Modmods Requests Thread

[Hydromancerx]

Yes, I can calculate in city population, the game does keep track of it.

What about the building cost? Could such a thing be calculated? That way we would not have to arbitrarily make up how many megawatts a building creates.

So like population # + each buildings production cost = total city megawats

Don't forget the "Three Gorges Dam". I usually have that and hydro plants in cities will that cause problems? I have the hydro plants so that the "unclean" power plants get off the build list.

Well for that and the Fussion Reactor i was thinking that it coud give a huge ammount of megawats to each city. As well as providing "power".

Note it would be 2 fold.

1. Power is either provided or not just like the game is now.

2. Power used is based upon the population and buildings in a city. Not having enough megawatts that the city consumes would create unhappiness.

 

[Afforess]

What about the building cost? Could such a thing be calculated? That way we would not have to arbitrarily make up how many megawatts a building creates.

So like population # + each buildings production cost = total city megawats

Yes, production cost could be factored in too.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Yes, production cost could be factored in too.

The only problem I see is that production coast changes depending upon the speed. Which would mean that the power plants output would need to be adjusted to the speed as well.

And the other question is how much should the existing power plants produce? Based on real life or what?

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

I think we need an obsolete tech tag for those units which have limited era usage like those in WarriorsOfGod and for those units which have limited numbers but upgrade like the Trade Caravan.

BTW WarriorsOfGod is working fine but I wont be releasing it until after Afforess' 1.5 because it currently uses Python Call backs which slow the game down.

 

[Hydromancerx]

So I was going over the Megawatts from the Sim City games and this is what I came up with ...

Green = Sim City 4
Blue = Sim City 4 Mod
Red = Sim City 2000

Biofuel Power Plant = ?

Biomass Power Plant = ?

Coal Plant = 6,000 mWh/Month

Fusion Power = 75,000 mWh/Month

Geothermal Power Plant = ?

High-Tech Coal = 12,000 mWh/Month

Hydroelectric Dam = 5,0000 mWh/Month

Hydrogen Power Plant = 50,000 mWh/Month

Microwave Power Plant (Space-Based Solar Power) = 48,000 mWh/Month

Natural Gas = 3,0000 mWh/Month

Nuclear Plant = 16,0000 mWh/Month

Oil Plant = 7,0000 mWh/Month

Shale Power Plant = ?

Solar Mirror Array = 5,000 mWh/Month

Solar Cell Power Plant = 500 mWh/Month

Solar Updraft Tower = ?

The Three Gorges Dam = ?

Tidal Turbine = 500 mWh/Month

Waste to Energy Power Plant = 5,000 mWh/Month

Wave Power Plant = 100 mWh/Month

Wind Turbine = 200 mWh/Month

As you can see some don't sound right. Also I can't seem to find what the real numbers are on wikipedia.

 

[zappara]

Yes. I would have to add some new functions, but I can do that. It would be more interesting to add a MW consumed and MW produced though.

Now that would be really something useful... though it would require to overhaul all power plant buildings and buildings that work with power.

Example:
City 1 (size 20)
------
Coal Plant = +500MW
Population = -200MW (10MW / 1 pop)

City 2 (size 30)
------------
Nuclear Plant = +1000MW
Population = -300MW

unused power
--------------
1000MW

City 2 builds
Supercollider = -500MW (just example number)

=> unused power 500MW

If civ doesn't have sufficient power output to keep all buildings "active" the population would get unhappy.

Now if there was also duplicates of all commerce modifiers that would work with power... The problem with electricity in civ modding is that there really aren't that many modifiers that can use power as requirement.

Perhaps electricity output could be a new yield value like gold/science/culture/espionage? As if you sell power to other civs you'd need to be able to adjust the sum just like gold per turn.

Another thought about new yields - at early RoM development phase I was hoping there was following yield types besides gold/science/culture/espionage:
Health
Electricity
Religion (like in Colonization, with this religion and culture would be different things)
Stability/Administration (actually revolution index is the same thing in current RoM, for example courthouse would increase your empire's stability)
... plus some others that I can't remember now

 

[Afforess]

Now that would be really something useful... though it would require to overhaul all power plant buildings and buildings that work with power.

Example:
City 1 (size 20)
------
Coal Plant = +500MW
Population = -200MW (10MW / 1 pop)

City 2 (size 30)
------------
Nuclear Plant = +1000MW
Population = -300MW

unused power
--------------
1000MW

City 2 builds
Supercollider = -500MW (just example number)

=> unused power 500MW

If civ doesn't have sufficient power output to keep all buildings "active" the population would get unhappy.

Now if there was also duplicates of all commerce modifiers that would work with power... The problem with electricity in civ modding is that there really aren't that many modifiers that can use power as requirement.

Perhaps electricity output could be a new yield value like gold/science/culture/espionage? As if you sell power to other civs you'd need to be able to adjust the sum just like gold per turn.

Hmm. I know it's possible to add new yields, but it would be quite a task. One of the other stumbling blocks we had with this mod is when to make your citizens demand electricity. In the real world, there was no "flip of the switch" where people just demanded electricity. It spread slowly, over time, until it all the big cities had it. There was some legislation to make power companies power rural areas too, I believe... I haven't the slightest clue how to simulate that.

Stability/Administration (actually revolution index is the same thing in current RoM, for example courthouse would increase your empire's stability)

Dom Pedro added a RevolutionIndex modifier for buildings. It would be fairly trivial to "use" it.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Hmm. I know it's possible to add new yields, but it would be quite a task. One of the other stumbling blocks we had with this mod is when to make your citizens demand electricity. In the real world, there was no "flip of the switch" where people just demanded electricity. It spread slowly, over time, until it all the big cities had it. There was some legislation to make power companies power rural areas too, I believe... I haven't the slightest clue how to simulate that.

I know I know! I have been thinking this over since the old "We don't have the POWER captain!" thread. And what you do is base it on technology. For instance ...

Electricity = +2% Electricity Use
Refrigeration = +2% Electricity Use
Telegraph = +2% Electricity Use
Refining = +2% Electricity Use
Radio = +2% Electricity Use
Civil Engineering = +2% Electricity Use
Combustion = +2% Electricity Use
Industrialism = +2% Electricity Use
Plastics = +2% Electricity Use
Fission = +2% Electricity Use
Mass Transit = +2% Electricity Use
Electronics = +2% Electricity Use
Manufacturing = +2% Electricity Use
Computers = +2% Electricity Use
Mass Media = +2% Electricity Use
Semiconductors = +2% Electricity Use
Nuclear Power = +2% Electricity Use
Superconductors = +2% Electricity Use
Microprocessor = +2% Electricity Use
Robotics = +2% Electricity Use
Computer Networks = +2% Electricity Use
Globalization = +2% Electricity Use
Fiber Optics = +2% Electricity Use
3D Modeling = = +2% Electricity Use
Communications Networks = +2% Electricity Use ------------- 50%
Magnetic Levitation = +2% Electricity Use
Virtual Reality = +2% Electricity Use
Fuel Cells = +2% Electricity Use
Wearable Electronics = +2% Electricity Use
Cognitive Robotics = +2% Electricity Use
Knowledge Management = +2% Electricity Use
Rapid Prototyping = +2% Electricity Use
Biofuels = +2% Electricity Use
Automated Traffic = +2% Electricity Use
Controlled Plasma = +2% Electricity Use
Fusion = +2% Electricity Use
Skyroads = +2% Electricity Use
Advanced Computers = +2% Electricity Use
Wireless Electricity = +2% Electricity Use
Quantum Computing = +2% Electricity Use
Plastic Electronics = +2% Electricity Use
Personal Robotics = +2% Electricity Use
Nanoelectronics = +2% Electricity Use -82
Megastructure Engineering = +2% Electricity Use
Shielding = +2% Electricity Use
Mind Uploading = +2% Electricity Use
Advanced Shielding = +2% Electricity Use
Terra Computer = +2% Electricity Use
Teleportation = +2% Electricity Use
Sentient Earth = +2% Electricity Use ------------- 100%

As you can see gradually over time as they discover diffrent technologies then the % of electricity used goes up by 2%. Until by the end of the game you are 100% usage. Thus a level 10 city in the modern era will require significantly less power than a level 10 city in the trans-human era.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Ok i think i figured out how electricity can work. I know this is going to be shocking but the power plants will not be producing electricity. However a new building "Power Lines" will. As we have it now the power plants produce a little lightning bolt that says if the city has power or not. The "power lines" will now do this. Once they are built then all other power plants can be built. Basiclly its a prerequisite building.

Now you are saying "Well that just gives away free power. Why should I buy a power plant?" Well sure its marking the city with power but the city will not be happy unless their megawatt usage is satisfied.

Rather than each power plant only powering one city each power plant would add to the nations "total power". Which would mean you could make a nuclear power plant in one city and have it power other cities in your nation. Note that only cities with "power lines" built in them will gain access to the nations "total power".

And if we use my idea above about gradually gaining electricity then it should not be too much of a shock. For instance lets say you have 5 cities. Which together add up to say 1000 MW for the national consumption of power. But in one of those cities you have a coal power plant which produces 500 MW to the national power grid. Normally this would mean you are consuming more power than you are producing. However your techs are only up to say 25% usage then that would only be 250 MW consumed rather than 1000 MW. And thus less than the 500 MW produced. Thus giving you half the power not even used.

 

[Supercheese]

Ok i think i figured out how electricity can work. I know this is going to be shocking but the power plants will not be producing electricity. However a new building "Power Lines" will. As we have it now the power plants produce a little lightning bolt that says if the city has power or not. The "power lines" will now do this. Once they are built then all other power plants can be built. Basiclly its a prerequisite building.
Now you are saying "Well that just gives away free power. Why should I buy a power plant?" Well sure its marking the city with power but the city will not be happy unless their megawatt usage is satisfied.
Rather than each power plant only powering one city each power plant would add to the nations "total power". Which would mean you could make a nuclear power plant in one city and have it power other cities in your nation. Note that only cities with "power lines" built in them will gain access to the nations "total power".
And if we use my idea above about gradually gaining electricity then it should not be too much of a shock. For instance lets say you have 5 cities. Which together add up to say 1000 MW for the national consumption of power. But in one of those cities you have a coal power plant which produces 500 MW to the national power grid. Normally this would mean you are consuming more power than you are producing. However your techs are only up to say 25% usage then that would only be 250 MW consumed rather than 1000 MW. And thus less than the 500 MW produced. Thus giving you half the power not even used.

That actually sounds like a rather good idea. However, this only deals with the distribution & generation side of things. For specific consumption, if you have a shortage of power supply (the demand coming coming from both buildings and population), how is it determined which buildings are deprived of power? Do the citizens suffer, but manufacturing continues? Or are factories shut down in favor of private homes still receiving power?
I suppose a new in-game menu/popup could deal with this...

 

[Afforess]

I know I know! I have been thinking this over since the old "We don't have the POWER captain!" thread. And what you do is base it on technology. For instance ...

Electricity = +2% Electricity Use
Refrigeration = +2% Electricity Use
Telegraph = +2% Electricity Use
Refining = +2% Electricity Use
Radio = +2% Electricity Use
Civil Engineering = +2% Electricity Use
Combustion = +2% Electricity Use
Industrialism = +2% Electricity Use
Plastics = +2% Electricity Use
Fission = +2% Electricity Use
Mass Transit = +2% Electricity Use
Electronics = +2% Electricity Use
Manufacturing = +2% Electricity Use
Computers = +2% Electricity Use
Mass Media = +2% Electricity Use
Semiconductors = +2% Electricity Use
Nuclear Power = +2% Electricity Use
Superconductors = +2% Electricity Use
Microprocessor = +2% Electricity Use
Robotics = +2% Electricity Use
Computer Networks = +2% Electricity Use
Globalization = +2% Electricity Use
Fiber Optics = +2% Electricity Use
3D Modeling = = +2% Electricity Use
Communications Networks = +2% Electricity Use ------------- 50%
Magnetic Levitation = +2% Electricity Use
Virtual Reality = +2% Electricity Use
Fuel Cells = +2% Electricity Use
Wearable Electronics = +2% Electricity Use
Cognitive Robotics = +2% Electricity Use
Knowledge Management = +2% Electricity Use
Rapid Prototyping = +2% Electricity Use
Biofuels = +2% Electricity Use
Automated Traffic = +2% Electricity Use
Controlled Plasma = +2% Electricity Use
Fusion = +2% Electricity Use
Skyroads = +2% Electricity Use
Advanced Computers = +2% Electricity Use
Wireless Electricity = +2% Electricity Use
Quantum Computing = +2% Electricity Use
Plastic Electronics = +2% Electricity Use
Personal Robotics = +2% Electricity Use
Nanoelectronics = +2% Electricity Use -82
Megastructure Engineering = +2% Electricity Use
Shielding = +2% Electricity Use
Mind Uploading = +2% Electricity Use
Advanced Shielding = +2% Electricity Use
Terra Computer = +2% Electricity Use
Teleportation = +2% Electricity Use
Sentient Earth = +2% Electricity Use ------------- 100%

As you can see gradually over time as they discover diffrent technologies then the % of electricity used goes up by 2%. Until by the end of the game you are 100% usage. Thus a level 10 city in the modern era will require significantly less power than a level 10 city in the trans-human era.

Ok i think i figured out how electricity can work. I know this is going to be shocking but the power plants will not be producing electricity. However a new building "Power Lines" will. As we have it now the power plants produce a little lightning bolt that says if the city has power or not. The "power lines" will now do this. Once they are built then all other power plants can be built. Basiclly its a prerequisite building.

Now you are saying "Well that just gives away free power. Why should I buy a power plant?" Well sure its marking the city with power but the city will not be happy unless their megawatt usage is satisfied.

Rather than each power plant only powering one city each power plant would add to the nations "total power". Which would mean you could make a nuclear power plant in one city and have it power other cities in your nation. Note that only cities with "power lines" built in them will gain access to the nations "total power".

And if we use my idea above about gradually gaining electricity then it should not be too much of a shock. For instance lets say you have 5 cities. Which together add up to say 1000 MW for the national consumption of power. But in one of those cities you have a coal power plant which produces 500 MW to the national power grid. Normally this would mean you are consuming more power than you are producing. However your techs are only up to say 25% usage then that would only be 250 MW consumed rather than 1000 MW. And thus less than the 500 MW produced. Thus giving you half the power not even used.

That actually sounds like a rather good idea. However, this only deals with the distribution & generation side of things. For specific consumption, if you have a shortage of power supply (the demand coming coming from both buildings and population), how is it determined which buildings are deprived of power? Do the citizens suffer, but manufacturing continues? Or are factories shut down in favor of private homes still receiving power?
I suppose a new in-game menu/popup could deal with this...

I'd support this. But I doubt I could make the new screen/interface. Someone else would have to.

 

[Hydromancerx]

That actually sounds like a rather good idea. However, this only deals with the distribution & generation side of things. For specific consumption, if you have a shortage of power supply (the demand coming coming from both buildings and population), how is it determined which buildings are deprived of power? Do the citizens suffer, but manufacturing continues? Or are factories shut down in favor of private homes still receiving power?
I suppose a new in-game menu/popup could deal with this...

Well at the moment it would just be unhappiness. I would assume the less power you had compared to how much you consumed would determine how unhappy they would get.

As for individually deprived buildings. Well that seems like it would be very difficult if not impossible to simulate.

 

[Afforess]

Well at the moment it would just be unhappiness. I would assume the less power you had compared to how much you consumed would determine how unhappy they would get.

And unhealthiness. Lots more unhealthiness too.

 

[Hydromancerx]

I'd support this. But I doubt I could make the new screen/interface. Someone else would have to.

Could what I suggested be done without a new screen?

 

[Afforess]

Could what I suggested be done without a new screen?

Yes, if you mean that cities don't differentiate between buildings/citizens that lose power.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Yes, if you mean that cities don't differentiate between buildings/citizens that lose power.

Yeah. Basiclly my idea is ...

Power Lines
Provide Power Connections. It is the only building that marks if a city has power or not. Is a prerequisite to all power plants.

Power Plants
They require power lines before they can be built. The provide a megawatt production value to the national power level. They would come in many types and each produce a diffrent amount of megawatts. Note that they don't actually provide "power" anymore.

City Power Consumption
Each city uses up x number of megawatts from the national power level. The amount is determined by the population, buildings and techs.

Tech Usage
Specific techs allow more power to be used. Thus cities in the earlier eras use up less power than a city of the same size in later eras. Each of the techs increase it by 2%.

National Power Level
The national power level is determined by how much power plants are producing vs how much each city is consuming. If the power consumption is higher than that produced then cities will exponentially become more unhappy and unhealthy. In addition power is distributed to all cities via power line building being built in each city.

--------

I also had a new idea.

Department of Power [National Wonder]
Gives every city "Power Line" buildings. Possibly have "power lines" only built with this wonder. Could also give some sort of other bonues to the city it is in.

 

[Afforess]

Yeah. Basiclly my idea is ...

Power Lines
Provide Power Connections. It is the only building that marks if a city has power or not. Is a prerequisite to all power plants.

Okay.

Power Plants
They require power lines before they can be built. The provide a megawatt production value to the national power level. They would come in many types and each produce a diffrent amount of megawatts. Note that they don't actually provide "power" anymore.

They produce MW. Got it.

City Power Consumption
Each city uses up x number of megawatts from the national power level. The amount is determined by the population, buildings and techs.

Want to come up with a basic forumla for me? Like ( population *3 + buildings production cost / 10 ) * tech power usage

Something, please. I just made that one up off the top of my head.

Tech Usage
Specific techs allow more power to be used. Thus cities in the earlier eras use up less power than a city of the same size in later eras. Each of the techs increase it by 2%.

No Problem.

National Power Level
The national power level is determined by how much power plants are producing vs how much each city is consuming. If the power consumption is higher than that produced then cities will exponentially become more unhappy and unhealthy. In addition power is distributed to all cities via power line building being built in each city.

Where should the "National Power Level" be shown to the user?

--------

I also had a new idea.

Department of Power [National Wonder]
Gives every city "Power Line" buildings. Possibly have "power lines" only built with this wonder. Could also give some sort of other bonues to the city it is in.

Department of Energy sounds better. I like the concept though.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Want to come up with a basic forumla for me? Like ( population *3 + buildings production cost / 10 ) * tech power usage

Something, please. I just made that one up off the top of my head.

Ok how about this ...

Megawatt Production (MWP) = 500
National Population (NP) = 500
Total Building Production (TBP) = 500
Tech Power Usage (TPU) = 25% or 1/4
Megawatt Consumption (MWC) = 250
National Power Level (NPL) = 250

NPL = MWP - ((NP + TBP) / TPU)

250 = 500 - ((500 + 500) / 4)

As you can see I used the numbers from before as an example.

Where should the "National Power Level" be shown to the user?

Well have no idea. I suppose that might need to be shown somewhere. However could it be done as a hidden variable in the meantime? sort of like its working but the only way you would know what the level is, is if you don't have enough megawatts and the side effects such as unhappiness started happening.

Department of Energy sounds better. I like the concept though.

Ok. The name doesn't matter. But I think its the best choice to have a national wonder that sets up the power by giving a free building to every city that provides power. That way all cities will begin a but unhappy that they do not have enough megawatts. Or possibly have the wonder add a small amount of megawatts to begin with. Since electricity would be only like 2% used.

 

[Afforess]

Ok how about this ...

Megawatt Production (MWP) = 500
National Population (NP) = 500
Total Building Production (TBP) = 500
Tech Power Usage (TPU) = 25% or 1/4
Megawatt Consumption (MWC) = 250
National Power Level (NPL) = 250

NPL = MWP - ((NP + TBP) / TPU)

250 = 500 - ((500 + 500) / 4)

As you can see I used the numbers from before as an example.

For the formula, I think you mean this:

NPL = MWP - ((NP + TBP) * TPU)

Otherwise it looks fine.

Well have no idea. I suppose that might need to be shown somewhere. However could it be done as a hidden variable in the meantime? sort of like its working but the only way you would know what the level is, is if you don't have enough megawatts and the side effects such as unhappiness started happening.

How about just a little bar, like the GGXP bar or Tech Progress Bar, where if you hover over it, it says "Total MW Produced: XYZ, Total MW Consumed, ZYX" Otherwise, the bar just has a level power level, and the closer it gets to being full, the less excess power you have. Adding that couldn't be too hard.

Ok. The name doesn't matter. But I think its the best choice to have a national wonder that sets up the power by giving a free building to every city that provides power. That way all cities will begin a but unhappy that they do not have enough megawatts. Or possibly have the wonder add a small amount of megawatts to begin with. Since electricity would be only like 2% used.

I've been thinking, with electricity, we need to use the "rod" and the "carrot". If a player doesn't provide enough electricity, he gets unhappy/unhealthy cities. But if he has too much he can sell it other players (That would be easy to add) and as long as he has more than enough, cities get a 5% boost to , , , , , ... etc...

 

[Hydromancerx]

1. Oops! I was never good at math. But you get the idea.

2. As long as this mod is not held up over the "Megawatt Bar". I really want to see this mod get made in the near future.

3. Oh good! I was hoping such a thing could be added to diplomacy.

As for the boost to other things that sounds reasonable as long as they do not over power things too much. We already have a lot of buildings doing the same thing.

And of course each power plant would have their own +/- effects such as power/pollution.

------

What should we do about the Three Gorge Dam and Fusion Power? Right now it provides power to all cities on the continent. But with the whole "Department of Energy" and "Power Lines" every city would get "power" but not necessarily enough megawatts. So I am thinking that both would give an extremely large amount of megawatts to the national power grid. In addition keep the limit of only 3 Fusion Power Plants. Likewise the new "Solar Updraft Tower" wonder could also give a high amount of megawatts too.