[MOD] Fall from Heaven

[Kael]

It looks like we are going to bust 300,000 views today. I wonder if this thread will go over 300 pages before or after the FfH2 beta is released?

 

[Youri Andropov]

Hi Kael !

Your mod is really great =)

I've a problem with version 100f. It seems that this version crashes (C++ runtime error) when loading a multiplayer saved game in Direct IP mode. Could you investigate ? When loading with a previous version, it seems to work.
Thanks a lot.

 

[Drogear]

Speaking of FfH2 beta? when is it due, and is it an open beta?

 

[Chalid]

Significant SDK changes are being rolled in, and we are prepping the Mod for the May 19th "beta" release.

Read the 7th post of this thread for detailed information.

 

[Kael]

Hi Kael !

Your mod is really great =)

I've a problem with version 100f. It seems that this version crashes (C++ runtime error) when loading a multiplayer saved game in Direct IP mode. Could you investigate ? When loading with a previous version, it seems to work.
Thanks a lot.

Glad you are enjoying it, it was a team effort.

As for the crashes I dont have multiple computers to test that. Does anyone else play multiplayer direct ip games? If so are you having this issue?

 

[upthorn]

Kael:

While simply removing all the sound files might make things buggy, it should work to just replace all the sound files with 1kb quiet versions. That shouldn't be a lot of work either.

I think that's an awesome idea and it made me wonder is that really possible. I switch the music off most of the times and would gladly drop it for easier access to FFH.

I haven't seen this replied to, and it is a very good idea, so I'm quoting it to make sure it didn't get missed.
I've got a cable internet connection, so it's not a problem for me, but I know it would really help people out if you made "empty" versions of all your sound files and distributed the mod that way, too.

It's also really easy to do.

 

[Kael]

I haven't seen this replied to, and it is a very good idea, so I'm quoting it to make sure it didn't get missed.
I've got a cable internet connection, so it's not a problem for me, but I know it would really help people out if you made "empty" versions of all your sound files and distributed the mod that way, too.

It's also really easy to do.

I agree that its a good idea. It was responded to here: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4018462&postcount=5565

 

[kendric]

I've not had crashes doing direct Ip with 1.0f

 

[Youri Andropov]

I tried with another computer and the same saved game, I had the same crash; note that only the joining computer crashes, not the host. I'll try with version 100e.
[EDIT] The same saved game works fine with version 100e.

 

[Kael]

I tried with another computer and the same saved game, I had the same crash; note that only the joining computer crashes, not the host. I'll try with version 100e.
[EDIT] The same saved game works fine with version 100e.

Cool, glad to hear it worked out.

 

[naf4ever]

I pointed out some problems but Gyahaar fixed em and now the saveconvert utility program seems to work good with the latest savegame files from FfH.

 

[Chammadai]

I've been wondering about the game and came up with few things...

1) Have you thought about cheap early demon/familiar units for the Veil who would be invisible to most units and could explore enemy territory? They'd be very useful to spy on opponents in the mid game but later on would be useless since it would easy for mages to detect them - and they'd have no real fighting power so they'd be an easy kill.

2) Would it be possible to make certain specialists stronger for specializing civs? So, for example, a civ which concentrates on religion has it's priest produce more gold while the one with many artisans has more productive engineers? That would make the civs even more specialized.

3) How about you needed different resources to summon/create a really powerful creatures? And when it would come to scenarios it would be very hard to acquire all of them without lots of trading and/or conquest. Imagine a Runes followers requiring Pearls (among other things) for a powerful structure but since they probably wouldn't be Seafaring they'd have to trade...

That's it for now.
Cheers

 

[Kael]

I've been wondering about the game and came up with few things...

1) Have you thought about cheap early demon/familiar units for the Veil who would be invisible to most units and could explore enemy territory? They'd be very useful to spy on opponents in the mid game but later on would be useless since it would easy for mages to detect them - and they'd have no real fighting power so they'd be an easy kill.

The veil is a midgame religion (unless its rushed), so by the time you got access to the units they wouldnt do you much good.

2) Would it be possible to make certain specialists stronger for specializing civs? So, for example, a civ which concentrates on religion has it's priest produce more gold while the one with many artisans has more productive engineers? That would make the civs even more specialized.

Yes, in general though I leave this to the player to effect through civic choices and wonders. That way the player decides to build a military/religion/magic based version of his civ instead of being pushed into one because its better for that particular purpose. It is hard to differentiate objects without limiting options (at some level granting an abiliy to one is denying it to the others) but we try not to force particular styles of play or builds. The game ends up playing you instead of the other way around.

3) How about you needed different resources to summon/create a really powerful creatures? And when it would come to scenarios it would be very hard to acquire all of them without lots of trading and/or conquest. Imagine a Runes followers requiring Pearls (among other things) for a powerful structure but since they probably wouldn't be Seafaring they'd have to trade...

That's it for now.
Cheers

Yeap, we are talking about requireing multiple mana different or the multiples of the same type to create certain units.

 

[PriestOfDiscord]

Looking through all the previews I've missed while I've been away and I'm drooling. Once again, the ideas floating around here are simply fantastic. I love being given the huge amount of viable choices in this mod and hope to see more added in. I just have a few questions/ideas of my own.

Not specifically because we havent designed it yet, thats the focus of "Fire". The short of it is that we want Armageddon to be a much more active part of the game. Some civs want to cause it, some want to prevent it. The counter will increase when certain action are performed and decrease with others. Think of it like global warming except somewhat easier to influence and the level of the counter detemines what can and cant be done. Some buildings, units, spells, wonders, etc will only be available if the required counter level is reached. If the counter is high expect the game to be nastier and more destructive, if it is low things like the apocalypse spell wont be able to be used.

This is awesome, and really gives the impression that in the late game the situation -quite literally- is going to hell if the sinister civs are having their way. My hope here is that the further along the path of Armageddon you are the more blighted and hellish the landscape becomes, as if all the bad magic is sucking the life out of everything.

Yeap, we are talking about requireing multiple mana different or the multiples of the same type to create certain units.

Speaking of mana nodes, will certain spells require you to know multiple schools of magic?

Also I had an idea to even further differentiate between each civ within the game: Religious sects. What I mean by that is that while all nations following the same religion will share the same general values, there would be small differences in how a certain nation would worship the same god that another nation worships. The Calabim and (can't think of the name for the pirate faction offhand) might both be OO in a game, for instance, but the Calabim would get a small boost to the mind control aspects given by their gods when comapred to the Pirates who would get Drown Swashbucklers, a boosted Drown. So there would still be the same 5 religions, just that every nation would get a different small extra boost (called the national religious sect or whatever) per religion depending on their nations values and how they interact with their chosen state religion. Hopefully this long, rambling paragraph made sense to someone.

Well thats all I have for now. I can't wait for the Phase 2 beta!

 

[Zherak_Khan]

Okay, I was toying around with a Parthenon/Great Library with Marble -> Ashen Veil strategy at Emperor, which actually works as long as you don't get attacked too early by Orthus/Agressive AI with Bronze. Good fun.

Now, one thing which has always annoyed me endlessly, and which is a part of the original Civ4, is that Great People settled in a city (not fortified, but settled, to give for instance 3Gold 12Culture) instantly vanish if the city is captured. Even if liberated the very next turn, while still in riot, you lose your Great People. Needless to say, I lost my all-essential Bard which was holding off Ehlenna's mad culture, and was furious. My other city was producing Prophets to maintain cultural control of a Gem Mine which was keeping my tiny empire happy. It was surprisingly efficient.

Consider this a petition to add the possibility of liberating Great People.

Another thing I have noticed - there seems to be a bug relating to the new resources. It seems to me that Reagents is "abundant" on both Pangea and Continents, and Fantasy Realm for that matter. (I love Oasis-Plains-Hills-River). However, I have never seen even a single Reagent playing my favourite map, Great Plains. If they even exist (they should, seeing as I got Conjurer-massed by Ehlenna once), they are extremely rare.


Short version:
- Liberating great people would be great.
- Resources, particularly Reagents on Great Plains, seem bugged.
- New map types, for example Fantasy-Realms-ish wrapping both horizontally and vertically would be interesting.
- I am still running 1.00b.

Edit: By the way, I was thinking of composing an original, instrumental theme for FfH. If it interests you, feel free to suggest atmosphere and instruments, maybe length for that matter.

 

[Kael]

Looking through all the previews I've missed while I've been away and I'm drooling. Once again, the ideas floating around here are simply fantastic. I love being given the huge amount of viable choices in this mod and hope to see more added in. I just have a few questions/ideas of my own.

This is awesome, and really gives the impression that in the late game the situation -quite literally- is going to hell if the sinister civs are having their way. My hope here is that the further along the path of Armageddon you are the more blighted and hellish the landscape becomes, as if all the bad magic is sucking the life out of everything.

Speaking of mana nodes, will certain spells require you to know multiple schools of magic?

None in the design yet as we are still working on filling the base sphere spell slots (we have 3 openings left). But more than half of the spells in the origional material required more than one spell sphere.

I dont know if we will ever implement that in the mod though, it could get confusing for casual players trying to get a spell and having to learn multiple spheres to do it.

Also I had an idea to even further differentiate between each civ within the game: Religious sects. What I mean by that is that while all nations following the same religion will share the same general values, there would be small differences in how a certain nation would worship the same god that another nation worships. The Calabim and (can't think of the name for the pirate faction offhand) might both be OO in a game, for instance, but the Calabim would get a small boost to the mind control aspects given by their gods when comapred to the Pirates who would get Drown Swashbucklers, a boosted Drown. So there would still be the same 5 religions, just that every nation would get a different small extra boost (called the national religious sect or whatever) per religion depending on their nations values and how they interact with their chosen state religion. Hopefully this long, rambling paragraph made sense to someone.

That is kinda what we are hoping to accomplish with the advanced temples, to allow the religion to take different styles in different civs. I considered allowing certain civs only access to one advanced temple (so the Khazad may get the Halls of Granite while the Luchuirp can only pick the Runevault). But in the end I thought its better to allow the players as many options as possible.

 

[Kael]

Okay, I was toying around with a Parthenon/Great Library with Marble -> Ashen Veil strategy at Emperor, which actually works as long as you don't get attacked too early by Orthus/Agressive AI with Bronze. Good fun.

Now, one thing which has always annoyed me endlessly, and which is a part of the original Civ4, is that Great People settled in a city (not fortified, but settled, to give for instance 3Gold 12Culture) instantly vanish if the city is captured. Even if liberated the very next turn, while still in riot, you lose your Great People. Needless to say, I lost my all-essential Bard which was holding off Ehlenna's mad culture, and was furious. My other city was producing Prophets to maintain cultural control of a Gem Mine which was keeping my tiny empire happy. It was surprisingly efficient.

Consider this a petition to add the possibility of liberating Great People.

Let me think about it (and other team members that see this post feel free to throw your thoughts in). We may be able to jail them and give them back is resuced in x amount of turns. Hmm... we wouldnt want to pass great people to the conquering civ, that would be to effective for warmongers.

Another thing I have noticed - there seems to be a bug relating to the new resources. It seems to me that Reagents is "abundant" on both Pangea and Continents, and Fantasy Realm for that matter. (I love Oasis-Plains-Hills-River). However, I have never seen even a single Reagent playing my favourite map, Great Plains. If they even exist (they should, seeing as I got Conjurer-massed by Ehlenna once), they are extremely rare.

Version 100f includes a new function which makes sure (if its not broke) that there are at least 3 reagents on every map. I would be interested to see if you can gen a random map of any type that doesnt have 3 reagents on it with this version.

Short version:
- Liberating great people would be great.
- Resources, particularly Reagents on Great Plains, seem bugged.
- New map types, for example Fantasy-Realms-ish wrapping both horizontally and vertically would be interesting.
- I am still running 1.00b.

Edit: By the way, I was thinking of composing an original, instrumental theme for FfH. If it interests you, feel free to suggest atmosphere and instruments, maybe length for that matter.

I would love to hear anything you come up with, shoot me a pm if you have a sample or two and ill give feedback. As for atmosphere, I prefer more eerie or celtic music. Of course we wouldnt want anything to modern.

 

[Chalid]

Let me think about it (and other team members that see this post feel free to throw your thoughts in). We may be able to jail them and give them back is resuced in x amount of turns. Hmm... we wouldnt want to pass great people to the conquering civ, that would be to effective for warmongers.

Maybe we give each settlet great Guy a 60% chance to survive an attack. if he survives he flees the city (is set to the neighboring field of the city that is either occupied by his allies or lies in the direction of the next town.) This will give the Conqueror the chance to kill of the GP and the Looser to rescue him.

 

[Oran-ge]

Hey, are you guys planning to add any other sdk mod components, like the great person per city thresholds?

 

[Kael]

Hey, are you guys planning to add any other sdk mod components, like the great person per city thresholds?

If you are talking about FfH1, then no. There won't be aby new components added.

If you are talking about FfH2 then we are hoping to incorporate the next version of TheLopez's mercenary mod. I am also considering some interface improvement like the Exotic Foreign advisor and the Special Domestic advisor.

In general for each person that loves a component there is someone else who hates it and FfH is so far off the normal codebase that it often takes quite a bit of work to get modpacks to work (even if they slip nicely into other mods). So we tend to avoid modpacks unless there is a huge advantage to including them.