[MOD] Fall from Heaven II

[Broken Hawk]

Last night I discovered that Good and Evil Civs cannot build Druids. What was the thinking behind that?

It's hard enough to constantly keep an eye on the AC but now you cannot terraform with Druids.

OK, so much for my complaint. At least you can still build the Genesis wonder. Can you promote an Adept to, say, a Mage and terraform to some extent? If so, what promotions/spells are needed?

Thanks.

 

[Lucius Sulla]

In my oppinion, it was just way too easy and profitable to terraform. In 'Light' I ended up with perfect paradises in my lands, no matter what civ I was... of course the blight effect now has made it a bit more need, but still precisely for that, being able to terraform fast and easy would lessen the impact of this horrible plague.

By the way, Kael, you might want to check a post in the FFH2 forum (the malakim religion thread), in which I posted some ideas about religions&religious themes.

 

[Thimblyjoe]

It's funny, everyone's whining about the druids, but I never even realized they had that effect. I always went the hard way by using high priests upgraded from priests of leaves. Short of that I used an archmage. In other words, there's more then one way to skin a cat... not that I'm into that kind of thing. Frankly, I think it's good they did that, I always thought that a demonic or vampiric druid was a bit out of place. If it makes the game more difficult, then it's just that much more challenge. In short, good work to Kael and the gang, keep it up.

 

[Nor'easter]

Last night I discovered that Good and Evil Civs cannot build Druids. What was the thinking behind that?

It's hard enough to constantly keep an eye on the AC but now you cannot terraform with Druids.

OK, so much for my complaint. At least you can still build the Genesis wonder. Can you promote an Adept to, say, a Mage and terraform to some extent? If so, what promotions/spells are needed?

Thanks.

I don't know offhand about Mages, but Conjurers with the Water I promotion can cast a spell called "Spring," which upgrades a desert tile to plains. Mages should be able to do it, also, because in addition to Water I you need the Channeling I promotion. Makes the tile much more useful than before.

 

[Broken Hawk]

In my oppinion, it was just way too easy and profitable to terraform. In 'Light' I ended up with perfect paradises in my lands, no matter what civ I was... of course the blight effect now has made it a bit more need, but still precisely for that, being able to terraform fast and easy would lessen the impact of this horrible plague.

Valid point. So much for the "Age of Rebirth".

 

[Kael]

Last night I discovered that Good and Evil Civs cannot build Druids. What was the thinking behind that?

It's hard enough to constantly keep an eye on the AC but now you cannot terraform with Druids.

OK, so much for my complaint. At least you can still build the Genesis wonder. Can you promote an Adept to, say, a Mage and terraform to some extent? If so, what promotions/spells are needed?

Thanks.

It didn't make sense to me to have druids joining evil givs, paladins joining neutral civs. Heck in Light you could be good, worship the Fellowship and build Eidolons.

So instead we broke them out in "Fire". You have to be good to build paladins, neutral to bruid druids and evil to build eidolons. They are all substantial units in "Fire" and I think its a fair balance by only allowing a player to have access to them.

Plus I think Neutral players kinda got left out of "Fire", and allowing them singular access to druids seemed fair.

 

[Broken Hawk]

I didn't realize the change to Paladins and Eidolons. Correct alignment and better balance now.

 

[Nor'easter]

Is that so? If so, I'd second above post!

I was writing hypothetically. Some people have remarked about the Blight destroying resources. I simply said that "IF" the Blight destroyed strategic resources (incense, reagents, horses, elephants) -- which I haven't seen happen and which nobody has reported happening -- then I would object, since that could be game-breaking in a way that losing corn or wheat is not. That's all.

 

[Maniac]

But I couldn't imagine Kilmorph really having a substantial evil population worshipping her.

Earth goblins, cave trolls, Uruk-hai industrially created from earth.

 

[Darcave]

I think it should lower armagedon count when inquisitor remove AS from city. Its more "Better", more peacefull way than raze the city.

 

[thealien_83]

I think it should lower armagedon count when inquisitor remove AS from city. Its more "Better", more peacefull way than raze the city.

Quite honestly, I'm inclined to disagree, if mostly for theme and flavor reasons. If a city has been inhabited by demon-worshipping heathens for any substantial time, I would imagine the only way to be sure that you have removed the foul taint of the hellspawn would be to put the city to the torch, tear down the charred remains and then sprinkle holy water over the blackened earth remaining. And then maybe. "Just" converting the population with sword and fire just won't cut it when dealing with the taint of Hell that the followers of the Ashen Veil would have allowed into the world.

Besides, it makes the battle against Armageddon much more brutal and fierce. You can't just capture a city and then inquisition it and then go on, if you want that Counter to go down you have to be ruthless, which again fits the theme perfectly. If you want to avert the end of the world, sacrifices will have to be made.

 

[thealien_83]

Earth goblins, cave trolls, Uruk-hai industrially created from earth.

Different mythos.

 

[thealien_83]

You guys are right, Corlindale's ability was broken. He isn't sacrificing himself or halving the armageddon counter. It will be fixed in the next version.

On that note, is he supposed to end all wars, or just ones the Elohim are involved in? Because he seems to be doing only the latter in my current game. My friend, playing the Mercurians, is trying to stop the (AI) Elohim from achieving an Altar victory, but Corlindale keeps nulling all declarations of war and keeping him from doing it. Meanwhile my Amurites are involved in a war with the (AI) Malakim, but our squabble isn't being affected by Cordlindale's hippie magic.

Also, dare I ask if there's any idea yet when that version will be out? That bug is terribly obnoxious, but I prefer to keep all civ's on random rather than manually making sure the Elohim won't be in the game just to avoid it.

 

[Thimblyjoe]

Cordlindale's hippie magic.

that's hilarious.
(I summon the Great Hippy in the Sky to aid me in my time of need)

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[Rotting]

It's funny, everyone's whining about the druids, but I never even realized they had that effect. I always went the hard way by using high priests upgraded from priests of leaves. Short of that I used an archmage. In other words, there's more then one way to skin a cat... not that I'm into that kind of thing. Frankly, I think it's good they did that, I always thought that a demonic or vampiric druid was a bit out of place. If it makes the game more difficult, then it's just that much more challenge. In short, good work to Kael and the gang, keep it up.

Does that mean, you can upgrade your terrain with Archmages (not only Spring like but really) making Ice to Grassland?

If so, I will play Sheaim in my next game again and be a bad, VERY bad guy! Err... do they gat Archmages!?

 

[MisterBenn]

I'm new to the mod but not to Civ 4 - I have to say I am hooked on this mod! A superb job has been done in applying the fantasy / rpg themes over the structure of Civ 4, and the more I play the more like it! It's really good work!

With the obligatory praise out of the way, I have some thoughts regarding the armegeddon counter. Has anyone considered shifting the relations of neutral races away from the evil and towards the good races progressively as the major AC thresholds are passed? It seems to me that the neutral races are unlikely to be very happy if the progression of evil races leads to a blight coming over the land, or the pouring of demons into the world. And since from what I've read here the counter has a general tendency to rise over time, the gentle encouragement of the goods and neutrals to pact together and isolate the major threats in the realm is reasonable behaviour and I believe is a good counterbalancing factor versus the fact that the evil races get all the best toys!

Just an idea. Keep up the good work!

 

[Ankhman]

I am not sure where to ask this question but will do so here. I play the Khazad quite often. One of their starting mana's is Nature but I am unable to get my druids to learn Vitalize. Is this intended or is there some building or technology I need before it is triggered. It doesn't make sense to me. Perhaps its a bug.

 

[grumpylad]

I am not sure where to ask this question but will do so here. I play the Khazad quite often. One of their starting mana's is Nature but I am unable to get my druids to learn Vitalize. Is this intended or is there some building or technology I need before it is triggered. It doesn't make sense to me. Perhaps its a bug.

I'm pretty sure that the Khazad are limited to the level of their spellcasters. I thought it applied to druids as well as mages, also they start with Earth rather than Nature which I think is a requirement for vitalise

 

[Ankhman]

i stand corrected; I had thought all along that the Khazad started with Nature and it's Earth instead.

 

[CoheeLunden]

Is it intentional that typhoid mary no longer has the hero promotion?