[MOD] Fall from Heaven

[kevjm]

Did you see the werewolf suggestion?

 

[Kael]

Did you see the werewolf suggestion?

Werewolves as animals? Yeap, I like it! Im thinking about slipping it into 1.0. Its gonna require a pretty hefty change to promotions (currently animals cant gain promotions).

Hmpf, looking through the code, its possible but Id have to change a lot. Basically anything that keys off of an animal will have to have an exception written for werewolves. Possible, but I don't tihnk I will do it in 1.0. I'll make a note about it for phase 2.

 

[Chip56]

Are you talking about the cost of the Saboteur unit, or the cost to steal plans or demolish production?

of demolish production, steal plans and destroy improvements

 

[kevjm]

Thanks for replying!

 

[Kael]

of demolish production, steal plans and destroy improvements

Yeap, I could reduce them, but they seem pretty reasonable. 90 gold to ruin production seems about right.

 

[loki1232]

Werewolves as animals? Yeap, I like it! Im thinking about slipping it into 1.0. Its gonna require a pretty hefty change to promotions (currently animals cant gain promotions).

Hmpf, looking through the code, its possible but Id have to change a lot. Basically anything that keys off of an animal will have to have an exception written for werewolves. Possible, but I don't tihnk I will do it in 1.0. I'll make a note about it for phase 2.

I like it as well. Did You catch my werewolf slaying promotion idea?

 

[kevjm]

Werewolves as animals? Yeap, I like it! Im thinking about slipping it into 1.0. Its gonna require a pretty hefty change to promotions (currently animals cant gain promotions).

Hmpf, looking through the code, its possible but Id have to change a lot. Basically anything that keys off of an animal will have to have an exception written for werewolves. Possible, but I don't tihnk I will do it in 1.0. I'll make a note about it for phase 2.

Perhaps just give them very limited promotions? A few combat promotions? They'd probably upgrade before they use up all the combat promotions, right?

 

[Chip56]

IMO 200gold to destroy a mine or farm is too much
and the price to ruin destruction is in most cases higher than 90gold.
Tested it:
comp builds apprentince:
after 1 round: 28/60prod-> 106Gold
after 2rounds: 54/60prod-> 158Gold
I will look how much it costs to ruin wonder& building prod
Posting results later.
And what to you think about making sab a non combat unit?

 

[Kael]

Perhaps just give them very limited promotions? A few combat promotions? They'd probably upgrade before they use up all the combat promotions, right?

Yeah, building a promotion set wouldnt be to bad. But the werewolves would be capturable with animal handling and that kind of stuff. It could all be done (and I think its worth doing) but probably not for 1.0.

 

[Chip56]

Ok the price for ruining productons is:
Buildings& units:
50+ 2x Hammers already produced
Chances for mission 8-58 +1 per remaining round of prod
Wonders:
50+4x Hammers already produced
Chances for mission 6-56 +1 per remaining round of prod

 

[Chip56]

Maybe you could decrease the price to something like 25+2 for b&u
and 25+3 for wonders?
The price of destroying farms, etc should be decreased to maybe 50 IMO.
Well told you my opinion, what you do with these numbers is up to you

 

[Kael]

IMO 200gold to destroy a mine or farm is too much
and the price to ruin destruction is in most cases higher than 90gold.
Tested it:
comp builds apprentince:
after 1 round: 28/60prod-> 106Gold
after 2rounds: 54/60prod-> 158Gold
I will look how much it costs to ruin wonder& building prod
Posting results later.
And what to you think about making sab a non combat unit?

I like haveing the sab a combat unit, hes an upgrade from the assassin, and in some cases could have earned a lot of promotions by the time it becomes a sab. I would hate to ruin that by upgrading into a 0 strength unit.

I just ran a test on the sabotage ability. Your right, it doesn't make much sense. I may just remove the ability or halve the cost. Let me look into it.

 

[Kael]

Maybe you could decrease the price to something like 25+2 for b&u
and 25+3 for wonders?
The price of destroying farms, etc should be decreased to maybe 50 IMO.
Well told you my opinion, what you do with these numbers is up to you

K, I added the following:

*41. Saboteur Sabotage ability reduced from a base 200 to 50 cost.
*42. Saboteur Steal Plans cost reduced from 100 to 25.
*43. Saboteur Destory cost reduced from 50 to 25.

Ill playtest and try it out.

 

[Chip56]

I like haveing the sab a combat unit, hes an upgrade from the assassin, and in some cases could have earned a lot of promotions by the time it becomes a sab. I would hate to ruin that by upgrading into a 0 strength unit.

Thats right but there is no way you can ruin the production or steal plans of a nation your at war with (where it would make most sense)
So maybe sab should not be considered a upgrade of assasin but stand alone unit?

 

[Lightzy]

k well, what IS the point of armaggeddon spells that most likely hurt you more than they hurt any of the other civs (this is assuming that if you got to the point where you're the first to cast armaggedon spells, you're pretty much winning, and you just need a tool to let you do it faster)

 

[Kael]

k well, what IS the point of armaggeddon spells that most likely hurt you more than they hurt any of the other civs (this is assuming that if you got to the point where you're the first to cast armaggedon spells, you're pretty much winning, and you just need a tool to let you do it faster)

Blowing stuff up is fun?

Honestly I want there to be conditions where they are useful. There is for the Wrath, Mithril golem, Meshabber, Gate to the Abyss, Bane Divine, Blood of the Phoenix and Glory Everlasting.

But Blight and Apocalypse don't currently have much of a game advantage. I am hoping that in phase 2 these will make sense in some situations. I want to do it without making the effects uneven (I dont want to exclude the builder from the effect).

My plans are that certain civs would enjoy the effects. For example, civs that sacrifice their population would be less effected by a blight than the countries that build large populations (and have to feed them).

And I would like to make Apocalypse only effect living units, so countries that have large golem or demonic armies would be well served by a well times apocalypse.

So I agree with you, and right now Apocalypse and Blight don't have much "game effect" except the throw things into chaos when the AI drops one (which honestly is reason enough for me to have them). I hope toi improve it in phase 2.

 

[Maarak]

This may have been mentioned before, but will there be a FfH specific map designed for this mod? I can only imagine that Kael must have mapped out the campaign setting extensivly if he used it for a multiyear D&D game. I for one would like to play on a map similiar to the one used there.

 

[Kael]

This may have been mentioned before, but will there be a FfH specific map designed for this mod? I can only imagine that Kael must have mapped out the campaign setting extensivly if he used it for a multiyear D&D game. I for one would like to play on a map similiar to the one used there.

I hadn't even really thought about that. I guess one could be made. Im a big fan of random maps. I am planning to make some scenerios that will have static maps, but they probably won't be the "world" maps like your talking about.

Maybe after 1.0 ships someone will go and make a world map scenerio for us all to play.

 

[loki1232]

I hadn't even really thought about that. I guess one could be made. Im a big fan of random maps. I am planning to make some scenerios that will have static maps, but they probably won't be the "world" maps like your talking about.

Maybe after 1.0 ships someone will go and make a world map scenerio for us all to play.

I would love to play such a world map, especially if it started with some Cities and techs. ie: classical era.

Course, I would like to play a static scenario map even more.

 

[Jono]

I hadn't even really thought about that. I guess one could be made. Im a big fan of random maps. I am planning to make some scenerios that will have static maps, but they probably won't be the "world" maps like your talking about.

Maybe after 1.0 ships someone will go and make a world map scenerio for us all to play.

How about way into the future after all of the armaggedon spells, islands and sea... #3000!!