music Theory going -- no real reason not to, as the citizen would just be producing a few wasted shields if used.
I - NF completes marketplace, begins settler.
Russians begin Leonardo's.
(1) 70 - I do a little trick to get the defender to Tye faster. I send the "new" warrior (from All) to Grand River and wake the GR defender and send him to Tye. In this case, it probably doesn't matter, but it's good practice.
The worker gang by OS (wasteful) is broken into parts to mine the iron mountain, road the hills to the east and to set up a new grassland square.
Scout sees pikes defending both Odessa and Minsk and ducks back into Iroquois land. Warrior reaches OS and upgrades to sword.
Boring diplo front.
I - Sala MW -> MW. OS pike -> MW.
(2) 90 - Extra pike from OS sent to Catt via change-over in Allegheny. He'll try to march with the offensive and defend the new acquisitions.
After finishing task by Tona, worker goes to NF to mine a desert to help that city with its shield production. MW from Sala sent to Catt. Workers in the north (having roaded a mountain) split -- two going to road another incense and the third headed southwest to bring irrigation to Akw's grassland square. Grassland by Centralia being roaded.
Offensive is set to start in a few turns -- we have almost 15 MWs in Catt. This will be a pretty good GA time and we can hopefully get four Russian cities including wines and horses. That's the goal. First two turn goal would be to get all three frontline cities -- Odessa, Minsk, and Tblisi. Minsk and Tblisi have no good route to it, so will have to be second turn goals.
I - Russian pike runs from Odessa towards Minsk -- makes me a bit leery, but we should be able to handle whatever. All finishes MW and starts another.
(3) 110 - All MWs from Catt awakened and sent to the jungle bordering Russia. Swordsmen and one pike go, too. This is our SoD and it will split when it needs to, but it's our offensive push.
More workers sent to improve NF. Irrigation north of St. R. begins. Workers south of OS move to grassland and protection. The warrior who had been defending them moves to OS and upgrades to swordsman.
Worker by Stevetown irrigates, as we have more ivory than we can trade right now.
I - China wants to trade his WM for our WM and 3 gold. I acquiesce, just to keep him happy.
Sala MW -> MW.
(4) 130 - MW from Sala heads SW (really should've waited with him until some of the outcomes of the combats were known. Oh well. On second thought, we won't actually see any combat this turn.... At least not until the interturn.)
I then check our Active deals with Russia -- none. Good. We don't want a reputation hit for this war. I then declare war with all our troops still in our territory. This makes all our trading still from a reputable standpoint.
WAR CHECKLIST:
1. Goal --- You should always have clearly defined goals in mind when declaring war. Is it a limited war to get a luxury/resource? A war to get a wonder you want? A war to the death? Know what the goal is before you start.
Our goal is clear in this case -- we want to get wines and horses -- that will require the conquest of 4 cities, including the capital, which should count as about 2 cities worth of difficulty.
2. Military preparedness -- Do you have enough troops on-hand to do the job, given standard AI defense? Are there plans in place to replace losses?
Yes. We are prepared on the west front, fully. We have enough troops to take at least two cities. Reinforcements will be fast and furious, because we will trigger our GA and Sala can produce one MW/turn under GA conditions. We have defensive troops to move with the offense. We're set -- mostly. The east force is too small, really, but I got overanxious by a couple turns --.
3. Diplomatic -- Deals with the target civ that need to be cancelled/expire? Concerns about a multiple-front war?
We have no active deals with Russia. The only other fronts would be on Russian acquisitions or from the sea, which we can handle.
4. Logistics -- Are the troops in place? Is there a clear line of offense? Is defense prepared?
We're set here. All is ready, as much as we can foresee.
5. Worst-case scenario -- What is it? Can you handle it? What's the expected loss vs. gain?
Worst-case, Egypt joins Russia and we lose our southern two cities and make minimal gains in Russia. Not fatal and pretty unlikely. Expected gain is very high -- horses and another native luxury. Both are important for us.
OK, we're ready for war. Checklist completed.
Workers by NF head to the mountain -- shields for NF becomes their rallying call.
Workers by Centralia head to the grassland to mine and road -- more people is always good.
All 15 MWs in the west go one square south into Russian land. They all wait a round -- I want to see how the battle for Odessa goes before committing troop count to Minsk. This way, too, they can all be defended by the pike and swords coming behind.
In the east, the MW and the swords also move into Russian territory -- near Tblisi.
Oh. Egypt now has Astronomy and Invention. Interesting. I check for the price of an alliance. WM and 470 gold. It's worth considering. If we can win a few battles, the price may drop. But it would lock us into 20 turns of war, which we may not really want as a Republic. Certainly not desirable now, just a checking.
India also has Invention, so it's cheap now. But we're gonna wait and see if we can beat it out of Russia.
I also check every city for unhappiness. Declaring war while a Republic can have dire consequences. Everything appears OK. So on we go!
I - Great! Cleo comes demanding. I, of course, cave. War with one major power is enough, thank you very much. War against Egypt would be horrible right now. TM and 59 gold is cheap enough.
MC galley -> aqueduct (marketplace a close second).
(5) 150 - Worker by GR to second forest to road it.
Begin the MW parade towards Odessa. Always bring enough troops. I expect to see two or three regular pikemen defending it -- fortified in a city gives 'em +100%, so they defend at a 6. Every hp we do will cost, on average, two of ours. If we're lucky, 4 troops will be enough. 6 is realistic and 10 should be plenty. We'll see.
I send 'em one-at-a-time so that any non-used ones can wheel around and head for Minsk.
Battle for Odessa (three regular pikes and a longbowmen defending)
First one --(rp1) one hp damage and dies.
Second -- (rp2) 0 hp and retreat.
Third -- (rp2) 1 hp and retreat. Great -- they have at least 3 defenders.
Fourth -- (rp3) WINS at 1 hp! Kills one and we enter our GA! (More on the GA later).
Fifth -- (rp1) 1 hp, dies, and the defender promotes. Sigh.
Sixth -- (rp2) Wins with no damage to himself.
Seventh -- (vp) Wins with no damage -- a longbowman remains.
Eighth -- (l) Wins at 2 hp. We go ahead and capture Odessa -- razing is often good, but we don't have a settler ready and China/India could easily beat us to the punch.
Starvation begins immediately -- there's absolutely no reason not to!
Two nice things about Odessa. One, the barracks survived, giving us a healing location on this side of the jungle. Two, it's connected to China's roadnet, so we have the fourth luxury online immediately. A temple is ordered.
The 7 remaining MWs and the swords/pike go east towards Minsk. That might not be enough force -- we'll have to consider next turn.
Battle for Tblisi: Too few forces!
We send the MW first, for retreat potential.
Kills the regular spear with one hp remaining and waits for further developments.
Sword 1 -- deals 1 hp damage and dies.
Sword 2 -- does the same and the #$!@(& spear promotes. Always bring enough forces, Arathorn! Pike does nothing. MW retreats to OS.
OK, our GA started and we got a fourth luxury -- time to review ALL our cities. First, I move the lux slider to zero.
With a little help from NF (returning the mined hill), Sala can pull 30 shields/turn. That's a MW/turn, which wil be VERY important. That change is made. NF takes over the scientist gig (for one turn, at which point it will need to be reevaluated, as it will have produced a settler). OS put to max food, not affecting MW build time. The cities in the far south are unaffected--not surprisingly.
Cost for an Egyptian alliance is still high -- WM and 570 gold. OUCH! It went up. Well, as long as they don't ally AGAINST us, we'll be OK. Expensive insurance...and we might be able to handle that war, too. I go without it, this turn.
Ivory gets WM and 66 gold from Mao.
I - longbowman attacks our pike in the jungle by Tblisi and dies. That front is in a shambles. Sala MW -> MW. NF settler -> harbor. GR marketplace -> aqueduct. All MW -> MW. OS MW -> MW. StR aqueduct -> pike.
(6) 170 - Workers on incense by Centralia to forest to clear another food square. Galley from MC explores SE. Settler from NF heads SW towards the front. Workers between OS and Tye mine hill.
4 MWs reinforce Tblisi front (from OS, Sala, All, and the floater from last turn). Wounded MW to OS to heal. Pike stays put.
Decision on attacking Minsk. 2 regular swords and 7 MWs. At least one vet pike in defense. Touch-and-go decision. We have two more MWs who can get there this turn to add to the next turn's attack. ALWAYS bring decisive force. I wait, unhappily.
The two healthy MWs from the Odessa attack move to reinforce. Others to Odessa to heal.
Odessa put back on starvation. No scientist assigned.
I - Russia sends two defensive troops to our southern area -- worker unprotected. Might have to rush something down there.
Sala MW->MW.
(to be continued)
Warriors in Sala, Allegheny, St. R waked. The one from All sent to defend Tye. The one from St. R. sent to defend Akw. The one from Sala sent to OS to become a swordsman.
StR MM'd for shields. Sala given extra commerce.
MWs in the MC area rerouted south -- or activated and told to await orders next turn.
Scout sent S to explore defense. I note both Russian cities are size 7 -- that means a bonus defense. Shoot!
I make the diplomatic rounds, too, but no good deals were available. Invention has only been partially shopped and Astronomy is unique to Russia.
I also spend 228 gold to rush the marketplace in NF. I keep the min sci gambit on Music Theory going -- no real reason not to, as the citizen would just be producing a few wasted shields if used.
I - NF completes marketplace, begins settler.
Russians begin Leonardo's.
(1) 70 - I do a little trick to get the defender to Tye faster. I send the "new" warrior (from All) to Grand River and wake the GR defender and send him to Tye. In this case, it probably doesn't matter, but it's good practice.
The worker gang by OS (wasteful) is broken into parts to mine the iron mountain, road the hills to the east and to set up a new grassland square.
Scout sees pikes defending both Odessa and Minsk and ducks back into Iroquois land. Warrior reaches OS and upgrades to sword.
Boring diplo front.
I - Sala MW -> MW. OS pike -> MW.
(2) 90 - Extra pike from OS sent to Catt via change-over in Allegheny. He'll try to march with the offensive and defend the new acquisitions.
After finishing task by Tona, worker goes to NF to mine a desert to help that city with its shield production. MW from Sala sent to Catt. Workers in the north (having roaded a mountain) split -- two going to road another incense and the third headed southwest to bring irrigation to Akw's grassland square. Grassland by Centralia being roaded.
Offensive is set to start in a few turns -- we have almost 15 MWs in Catt. This will be a pretty good GA time and we can hopefully get four Russian cities including wines and horses. That's the goal. First two turn goal would be to get all three frontline cities -- Odessa, Minsk, and Tblisi. Minsk and Tblisi have no good route to it, so will have to be second turn goals.
I - Russian pike runs from Odessa towards Minsk -- makes me a bit leery, but we should be able to handle whatever. All finishes MW and starts another.
(3) 110 - All MWs from Catt awakened and sent to the jungle bordering Russia. Swordsmen and one pike go, too. This is our SoD and it will split when it needs to, but it's our offensive push.
More workers sent to improve NF. Irrigation north of St. R. begins. Workers south of OS move to grassland and protection. The warrior who had been defending them moves to OS and upgrades to swordsman.
Worker by Stevetown irrigates, as we have more ivory than we can trade right now.
I - China wants to trade his WM for our WM and 3 gold. I acquiesce, just to keep him happy.
Sala MW -> MW.
(4) 130 - MW from Sala heads SW (really should've waited with him until some of the outcomes of the combats were known. Oh well. On second thought, we won't actually see any combat this turn.... At least not until the interturn.)
I then check our Active deals with Russia -- none. Good. We don't want a reputation hit for this war. I then declare war with all our troops still in our territory. This makes all our trading still from a reputable standpoint.
WAR CHECKLIST:
1. Goal --- You should always have clearly defined goals in mind when declaring war. Is it a limited war to get a luxury/resource? A war to get a wonder you want? A war to the death? Know what the goal is before you start.
Our goal is clear in this case -- we want to get wines and horses -- that will require the conquest of 4 cities, including the capital, which should count as about 2 cities worth of difficulty.
2. Military preparedness -- Do you have enough troops on-hand to do the job, given standard AI defense? Are there plans in place to replace losses?
Yes. We are prepared on the west front, fully. We have enough troops to take at least two cities. Reinforcements will be fast and furious, because we will trigger our GA and Sala can produce one MW/turn under GA conditions. We have defensive troops to move with the offense. We're set -- mostly. The east force is too small, really, but I got overanxious by a couple turns --
.3. Diplomatic -- Deals with the target civ that need to be cancelled/expire? Concerns about a multiple-front war?
We have no active deals with Russia. The only other fronts would be on Russian acquisitions or from the sea, which we can handle.
4. Logistics -- Are the troops in place? Is there a clear line of offense? Is defense prepared?
We're set here. All is ready, as much as we can foresee.
5. Worst-case scenario -- What is it? Can you handle it? What's the expected loss vs. gain?
Worst-case, Egypt joins Russia and we lose our southern two cities and make minimal gains in Russia. Not fatal and pretty unlikely. Expected gain is very high -- horses and another native luxury. Both are important for us.
OK, we're ready for war. Checklist completed.
Workers by NF head to the mountain -- shields for NF becomes their rallying call.
Workers by Centralia head to the grassland to mine and road -- more people is always good.
All 15 MWs in the west go one square south into Russian land. They all wait a round -- I want to see how the battle for Odessa goes before committing troop count to Minsk. This way, too, they can all be defended by the pike and swords coming behind.
In the east, the MW and the swords also move into Russian territory -- near Tblisi.
Oh. Egypt now has Astronomy and Invention. Interesting. I check for the price of an alliance. WM and 470 gold. It's worth considering. If we can win a few battles, the price may drop. But it would lock us into 20 turns of war, which we may not really want as a Republic. Certainly not desirable now, just a checking.
India also has Invention, so it's cheap now. But we're gonna wait and see if we can beat it out of Russia.
I also check every city for unhappiness. Declaring war while a Republic can have dire consequences. Everything appears OK. So on we go!
I - Great! Cleo comes demanding. I, of course, cave. War with one major power is enough, thank you very much. War against Egypt would be horrible right now. TM and 59 gold is cheap enough.
MC galley -> aqueduct (marketplace a close second).
(5) 150 - Worker by GR to second forest to road it.
Begin the MW parade towards Odessa. Always bring enough troops. I expect to see two or three regular pikemen defending it -- fortified in a city gives 'em +100%, so they defend at a 6. Every hp we do will cost, on average, two of ours. If we're lucky, 4 troops will be enough. 6 is realistic and 10 should be plenty. We'll see.
I send 'em one-at-a-time so that any non-used ones can wheel around and head for Minsk.
Battle for Odessa (three regular pikes and a longbowmen defending)
First one --(rp1) one hp damage and dies.
Second -- (rp2) 0 hp and retreat.
Third -- (rp2) 1 hp and retreat. Great -- they have at least 3 defenders.
Fourth -- (rp3) WINS at 1 hp! Kills one and we enter our GA! (More on the GA later).
Fifth -- (rp1) 1 hp, dies, and the defender promotes. Sigh.
Sixth -- (rp2) Wins with no damage to himself.
Seventh -- (vp) Wins with no damage -- a longbowman remains.
Eighth -- (l) Wins at 2 hp. We go ahead and capture Odessa -- razing is often good, but we don't have a settler ready and China/India could easily beat us to the punch.
Starvation begins immediately -- there's absolutely no reason not to!
Two nice things about Odessa. One, the barracks survived, giving us a healing location on this side of the jungle. Two, it's connected to China's roadnet, so we have the fourth luxury online immediately. A temple is ordered.
The 7 remaining MWs and the swords/pike go east towards Minsk. That might not be enough force -- we'll have to consider next turn.
Battle for Tblisi:
Too few forces!We send the MW first, for retreat potential.
Kills the regular spear with one hp remaining and waits for further developments.
Sword 1 -- deals 1 hp damage and dies.
Sword 2 -- does the same and the #$!@(& spear promotes. Always bring enough forces, Arathorn! Pike does nothing. MW retreats to OS.
OK, our GA started and we got a fourth luxury -- time to review ALL our cities. First, I move the lux slider to zero.
With a little help from NF (returning the mined hill), Sala can pull 30 shields/turn. That's a MW/turn, which wil be VERY important. That change is made. NF takes over the scientist gig (for one turn, at which point it will need to be reevaluated, as it will have produced a settler). OS put to max food, not affecting MW build time. The cities in the far south are unaffected--not surprisingly.
Cost for an Egyptian alliance is still high -- WM and 570 gold. OUCH! It went up. Well, as long as they don't ally AGAINST us, we'll be OK. Expensive insurance...and we might be able to handle that war, too. I go without it, this turn.
Ivory gets WM and 66 gold from Mao.
I - longbowman attacks our pike in the jungle by Tblisi and dies. That front is in a shambles. Sala MW -> MW. NF settler -> harbor. GR marketplace -> aqueduct. All MW -> MW. OS MW -> MW. StR aqueduct -> pike.
(6) 170 - Workers on incense by Centralia to forest to clear another food square. Galley from MC explores SE. Settler from NF heads SW towards the front. Workers between OS and Tye mine hill.
4 MWs reinforce Tblisi front (from OS, Sala, All, and the floater from last turn). Wounded MW to OS to heal. Pike stays put.
Decision on attacking Minsk. 2 regular swords and 7 MWs. At least one vet pike in defense. Touch-and-go decision. We have two more MWs who can get there this turn to add to the next turn's attack. ALWAYS bring decisive force. I wait, unhappily.
The two healthy MWs from the Odessa attack move to reinforce. Others to Odessa to heal.
Odessa put back on starvation. No scientist assigned.
I - Russia sends two defensive troops to our southern area -- worker unprotected. Might have to rush something down there.
Sala MW->MW.
(to be continued)
(7) 190 - Odessa still in starvation.
Battle for Minsk (1 vet pike, 1 regular pike, 1 regular spear):
MW 1 - (vp) takes 2 hp and dies.
MW 2 - (rp) 0 hp, retreats, and waits.
MW 3 - (rp) 1 hp and dies.
MW 4 - (rp) takes 2 hp for a victory, and waits.
MW 5 - (rs) 0 hp, retreats, and waits.
MW 6 - (rs) takes 0 hp, wins, and waits.
MW 7 - (vp) 1 hp and dies (vp->ep)
MW 8 - (ep) 1 hp and dies
MW 9 - (ep) takes 1 hp, wins, and the city is ours. We again capture instead of razing. We want the people and the borders. It improves our odds on Moscow.
No buildings survived. We start a temple and the starvation process.
Second battle for Tblisi (1 vet spear, 1 regular spear): more 6 troops should be sent -- try for 3:1 odds on the attack.
MW 1 - (vs) 3 hp and dies.
MW 2 - (rs) 2 hp and dies.
MW 3 - (rs) takes 0 hp, wins, waits.
MW 4 - (vs) 0 hp, dies, and he promotes. SUCKY luck!
Still, we should've killed the darn vet spear with MW 4. If I'd've done what I should've and had two more attackers, we would have won definitively and given him no chance to heal.
Workers complete mountain near OS. Some head to hill to help mine -- others to mountain by Sala to road/mine.
Settler to OS. Workers by Centralia chop forest. Worker north of StR moves north to irrigate more.
MW from Sala to Tblisi front.
Healed MW from Odessa explores west, looking for Russian slave fodder -- no luck.
Wounded MWs from Minsk to Odessa to heal. Swords and pike in to defend.
Oooohhh...Egypt has Chivalry. Who else? China and India (and maybe Russia).
India still needs Incense. Let's make a deal. Incense, WM, and 338 gold swing the deal.
But, shoot! That means we can't do the MW every turn from Sala anymore. Stupid, stupid. Oh well. We can still crank a fair few knights and having them will speed our Russian conquest significantly.
24 is the magic number for knights (just over 70 shields in 3 turns) so Sala can return the hill to NF with no loss in build time. All on no-growth cuts a turn from its knight production time, so we do that (should be necessary this turn only). OS saves a knight turn and doesn't affect growth time by moving one citizen from irrigated grass to mined grass.
(In retrospect (i.e. a day later), I should've put Sala on pikemen duty at 30 shields each. More troops for defense and upgradeability with less loss. Not thinking the clearest last night. Rushing my turns a bit too much.)
Knight rushed in Avaris for defense purposes.
I - no counter-attack. Tona aqueduct -> marketplace. Avaris knight -> pike. Indians start Copernicus.
(8) 210 - Minsk/Odessa on full starvation.
6 MWs updated for 480 gold. 4 more (after movement) for another 320 gold. Workers do their thing. Tblisi front abandoned to upgrade. 2 more knights for another 160 gold.
Avaris knight doesn't attack uphill to try to defend the iron. If/when they pillage, we'll be OK. We still have an extra source.
We're now broke, but we have a very modern army.
I - Russians pillage as expected. Sala riots??? War weariness? I zoom and use right-arrows to check all other cities. And, yep, the peace-mongers are out in force. Sigh! Darn pillaging. I wish I'd've run 10% luxuries. Oh well. MM each city. A number of cities are affected. Minsk/Odessa end their resistance. Will continue to starve.
StR pike->pike.
(9) 230 - StR pike -> Centralia as there's a Russian ship nearby. The OS knights head for Tblisi -- the pikes play tag to get a healthy one down there. All but one knight from Odessa heads towards Moscow. We want to capture that before making peace.
A blocking warrior dies. The 2 swords come for entertainment. Avaris knight kills Russian pike who had moved down to the plains.
Russia won't even give one tech for peace (not that we were very interested anyway -- YET).
NF grew and needed a scientist built. Odessa put on minor growth with no effect on knight time.
I - All knight -> knight. Catt aqueduct -> harbor. Chinese start Copernicus. China completes Sun-Tzu's in Shanghai.
(10) 250 - Third battle for Tblisi (still way too early and still no decisive force):
Knight 1 - (es) 0 hp and retreats.
Knight 2 - (es) 3 hp and dies.
Knight 3 - (rs) loses 1 hp, kills him and promotes.
Still Russian.
Battle for Moscow: [Note: With only 8 knights, I would NOT try this were it not a shadow of a training game. The potential for disaster is too high. Capitals are tough and usually VERY well defended.]
Knight 1 - (rp) loses 0 hp, kills him.
Knight 2 - (rs) 0 hp, dies. Gives promotion.
Knight 3 - (vs) loses 2 hp, kills him.
Knight 5 - (rs) loses 3 hp, wins.
Knight 6 - (rs) loses 3 hp, wins.
Knight 7 - (rs) loses 2 hp, wins.
Knight 8 - (rs) [I've been attacking across water -- always check Cntl-Shift-M, which I didn't do, since this isn't "official"] loses 1 hp, wins. We capture Moscow. EXTREMELY lucky result.
6 defenders. 4 attack vs. 3 defense and 4 hp vs. 3 hp usually wins but not as often as I did above. I repeat, this attack was premature and the fact that it was successful does not change the fact that it was not good practice.
Start the starvation. Great Library and Colossus. I usually can't bear to raze that. Troops will be stationed to retake it when it flips. Temple begun to get horses into cultural range.
Avaris knight kills another Russian spear in our southern lands...returns to Avaris again.
All knight to Tblisi front. Settler SW along river. Swords on mountain to view Russia.
Odessa back to starvation. Rest of the cities unchecked.
Russia won't give Tblisi for peace, so heck with them.
Save game at
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/lotr3-shadow-Arathorn-250ad.zip
Arathorn
Battle for Minsk (1 vet pike, 1 regular pike, 1 regular spear):
MW 1 - (vp) takes 2 hp and dies.
MW 2 - (rp) 0 hp, retreats, and waits.
MW 3 - (rp) 1 hp and dies.
MW 4 - (rp) takes 2 hp for a victory, and waits.
MW 5 - (rs) 0 hp, retreats, and waits.
MW 6 - (rs) takes 0 hp, wins, and waits.
MW 7 - (vp) 1 hp and dies (vp->ep)
MW 8 - (ep) 1 hp and dies
MW 9 - (ep) takes 1 hp, wins, and the city is ours. We again capture instead of razing. We want the people and the borders. It improves our odds on Moscow.
No buildings survived. We start a temple and the starvation process.
Second battle for Tblisi (1 vet spear, 1 regular spear): more
6 troops should be sent -- try for 3:1 odds on the attack.MW 1 - (vs) 3 hp and dies.
MW 2 - (rs) 2 hp and dies.
MW 3 - (rs) takes 0 hp, wins, waits.
MW 4 - (vs) 0 hp, dies, and he promotes. SUCKY luck!
Still, we should've killed the darn vet spear with MW 4. If I'd've done what I should've and had two more attackers, we would have won definitively and given him no chance to heal.
Workers complete mountain near OS. Some head to hill to help mine -- others to mountain by Sala to road/mine.
Settler to OS. Workers by Centralia chop forest. Worker north of StR moves north to irrigate more.
MW from Sala to Tblisi front.
Healed MW from Odessa explores west, looking for Russian slave fodder -- no luck.
Wounded MWs from Minsk to Odessa to heal. Swords and pike in to defend.
Oooohhh...Egypt has Chivalry. Who else? China and India (and maybe Russia).
India still needs Incense. Let's make a deal. Incense, WM, and 338 gold swing the deal.
But, shoot! That means we can't do the MW every turn from Sala anymore. Stupid, stupid. Oh well. We can still crank a fair few knights and having them will speed our Russian conquest significantly.
24 is the magic number for knights (just over 70 shields in 3 turns) so Sala can return the hill to NF with no loss in build time. All on no-growth cuts a turn from its knight production time, so we do that (should be necessary this turn only). OS saves a knight turn and doesn't affect growth time by moving one citizen from irrigated grass to mined grass.
(In retrospect (i.e. a day later), I should've put Sala on pikemen duty at 30 shields each. More troops for defense and upgradeability with less loss. Not thinking the clearest last night. Rushing my turns a bit too much.)
Knight rushed in Avaris for defense purposes.
I - no counter-attack. Tona aqueduct -> marketplace. Avaris knight -> pike. Indians start Copernicus.
(8) 210 - Minsk/Odessa on full starvation.
6 MWs updated for 480 gold. 4 more (after movement) for another 320 gold. Workers do their thing. Tblisi front abandoned to upgrade. 2 more knights for another 160 gold.
Avaris knight doesn't attack uphill to try to defend the iron. If/when they pillage, we'll be OK. We still have an extra source.
We're now broke, but we have a very modern army.
I - Russians pillage as expected. Sala riots??? War weariness? I zoom and use right-arrows to check all other cities. And, yep, the peace-mongers are out in force. Sigh! Darn pillaging. I wish I'd've run 10% luxuries. Oh well. MM each city. A number of cities are affected. Minsk/Odessa end their resistance. Will continue to starve.
StR pike->pike.
(9) 230 - StR pike -> Centralia as there's a Russian ship nearby. The OS knights head for Tblisi -- the pikes play tag to get a healthy one down there. All but one knight from Odessa heads towards Moscow. We want to capture that before making peace.
A blocking warrior dies. The 2 swords come for entertainment. Avaris knight kills Russian pike who had moved down to the plains.
Russia won't even give one tech for peace (not that we were very interested anyway -- YET).
NF grew and needed a scientist built. Odessa put on minor growth with no effect on knight time.
I - All knight -> knight. Catt aqueduct -> harbor. Chinese start Copernicus. China completes Sun-Tzu's in Shanghai.
(10) 250 - Third battle for Tblisi (still way too early and still no decisive force):
Knight 1 - (es) 0 hp and retreats.
Knight 2 - (es) 3 hp and dies.
Knight 3 - (rs) loses 1 hp, kills him and promotes.
Still Russian.
Battle for Moscow: [Note: With only 8 knights, I would NOT try this were it not a shadow of a training game. The potential for disaster is too high. Capitals are tough and usually VERY well defended.]
Knight 1 - (rp) loses 0 hp, kills him.
Knight 2 - (rs) 0 hp, dies. Gives promotion.
Knight 3 - (vs) loses 2 hp, kills him.
Knight 5 - (rs) loses 3 hp, wins.
Knight 6 - (rs) loses 3 hp, wins.
Knight 7 - (rs) loses 2 hp, wins.
Knight 8 - (rs) [I've been attacking across water -- always check Cntl-Shift-M, which I didn't do, since this isn't "official"] loses 1 hp, wins. We capture Moscow. EXTREMELY lucky result.
6 defenders. 4 attack vs. 3 defense and 4 hp vs. 3 hp usually wins but not as often as I did above. I repeat, this attack was premature and the fact that it was successful does not change the fact that it was not good practice.
Start the starvation. Great Library and Colossus. I usually can't bear to raze that. Troops will be stationed to retake it when it flips. Temple begun to get horses into cultural range.
Avaris knight kills another Russian spear in our southern lands...returns to Avaris again.
All knight to Tblisi front. Settler SW along river. Swords on mountain to view Russia.
Odessa back to starvation. Rest of the cities unchecked.
Russia won't give Tblisi for peace, so heck with them.
Save game at
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/lotr3-shadow-Arathorn-250ad.zip
Arathorn
