Monarch Diplomatic win

[obsolete]

I finaly hit my first DIPLOMATIC win on monarch with this new patch. Usually I get by with the space race escapade, but I guess I'm a sucker for this wonder.

Yes, I mean sucker. I keep building it, and doing everything in my power to get friends who will vote for me, and I get backstabbed every time when the final votes come in. It seems on this level the AI prefers to vote for its enemy over the human player.

I tried to get China to be my best friend all game. He'd go to war with gahndi, and I would follow suit. Even though they were both on another continent I still joined anyhow. Anything to keep up foreign relations. Not to mention, I gave him EVERY resource I had, FREE. I even gave China free oil and everything else. And considering I conqured 3 other civs on my own continent, that was a LOT of resources I put together. I also gave him numerous techs for free when he fell behind too.


But in the end, I finall pulled it off by getting enough votes from ME, MYSELF. This was the only way possible, as he refused to vote in my favour EVERY time!

Now I don't doubt there must be some sort of exploit with the UN wonder on Monarch, but for the life of me I can't seem to get anyone's votes no matter what I do.

The only thing I didn't have, was China's religion. However he was on another continent so me getting it was damn impossible. Also, in other games where I have converted religions I still had problems getting the UN votes.

That being said, I'm really thinking that the UN system really is limited, unless you feel you will have more than enough of the world's population yourself when it comes time.

 

[Michelangelo]

You have to make sure they are "Friendly" with you. In my experience, this is a good indicator of how they will vote. Some leaders though have a higher threshold for being friendly, so it will be harder to get them to vote for you.

Also you can try to get them on bad terms with the other candidate. Then the only can choose for you or abstain.

 

[Killroyan]

Well I am working on my first diplomatic win also. Right now I have one annoyed with me (Monty? How is that possible), 2 pleased and 1 friendly. There is definitely a difference in threshold for being friendly because 1 pleased and the friendly have the same score if I am not mistaken. But I will ask them in a war against Monty when I take his land to get some extra browny points.

 

[obsolete]

Then the only can choose for you or abstain.

If an AI is at war with another AI, they will abstain, even if friendly with me. I just can't get the diplo votes on this level.

Back in the days of Civ III it was easy, I always signed mutual protection pact just before the voting and was guaranteed the win.

 

[Khalid]

I'm not an diplo expert myself, but some points to consider:

1) You probably had a longlasting open borders agreement.
2) You can get a maximum of +4 relation for trading, so giving them excess techs or resources is futile.
3) You may rather wait and give it if they ask for. You will get bonuses for paying tribute
4) Do you have many negative modifiers for attacking his friends?
5) Swithing to his favourite cvics can help
6) What about joining the war, conquering a city of his rival with his religion and convert. Doing a real damage in war boost relation
7) Signing a mutual protection pact with him

 

[Naismith]

My experience with diplomatic wins is limited, since I got disgusted with it early on. If I remember correctly, getting an AI to Friendly won't always be enough. As mentioned above, it's different for different leaders. I think you have to get up to a +14 with some of them. Even then they may not vote for you. I dimly remember having a Friendly Louis (about a +12) voting for my opponent. Louis was Friendly with the opponent with a +10 or so.

You can give them stuff all you like, but that won't get you there. The big positive modifiers are for adopting favorite Civics, shared religion, and mutual military struggle. The Civics thing is unlikely to apply to more than one Civ in the game, two if you're lucky. (In order to get it, you may have to run Civics that really hamstring your economy, which is a distinct disadvantage in a close game that may come down to a space race.) Shared religion may apply to a couple of Civs (assuming the usual proliferation of religions in the game). Mutual military struggle is the easiest to get. I think all of these three can get up to a +8, although I think that also varies by leader.

 

[mkarules]

How do you win diplomatically. I mean whenever I try it never works so could someone tell me how to do it?

 

[oyzar]

you need +8 to get someone to vote for you. Get same religion etc helps. Civics might be needed too.

 

[Syndrome Zed]

I'm not an diplo expert myself, but some points to consider:

5) Swithing to his favourite cvics can help
7) Signing a mutual protection pact with him

These are two of the three big ones. The 3rd is religion - Free Religion may be great for you, but unless the UN has been used to shove it down the AI's throats, your religions will make a huge difference in the late game diplomacy. The longer you and the other nation(s) share a religion, the higher your diplomacy bonus for that (although I don't know what the actual cap is on that value, just that it's bigger than most of the others). This is especially true if the nation you're trying to be friends with founded that religion - then the AI is EXTREMELY reluctant to give it up, even if the civic bonus for FR would help it more than keeping the religion.

The other case this is especially true is with the "religious nut" leaders , like Isabella and (to a lesser extent) Saladin.

Only times I've had people voting for me: Sharing religion (with or without favorite civics, although that helped too) and vassalizing them early enough to leave them a good number of votes (Warlords).

 

[Killroyan]

Obsolete, I will join you in the ranks of diplomatic wins on Monarch WOOOOHOOOOOO I had a day of yesterday and got >80% to vote for me even though some were building space parts. 1918 is pretty respectable I guess. First win on Monarch.

 

[obsolete]

Hmm, I just failed again. I happened to get two AI's (with rediculous happy points for relations) to vote for me, but still kept falling short. Anyhow, it's also been my experience that the moment your population reaches the area where you will hit the win, that is just when one of the AI's decides to backstab you and not vote anymore for you. It's almost like they know when their votes matter, and change accordingly.

 

[futurehermit]

^^^Sounds like politics to me

 

[Iamdead7]

I was trying for a diplo win yesterday, and I was 30 votes off, my oponent was hated, when Frederick (3rd biggest) goes to war with Ragnar and vassalizes him, giving him enough votes to be in second. and everyone loves him. So close!

 

[Moxxa]

Hmmm, maybe the AI's will be less likely to vote for you if you have a high number of votes. Say you have 250 votes and you need 300 to win. The AIs, even the friendly or pleased ones, will be less likely to vote for you than if you had something like 100 votes. This is all speculation, but has anyone tested this?

 

[obsolete]

That would make sense to me. An algorithm with a bias that is perhaps also increased as the level of difficulty increases as well. Possibly was added to prevent making the UN an instant win for the player.

 

[Moxxa]

So if you are an average sized civ with all the AI's friendly or at least pleased, you might have a better chance at winning the UN vote. It would be too easy if you could just have 75% if the required votes and then bribe the AIs for the other 25% you need.

The more civs you need to vote for you, the more likely it is that they will.

 

[nullspace]

Diplomatic wins aren't just about getting other leaders to like you, you also need to attack the leaders who don't like you, and conquer their population to steal their votes. Use diplomacy to get your allies to help you attack your enemies. If your allies conquer the cities, that's fine too because then your allies will have more votes to vote for you.

Diplomatic victories are hard if you try to do it entirely peacefully. You need to use some force to convince to world to vote you as their ruler. If you want a completely peaceful victory, go for culture or space race.

 

[weimingshi]

As for religion modifier, you can get +7 or +8 with 1 civ of same religion, usually its the civ with holy city of that religion. If you own the holy city, its another random civ gets the +8 modifier, dono how computer choose it. the others usually only +4 from religion.

 

[Silver Marmot]

I won diplomatic on warlord (the level, not the expansion) a long time ago, but never bothered to try after that. To me, it seems like it not only matters a civ is friendly to you, but they can't be friendly or pleased with your rival.

 

[Tatran]

You can never work towards a clean diplomatic victory (not a domination
victory in disguise), because you don't know who will be your opponent
in voting at the end.

Last game (diplomatic victory) I shared a continent with Isabella, Montezuma,
Shaka, Peter and Kublai Khan. Izzy and Monty were my neighbours.
The other continent : Gandhi, Wang Kon and Hatshepsut.
Izzy declared war on me (wrong religion) and was removed, all other leaders
at my continent were friendly. Gandhi was the no. 1 in population and
vassalaged the other AIs on his continent, knowing this I worked towards
the diplomatic victory. The leaders at my continent hated Gandhi anyway,
so need to worry about losing votes, just getting enough votes.
When I started the game and met all those leaders I never thought of
a diplomatic victory just survive and try to win. (Monarch+ game)